The State of the Democratic Party II

[Torrocca]

I mean, let's just ignore recent historical developments like, oh I don't know, the Vietnam War or several other heinous events that Democrats have supported or even directly spurred on. I mean, what even are things like NATO in Libya or Democrat support for Apartheid in Israel and Palenstine?

EDIT: Just because one of the two very similar shades of gray masked themselves behind rainbows while the other didn't doesn't make that shade of gray any less gray than the other one.

You didn't answer any of my questions.

Here's another one.

Do republicans support Israel's actions wrt Palestine more or less than democrats?

How the hell do you expect me to measure that? Do you want me to ask them on a scale of one to ten?

Also, I love how you say the Dems are against CU when their frontrunner for the 2016 presidency was literally funded by them lmao.

[Crockerland]

I mean, Democrats have definitely been about the same though in regards to those exact things. Just because you refuse to see it doesn't make it suddenly less true.

Which party opposed huge tax cuts to the wealthy and which supported and passed them?

Which party supports spending on the poor and which opposes it?

Which party opposes citizens united and which supports it?

Which party forced American citizens to pay the disgustingly corrupt medical insurance industry under threat of fines or jail time through Obamacare?

Which party supports NAFTA, incentivizing companies to abandon their low-income workers in America in favor of moving their businesses to Mexico?

Which party opposes tariffs that would stop the exploitation of child slaves in Asia from being profitable?

Which party wants to mass-import people from other countries to directly compete with and devalue the labor of the American workers?

Which party opposses Trumps aggressive approach to Iran and North Korea and which supports it?

North Korea & Iran apologism, gross. These countries openly threaten to attack us.

As for corporate spending on elections...

[Torrocca]

Which party opposses Trumps aggressive approach to Iran and North Korea and which supports it?

North Korea & Iran apologism, gross. These countries openly threaten to attack us.

As for corporate spending on elections...

Almost like they don't want to be invaded by the world's superpower or something. Hmmm.

[Tobleste]

You didn't answer any of my questions.

Here's another one.

Do republicans support Israel's actions wrt Palestine more or less than democrats?

How the hell do you expect me to measure that? Do you want me to ask them on a scale of one to ten?

Also, I love how you say the Dems are against CU when their frontrunner for the 2016 presidency was literally funded by them lmao.

So you can't measure the differences. I guess you can't tell the differences between shades of grey.

Wrt CU, look at the judge's that dissented and which party they were nominated by. Or dismiss them both as evil and accomplish nothing.

[Tobleste]

Which party opposed huge tax cuts to the wealthy and which supported and passed them?

Which party supports spending on the poor and which opposes it?

Which party opposes citizens united and which supports it?

Which party forced American citizens to pay the disgustingly corrupt medical insurance industry under threat of fines or jail time through Obamacare?

Which party supports NAFTA, incentivizing companies to abandon their low-income workers in America in favor of moving their businesses to Mexico?

Which party opposes tariffs that would stop the exploitation of child slaves in Asia from being profitable?

Which party wants to mass-import people from other countries to directly compete with and devalue the labor of the American workers?

Which party opposses Trumps aggressive approach to Iran and North Korea and which supports it?

North Korea & Iran apologism, gross. These countries openly threaten to attack us.

As for corporate spending on elections...

I don't think you understand economics. Or what apologism is.

[Washington Resistance Army]

How the hell do you expect me to measure that? Do you want me to ask them on a scale of one to ten?

Also, I love how you say the Dems are against CU when their frontrunner for the 2016 presidency was literally funded by them lmao.

So you can't measure the differences. I guess you can't tell the differences between shades of grey.

Wrt CU, look at the judge's that dissented and which party they were nominated by. Or dismiss them both as evil and accomplish nothing.

CU was correctly decided, the Judges on your side were very much wrong.

[Torrocca]

How the hell do you expect me to measure that? Do you want me to ask them on a scale of one to ten?

Also, I love how you say the Dems are against CU when their frontrunner for the 2016 presidency was literally funded by them lmao.

So you can't measure the differences. I guess you can't tell the differences between shades of grey.

Wrt CU, look at the judge's that dissented and which party they were nominated by. Or dismiss them both as evil and accomplish nothing.

Oh, I can definitely see the differences. Don't change the fact much that Dems and Republicans both got blood on their hands.

[Tobleste]

So you can't measure the differences. I guess you can't tell the differences between shades of grey.

Wrt CU, look at the judge's that dissented and which party they were nominated by. Or dismiss them both as evil and accomplish nothing.

CU was correctly decided, the Judges on your side were very much wrong.

Oh really? E-mail them and I'm sure they'll reverse positions once they hear you disagree with them.

[Tobleste]

So you can't measure the differences. I guess you can't tell the differences between shades of grey.

Wrt CU, look at the judge's that dissented and which party they were nominated by. Or dismiss them both as evil and accomplish nothing.

Oh, I can definitely see the differences. Don't change the fact much that Dems and Republicans both got blood on their hands.

Every party and government on earth has blood on its hands. What matters is how much and was it avoidable.

[Washington Resistance Army]

CU was correctly decided, the Judges on your side were very much wrong.

Oh really? E-mail them and I'm sure they'll reverse positions once they hear you disagree with them.

I don't need to do anything of the sort, with any luck Kennedy will retire later this year after the gerrymandering stuff is decided and Ginsburg will be replaced eventually and we'll have a sensible court for quite some time.

[Tobleste]

Oh really? E-mail them and I'm sure they'll reverse positions once they hear you disagree with them.

I don't need to do anything of the sort, with any luck Kennedy will retire later this year after the gerrymandering stuff is decided and Ginsburg will be replaced eventually and we'll have a sensible court for quite some time.

Maybe, maybe not. Dems look like they could break even this November and they're defending less seats in 2 years time when trump will be on the ballot to drag republicans down. I would actually get popcorn to see the right wing meltdown if a dem Senate refuses to nominate whatever far right knuckle dragger trump wants to nominate.

[Washington Resistance Army]

I don't need to do anything of the sort, with any luck Kennedy will retire later this year after the gerrymandering stuff is decided and Ginsburg will be replaced eventually and we'll have a sensible court for quite some time.

Maybe, maybe not. Dems look like they could break even this November and they're defending less seats in 2 years time when trump will be on the ballot to drag republicans down. I would actually get popcorn to see the right wing meltdown if a dem Senate refuses to nominate whatever far right knuckle dragger trump wants to nominate.

The Senate is staying Republican, there's almost no chance it flips with the current map. The Dems best hope is to try and take the House and hope their numbers don't continue to slip going forward.

[Myrensis]

So you're acknowledging that Bernie's loss had nothing to do with anything but Bernie? Otherwise it seems those 'bandit tricks' would be super topical. But okay, in the spirit of kindness, I'll let you weasel your way out of your inability to answer the actual question and move on to this new whining. What bandit tricks? Tilleman is still on the ballot, the DNC has absolutely no way to deny ballot access or use of the Democratic name to anyone, all they've done is make it clear they're backing the candidate they believe has the best chance. Which...is neither surprising nor shady to anyone not looking to manufacture some political outrage because in spite of the supposed overwhelming desire of the American people for a Progressive revolution, progressive candidates don't seem to be making huge waves.

And yes, we know that Clinton lost the election. Just like Bernie, the Progressive Messiah, lost to her. It's still amusing to me that you can't see the irony of using 'hurr durr, she lost!" as some vindication of the progressive movement.

Hillary was the worst candidate ever! Except apparently for the most popular and influential figure in the entire progressive wing.

You weren't asking a question, you were just trying to strawman me as a Bernie supporter. No substance, no real comment as per the usual besides mediocre defenses of scummy tactics. The spirit of kindness is merely you acknowledging your failure to flip the topic onto ground where you might have had a chance. This was over scummy tactics and your side's inability to win a straight up fight. Hillary's defeat in the big leagues is proof positive of what a dumb idea that is. Turns out its much tougher to play dirty when the otherside has a machine too. Its good proof, and proof you no doubt resent, that when you engage in these sorts of things and then take them up, you lose. Hillary, Feingold, etc. The list of defeats goes on. Your only defense is "B-Bernie", which doesn't change the fact of what was going on in that article or Bakery's original point. You've put your cards on full display and I am glad you have decided to engage a bit more deeply beyond just posting when Trump does badly. One couldn't ask for a better illustration of why those tactics lead to bad outcomes or the personalities behind them :^)

So much whining and trash talking, and still no actual point or explanation of what these dirty tactics supposedly are beyond 'The DNC promotes candidates it believes have the better chance to win and advance DNC policies, though that doesn't in any way prevent anyone who wants to from running as a Democrat as well... and that's super terrible for...reasons!"

Really the problem seems to be that since your side can't win actual victories, you're left with ranting about all the ways you totally could hypothetically win if not for the vast corporate establishment shill conspiracy to stop you from reaching out to the 110% of American voters who you know deep down are aching for a Progressive Revolution.

Just like the Tea Party knows the vast silent majority is on their side if only the RINO sellouts would stop getting in the way of their true conservative message!

[Telconi]

CU was correctly decided, the Judges on your side were very much wrong.

Oh really? E-mail them and I'm sure they'll reverse positions once they hear you disagree with them.

If nicely asking awful people to stop being awful actually worked the world wouldn't have the problems it has.

[Torrocca]

Oh, I can definitely see the differences. Don't change the fact much that Dems and Republicans both got blood on their hands.

Every party and government on earth has blood on its hands. What matters is how much and was it avoidable.

You mean like the Vietnam War?

[Cannot think of a name]

Every party and government on earth has blood on its hands. What matters is how much and was it avoidable.

You mean like the Vietnam War?

Are there candidates on this years ballot that are advocating for war with Vietnam?

[Torrocca]

You mean like the Vietnam War?

Are there candidates on this years ballot that are advocating for war with Vietnam?

Just pointing out that the Democrats aren't as clean as Tobleste wants them to be. :^)

Besides that, there definitely are Democrats that want war with foreign countries.

[Aeken]

Are there candidates on this years ballot that are advocating for war with Vietnam?

Just pointing out that the Democrats aren't as clean as Tobleste wants them to be. :^)

Besides that, there definitely are Democrats that want war with foreign countries.

All the rage these days is Russia, Syria, and Iran. Warhawks don't give up easily on the military industrial complex.

[Torrocca]

Just pointing out that the Democrats aren't as clean as Tobleste wants them to be. :^)

Besides that, there definitely are Democrats that want war with foreign countries.

All the rage these days is Russia, Syria, and Iran. Warhawks don't give up easily on the military industrial complex.

Almost like both political parties are deep in the pockets of corruption and on corporate payrolls or something. Hmm.

[Aeken]

All the rage these days is Russia, Syria, and Iran. Warhawks don't give up easily on the military industrial complex.

Almost like both political parties are deep in the pockets of corruption and on corporate payrolls or something. Hmm.

But they need more money to do their job right!

[Torrocca]

Almost like both political parties are deep in the pockets of corruption and on corporate payrolls or something. Hmm.

But they need more money to do their job right!

"But they need more money to do their job right! according to the whims and wishes of their corporate funders." FTFY :^)

[Cannot think of a name]

Are there candidates on this years ballot that are advocating for war with Vietnam?

Just pointing out that the Democrats aren't as clean as Tobleste wants them to be. :^)

Besides that, there definitely are Democrats that want war with foreign countries.

Great. Maybe we could talk about those guys in the 2018 Midterms thread when we're playing the moronically simplistic game of 'pox on both their houses' or 'people in your general definition did a bad thing once so that moots all criticism' games.

EDIT: Who's got two thumbs and thought he was in a different thread? This guy. While the spirit (it's the state of the Democratic party, not the previous states of the Democratic party) is the same, that's some quality hubris fuckery that I'll let stand to not hide my shame...

[Torrocca]

Just pointing out that the Democrats aren't as clean as Tobleste wants them to be. :^)

Besides that, there definitely are Democrats that want war with foreign countries.

Great. Maybe we could talk about those guys in the 2018 Midterms thread when we're playing the moronically simplistic game of 'pox on both their houses' or 'people in your general definition did a bad thing once so that moots all criticism' games.

I mean, a plague upon both their houses regardless though.

[New Emeline]

Just pointing out that the Democrats aren't as clean as Tobleste wants them to be. :^)

Besides that, there definitely are Democrats that want war with foreign countries.

Great. Maybe we could talk about those guys in the 2018 Midterms thread when we're playing the moronically simplistic game of 'pox on both their houses' or 'people in your general definition did a bad thing once so that moots all criticism' games.

Curse you Todd Howard!!! A pox upon yo- wait wrong thread

[MERIZoC]

You mean like the Vietnam War?

Are there candidates on this years ballot that are advocating for war with Vietnam?

There are candidates on this years ballot that are advocating for war with Syria. That voted for the war in Iraq. That support war in Yemen. This isn’t ancient history, this is happening right now.