White? Why not pay more?

[Alvecia]

They aren't asked as individuals, they're asked as a member of the aforementioned racial group

...who are still individuals.

But aren't being asked in that capacity.

[Ifreann]

As a symbolic gesture to raise awareness about the disparity in average income between black and white people.

Asking people to pay more of their own money is a bit more than "symbolic".

How is it?

No, it doesn't.

Yes, it does.

How? What part of "Do you want to pay $30 or $12?" involves assuming anything about anything or anyone?

---

A better option would be if we could all just ignore everyone's skin color, including our own. Let's judge on merit, not skin color. I note that we all bleed the same color.

Is there a pay disparity? Yes. Is it from racism, or from the fact that there are more 'colored' people in some areas of the United States, and have different jobs? Unfortunately, there is some of the former, but a large amount of this disparity is from the latter point.

I certainly feel that charging any color more than any other color is racism.
Let's try be the generation that ends racism, by just ignoring race.

Ignoring problems won't make them go away.

[Kramanica]

...who are still individuals.

But aren't being asked in that capacity.

It doesn't fucking matter. Individual people still pay for their own food. There isn't some Grand Council of Whites that pays for it for them. This isn't fucking hard.

But they are being assumed to make more than a black customer because they make more on average.

[Ostroeuropa]

Asking people to pay more of their own money is a bit more than "symbolic".

How is it?

Yes, it does.

How? What part of "Do you want to pay $30 or $12?" involves assuming anything about anything or anyone?

---

A better option would be if we could all just ignore everyone's skin color, including our own. Let's judge on merit, not skin color. I note that we all bleed the same color.

Is there a pay disparity? Yes. Is it from racism, or from the fact that there are more 'colored' people in some areas of the United States, and have different jobs? Unfortunately, there is some of the former, but a large amount of this disparity is from the latter point.

I certainly feel that charging any color more than any other color is racism.
Let's try be the generation that ends racism, by just ignoring race.

Ignoring problems won't make them go away.

In the cultural context of whites not going along with progressive shenanigans resulting in social and sometimes economic penalties, it's not a free choice. This is much like arguing like the reason for gender disparities in number of people in professions is due to "choice."
This instance also involves progressives peddling a particular view of the situation that is tantamount to racism.

"Hey man, cos blacks commit a disproportionate amount of crime, we're going to ask if you want to pay more."
"What's the problem? They were given a choice."

Using sociological stats this way in a manner that ignores class and treats all whites as causing the disparity is racism.

[Kramanica]

Asking people to pay more of their own money is a bit more than "symbolic".

How is it?

Because it's actual, real money that people work hard to earn.

How? What part of "Do you want to pay $30 or $12?" involves assuming anything about anything or anyone?

If you're asking all whites to pay more because they belong to a certain racial group who makes more than another then you are assuming that they themselves make more.

I've only explained this like 60 times.

[Ifreann]

How is it?


How? What part of "Do you want to pay $30 or $12?" involves assuming anything about anything or anyone?

---

Ignoring problems won't make them go away.

In the cultural context of whites not going along with progressive shenanigans resulting in social and sometimes economic penalties,

The what now?

it's not a free choice.

Sure it is.

[Ifreann]

How is it?

Because it's actual, real money that people work hard to earn.

That doesn't make the gesture not symbolic.

How? What part of "Do you want to pay $30 or $12?" involves assuming anything about anything or anyone?

If you're asking all whites to pay more because they belong to a certain racial group who makes more than another then you are assuming that they themselves make more.

How are you?

I've only explained this like 60 times.

You've repeated it several times. You've yet to explain it.

[Kramanica]

Because it's actual, real money that people work hard to earn.

That doesn't make the gesture not symbolic.

Because the only purpose it actually serves is to make this douche bag more money.

If you're asking all whites to pay more because they belong to a certain racial group who makes more than another then you are assuming that they themselves make more.

How are you?

I've only explained this like 60 times.

You've repeated it several times. You've yet to explain it.

"You belong to racial group X which makes more. Therefore, you should pay more."

Even if you're dirt poor you're still asked to pay more.

[Ostroeuropa]

In the cultural context of whites not going along with progressive shenanigans resulting in social and sometimes economic penalties,

The what now?

it's not a free choice.

Sure it is.

This is much like arguing like the reason for gender disparities in number of people in professions is due to "choice.", it's ignoring the social pressures behind it that lead to particular outcomes.

This instance also involves progressives peddling a particular view of the situation that is tantamount to racism.

"Hey man, cos blacks commit a disproportionate amount of crime, we're going to ask if you want to pay more."
"What's the problem? They were given a choice."

Using sociological stats this way in a manner that ignores class and treats all whites as causing the disparity is racism.


The social pressures here are the pressures pushed by media, progressivism etc that denies the existence of anti-white racism and tells people thinking it exists makes you a bad person. That's akin to arguing it's womens "Choice" to remain at home if their culture routinely tells them anyone who isn't barefoot and in the kitchen is a bad person, and that there's no such thing as discriminating against them.

In addition to that you've got the pressures from the same group of people and institutions that equate not capitulating to demands like this to racism.

[Kubumba Tribe]

Y'all.....
This was a social experiment, not something someone was actually doing to discriminate against white people! OP, you shoulda read the article before making this thread.

[Alvecia]

But aren't being asked in that capacity.

It doesn't fucking matter. Individual people still pay for their own food. There isn't some Grand Council of Whites that pays for it for them. This isn't fucking hard.

But they are being assumed to make more than a black customer because they make more on average.

No, they're assumed to be part of a racial group that on average makes more than another. Jenny from down the road isn't having her personal income assumed or determined. A demographic that she happens to be a part of is.

That's part of how these averages work. You can have people earning all over the spectrum, but you don't know which end Jenny might be because you're not measuring hers.

[Ifreann]

That doesn't make the gesture not symbolic.

Because the only purpose it actually serves is to make this douche bag more money.

Even if that's true, and I don't think it is, this is clearly meant as a gesture. Something to make the income disparity more real for people, not just numbers on a screen.

How are you?


You've repeated it several times. You've yet to explain it.

"You belong to racial group X which makes more. Therefore, you should pay more."

He doesn't tell anyone they should pay more. He gives them the option to pay more.

Even if you're dirt poor you're still asked to pay more.

Yes. Because the idea is to raise awareness.

---

The what now?

Sure it is.

This is much like arguing like the reason for gender disparities in number of people in professions is due to "choice.", it's ignoring the social pressures behind it that lead to particular outcomes.

What social pressures? It's one restaurant in New Orleans.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

Y'all.....
This was a social experiment, not something someone was actually doing to discriminate against white people! OP, you shoulda read the article before making this thread.

Being a social experiment and being racist are not mutually exclusive.

The "social experiment" excuse died when YT "pranksters" used it to death and ran it thru the mud.

[Kubumba Tribe]

Being a social experiment and being racist are not mutually exclusive.

The "social experiment" excuse died when YT "pranksters" used it to death and ran it thru the mud.

Wey is not a part of the pranksters.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

Being a social experiment and being racist are not mutually exclusive.

The "social experiment" excuse died when YT "pranksters" used it to death and ran it thru the mud.

Wey is not a part of the pranksters.

Doesn't matter, the excuse died when they used it to death.

[Liriena]

A better option would be if we could all just ignore everyone's skin color, including our own. Let's judge on merit, not skin color. I note that we all bleed the same color.

Is there a pay disparity? Yes. Is it from racism, or from the fact that there are more 'colored' people in some areas of the United States, and have different jobs? Unfortunately, there is some of the former, but a large amount of this disparity is from the latter point.

I certainly feel that charging any color more than any other color is racism.
Let's try be the generation that ends racism, by just ignoring race.

Quick question: Do you believe that the pay disparity is largely the result of something natural, inherent to different races? Do you believe that black people in New Orleans are just naturally predisposed to worse paying jobs?

I'm just asking because it sounds to me like the whole "let's just ignore race" thing is more at the service of saving face and not addressing uncomfortable issues than it is at the service of a genuinely better society.

[Liriena]

The original paper goes more in depth in explaining the concept.

After skimming through, there's a lot to unpack. The piece reeks of unobjectivity. It's filled with conjecture and it says itself that white fragility relies on the concept of whiteness (noticing a pattern here) which relies on the premise of white privelige. That's not how you do research. You don't look for evidence to prove your conclusions, you determine a conclusion based on the evidence. Lemme guess, "something something antipositivism."

The paper seems to have a hate-boner for "white" liberalism (there's that patter again), individualism and meritocracy. It percieves challenge to individualism as a trigger for white fragility, so I guess I've got white fragility now. It dedicates a whole paragraph to individualism wherein it intentionally misrepresents it with the academic equivalent of gotchas saying "They say we're all humans which means we're all the same but then says we're all individuals which means we're all unique, which one is it, lol." It baselessly assumes that white people seeing humans as individuals extends only to white people.

It makes so many statements which aren't proven, as if the entire paper is just a diary of something the author thinks exists. It reminds me of a a sermon, I'd say it's more theology than science, but at least theology uses scripture as a stand-in for evidence.

*shrug* It's hardly a concept set in stone, academically speaking, but given my past interactions with many fellow white people, I see much truth in it.

[Liriena]

Your 8values results give off that vibe.

I only gave myself 100% liberty as a meme, which made me an anarchist when I'm really not.

Yikes. The meme economy is really going down the gutter.

[Liriena]

...for offering you the possibility, which you could refuse, of paying more?

You'd physically assault someone for a harmless symbolic gesture?

"Choice" in the context of aggressive social and cultural norms that penalize you for acting certain ways isn't reason to ignore sexism, nor anti-white racism.

A clumsy capitalistic attempt to bring attention to vastly lower average income among black people is anti-white racism. #themoreyouknow

[Liriena]

Would you call it harmless to peddle harmful stereotypes about other races?

"This demographic in this region, on average, earns far less than this other one," is not a stereotype.

[Ostroeuropa]

"Choice" in the context of aggressive social and cultural norms that penalize you for acting certain ways isn't reason to ignore sexism, nor anti-white racism.

A clumsy capitalistic attempt to bring attention to vastly lower average income among black people is anti-white racism. #themoreyouknow

It's based on a particular form of awareness that is tantamount to racism due to how it erases and ignores relevant factors. Much like a "Science awareness day" full of white males with no others would be pretty racist, or say, a campaign about rape that perpetuated notions of male perpetrators and female victims would be sexist, especially in the context of a social environment where that ignorance and lack of awareness is a norm.

[Ostroeuropa]

Would you call it harmless to peddle harmful stereotypes about other races?

"This demographic in this region, on average, earns far less than this other one," is not a stereotype.

"Black people on average commit more crimes. So we're going to ask every black person if they want to pay the higher amount, or be followed around by the security guard. It raises awareness."

[Des-Bal]

"This demographic in this region, on average, earns far less than this other one," is not a stereotype.

Neither is "this demographic in this region, on average, commits far more crimes than this other one."

[Liriena]

A clumsy capitalistic attempt to bring attention to vastly lower average income among black people is anti-white racism. #themoreyouknow

It's based on a particular form of awareness that is tantamount to racism due to how it erases and ignores relevant factors. Much like a "Science awareness day" full of white males with no others would be pretty racist, or say, a campaign about rape that perpetuated notions of male perpetrators and female victims would be sexist, especially in the context of a social environment where that ignorance and lack of awareness is a norm.

A fair point.

[Kubumba Tribe]

Wey is not a part of the pranksters.

Doesn't matter, the excuse died when they used it to death.

Ok, when they used it, not when Wey was actually doing it.