Left Wing Discussion Thread IV: Oh Hai Marx

[Proctopeo]

Isn't libertarian communism just anarchism?

Libertarian communism includes left anarchism/libertarian socialism, council communism, Autonomism, Open Marxism, Luxemburgism, and others.

The Welsh Union has capitulated.

It’s worth remembering that authoritarian leftists are still the enemy for democratic leftists.

Authoritarian social democracy tho.

D E S T R O Y T H E K L A N
E D U C A T I O N F O R T H E M A S S E S
E N D P O L L T A X
W E A L T H T A X A C T
S O C I A L S E C U R I T Y

*applause*

I M P E R I A L P R E S I D E N C Y
M A X I M U M I N C O M E A C T
R O O T O U T T R A I T O R S
F I G H T F I R E W I T H F I R E
C A R R Y A B I G S T I C K

*confused applause*

( https://i.redd.it/usctwhicnag01.jpg )

Democracy and authoritarianism are not at odds, necessarily. Doesn't mean authoritarianism is good, just that it can be democratic.

Trump on the campaign trail appealed to the Auth-Soc-Dem sentiment imo.

Every Man a King!

[Ostroeuropa]

Libertarian communism includes left anarchism/libertarian socialism, council communism, Autonomism, Open Marxism, Luxemburgism, and others.

The Welsh Union has capitulated.

Authoritarian social democracy tho.

D E S T R O Y T H E K L A N
E D U C A T I O N F O R T H E M A S S E S
E N D P O L L T A X
W E A L T H T A X A C T
S O C I A L S E C U R I T Y

*applause*

I M P E R I A L P R E S I D E N C Y
M A X I M U M I N C O M E A C T
R O O T O U T T R A I T O R S
F I G H T F I R E W I T H F I R E
C A R R Y A B I G S T I C K

*confused applause*

( https://i.redd.it/usctwhicnag01.jpg )

Democracy and authoritarianism are not at odds, necessarily. Doesn't mean authoritarianism is good, just that it can be democratic.

Trump on the campaign trail appealed to the Auth-Soc-Dem sentiment imo.

Every Man a King!

Let's watch the kingfish at work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hphgHi6FD8k

[Democratic Communist Federation]

The Welsh Union has capitulated.

To what?

[Proctopeo]

The Welsh Union has capitulated.

To what?

It's a Kaiserreich meme. Blame the Autonomists (Radical Socialists).

[Ostroeuropa]

The Welsh Union has capitulated.

To what?

It's a Kaiserreich meme. If you side with Radical Socialists (Autonomists) in the Union of Britain, they turn the Union of Britain into Welsh Union, Scottish Union, and English Union when you decide to abolish the trade union congress and devolve power to townships.
Because wales is small, as soon as Cardiff is occupied, they surrender, but it's on the border of England, so often there's an immediate retaliation from their allies, and as soon as it's recaptured, the welsh union rebounds. Leading to a series of notifications that the welsh union has capitulated spamming everyone when there's a battle over wales.

It's one major reason people who play UOB tend to side with Mosley and his Maximists (Totalitarians obsessed with a centralized socialist state, to the extent there's an event to "Centralize Art" that leads to bringing all the art in the nation to one place.) or the Congregationists (Syndicalists, who run the country through the trade union congress, and have pacifist and interventionist subfactions.)

Radical socialism tends to represent non-totalitarian socialism in the game, often anarchists. (In france, it's Anarchistes.). Maximism/Totalism/National Syndicalists for the totalitarian socialists and syndicalists. The rest are Syndicalists. Most socialist nations in the early stages have events where the three factions struggle for power. Seeing Union of britain turn radical socialist gets groans, because WELSH UNION HAS CAPITULATED.

In the Kaiserreich community, radical socialists (Any type of socialist that isn't a syndicalist or a totalitarian) are the butt of a lot of jokes, but then, everyone is.

Totalists: REPLACE THE CHAINS!
Syndicalists: BREAK THE CHAINS!
Radical Socialists: IS MAYONNAISE A CHAIN!
Social Democrats: POLITELY ASK FOR THE CHAINS TO BE REMOVED!
Social Liberals: BREAK ONLY THESE SPECIFIC CHAINS PLEASE!
Market Liberals: WHAT CHAINS!
Social Conservative: THE CHAINS 50 YEARS AGO WERE BETTER!
Authoritarian Dem: THESE ARE MY FAVORITE CHAINS! WOULD YOU LIKE TO TRY THEM?
Paternal Autocrat: THESE WERE MY GREAT GREAT GREAT GRANDFATHERS CHAINS, YOU PEASANT!
National Populist: WEAPONIZE THE CHAINS!

As an example.

Kaiserreich itself is an alternative timeline where Germany doesn't pursue unrestricted naval warfare in WW1, and the US stays out of the war.
Eventually Germans occupy Paris, but the war continues to 1921, eventually resulting in the "peace with honor" and a reverse outcome to the historical one.
The Soviets are put down by an emboldened Germany and the Kerensky republic endures. Thus, soviet communism is viewed as a fringe and discredited ideology.

The economic sanctions and anger at loss of even more land in france leads to a revolution, which, because it occurs in an industrialized and western nation rather than Russia, takes on different characteristics, and is a Syndicalist revolution of the unions seizing power. This then becomes the hegemonic ideology of the radical left wing, instead of Leninism.
There's a miners strike in the UK, and the government, panicking over revolutionary tendencies, cracks down, which backfires.

Things go on from there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7VAxt7Dhs8

[Democratic Communist Federation]

It's a Kaiserreich meme. Blame the Autonomists (Radical Socialists).

Oh, okay. Well, I am only partially an Autonomist, so I can only be blamed partially.

[Proctopeo]

It's a Kaiserreich meme. Blame the Autonomists (Radical Socialists).

Oh, okay. Well, I am only partially an Autonomist, so I can only be blamed partially.

In KR you'd probably be some kind of RadSoc anyway, assuming you're not left-Syndicalist or an authoritarian leftist. Or a Social Democrat.

[Ostroeuropa]

Oh, okay. Well, I am only partially an Autonomist, so I can only be blamed partially.

In KR you'd probably be some kind of RadSoc anyway, assuming you're not left-Syndicalist or an authoritarian leftist. Or a Social Democrat.

Which faction do you side with Proctopeo? Curious since you're centre-right.
You're not a Garner guy are you?

[Thermodolia]

To what?

It's a Kaiserreich meme. If you side with Radical Socialists (Autonomists) in the Union of Britain, they turn the Union of Britain into Welsh Union, Scottish Union, and English Union when you decide to abolish the trade union congress and devolve power to townships.
Because wales is small, as soon as Cardiff is occupied, they surrender, but it's on the border of England, so often there's an immediate retaliation from their allies, and as soon as it's recaptured, the welsh union rebounds. Leading to a series of notifications that the welsh union has capitulated spamming everyone when there's a battle over wales.

It's one major reason people who play UOB tend to side with Mosley and his Maximists (Totalitarians obsessed with a centralized socialist state, to the extent there's an event to "Centralize Art" that leads to bringing all the art in the nation to one place.) or the Congregationists (Syndicalists, who run the country through the trade union congress, and have pacifist and interventionist subfactions.)

Radical socialism tends to represent non-totalitarian socialism in the game, often anarchists. (In france, it's Anarchistes.). Maximism/Totalism/National Syndicalists for the totalitarian socialists and syndicalists. The rest are Syndicalists. Most socialist nations in the early stages have events where the three factions struggle for power. Seeing Union of britain turn radical socialist gets groans, because WELSH UNION HAS CAPITULATED.

In the Kaiserreich community, radical socialists (Any type of socialist that isn't a syndicalist or a totalitarian) are the butt of a lot of jokes, but then, everyone is.

Totalists: REPLACE THE CHAINS!
Syndicalists: BREAK THE CHAINS!
Radical Socialists: IS MAYONNAISE A CHAIN!
Social Democrats: POLITELY ASK FOR THE CHAINS TO BE REMOVED!
Social Liberals: BREAK ONLY THESE SPECIFIC CHAINS PLEASE!
Market Liberals: WHAT CHAINS!
Social Conservative: THE CHAINS 50 YEARS AGO WERE BETTER!
Authoritarian Dem: THESE ARE MY FAVORITE CHAINS! WOULD YOU LIKE TO TRY THEM?
Paternal Autocrat: THESE WERE MY GREAT GREAT GREAT GRANDFATHERS CHAINS, YOU PEASANT!
National Populist: WEAPONIZE THE CHAINS!

As an example.

Kaiserreich itself is an alternative timeline where Germany doesn't pursue unrestricted naval warfare in WW1, and the US stays out of the war.
Eventually Germans occupy Paris, but the war continues to 1921, eventually resulting in the "peace with honor" and a reverse outcome to the historical one.
The Soviets are put down by an emboldened Germany and the Kerensky republic endures. Thus, soviet communism is viewed as a fringe and discredited ideology.

The economic sanctions and anger at loss of even more land in france leads to a revolution, which, because it occurs in an industrialized and western nation rather than Russia, takes on different characteristics, and is a Syndicalist revolution of the unions seizing power. This then becomes the hegemonic ideology of the radical left wing, instead of Leninism.
There's a miners strike in the UK, and the government, panicking over revolutionary tendencies, cracks down, which backfires.

Things go on from there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7VAxt7Dhs8

Oh god that’s so true. Especially the RadSoc and NatPop. I personally love playing as the Kaiserreich. In one game somehow Russia became a monarchy and joined Mitteleuropa.

[Thermodolia]

In KR you'd probably be some kind of RadSoc anyway, assuming you're not left-Syndicalist or an authoritarian leftist. Or a Social Democrat.

Which faction do you side with Proctopeo? Curious since you're centre-right.
You're not a Garner guy are you?

MacArthur for me!!

[Liriena]

Cutting taxes is not necessarily laissez-faire. Taxes under the Ancien Régime were exclusively on the poor and middle class. Both socialists and liberals would favor cutting taxes under such a scenario.

A minimum platform for any good socialist would include: Cutting taxes further for working class people, eliminating sales taxes on everyday items, a prohibitive tariffs and further luxury taxation on all European cars.

Woof. :3

[Proctopeo]

In KR you'd probably be some kind of RadSoc anyway, assuming you're not left-Syndicalist or an authoritarian leftist. Or a Social Democrat.

Which faction do you side with Proctopeo? Curious since you're centre-right.
You're not a Garner guy are you?

Market Liberals. So, yes, a Garner guy.
Syndicalism ain't worth a bucket of warm spit, after all.

[Reikoku]

Oh, okay. Well, I am only partially an Autonomist, so I can only be blamed partially.

In KR you'd probably be some kind of RadSoc anyway, assuming you're not left-Syndicalist or an authoritarian leftist. Or a Social Democrat.

As someone who's a Francophile, conquering Germany in the name of Sorelian France was glorious.

[Ostroeuropa]

Which faction do you side with Proctopeo? Curious since you're centre-right.
You're not a Garner guy are you?

Market Liberals. So, yes, a Garner guy.
Syndicalism ain't worth a bucket of warm spit, after all.

*Glowing eyes of doom*

Why not Huey? Let's prevent bloodshed.

Which faction do you side with Proctopeo? Curious since you're centre-right.
You're not a Garner guy are you?

MacArthur for me!!

Ave, true to Caesar.
...I- I mean, N-No, MacArthur is a meanie!
...

[Proctopeo]

Market Liberals. So, yes, a Garner guy.
Syndicalism ain't worth a bucket of warm spit, after all.

*Glowing eyes of doom*

Why not Huey? Let's prevent bloodshed.

Huey is also an acceptable option.
But nobody is better than Cactus Jack.

[Democratic Communist Federation]

The problem with centrism is it doesn't have any kind of core beliefs. People on the far-right and far-left could easily consider themselves centrist. Where you put the line between left and right is completely arbitrary.

I cannot speak for the right, but I will speak for the Left, which is certainly not an arbitrary category. The Left stands, in the case of Marxism, for the replacement of capitalism with communism or socialism and, in the case of left Anarchism, for the replacement of verticalism with horizontalism.

[Democratic Communist Federation]

You should find a better word to describe your ideology than centrism though. Everyone thinks they're a centrist and that their ideology perfectly balances both sides.

Not everyone. Just ask Tariq Ali (or me for that matter).

[Democratic Communist Federation]

In KR you'd probably be some kind of RadSoc anyway, assuming you're not left-Syndicalist or an authoritarian leftist. Or a Social Democrat.

I prefer libertarian or left communist, but radical socialist will do.

[Proctopeo]

In KR you'd probably be some kind of RadSoc anyway, assuming you're not left-Syndicalist or an authoritarian leftist. Or a Social Democrat.

I prefer libertarian or left communist, but radical socialist will do.

Neither of those are options (currently, IDK what the planned ideology rework will add), so yeah, RadSoc.

[Reikoku]

Oh for fuck's sake more slander.

It's not slander when the main thing the Pro-Life movement is known for is getting in front of clinics and shouting at pregnant women to scare them away.

I told you don't debate this.

Then why are you posting it on a debate forum?

You're disgusting by harassing me for my beliefs when I said let's not discuss it.

So drop it.

No.

Also if you're pro-life, you're going to believe planned parenthood does that.

If you're a Young Earth Creationist, you're going to believe the world is 6,000 years old. It doesn't make it true. Neither do lies about Planned Parenthood.

Stop being one of the oppressive people who are trying to ostracize pro-life people from the left for trying to in their eyes stop murder.

I don't need to. Your position has done a fine enough job of that itself.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

It’s worth remembering that authoritarian leftists are still the enemy for democratic leftists.

Authoritarian social democracy tho.

D E S T R O Y T H E K L A N
E D U C A T I O N F O R T H E M A S S E S
E N D P O L L T A X
W E A L T H T A X A C T
S O C I A L S E C U R I T Y

*applause*

I M P E R I A L P R E S I D E N C Y
M A X I M U M I N C O M E A C T
R O O T O U T T R A I T O R S
F I G H T F I R E W I T H F I R E
C A R R Y A B I G S T I C K

*confused applause*

( https://i.redd.it/usctwhicnag01.jpg )

Democracy and authoritarianism are not at odds, necessarily. Doesn't mean authoritarianism is good, just that it can be democratic.

Trump on the campaign trail appealed to the Auth-Soc-Dem sentiment imo.

Democracy and authoritarianism aren't at odds in theory, but unless you place massive restrictions on speech, an authoritarian democracy becomes hard to sustain because eventually, people will vote for more liberal candidates.

[Democratic Communist Federation]

Democracy and authoritarianism are not at odds, necessarily. Doesn't mean authoritarianism is good, just that it can be democratic.

IMO, proletarian democracy and authoritarianism are polar opposites.

[Bakery Hill]

A minimum platform for any good socialist would include: Cutting taxes further for working class people, eliminating sales taxes on everyday items, a prohibitive tariffs and further luxury taxation on all European cars.

Woof. :3

Oh yes, and ban the furries, almost forgot.

[Kubra]

Democracy and authoritarianism are not at odds, necessarily. Doesn't mean authoritarianism is good, just that it can be democratic.

IMO, proletarian democracy and authoritarianism are polar opposites.

yeah until the sans culottes storm in and demand terror be made the order of the day

[Aellex]

Woof. :3

Oh yes, and ban the furries, almost forgot.

Ban? I was promised by you a purge.
Are you betraying your engagement to the Committee, Camarade Bakery ?