Should Felons be Allowed to Vote? Florida to Have Referendum

[Tyrassueb]

Served your time and out of the big house and no longer on parole? Then yes, they should be allowed their vote back.

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

People who've been released from prison obviously should be able to vote again, but I don't think there is any real point in letting anyone who is incarcerated to vote. These are people who because of their circumstances- likely won't be informed on the issues, aren't able to follow the news or participate in any aspect of civic life and perhaps will have undue biases against the judicial and criminal justice system.

A bias that is at least somewhat isolated, whereas the "letting people who make the laws determine who gets to vote" feedback loop is not.

[Liriena]

While your a prisoner yes. But why should that apply after? What exactly is a criminal vote?

A vote cast by a mind capable of breaking the law. What value does such a vote hold? Only negative and danger!

That sort of thinking is painfully simplistic and borderline childish. People make mistakes, mistakes for which they can and often do atone. Once they've served their time and paid their fines, continuing to deny them their political rights makes no sense. It's just pointless political sadism thinly veiled as moralism, specially once you take into account that "the law" often includes unfair laws and minor, victimless crimes.

Should small marijuana growers and smokers have their right to vote permanently taken away from them? Should the men imprisoned under the since ruled unconstitutional anti-sodomy laws lose their right to vote?

[Liriena]

yes they do

So, if I'm not mistaken, this needs at least 60% of the vote to pass. I don't think it will TBH.

Yeah, this is the sort of stuff that would be very easy to make an effective negative campaign about. I generally have faith in people, but the way in which most of us learn to think about crime and punishment pretty much guarantees that we'll often be all too willing to overlook or outright justify this sort of thing. It's extremely tempting and easy to hate that big scary "other" that is convicted criminals to the point of dehumanization.

[Arlenton]

So, if I'm not mistaken, this needs at least 60% of the vote to pass. I don't think it will TBH.

Yeah, this is the sort of stuff that would be very easy to make an effective negative campaign about. I generally have faith in people, but the way in which most of us learn to think about crime and punishment pretty much guarantees that we'll often be all too willing to overlook or outright justify this sort of thing. It's extremely tempting and easy to hate that big scary "other" that is convicted criminals to the point of dehumanization.

Medical marijuana legalization got only 57%. This felons voting issue should be much more divisive. Which is why I really doubt it will pass. Or even have much of a chance, frankly.

[Liriena]

Yeah, this is the sort of stuff that would be very easy to make an effective negative campaign about. I generally have faith in people, but the way in which most of us learn to think about crime and punishment pretty much guarantees that we'll often be all too willing to overlook or outright justify this sort of thing. It's extremely tempting and easy to hate that big scary "other" that is convicted criminals to the point of dehumanization.

Medical marijuana legalization got only 57%. This felons voting issue should be much more divisive. Which is why I really doubt it will pass. Or even have much of a chance, frankly.

Goddamn Florida.

[San Lumen]

Yeah, this is the sort of stuff that would be very easy to make an effective negative campaign about. I generally have faith in people, but the way in which most of us learn to think about crime and punishment pretty much guarantees that we'll often be all too willing to overlook or outright justify this sort of thing. It's extremely tempting and easy to hate that big scary "other" that is convicted criminals to the point of dehumanization.

Medical marijuana legalization got only 57%. This felons voting issue should be much more divisive. Which is why I really doubt it will pass. Or even have much of a chance, frankly.

However this is an issue that stretches across party lines and race.

[Genivaria]

While your a prisoner yes. But why should that apply after? What exactly is a criminal vote?

A vote cast by a mind capable of breaking the law. What value does such a vote hold? Only negative and danger!

So literally everyone?

[Katganistan]

That's terminology. I am speaking of intrinsic, deontological purpose of the action. That is not words, but principle. One breaks a law, one brings revenge down.

Ah, so you're just making wild unsupported claims.

Of course, along with Mad Max III revenge fantasies.

[Katganistan]

Words have meaning. That is not what "purpose" means. Also, you are assuming your conclusion.

Yes. Some things cannot be questioned, thus assumption is not assumption but axiom. It is mathematical.

In other words, there is no argument other than "I'm right, you're wrong. Vengeance is mine, sayeth me."

[Annihitor the Incred]

A vote cast by a mind capable of breaking the law. What value does such a vote hold? Only negative and danger!

So literally everyone?

Shown itself capable. I frown on deliberate cherry picking. Would you hand the wheel over to a proven robber? Would you grant power to a proven thief?

[San Lumen]

So literally everyone?

Shown itself capable. I frown on deliberate cherry picking. Would you hand the wheel over to a proven robber? Would you grant power to a proven thief?

If they served their time they should have their rights restored. Simple as that.

[Annihitor the Incred]

Shown itself capable. I frown on deliberate cherry picking. Would you hand the wheel over to a proven robber? Would you grant power to a proven thief?

If they served their time they should have their rights restored. Simple as that.

Why? I'm not advocating capital punishment here. Taking away vote is like taking away pocket money, a slap on the wrist.

[San Lumen]

If they served their time they should have their rights restored. Simple as that.

Why? I'm not advocating capital punishment here. Taking away vote is like taking away pocket money, a slap on the wrist.

No its not.

[Ifreann]

If they served their time they should have their rights restored. Simple as that.

Why? I'm not advocating capital punishment here. Taking away vote is like taking away pocket money, a slap on the wrist.

Sure, the right to vote isn't a big deal.

[Annihitor the Incred]

Why? I'm not advocating capital punishment here. Taking away vote is like taking away pocket money, a slap on the wrist.

No its not.

It is.

Why? I'm not advocating capital punishment here. Taking away vote is like taking away pocket money, a slap on the wrist.

Sure, the right to vote isn't a big deal.

True.

[Ifreann]

No its not.

It is.

Sure, the right to vote isn't a big deal.

True.

Your shitposting is bad and you should feel bad.

[Annihitor the Incred]

It is.

True.

Your shitposting is bad and you should feel bad.

Seems I have wandered into a thread with a predetermined outcome, then. What gall on my part, to challenge your views and broaden you mind!

Well, then - riddle me this! What constitutes a grievous enough offense to remove some vote, when years in prison is fine? Wasted years - fine, losing nothing at all - too harsh? Does a criminal even care to vote? What is a vote worth to one such man?

[Alvecia]

Your shitposting is bad and you should feel bad.

Seems I have wandered into a thread with a predetermined outcome, then. What gall on my part, to challenge your views and broaden you mind!

Well, then - riddle me this! What constitutes a grievous enough offense to remove some vote, when years in prison is fine? Wasted years - fine, losing nothing at all - too harsh? Does a criminal even care to vote? What is a vote worth to one such man?

If there had to be something, I'd say voter fraud

[Veleth]

People who mean harm to society should not have a say on who should govern it.

[Katganistan]

People who mean harm to society should not have a say on who should govern it.

By that logic we should judge you forever on your smacking one of your playmates and stealing the toy they were playing with as a toddler, because you'll never be anything but a violent person who uses assault to get what they want.

[Annihitor the Incred]

People who mean harm to society should not have a say on who should govern it.

By that logic we should judge you forever on your smacking one of your playmates and stealing the toy they were playing with as a toddler, because you'll never be anything but a violent person who uses assault to get what they want.

Slippery slope fallacy, and false equivalence. Kindergarteners are not held legally accountable with good reason. We speak of adult lawbreakers here, fully cognizant and responsible for their decisions.

[Kasynatia]

No, they shouldn't. A. Because they are criminals who have broken the law so why should they have a say in what should be the law? B. They'd all vote Democrat.

[Insaeldor]

No, they shouldn't. A. Because they are criminals who have broken the law so why should they have a say in what should be the law? B. They'd all vote Democrat.

Okay but

A: Should you really have your constitutionally given rights stripped permanently? It's a life long punishment that exceeds the punishment given by the judge.

B: voting habits should not be a factor in weather someone is allowed to vote or not.

[Al-Ismailiyya]

No, they shouldn't. A. Because they are criminals who have broken the law so why should they have a say in what should be the law? B. They'd all vote Democrat.

And there is the current failing of the American democratic system right there.