Gun Control III - the Gunnening

[Chan Island]

And since driving on public roads is the vast, vast majority of car usage in the US, I think we can safely say it's near enough to synonymous to proceed with semantic word games.

The vast majority of public firearms use in the United States is licensed carry or hunting(which also requires a license including education requirements).

True. Still lends itself to the question of usefulness.

And since driving on public roads is the vast, vast majority of car usage in the US, I think we can safely say it's near enough to synonymous to proceed without critiquing semantics.

It's not even remotely similar.

Is it though?

[Major-Tom]

...Not really? I mean - take the gun buyback concept, that's ludicrous and will spell doom for my party if they ever adopt that into their platform. But to have sensible gun control with more adequate background checks, elimination of the gun-show loophole, etc etc, that doesn't punish anybody with the exception of would be criminals. Law-abiding citizens from all parties and walks of life would still be able to buy plenty of guns and ammunition.

Fines aren't punishment?

I did not mention fines.

[Telconi]

The vast majority of public firearms use in the United States is licensed carry or hunting(which also requires a license including education requirements).

True. Still lends itself to the question of usefulness.

It's not even remotely similar.

Is it though?

No, it's not, and asserting it is indicates ignorance or dishonesty.

[Telconi]

Fines aren't punishment?

I did not mention fines.

Making people pay a penalty to the government for selling their gun is a fine in all but name.

[Chan Island]

True. Still lends itself to the question of usefulness.



Is it though?

No, it's not, and asserting it is indicates ignorance or dishonesty.

For the vast majority of people getting a car, it means acquire a vehicle to drive along public roads. There are very few people who get them to do anything else, and much fewer still who never use their cars to drive along them. Therefore, for all intents and purposes, in the real world, it is very similar.

[Aclion]

I’ve always said, the whole gun control issue in the US is more about punishing rural people for voting GOP than anything else.

...Not really? I mean - take the gun buyback concept, that's ludicrous and will spell doom for my party if they ever adopt that into their platform. But to have sensible gun control with more adequate background checks, elimination of the gun-show loophole, etc etc, that doesn't punish anybody with the exception of would be criminals. Law-abiding citizens from all parties and walks of life would still be able to buy plenty of guns and ammunition.

You don't know what your talking about and it shows. Those are the same thing.

[Telconi]

No, it's not, and asserting it is indicates ignorance or dishonesty.

For the vast majority of people getting a car, it means acquire a vehicle to drive along public roads. There are very few people who get them to do anything else, and much fewer still who never use their cars to drive along them. Therefore, for all intents and purposes, in the real world, it is very similar.

What people buy the car for is irrelevant to their legal capacity to buy the car.

[Major-Tom]

...Not really? I mean - take the gun buyback concept, that's ludicrous and will spell doom for my party if they ever adopt that into their platform. But to have sensible gun control with more adequate background checks, elimination of the gun-show loophole, etc etc, that doesn't punish anybody with the exception of would be criminals. Law-abiding citizens from all parties and walks of life would still be able to buy plenty of guns and ammunition.

What gun show loophole?
Any and all FFL dealers that attended gun shows and sell firearms at said show, have to conduct a bgc.

The loophole in many states wherein regulations are loose and limited if someone buys a gun from either;

(A. A private dealer.
(B. A gun show run by an assortment of private dealers.

It's pretty straightforward. The argument that we can't budge even a little bit on expanding background checks and the like is bizarre to me. People will be able to keep their guns, people with a relatively clean record will be able to purchase guns, the only losers will be those with malicious intentions.

If that's the sound of "government overreach," then I'd have to wonder what your ideal system of gun control is, or if you'd rather scrap background checks and the like altogether for some bizarre reason.

[Major-Tom]

...Not really? I mean - take the gun buyback concept, that's ludicrous and will spell doom for my party if they ever adopt that into their platform. But to have sensible gun control with more adequate background checks, elimination of the gun-show loophole, etc etc, that doesn't punish anybody with the exception of would be criminals. Law-abiding citizens from all parties and walks of life would still be able to buy plenty of guns and ammunition.

You don't know what your talking about and it shows. Those are the same thing.

And why is that? There are instances in which gun shows have background checks, but that do not meet the full extent of federal requirements.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

What gun show loophole?
Any and all FFL dealers that attended gun shows and sell firearms at said show, have to conduct a bgc.

The loophole in many states wherein regulations are loose and limited if someone buys a gun from either;

(A. A private dealer.
(B. A gun show run by an assortment of private dealers.

It's pretty straightforward. The argument that we can't budge even a little bit on expanding background checks and the like is bizarre to me. People will be able to keep their guns, people with a relatively clean record will be able to purchase guns, the only losers will be those with malicious intentions.

If that's the sound of "government overreach," then I'd have to wonder what your ideal system of gun control is, or if you'd rather scrap background checks and the like altogether for some bizarre reason.

Do you think it's okay that somebody considered safe enough to walk the streets loses a constitutional right because of a crime many many years ago?

[Major-Tom]

The loophole in many states wherein regulations are loose and limited if someone buys a gun from either;

(A. A private dealer.
(B. A gun show run by an assortment of private dealers.

It's pretty straightforward. The argument that we can't budge even a little bit on expanding background checks and the like is bizarre to me. People will be able to keep their guns, people with a relatively clean record will be able to purchase guns, the only losers will be those with malicious intentions.

If that's the sound of "government overreach," then I'd have to wonder what your ideal system of gun control is, or if you'd rather scrap background checks and the like altogether for some bizarre reason.

Do you think it's okay that somebody considered safe enough to walk the streets loses a constitutional right because of a crime many many years ago?

I suppose it would depend on the crime they committed in the past, there's a substantial difference between a non-violent drug arrest and something such as, say, domestic abuse.

[Telconi]

You don't know what your talking about and it shows. Those are the same thing.

And why is that? There are instances in which gun shows have background checks, but that do not meet the full extent of federal requirements.

Well if they don't meet federal requirements that's already a crime isn't it?

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Do you think it's okay that somebody considered safe enough to walk the streets loses a constitutional right because of a crime many many years ago?

I suppose it would depend on the crime they committed in the past, there's a substantial difference between a non-violent drug arrest and something such as, say, domestic abuse.

Did they serve their sentence for the latter?

[Chan Island]

For the vast majority of people getting a car, it means acquire a vehicle to drive along public roads. There are very few people who get them to do anything else, and much fewer still who never use their cars to drive along them. Therefore, for all intents and purposes, in the real world, it is very similar.

What people buy the car for is irrelevant to their legal capacity to buy the car.

What? Yes it is relevant. That's why we disallow cars with heavy weapons attached to them. It's why nobody gets a car until after they get a license.

[Telconi]

What people buy the car for is irrelevant to their legal capacity to buy the car.

What? Yes it is relevant. That's why we disallow cars with heavy weapons attached to them. It's why nobody gets a car until after they get a license.

They do though...

[Major-Tom]

And why is that? There are instances in which gun shows have background checks, but that do not meet the full extent of federal requirements.

Well if they don't meet federal requirements that's already a crime isn't it?

If unlicensed vendors are allowed at gun shows, which is a thing (hence the aforementioned term loophole I got attacked for), then perhaps the government can intervene there.

Also as per your previous post, gun-grabber? Really? I live in a place where most people own guns, hell I used to have one myself. What is this caricature of people with a hard on for stealing guns? It’s the most nonsense thing on this thread.

[Chan Island]

What? Yes it is relevant. That's why we disallow cars with heavy weapons attached to them. It's why nobody gets a car until after they get a license.

They do though...

Do they? Not anybody I know or heard of.

Meh, fair cop then.

[Telconi]

Well if they don't meet federal requirements that's already a crime isn't it?

If unlicensed vendors are allowed at gun shows, which is a thing (hence the aforementioned term loophole I got attacked for), then perhaps the government can intervene there.

Also as per your previous post, gun-grabber? Really? I live in a place where most people own guns, hell I used to have one myself. What is this caricature of people with a hard on for stealing guns? It’s the most nonsense thing on this thread.

Desire to see a stricter law in place does not make presently legal activity a "loophole".

I think the government ought to lower the speed limit for the road I live on. But if I asked the city council to close the "loophole" that allows people to drive 45 mph on my street it'd be pretty disengenuous.

[Telconi]

They do though...

Do they? Not anybody I know or heard of.

Meh, fair cop then.

I owned and drove my first car at the age of twelve.

[Chan Island]

Do they? Not anybody I know or heard of.

Meh, fair cop then.

I owned and drove my first car at the age of twelve.

... how?

[The Chuck]

Since we're almost at 500, I went and made the 4th incarnation of the Gun Control Megathread.

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=472220

[Telconi]

I owned and drove my first car at the age of twelve.

... how?

Uh, I bought it, and then I started it, and put it in gear, and pushed the accelerator, and turned the steering wheel when I wanted it to turn...

[Chan Island]

... how?

Uh, I bought it, and then I started it, and put it in gear, and pushed the accelerator, and turned the steering wheel when I wanted it to turn...

Must have been a cheap car. And were you driving on the roads?

[Telconi]

Uh, I bought it, and then I started it, and put it in gear, and pushed the accelerator, and turned the steering wheel when I wanted it to turn...

Must have been a cheap car. And were you driving on the roads?

It was, and no.

[Aclion]

You don't know what your talking about and it shows. Those are the same thing.

And why is that? There are instances in which gun shows have background checks, but that do not meet the full extent of federal requirements.

Gun show are subject to the same rules as any other sale. If you buy from a dealer they must verify through NICS that you are not a prohibited person, while for a private sale there is no such requirement(though private sellers still cannot sell to prohibited persons). Both "comprehensive background checks" and "closing the gun show loophole" are just branding for proposals to require private sales to use NICS.