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Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:40 pm**

Liriena wrote:Not an argument.

And "not my job to educate you" was?

Also, he made an interview with Stefan fucking Molyneux, for one.

A man who has been labelled as such by left-wing publications. Hardly evidence of Damore's own opinions being those of the alt-right. The fact that the memo contained ways to help Google better integrate female employees into the workforce is indicative of a willingness to help women, not throw them under the bus. But that was all lost in the constant shouting from people like you about perceived "sexism" in it.

And now apparently because he was interviewed by people whom left-leaning news organisations (American ones) labelled "alt-right", we're assuming that Damore is alt-right himself by guilt of association. Which isn't what I asked originally and doesn't even really count as proper evidence.

So I will repeat myself again: where are there instances where Damore shared opinions that come from an extremist ideology that is based in violence. No one has managed to provide me with the evidence to support this so I can but assume that such evidence does not exist.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:42 pm**

Proctopeo wrote:
Liriena wrote:Not an argument.

Also, he made an interview with Stefan fucking Molyneux, for one.

He's not the type of person that comes to mind when you read "far-right".
"Far-right" has connotations that don't apply to Molyneux, him seeming to be a right-libertarian if not a full-blown anarcho-capitalist. Just because Business Insider said it doesn't mean it's accurate with what the term means.

So, yes, while literally speaking, Molyneux is far-right, in terms of the implications of the term he's not.

Also, it is possible to be too far to one side of the political spectrum to accurately gauge the political positions of others based on their views. Antifa does it all the time.

Molyneux's is only a libertarian in that he has yet to go full "Hitler did nothing wrong". But given how he's already reached the "native genocide didn't happen" point in his shitty pseudo-intellectual career, he can't be too far off.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:42 pm**

Molyneux was okay in 2013, but recently he huffed bath salts and became some sort of insecure alt-rightist.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:46 pm**

Liriena wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:He's not the type of person that comes to mind when you read "far-right".
"Far-right" has connotations that don't apply to Molyneux, him seeming to be a right-libertarian if not a full-blown anarcho-capitalist. Just because Business Insider said it doesn't mean it's accurate with what the term means.

So, yes, while literally speaking, Molyneux is far-right, in terms of the implications of the term he's not.

Also, it is possible to be too far to one side of the political spectrum to accurately gauge the political positions of others based on their views. Antifa does it all the time.

Molyneux's is only a libertarian in that he has yet to go full "Hitler did nothing wrong". But given how he's already reached the "native genocide didn't happen" point in his shitty pseudo-intellectual career, he can't be too far off.

I don't follow these sorts, so I can't know if what you're saying is true or not.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:47 pm**

Proctopeo wrote:
Liriena wrote:Not an argument.

Also, he made an interview with Stefan fucking Molyneux, for one.

He's not the type of person that comes to mind when you read "far-right".
"Far-right" has connotations that don't apply to Molyneux, him seeming to be a right-libertarian if not a full-blown anarcho-capitalist. Just because Business Insider said it doesn't mean it's accurate with what the term means.

So, yes, while literally speaking, Molyneux is far-right, in terms of the implications of the term he's not.

Also, it is possible to be too far to one side of the political spectrum to accurately gauge the political positions of others based on their views. Antifa does it all the time.

Friendly reminder that antifa is not a group, let alone a hivemind. Antifa is a method. And the "antifa doesn't know what fascists are" cliché will only take you so far... "so far" being until we start to comb through the people antifa action in the United States has targeted lately, and find that even in the "nicer" right-wing rallies that were all about "muh free speech", there were almost always scummy right-wing authoritarian and racist groups and individuals in their midst.

Of course, antifa not even being a group and people being people, sometimes individuals involved in antifa action will get it wrong. Because, you know, that happens. Much in the same way that conservative chuds often misidentify liberals as "marxists" or "nazis" (or "feminazis", if they are liberal feminists), or Tories call Jeremy Corbyn an IRA-sympathizer because he took pictures with Sinn Fein leaders and tried to negotiate for peace.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:51 pm**

Liriena wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:He's not the type of person that comes to mind when you read "far-right".
"Far-right" has connotations that don't apply to Molyneux, him seeming to be a right-libertarian if not a full-blown anarcho-capitalist. Just because Business Insider said it doesn't mean it's accurate with what the term means.

So, yes, while literally speaking, Molyneux is far-right, in terms of the implications of the term he's not.

Also, it is possible to be too far to one side of the political spectrum to accurately gauge the political positions of others based on their views. Antifa does it all the time.

Friendly reminder that antifa is not a group, let alone a hivemind. Antifa is a method.

No, "black bloc" is a method. Antifa is a group, albeit an incredibly disorganized one.

And the "antifa doesn't know what fascists are" cliché will only take you so far... "so far" being until we start to comb through the people antifa action in the United States has targeted lately, and find that even in the "nicer" right-wing rallies that were all about "muh free speech", there were almost always scummy right-wing authoritarian and racist groups and individuals in their midst.

I'll take this with a grain of salt without evidence, yeah.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:53 pm**

Proctopeo wrote:
Liriena wrote:Molyneux's is only a libertarian in that he has yet to go full "Hitler did nothing wrong". But given how he's already reached the "native genocide didn't happen" point in his shitty pseudo-intellectual career, he can't be too far off.

I don't follow these sorts, so I can't know if what you're saying is true or not.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xd_nVCWPgiA

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:54 pm**

Oil exporting People wrote:
Liriena wrote:Yes.

Sweet summer child

Oh, I guess Nazis don't like it when I treat the ancaps as your peers?

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:56 pm**

Costa Fierro wrote:
Liriena wrote:Not an argument.

And "not my job to educate you" was?

That's not an actual quote. Sad.

Also, he made an interview with Stefan fucking Molyneux, for one.

A man who has been labelled as such by left-wing publications.[/quote]
Not an argument.

Costa Fierro wrote:Hardly evidence of Damore's own opinions being those of the alt-right.

Indeed. I don't think he's necessarily far right... but he sure is the perfect useful idiot for them.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:59 pm**

Nice to see big companies punished for their bullshit.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:01 pm**

Proctopeo wrote:
Liriena wrote:Friendly reminder that antifa is not a group, let alone a hivemind. Antifa is a method.

No, "black bloc" is a method. Antifa is a group, albeit an incredibly disorganized one.

You are half-wrong.

Black bloc is a method within the wider realm of what antifa action is. Antifa is pretty much anything you do to oppose fascism (and maybe the police state). That includes black bloc tactics to disrupt far right rallies, but it can also include doxxing fascists, infiltrating their organizations, protecting people from fascists, or maybe just doing something nice like giving food and housing to the homeless.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:02 pm**

Liriena wrote:That's not an actual quote. Sad.

Same line, different wording. "Do your own research" and "it's not my job to educate you" are no different in their meaning.

Not an argument.

Yes it is. It's pointing out that there's obvious bias labeling someone with a term that has connotations such as "alt-right".

Indeed. I don't think he's necessarily far right... but he sure is the perfect useful idiot for them.

So if you don't think he's far right, then where exactly where you going when you replied to me initially by saying Damore had been interviewed by "alt-right people"? Damore himself hasn't expressed any opinions beyond what we've seen inside the memo, and those are hardly damning evidence.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:02 pm**

Targovia wrote:Nice to see big companies punished for their bullshit.

I mean... Google is objectively evil and them getting owned is kinda nice... but maybe not in this particular way.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:08 pm**

Costa Fierro wrote:
Liriena wrote:That's not an actual quote. Sad.

Same line, different wording. "Do your own research" and "it's not my job to educate you" are no different in their meaning.

"It's not what you said but it's what you meant" is a dangerous game to play.

Costa Fierro wrote:
Not an argument.

Yes it is. It's pointing out that there's obvious bias labeling someone with a term that has connotations such as "alt-right".

So? Does it make the labeling wrong?

Stephan Molyneux is a genocide denier with some pretty shitty views about race and gender. They only reason one might hesistate to call him far right might be that he pays lip-service to economic libertarianism... which as a standard for who is or is not far right is a bad joke.

Costa Fierro wrote:
Indeed. I don't think he's necessarily far right... but he sure is the perfect useful idiot for them.

So if you don't think he's far right, then where exactly where you going when you replied to me initially by saying Damore had been interviewed by "alt-right people"? Damore himself hasn't expressed any opinions beyond what we've seen inside the memo, and those are hardly damning evidence.

While assigning guilty by association is crappy, there is an argument to be made that which platforms you choose to speak through, and in what terms, is necessarily reflective of where you stand on at least general terms.

And he chose a racist, misogynistic cult leader and genocide denier. Even if we want to be generous and say "well, he is just so nice he'll do an interview with anyone who asks without judging" or "he was desperate for any platform to tell his side of the story, and only Molyneux offered", he still made the conscious decision to go to him.

Damore gives me centrist vibes more than far right ones... but then again, centrism has a tendency to sometimes be butt-buddies with the far right.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:09 pm**

Liriena wrote:
Targovia wrote:Nice to see big companies punished for their bullshit.

I mean... Google is objectively evil and them getting owned is kinda nice... but maybe not in this particular way.

No, I think a company suppressing the opinion of their employees is absolutely worth a million dollar lawsuit.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:11 pm**

Targovia wrote:
Liriena wrote:I mean... Google is objectively evil and them getting owned is kinda nice... but maybe not in this particular way.

No, I think a company suppressing the opinion of their employees is absolutely worth a million dollar lawsuit.

If this opens the door to forcing Breitbart and Sinclair Broadcasting to open their doors to shameless leftists, sure. ;3

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:12 pm**

Liriena wrote:
Targovia wrote:No, I think a company suppressing the opinion of their employees is absolutely worth a million dollar lawsuit.

If this opens the door to forcing Breitbart and Sinclair Broadcasting to open their doors to shameless leftists, sure. ;3

kek, trying to get any media entity to change for the better is a pointless venture.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:15 pm**

Targovia wrote:
Liriena wrote:If this opens the door to forcing Breitbart and Sinclair Broadcasting to open their doors to shameless leftists, sure. ;3

kek, trying to get any media entity to change for the better is a pointless venture.

Hey, infiltrating Breitbart and relentlessly trolling the joy out of that ugly circle-jerk of fascism would be its own prize even if it didn't change it for the better.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:18 pm**

Liriena wrote:"It's not what you said but it's what you meant" is a dangerous game to play.

I've had it played against me before. But I like to live dangerously.

So? Does it make the labeling wrong?

In some instances, yes.

Stephan Molyneux is a genocide denier

And? That doesn't automatically make him someone that supports the same kind of politics as white supremacists or others. Shit, there's probably millions of Turkish people in Turkey and around the world that deny the Armenian Genocide ever happened, that doesn't make them "far right", it makes them shitty people.

While assigning guilty by association is crappy, there is an argument to be made that which platforms you choose to speak through, and in what terms, is necessarily reflective of where you stand on at least general terms.

It's an argument that is largely desperate and devoid of any kind of logic beyond the whole application of guilt by association.

And he chose a racist, misogynistic cult leader and genocide denier.

And who is this "racist, misogynistic cult leader"?

Damore gives me centrist vibes more than far right ones... but then again, centrism has a tendency to sometimes be butt-buddies with the far right.

"Has a tendency". That's a pretty bold claim, but unsurprising coming from someone who so utterly detests centrists.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:18 pm**

Liriena wrote:
Targovia wrote:kek, trying to get any media entity to change for the better is a pointless venture.

Hey, infiltrating Breitbart and relentlessly trolling the joy out of that ugly circle-jerk of fascism would be its own prize even if it didn't change it for the better.

Eh, calling them fascists is a little much.

Besides I'm sure a person like you would seriously object if some 'fascists' did the same to MSNBC or Salon.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:27 pm**

Costa Fierro wrote:
Stephan Molyneux is a genocide denier

And? That doesn't automatically make him someone that supports the same kind of politics as white supremacists or others. Shit, there's probably millions of Turkish people in Turkey and around the world that deny the Armenian Genocide ever happened, that doesn't make them "far right", it makes them shitty people.

He specifically denies genocides committed by white people, and simultaneously peddles "white genocide" bullshit. Put 2 and 2 together.

Costa Fierro wrote:
While assigning guilty by association is crappy, there is an argument to be made that which platforms you choose to speak through, and in what terms, is necessarily reflective of where you stand on at least general terms.

It's an argument that is largely desperate and devoid of any kind of logic beyond the whole application of guilt by association.

I'd say that depends on how you frame it, really. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I don't think what I did fits the definition of "guilty by association".

Costa Fierro wrote:
And he chose a racist, misogynistic cult leader and genocide denier.

And who is this "racist, misogynistic cult leader"?

Fucking Stefan Molyneux.

On second thought, I should add the qualifier "alleged" to "cult leader".

Costa Fierro wrote:
Damore gives me centrist vibes more than far right ones... but then again, centrism has a tendency to sometimes be butt-buddies with the far right.

"Has a tendency". That's a pretty bold claim, but unsurprising coming from someone who so utterly detests centrists.

I don't "utterly detest centrists", though. Lots of good people with good ideas are centrists, and I'd be lying if I said I didn't understand people who see staunchly left-wing movements and reject them in favor of moderation.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:28 pm**

Targovia wrote:
Liriena wrote:Hey, infiltrating Breitbart and relentlessly trolling the joy out of that ugly circle-jerk of fascism would be its own prize even if it didn't change it for the better.

Eh, calling them fascists is a little much.

Besides I'm sure a person like you would seriously object if some 'fascists' did the same to MSNBC or Salon.

Not really? I'd criticize them for being fascists. MSNBC and Salon are just media outlets. So long as they didn't harm any good, innocent people...

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:30 pm**

Liriena wrote:
Targovia wrote:Eh, calling them fascists is a little much.

Besides I'm sure a person like you would seriously object if some 'fascists' did the same to MSNBC or Salon.

Not really? I'd criticize them for being fascists. MSNBC and Salon are just media outlets. So long as they didn't harm any good, innocent people...

Yeah it's not like MSNBC, Salon, and CNN are as biased and shitty as Breitbart.

And aforementioned companies have never harmed good innocent people.

Not at all.

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:32 pm**

Liriena wrote:Hey, infiltrating Breitbart and relentlessly trolling the joy out of that ugly circle-jerk of fascism would be its own prize even if it didn't change it for the better.

> Breitbart
> Fascist

This is Poe's Law, right?

Posted: **Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:35 pm**

Liriena wrote:He specifically denies genocides committed by white people, and simultaneously peddles "white genocide" bullshit. Put 2 and 2 together.

Makes him a shitty person, not alt-right.

I'd say that depends on how you frame it, really. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I don't think what I did fits the definition of "guilty by association".

Yes it does. It was suggesting that because someone was interviewed by a person labelled as alt-right is alt-right themselves because of that.

Fucking Stefan Molyneux.

I'll believe it when I see it.

I don't "utterly detest centrists", though.

You say this right after saying that centrism have a tendency to be "butt buddies" with the far right.

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