Uni of Exeter law students in racist WhatsApp msgs row

[Cedoria]

I have to say these messages are incredibly normie compared to what goes on in mine, lol.

I think this is part of the wider crackdown on laddish culture and it will only continue to backfire. I certainly have noticed a very large right-wing shift in young white men, there's some stats to back that up as well, not least US demographic exit polls since 2004. Each event like this only makes it worse, as there are now people genuinely losing work placements and job offers over what most people would consider normal statements, especially in the sort of workplaces that they have applied to.

This will just make it more prevalent, more coarse and more underground.

If that's the sort of thing you consider normal statements, I'd look hard at the people you hand around with.

No problem with people and organisations deciding they don't want these people associated with them. No problem at all, and those who are normally pro-capitalist should have no difficulty with it either (or does 'free association' not apply here?)

[Ors Might]

If these guys were directing this at specific students or were doing it publically, then the uni would have been justified in suspending them. But I haven’t been able to find anything that suggests that’s the case. It just seems like a bunch of guys shit posting privately. I mean, hell, I’ve done the same thing. Though my posts weren’t quite..this.

In which case you have a point. I think it's more that the story is brand new. I can't find much about it on the Internet. No outraged WhatsApp posts from the students either.

Can you post on WhatsApp I don't fucking know.

True. It might be prudent to withhold judgement either way until we have more information.

[Petrolheadia]

I have to say these messages are incredibly normie compared to what goes on in mine, lol.

I think this is part of the wider crackdown on laddish culture and it will only continue to backfire. I certainly have noticed a very large right-wing shift in young white men, there's some stats to back that up as well, not least US demographic exit polls since 2004. Each event like this only makes it worse, as there are now people genuinely losing work placements and job offers over what most people would consider normal statements, especially in the sort of workplaces that they have applied to.

This will just make it more prevalent, more coarse and more underground.

If that's the sort of thing you consider normal statements, I'd look hard at the people you hand around with.

No problem with people and organisations deciding they don't want these people associated with them. No problem at all, and those who are normally pro-capitalist should have no difficulty with it either (or does 'free association' not apply here?)

It's only free association when they want to associate with you. How could you forget that?

[Trumptonium]

No problem with people and organisations deciding they don't want these people associated with them. No problem at all, and those who are normally pro-capitalist should have no difficulty with it either (or does 'free association' not apply here?)

I didn't say the business can't. I'm saying this attempted social ostracisation will lead to far more adverse effects. Not against me, as I don't particularly care, but especially against what the likes of you would prefer. As I've said on the first page, this will just drive people towards more coarse language, more underground and more prevalent, and perhaps change from humorous to actual views too.

As for the people, their lives are destroyed. It's similar to being falsely accused of rape. You've done nothing wrong but you sure as hell are going to be angry, so it's a question of how they express that anger. Now, if they just vote for Hiel Hortler at the next election or become sexist, nobody is affected too much. If they decide to suicide by setting off a bomb, well then. I've lost a study from Gatestone but one said that innocents falsely accused of rape are many times more likely to murder and/or become criminals than any other demographic, including former prisoners.

As for the organisation, it's a public organisation. It shouldn't have that right.

[Bakery Hill]

Another thing Trumptonium, let's not let our Cousins fall into the lazy two party way of thinking. The UK is after all a multiparty state (until Comrade Corbyn at least). If you lob in LAB+LIB DEM+GRN as left and CON + UKIP as right, then and leave out other (which is a charity because a lot of those are SNP and PC voters and Green stalwarts in 2017) you get this.

2015: Males aged 18 to 24: Left 53 - Right 39 14
2017: Males aged 18 to 24: Left 57 - Right 37 20

The best you can really say is that younger male millenials are not going left as fast as their girlfriends (lol jks millennial conservatives don't have gf) or their older brothers.

Well that's another way to look at it, although I still think that males voting Tory at twice the rate of females is a sign of something else going on than pure chance and young males drifting slower.

It is of course hard to measure things like this, and perhaps one of those "Would you describe yourself as left-wing, centre, right-wing" stuff would be better. I personally vote Labour even though I'm a million miles away from the average Labour voter & core ideology, so I am just one example of skewing the numbers.

you vote labour?

y

I still however think that there's certainly a marked shift to the right, or at least relative to females of the same age group, even if we account for multiple parties. However I don't deny that we don't have enough data to make any conclusions whatsoever, plus this would be many times easier if we had a two-party system. I certainly haven't found the "university makes you left-wing" mantra since enrolling, and I found people of similar convictions who themselves became more right-wing over the last few years. I certainly feel that, at least anecdotally, I've found a greater share of right-wing views at university than I did at sixth form.

I think it'd depend on the discipline but yes I do think the culutral marxism in the academy meme needs to end.

[Mushet]

All I'm reading is barely intelligible gibberish with racial slurs mixed in.

[Trumptonium]

you vote labour?

y

housing and tuition fees. self-interest really. though that might stop the moment i leave university depending on where i end up as a graduate

though there are some issues I'm closer to labour on than tories, like NES/R&D subsidies/higher taxes, overall I'm overwhelmingly right wing and the social side of labour is a big no for me

as for local elections, local tories are rural yeomen and local labour are basically Macron/mildly right-wing, and my views are basically Macron if we shift away from the culture war.

I think it'd depend on the discipline but yes I do think the culutral marxism in the academy meme needs to end.

Well, finance is necessarily more laddish.

And boy are there a lot of Chinese right-wingers* who love Trump and Chinese Commies. Never figured out what's up with that.

*sample of ~10

[Salandriagado]

Some arseholes broke rules that they agreed to when they started at the university and faced the consequences.

[Hurdergaryp]

Some arseholes broke rules that they agreed to when they started at the university and faced the consequences.

Internet racists sympathize with said arseholes and immediately feel persecuted as well.

[The Rich Port]

Some arseholes broke rules that they agreed to when they started at the university and faced the consequences.

Internet racists sympathize with said arseholes and immediately feel persecuted as well.

The Rich Port rubs his temples and considers alcoholism again.

Somewhat unrelated, but still.

[Hurdergaryp]

Internet racists sympathize with said arseholes and immediately feel persecuted as well.

The Rich Port rubs his temples and considers alcoholism again.

Somewhat unrelated, but still.

NationStates General often feels like a rather monstrous drinking game, so I understand where you're coming from.

[Greed and Death]

In response to message 4. Guess who had a placement revoked ?

[Bakery Hill]

you vote labour?

y

housing and tuition fees. self-interest really. though that might stop the moment i leave university depending on where i end up as a graduate

though there are some issues I'm closer to labour on than tories, like NES/R&D subsidies/higher taxes, overall I'm overwhelmingly right wing and the social side of labour is a big no for me

as for local elections, local tories are rural yeomen and local labour are basically Macron/mildly right-wing, and my views are basically Macron if we shift away from the culture war.

yeah that makes sense

I think it'd depend on the discipline but yes I do think the culutral marxism in the academy meme needs to end.

Well, finance is necessarily more laddish.

mfw

And boy are there a lot of Chinese right-wingers* who love Trump and Chinese Commies. Never figured out what's up with that.

*sample of ~10

they like their strong authority figures I suppose

[The Rich Port]

In response to message 4. Guess who had a placement revoked ?

Message 4?

[Otira]

You'd think law students would know better than to make multiple records, records they don't have any control over, of things they wouldn't want seen in public.

Just what I was thinking.

[The Rich Port]

You'd think law students would know better than to make multiple records, records they don't have any control over, of things they wouldn't want seen in public.

The real reason they were expelled.

"Obviously didn't learn anything here anyway. Ta-ta."

[Cannot think of a name]

Some arseholes broke rules that they agreed to when they started at the university and faced the consequences.

Internet racists sympathize with said arseholes and immediately feel persecuted as well.

Racists not liking being marginalized...waiting for the realization light to hit them...

[Fartsniffage]

Internet racists sympathize with said arseholes and immediately feel persecuted as well.

Racists not liking being marginalized...waiting for the realization light to hit them...

But they're better than the other races. Why would they ever be marginalised?

[Greed and Death]

In response to message 4. Guess who had a placement revoked ?

Message 4?

In the spoilers of the OP there are the messages in question. #4 is about a placement.

[Zyr and Pony]

As someone who was bullied extensively in elementary and middle school, and still suffering from Social Anxiety Disorder and Avoidant Personality Disorder as a direct result, more than 15 years after the fact, I think the university did the right thing here. Making fun of people with terms like the n word and dirty arabs, even in private, should never be acceptable IMO. The attitudes are toxic and need to die, and when perpetuated, even in jest, I think it exposes the biases that the people making said jokes don't want to publically share.

And someone asked earlier about whether I would intervene if I saw someone being bullied. I would absolutely do so. Sudies show that even the witnesses of bullying are negatively impacted, never mind the victims, so throwing this around, even where the targets of said attacks can't see them, is liable to have a negative impact on others who see them, especially if they have something in common with the victim that is being targeted. And not snitching makes things worse all around by allowing this to fester, so I don't see why you should take offense to someone reporting this as some have.

[The Free Joy State]

I have to say these messages are incredibly normie compared to what goes on in mine, lol.

I think this is part of the wider crackdown on laddish culture and it will only continue to backfire. I certainly have noticed a very large right-wing shift in young white men, there's some stats to back that up as well, not least US demographic exit polls since 2004. Each event like this only makes it worse, as there are now people genuinely losing work placements and job offers over what most people would consider normal statements, especially in the sort of workplaces that they have applied to.

This will just make it more prevalent, more coarse and more underground.

I've never met anybody - and I've not lived a sheltered life - who would consider the spoilered remarks in the OP "normal statements".

I do imagine that these students will lose job opportunities because of this, but anyone these days who goes for a job knows that the chances are high that anything egregious in your digital life - such as negative social media usage, like the sending of racist messages - will be discovered in pre-screening by diligent would-be employers. I'm afraid I can't be sorry if their own words lose them opportunities.

Universities in the UK may be funded - in part - by tuition fees, but they also (IIRC) have a code of conduct, which students have to agree to follow. Sending racist messages about fellow students would, I'm sure, contravene most universities' codes of conduct. And I think few of the other students would be sorry about that.

IMO, the university did the right thing here. The world could use far less hate and general nastiness.

[Trumptonium]

I have to say these messages are incredibly normie compared to what goes on in mine, lol.

I think this is part of the wider crackdown on laddish culture and it will only continue to backfire. I certainly have noticed a very large right-wing shift in young white men, there's some stats to back that up as well, not least US demographic exit polls since 2004. Each event like this only makes it worse, as there are now people genuinely losing work placements and job offers over what most people would consider normal statements, especially in the sort of workplaces that they have applied to.

This will just make it more prevalent, more coarse and more underground.

I've never met anybody - and I've not lived a sheltered life - who would consider the spoilered remarks in the OP "normal statements".

Well you have.

[The Free Joy State]

I've never met anybody - and I've not lived a sheltered life - who would consider the spoilered remarks in the OP "normal statements".

Well you have.

Which precise part of my statement were you objecting to?

I am very much aware of my own life, of the people I have personally met, and of the things they would consider normal. And I am absolutely certain that no-one I know would consider those statements to be a part of normal social discourse.

[Ors Might]

As someone who was bullied extensively in elementary and middle school, and still suffering from Social Anxiety Disorder and Avoidant Personality Disorder as a direct result, more than 15 years after the fact, I think the university did the right thing here. Making fun of people with terms like the n word and dirty arabs, even in private, should never be acceptable IMO. The attitudes are toxic and need to die, and when perpetuated, even in jest, I think it exposes the biases that the people making said jokes don't want to publically share.

And someone asked earlier about whether I would intervene if I saw someone being bullied. I would absolutely do so. Sudies show that even the witnesses of bullying are negatively impacted, never mind the victims, so throwing this around, even where the targets of said attacks can't see them, is liable to have a negative impact on others who see them, especially if they have something in common with the victim that is being targeted. And not snitching makes things worse all around by allowing this to fester, so I don't see why you should take offense to someone reporting this as some have.

I’m not familiar with UK laws but in the US, any college that receives government funding has to abide by similar rules as the government. For example, you can’t be kicked out of public college for your political beliefs. They also can’t kick you out for what you say in private, as long as you aren’t threatening another student. Again, I’m not familiar with UK laws so it might be a different legal situation over there. But it does seem odd to me for government funded bodies to be punishing citizens for what was said in private.

[Trumptonium]

Well you have.

Which precise part of my statement were you objecting to?

I am very much aware of my own life, of the people I have personally met, and of the things they would consider normal. And I am absolutely certain that no-one I know would consider those statements to be a part of normal social discourse.

The sheltered part