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Societal collapse of Oklahoma!

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
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Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:17 am

Maybe splitting the state in two and make one part Democratic Socialists is a good after all.
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Salandriagado
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Salandriagado » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:28 am

Northern Davincia wrote:
Salandriagado wrote:
"We tried this. It failed miserably. Let's do it some more!"

Oklahoma made the mistake of not acclimating people to living without government services. It's not a leap to be taken quickly.


Or in other words: the market failed to react quickly enough. Turns out, markets are really shit at reacting quickly.
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Anachronous Rex wrote:Good thing most a majority of people aren't so small-minded, and frightened of other's sexuality.

Over 40% (including me), are, so I fixed the post for accuracy.

Vilatania wrote:
Salandriagado wrote:
Notice that the link is to the notes from a university course on probability. You clearly have nothing beyond the most absurdly simplistic understanding of the subject.
By choosing 1, you no longer have 0 probability of choosing 1. End of subject.

(read up the quote stack)

Deal. £3000 do?[/quote]

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Liriena
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Liriena » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:32 am

Northern Davincia wrote:
Liriena wrote:You mean in the ideal, perfectly transparent and atomized free market that doesn't actually exist and would most likely not be born from this privatization?

A consumer's ability to dictate the quality and availability of services in a privatized system will largely depend on how much genuine competition there is (i.e. the system better not be a monopoly, an oligopoly, or a monopolistic competition model like cable companies), and how committed to accurately informing consumers the system is... which history teaches us it generally isn't. There's often a vast, vast difference between what's advertised to consumers and told to the media and what's said to shareholders (see: how private prisons advertise themselves to their clients as skilled rehabilitators while telling their investors that business is great because of all the recidivism and demanding that law enforcement find any excuse possible to arrest people so they can keep a large and profitable prison population).

If you ask me, it's a lot smarter and better for everyone but the greedy bastards in the private sector to cut the middle man and keep these services entirely public and dedicated entirely to providing them to as many people as possible at the highest quality possible, profitability be damned.

You complain about monopolies harming service quality, yet ignore the monopolistic nature of government itself. Why should education be entirely public if people see better alternatives in the private sector?

People can vote for how public services are handled, either through their representatives or through ballot measures. And they don't have to become shareholders in a for-profit scheme to get that vote.
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Liriena
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Postby Liriena » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:33 am

Kiwination wrote:
Northern Davincia wrote:You complain about monopolies harming service quality, yet ignore the monopolistic nature of government itself. Why should education be entirely public if people see better alternatives in the private sector?


Um...
It's not, and people do. Private schools do exist, people aren't forced to send their kids to a public school, it's just that many cannot afford an alternative. The reason private schooling isn't as widespread as it could be iss because of that somewhat restrictive cost of attending those schools.

I would lowkey ban private schools.
The Fabulous Pope of NS


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
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Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:35 am

This thread reminds me of all those "No true version of Nazism/Fascism/Communism has been implemented in any country yet" arguments.
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Dahon
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Postby Dahon » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:36 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:This thread reminds me of all those "No true version of Nazism/Fascism/Communism has been implemented in any country yet" arguments.


*raises right hand*

I do solemnly swear...
Authoritarianism kills all. Never forget that.

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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:01 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:This thread reminds me of all those "No true version of Nazism/Fascism/Communism has been implemented in any country yet" arguments.


Conservatism can never fail, it can only be failed after all.
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Aillyria
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Postby Aillyria » Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:29 am

Vassenor wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:This thread reminds me of all those "No true version of Nazism/Fascism/Communism has been implemented in any country yet" arguments.


Conservatism can never fail, it can only be failed after all.

Not really Conservativism, tbh, just libertarian economics.
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Well you aren't a real socialist. Just a sociopath disguised as one.
Not to mention that this thread split off from LWDT, so I assumed you would think this thread was a "revisionist hellhole".

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Thama
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Postby Thama » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:34 am

Senkaku wrote:So convince a 75%+ majority of the legislature to raise taxes. Shouldn't be so hard if shit's in such bad shape.


Shouldn't be so hard if shit's in such bad shape.


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Sovaal
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Postby Sovaal » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:40 am

Aillyria wrote:
Vassenor wrote:
Conservatism can never fail, it can only be failed after all.

Not really Conservativism, tbh, just libertarian economics.

More just bad governance then anything really. Can’t slash the taxes and expect everything to stay the same.

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Kernen
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Postby Kernen » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:41 am

Sovaal wrote:
Aillyria wrote:Not really Conservativism, tbh, just libertarian economics.

More just bad governance then anything really. Can’t slash the taxes and expect everything to stay the same.

Well, clearly you can. Its just unwise.
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Tierra Prime
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Tierra Prime » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:42 am

You'd think that most people would have a handle on the idea that you need taxes to pay for public services. Money doesn't just grow on trees.

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Sovaal
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Postby Sovaal » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:43 am

Kernen wrote:
Sovaal wrote:More just bad governance then anything really. Can’t slash the taxes and expect everything to stay the same.

Well, clearly you can. Its just unwise.

Touché.

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Sovaal
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Postby Sovaal » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:44 am

Tierra Prime wrote:You'd think that most people would have a handle on the idea that you need taxes to pay for public services. Money doesn't just grow on trees.

Well it seems Monsanto has their next project all laid out.

Dirty centrist
Unapologetic Jon Snow supporter
"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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Vassenor
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vassenor » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:45 am

Tierra Prime wrote:You'd think that most people would have a handle on the idea that you need taxes to pay for public services. Money doesn't just grow on trees.


#magicmoneytree was the best meme of the 2017 GE.
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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:45 am

Thama wrote:
Senkaku wrote:So convince a 75%+ majority of the legislature to raise taxes. Shouldn't be so hard if shit's in such bad shape.


Shouldn't be so hard if shit's in such bad shape.


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Welcome to the OK State.

Homeplace of the dumbass local GOP.
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Sovaal
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Sovaal » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:47 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:Maybe splitting the state in two and make one part Democratic Socialists is a good after all.

We’ll hich part would be which, and where would the line be drawn?

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"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:50 am

Sovaal wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:Maybe splitting the state in two and make one part Democratic Socialists is a good after all.

We’ll hich part would be which, and where would the line be drawn?


Split it up NE and SW right down the middle.
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Kramanica
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Postby Kramanica » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:50 am

Then convince the 75% to raise taxes if things are so shit.
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Kernen
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Postby Kernen » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:51 am

Kramanica wrote:Then convince the 75% to raise taxes if things are so shit.

Democracy is easy! Just convince more people to vote for you than anybody else! Lets not oversimplify the issue.
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From the throne of Khan Juk i'Behemoti, Juk Who-Is-The-Strength-of-the-Behemoth, Supreme Khan of the Ogres of Kernen. May the Khan ever drink the blood of his enemies!

Screw your society. I don't want to be part of it.

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Sovaal
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Sovaal » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:51 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
Sovaal wrote:We’ll hich part would be which, and where would the line be drawn?


Split it up NE and SW right down the middle.

So which is dem doc and which is not, why are the DemSocs DemSocs?

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"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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Kramanica
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Ex-Nation

Postby Kramanica » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:53 am

Kernen wrote:
Kramanica wrote:Then convince the 75% to raise taxes if things are so shit.

Democracy is easy! Just convince more people to vote for you than anybody else! Lets not oversimplify the issue.

It isn't easy, but that is essentially what happens.
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Internationalist Bastard
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Internationalist Bastard » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:54 am

Now irony aside, when are the feds getting involved
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Kramanica
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Postby Kramanica » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:54 am

Liriena wrote:
Kiwination wrote:
Um...
It's not, and people do. Private schools do exist, people aren't forced to send their kids to a public school, it's just that many cannot afford an alternative. The reason private schooling isn't as widespread as it could be iss because of that somewhat restrictive cost of attending those schools.

I would lowkey ban private schools.

Yeah, let the government have a monopoly on education. That's great...
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Kernen
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Postby Kernen » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:55 am

Kramanica wrote:
Kernen wrote:Democracy is easy! Just convince more people to vote for you than anybody else! Lets not oversimplify the issue.

It isn't easy, but that is essentially what happens.

Gross oversimplifications don't contribute to the discussion, so it seems pointless to make that assertion.

There's an undertone of paternalism in the alternative: finding a way to force the issue in a non-democratic manner, through the state's executive power or even federal intrusion. I wonder if perhaps that would be more effective than a democratic solution.
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From the throne of Khan Juk i'Behemoti, Juk Who-Is-The-Strength-of-the-Behemoth, Supreme Khan of the Ogres of Kernen. May the Khan ever drink the blood of his enemies!

Screw your society. I don't want to be part of it.

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