Iceland To Ban Male Circumcision

[Camicon]

It's more likely your routine Holocaust denial that's lead people to think you might be a Nazi than your stance on circumcision.

I am not a Nazi although I am a fascist. I don't believe in the racial stuff the Nazis said

He says, while spouting Holocaust denial propaganda.

Take this conversation somewhere else, this thread is not the place for it.

[Audioslavia]

Whats next muh the gorillion

You're clearly not getting the message with regards to shit-tier trolling, so here's a *** one week ban ***. Maybe go away and write 'regurgitating extremist memes isn't really what I should be doing with my time on NS' on a chalkboard.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

As a circumcised Jew I support banning circumcision until adulthood when the individual can at last consent to such 'modification' to one's genitals.

I read that Judaism states that cirumcision should be done 8 days after birth.

[Frostnia]

As a circumcised Jew I support banning circumcision until adulthood when the individual can at last consent to such 'modification' to one's genitals.

I read that Judaism states that cirumcision should be done 8 days after birth.

...Ok?

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

It's not good news when a nation violates religious freedom. Are they aware of the religious significance of circumcision for Judaism?

If Judaism condones this practice, Judaism is wrong.

Of course, whether or not it does depends on how you interpret its holy book. Which, if it's like any other religion's holy book, is probably just as riddled with contradictions.

[Camelone]

I'm Catholic and an American and I'm circumcised. I mean it's nowhere near as bad as FGM and I didn't even know I was circumcised until last year when I put two and two together, I'm 20 by the way. So I don't really see the point to this male circumcision isn't that big of a deal.

[Salus Maior]

As a circumcised Jew I support banning circumcision until adulthood when the individual can at last consent to such 'modification' to one's genitals.

As great as it is that you're a Jew, you also can't speak for your entire community. Especially with an opinion that runs contrary to Jewish doctrine so brazenly.

[Diogott]

I'm Catholic and an American and I'm circumcised. I mean it's nowhere near as bad as FGM and I didn't even know I was circumcised until last year when I put two and two together, I'm 20 by the way. So I don't really see the point to this male circumcision isn't that big of a deal.

It's a matter of consent though.

If someone asked if they could cut the tip of your cock off as an adult, presumably you'd be given the choice of whether you want to or not.

Babies aren't really capable of articulating their concerns.

[Salus Maior]

I'm Catholic and an American and I'm circumcised. I mean it's nowhere near as bad as FGM and I didn't even know I was circumcised until last year when I put two and two together, I'm 20 by the way. So I don't really see the point to this male circumcision isn't that big of a deal.

It's a matter of consent though.

If someone asked if they could cut the tip of your cock off as an adult, presumably you'd be given the choice of whether you want to or not.

Babies aren't really capable of articulating their concerns.

That's true of many decisions parents make for their children as they grow up.

[Des-Bal]

I'm Catholic and an American and I'm circumcised. I mean it's nowhere near as bad as FGM and I didn't even know I was circumcised until last year when I put two and two together, I'm 20 by the way. So I don't really see the point to this male circumcision isn't that big of a deal.

If on the day you were circumcised someone molested you you probably wouldn't know about it. You don't get to do things to baby's just because they'll forget.

[Blood Wine]

Glad to see it, but it goes too far imo, consenting adults should be able to get a circumcision if they want - circumcising a baby however is unethical, immoral and evil and should be outright banned for the child abuse it is

[Salus Maior]

I'm Catholic and an American and I'm circumcised. I mean it's nowhere near as bad as FGM and I didn't even know I was circumcised until last year when I put two and two together, I'm 20 by the way. So I don't really see the point to this male circumcision isn't that big of a deal.

If on the day you were circumcised someone molested you you probably wouldn't know about it. You don't get to do things to baby's just because they'll forget.

You're really the king of bad comparisons, Des-Bal.

[Camicon]

I'm Catholic and an American and I'm circumcised. I mean it's nowhere near as bad as FGM and I didn't even know I was circumcised until last year when I put two and two together, I'm 20 by the way. So I don't really see the point to this male circumcision isn't that big of a deal.

Why it's a big deal:

The number of births in the USA in 2014 was 3,988,076. Circumcision causes 117 neonatal deaths in the USA every year. Assuming that all newborns are male, and that all newborns are circumcised, that's 1 death for every 34086 newborns. Again, assuming all newborns are male, and assuming all newborns are circumcised, 1 in 34000 will be killed by circumcision.

Adjusting for the actual percentages of male/female births (1.05/1), and circumcised/uncircumcised newborns (.547/.453), there is approximately 1 neonatal death for every 10255 circumcisions. Nearly ten times higher than the penile cancer diagnosis rate, which is roughly 1 for every 100,000 men in the USA.

This is the report that most people use to justify their stance on circumcision and the benefits it provides regarding STI prevention. This study is in no way generalizable. Sub-Saharan Africa is not comparable to the USA, or any other developed nation: they lack the same infrastructure, education about health and cleanliness, education about STI's and STI prevention. Not only that, but the study looked specifically at HIV prevention, not STI prevention.

Circumcision is, in almost all cases, an unnecessary and potentially deadly medical procedure. It provides no benefits which cannot be replicated by a five-second application of clean water. Not to mention, it is a gross violation of bodily sovereignty.

[Des-Bal]

You're really the king of bad comparisons, Des-Bal.

No you're just really good at ignoring parallels while screaming "anti-semite!"

[Blood Wine]

I'm Catholic and an American and I'm circumcised. I mean it's nowhere near as bad as FGM and I didn't even know I was circumcised until last year when I put two and two together, I'm 20 by the way. So I don't really see the point to this male circumcision isn't that big of a deal.

Why it's a big deal:

The number of births in the USA in 2014 was 3,988,076. Circumcision causes 117 neonatal deaths in the USA every year. Assuming that all newborns are male, and that all newborns are circumcised, that's 1 death for every 34086 newborns. Again, assuming all newborns are male, and assuming all newborns are circumcised, 1 in 34000 will be killed by circumcision.

Adjusting for the actual percentages of male/female births (1.05/1), and circumcised/uncircumcised newborns (.547/.453), there is approximately 1 neonatal death for every 10255 circumcisions. Nearly ten times higher than the penile cancer diagnosis rate, which is roughly 1 for every 100,000 men in the USA.

This is the report that most people use to justify their stance on circumcision and the benefits it provides regarding STI prevention. This study is in no way generalizable. Sub-Saharan Africa is not comparable to the USA, or any other developed nation: they lack the same infrastructure, education about health and cleanliness, education about STI's and STI prevention. Not only that, but the study looked specifically at HIV prevention, not STI prevention.

Circumcision is, in almost all cases, an unnecessary and potentially deadly medical procedure. It provides no benefits which cannot be replicated by a five-second application of clean water. Not to mention, it is a gross violation of bodily sovereignty.

Nice stats, 100% agree with you

[El-Amin Caliphate]

I read that Judaism states that cirumcision should be done 8 days after birth.

...Ok?

So what he's/she's saying is possibly against Judaism's teachings. Like Salus Maior said:

As a circumcised Jew I support banning circumcision until adulthood when the individual can at last consent to such 'modification' to one's genitals.

As great as it is that you're a Jew, you also can't speak for your entire community. Especially with an opinion that runs contrary to Jewish doctrine so brazenly.

[Albynau]

Strikes me as not all that different from tattooing a baby, law makes sense to me.

[Salus Maior]

You're really the king of bad comparisons, Des-Bal.

No you're just really good at ignoring parallels while screaming "anti-semite!"

Raping and molesting children isn't the same thing as circumcision. And note, I haven't called anyone here an antisemite, I called the law antisemitic because it's discriminatory against Jewish practice. Which it is.

[Blood Wine]

No you're just really good at ignoring parallels while screaming "anti-semite!"

Raping and molesting children isn't the same thing as circumcision. And note, I haven't called anyone here an antisemite, I called the law antisemitic because it's discriminatory against Jewish practice. Which it is.

It's not aimed at jewish practice, it's aimed at child abuse (AKA circumcision)

[Salus Maior]

I'm Catholic and an American and I'm circumcised. I mean it's nowhere near as bad as FGM and I didn't even know I was circumcised until last year when I put two and two together, I'm 20 by the way. So I don't really see the point to this male circumcision isn't that big of a deal.

Why it's a big deal:

The number of births in the USA in 2014 was 3,988,076. Circumcision causes 117 neonatal deaths in the USA every year. Assuming that all newborns are male, and that all newborns are circumcised, that's 1 death for every 34086 newborns. Again, assuming all newborns are male, and assuming all newborns are circumcised, 1 in 34000 will be killed by circumcision.

Adjusting for the actual percentages of male/female births (1.05/1), and circumcised/uncircumcised newborns (.547/.453), there is approximately 1 neonatal death for every 10255 circumcisions. Nearly ten times higher than the penile cancer diagnosis rate, which is roughly 1 for every 100,000 men in the USA.

This is the report that most people use to justify their stance on circumcision and the benefits it provides regarding STI prevention. This study is in no way generalizable. Sub-Saharan Africa is not comparable to the USA, or any other developed nation: they lack the same infrastructure, education about health and cleanliness, education about STI's and STI prevention. Not only that, but the study looked specifically at HIV prevention, not STI prevention.

Circumcision is, in almost all cases, an unnecessary and potentially deadly medical procedure. It provides no benefits which cannot be replicated by a five-second application of clean water. Not to mention, it is a gross violation of bodily sovereignty.

One thing I want to point out which is relevant to the point I'm making, is that 1. it doesn't state anything about circumcision by a Mohel (a Jewish ritual circumciser), or anything about its effects on the Jewish population or Jewish boys. And I'm not inclined to equate the secular physician (whose been doing this work for like what? Since the Victorian era at most?) vs. the Jewish Mohel, who has been doing this for more than 2000 years and may do it differently.

2. I also want to point out that the tragic deaths listed are mostly from circumcisions that are clearly and horribly botched, or obviously had something else going on. Like that one kid who was oxygen deprived? How the hell?

And for that matter, I do agree that it's wrong that circumcision is the default in American hospitals. It shouldn't happen as an automatic part of birth.

[Salus Maior]

Raping and molesting children isn't the same thing as circumcision. And note, I haven't called anyone here an antisemite, I called the law antisemitic because it's discriminatory against Jewish practice. Which it is.

It's not aimed at jewish practice, it's aimed at child abuse (AKA circumcision)

And circumcision is an important part of Jewish practice as part of the Mosaic Covenant. It's part of what defines Jews as Jews.

[Anywhere Else But Here]

It's not aimed at jewish practice, it's aimed at child abuse (AKA circumcision)

And circumcision is an important part of Jewish practice as part of the Mosaic Covenant. It's part of what defines Jews as Jews.

Guess they'll have to wait until eighteen to be Jews, then.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Raping and molesting children isn't the same thing as circumcision. And note, I haven't called anyone here an antisemite, I called the law antisemitic because it's discriminatory against Jewish practice. Which it is.

It's not aimed at jewish practice, it's aimed at child abuse (AKA circumcision)

Circumcision is a Jewish practice

[Blood Wine]

Why it's a big deal:

One thing I want to point out which is relevant to the point I'm making, is that 1. it doesn't state anything about circumcision by a Mohel (a Jewish ritual circumciser), or anything about its effects on the Jewish population or Jewish boys. And I'm not inclined to equate the secular physician (whose been doing this work for like what? Since the Victorian era at most?) vs. the Jewish Mohel, who has been doing this for more than 2000 years and may do it differently.

2. I also want to point out that the tragic deaths listed are mostly from circumcisions that are clearly and horribly botched, or obviously had something else going on. Like that one kid who was oxygen deprived? How the hell?

And for that matter, I do agree that it's wrong that circumcision is the default in American hospitals. It shouldn't happen as an automatic part of birth.

1. You DO know that a licensed surgeon is far more skilled at cosmetic surgery then some random religious official + experience doesn't carry over from generation to generation any more then a trained professional?
2. Missing the point completely, all surgeries carry risk, and do to do without consent is unethical and immoral

It's not aimed at jewish practice, it's aimed at child abuse (AKA circumcision)

And circumcision is an important part of Jewish practice as part of the Mosaic Covenant. It's part of what defines Jews as Jews.[/quote]

If your religion requires you to mutilate your children then it might be time to re- evaluate your religious practices, regardless of such the bill is aimed at circumcision, not jewish people, so you can stop insulting people over a clearly non-targeted law

[Blood Wine]

Circumcision is a Jewish practice

Irrelevant

edit: misnested quote tags