It's Okay To Be White campaign

[The Empire of Pretantia]

>Taking /pol/ seriously
>Ever
This is why they do campaigns like this.

Then what do these people really believe? Are you saying that they are socialists or liberals collectively pulling a Colbert over and over and over? These peoples are not in any way genuinely racist, anti-semitic...?

You aren't naïve, so why are you buying their own face-saving excuses?

Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory. They're assholes for the sake of being assholes.

This is a website devoted to subversion.

[Liriena]

Then what do these people really believe? Are you saying that they are socialists or liberals collectively pulling a Colbert over and over and over? These peoples are not in any way genuinely racist, anti-semitic...?

You aren't naïve, so why are you buying their own face-saving excuses?

As far as I can ascertain, /pol/ has exactly one belief:

Hold my beer and watch this!

That's cute and all, but we really should stop being so generous to them. We're giving that sort of "ironic" garbage too much of a free pass, and we keep dismissing it as just "trolling" and "satire" when it's pretty obvious most of them are at least sympathetic to the underlying rationale of the ideas they "ironically" express.

The reason why comedians like Louis CK seldom got much hate even when they were creating extreme humour was because they always did a fairly good job of signalling that, in fact, they still thought stuff like rape or racism were awful. The people whose speech we are dismissing as just "trolling" and "satire" never do that.

[Petrasylvania]

Anything the left does short of bending over and spreading their anus apparently Drives People To The Right.

[Liriena]

Then what do these people really believe? Are you saying that they are socialists or liberals collectively pulling a Colbert over and over and over? These peoples are not in any way genuinely racist, anti-semitic...?

You aren't naïve, so why are you buying their own face-saving excuses?

Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory. They're assholes for the sake of being assholes.

This is a website devoted to subversion.

Are they racist and anti-semitic assholes?

[Liriena]

Anything the left does short of bending over and spreading their anus apparently Drives People To The Right.

...this too, to some extent.

[Galloism]

As far as I can ascertain, /pol/ has exactly one belief:

Hold my beer and watch this!

That's cute and all, but we really should stop being so generous to them. We're giving that sort of "ironic" garbage too much of a free pass, and we keep dismissing it as just "trolling" and "satire" when it's pretty obvious most of them are at least sympathetic to the underlying rationale of the ideas they "ironically" express.

I think you’re crediting /pol/ with way too much planning, plotting, and scheming. There seems to be very little of that. Just massive irl and online trolling.

They keep doing it because you keep falling for it.

The reason why comedians like Louis CK seldom got much hate even when they were creating extreme humour was because they always did a fairly good job of signalling that, in fact, they still thought stuff like rape or racism were awful. The people whose speech we are dismissing as just "trolling" and "satire" never do that.

And I never mark the news I post as satire or legit. That doesn’t mean I can’t tell the difference.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory. They're assholes for the sake of being assholes.

This is a website devoted to subversion.

Are they racist and anti-semitic assholes?

Nope.

Then what do these people really believe? Are you saying that they are socialists or liberals collectively pulling a Colbert over and over and over? These peoples are not in any way genuinely racist, anti-semitic...?

You aren't naïve, so why are you buying their own face-saving excuses?

Seriously, y'all need more Contra.
https://youtu.be/Sx4BVGPkdzk?t=13m9s

Everybody uses memes, Contra. It's not an alt right thing.

[Liriena]

Having read all of that... I don't think you can really claim that there's no white supremacism at play here.

A history, I might add, that has brought about the very civilization that you all take for granted. The wood and steel mills that founded the very chair that you're sitting on, the drywall and insulation that keeps you nice and toasty, the tar and shingles of the roof that keeps the rain and snow from falling on your head.... Everything was built by whites.

Jealous haters, enabled by Jews (seeking not to be a minority themselves) want to claim that being White is a bad thing. Remember this, it was Whites who ended slavery and a host of other calamities. We're not the bad guys.

And the rest... these people aren't simply innocent, well-meaning centrists, libertarians or conservatives trying to "expose" hypocrisy. They are trying to radicalize "normies" into their clearly far right worldview.

They're a bunch of edgy 15-25 year olds who find pleasure in being different and trolling people. They are trying to amuse themselves. Not everything is political.

That's literally political speech, even if it's "ironic".

Are there some who subscribe to white nationalism? Yes, that is pretty likely. Are some of them a part of this campaign? Yeah, pretty likely given how the internet works.

There aren't very many white nationalists in the US though. They get an excessively large presence in the media because it gets views/clicks/sells papers. Same with Antifa and leftist groups. Anything done gets blown up, not out of malice, but out of chasing profits.

At a certain point, you have to recognize that ideas and campaigns can be decent regardless of source. Many of the Founding Fathers were slave owners and elitists. That doesn't make the American experiment invalid. They might not have wanted to give women or nonwhites rights, but large portions of their philosophies are acceptable. By now, we should be able to recognize what is good and acceptable in things and remove/ignore the bad parts... You don't have to swallow 100% of a concept to accept that some parts of it have merit.

I have already said, and repeatedly I think, that I agree with the notion that "it's okay to be white" (duh), but you can't separate this particular slogan from its origins and underlying motive. "Death of the author" is for works of art, not political campaigns and slogans.

[Liriena]

Are they racist and anti-semitic assholes?

Nope.

How do you know?

Seriously, y'all need more Contra.
https://youtu.be/Sx4BVGPkdzk?t=13m9s

Everybody uses memes, Contra. It's not an alt right thing.

She acknowledges that. But past a certain point, it becomes harder and harder to accept that a "meme" can be separated from its most common political uses.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

As far as I can ascertain, /pol/ has exactly one belief:

Hold my beer and watch this!

That's cute and all, but we really should stop being so generous to them. We're giving that sort of "ironic" garbage too much of a free pass, and we keep dismissing it as just "trolling" and "satire" when it's pretty obvious most of them are at least sympathetic to the underlying rationale of the ideas they "ironically" express.

The reason why comedians like Louis CK seldom got much hate even when they were creating extreme humour was because they always did a fairly good job of signalling that, in fact, they still thought stuff like rape or racism were awful. The people whose speech we are dismissing as just "trolling" and "satire" never do that.

The magic would go away if they had to put disclaimer in every post.

Think: would devout racists who sincerely despise miscegenation and foreign cultures post on a website devoted to anime tiddies?

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Nope.

How do you know?

How do you?

Everybody uses memes, Contra. It's not an alt right thing.

She acknowledges that. But past a certain point, it becomes harder and harder to accept that a "meme" can be separated from its most common political uses.

It's easy when you're on an Indonesian haberdashery website.

[Liriena]

That's cute and all, but we really should stop being so generous to them. We're giving that sort of "ironic" garbage too much of a free pass, and we keep dismissing it as just "trolling" and "satire" when it's pretty obvious most of them are at least sympathetic to the underlying rationale of the ideas they "ironically" express.

I think you’re crediting /pol/ with way too much planning, plotting, and scheming. There seems to be very little of that. Just massive irl and online trolling.

They keep doing it because you keep falling for it.

So what? Do you believe that most of them are centrists irl? That they don't actually hold any sorts of racial, anti-semitic prejudices? Do you believe that they have no ideology whatsoever? No political opinions, no worldview beyond "for the lulz"?

The reason why comedians like Louis CK seldom got much hate even when they were creating extreme humour was because they always did a fairly good job of signalling that, in fact, they still thought stuff like rape or racism were awful. The people whose speech we are dismissing as just "trolling" and "satire" never do that.

And I never mark the news I post as satire or legit. That doesn’t mean I can’t tell the difference.

And how exactly do you know, for a fact, that the people behind this campaign are merely ironic about their racism and anti-semitism? Just because they are in 4chan and you've learned to assume that 4chan = "ironic"?

[Petrasylvania]

And I never mark the news I post as satire or legit. That doesn’t mean I can’t tell the difference.

And how exactly do you know, for a fact, that the people behind this campaign are merely ironic about their racism and anti-semitism? Just because they are in 4chan and you've learned to assume that 4chan = "ironic"?

If 4chan started spreading jihadi propaganda for lulz would people still think they were being ironic?

[Washington Resistance Army]

And how exactly do you know, for a fact, that the people behind this campaign are merely ironic about their racism and anti-semitism? Just because they are in 4chan and you've learned to assume that 4chan = "ironic"?

If 4chan started spreading jihadi propaganda for lulz would people still think they were being ironic?

Part of me thinks they've already done that.

[Aellex]

Elaborate.

People like Can not and others making some rather high-tier levels of mental gymnastic to justify racism, among other things.

I agree only to an extent. In most cases, I'm fine keeping politics and religion out of my interactions with friends and family, specially if we disagree, but I also think that there are specific circumstances in which it'd be acceptable (and even necessary). If, for instance, I saw a formerly libertarian friend starting to get himself involved in openly, explicitly fascist circles, or saw a family member getting exposed to a lot of misinformation, I'd step in. Past a certain point, it stops being just a disagreement with loved ones and it starts being a legitimate cause for concern.

Again, I would disagree. It's not up to one to decide for his/her close ones what are acceptable opinions to hold and what are not. Moreover, there is nothing more annoying than proselytism from people to who you can't just tell to go fuck off and stop bothering you.

[Liriena]

How do you know?

How do you?

Answering a question with another question is bad praxis.

If these people are being entirely "ironic" about their worldview, they are doing a terrible job of signalling it, and clearly delineating between what's ironic and what's unironic, specially with regards to this campaign. Which leads me to think that the "irony" is superficial at best. Not to mention the fact that their clearly, unironically stated goal would make it, in my opinion, a pretty fair assumption that these people do, in fact, hold views that are decisively on the "non-normie" right-wing, meaning that they are clearly not "moderates" or "conservatives", let alone liberals or leftists. There are very few options left at that point, and you can't hide behind "just joking" forever, specially if you never, ever stop "joking".

If someone constantly told racist jokes about black people, and never even took a moment to simply say or even imply "I don't actually believe this", what reason to I have to think they are not, in fact, racist?

She acknowledges that. But past a certain point, it becomes harder and harder to accept that a "meme" can be separated from its most common political uses.

It's easy when you're on an Indonesian haberdashery website.

Meh.

[Galloism]

If 4chan started spreading jihadi propaganda for lulz would people still think they were being ironic?

Part of me thinks they've already done that.

Pretty sure they have. I think I remember something like that around 2014.

[Liriena]

Elaborate.

People like Can not and others making some rather high-tier levels of mental gymnastic to justify racism, among other things.

I agree only to an extent. In most cases, I'm fine keeping politics and religion out of my interactions with friends and family, specially if we disagree, but I also think that there are specific circumstances in which it'd be acceptable (and even necessary). If, for instance, I saw a formerly libertarian friend starting to get himself involved in openly, explicitly fascist circles, or saw a family member getting exposed to a lot of misinformation, I'd step in. Past a certain point, it stops being just a disagreement with loved ones and it starts being a legitimate cause for concern.

Again, I would disagree. It's not up to one to decide for his/her close ones what are acceptable opinions to hold and what are not. Moreover, there is nothing more annoying than proselytism from people to who you can't just tell to go fuck off and stop bothering you.

We can agree to disagree, then.

[The East Marches II]

And how exactly do you know, for a fact, that the people behind this campaign are merely ironic about their racism and anti-semitism? Just because they are in 4chan and you've learned to assume that 4chan = "ironic"?

If 4chan started spreading jihadi propaganda for lulz would people still think they were being ironic?

I'm positive that's been done already.

[The Sauganash Union]

Then what do these people really believe? Are you saying that they are socialists or liberals collectively pulling a Colbert over and over and over? These peoples are not in any way genuinely racist, anti-semitic...?

You aren't naïve, so why are you buying their own face-saving excuses?

As far as I can ascertain, /pol/ has exactly one belief:

Hold my beer and watch this!

It's more about pissing off the sensibilities of those in the cultural norm.

It was conservatives in the early 2000s (4chan really mocked Bush-era cons), and it was liberals in the 2010s.

[Galloism]

I think you’re crediting /pol/ with way too much planning, plotting, and scheming. There seems to be very little of that. Just massive irl and online trolling.

They keep doing it because you keep falling for it.

So what? Do you believe that most of them are centrists irl? That they don't actually hold any sorts of racial, anti-semitic prejudices? Do you believe that they have no ideology whatsoever? No political opinions, no worldview beyond "for the lulz"?

You might as well send me a picture of Times Square or the LAX terminal and demand I tell you their political opinions.

And I never mark the news I post as satire or legit. That doesn’t mean I can’t tell the difference.

And how exactly do you know, for a fact, that the people behind this campaign are merely ironic about their racism and anti-semitism? Just because they are in 4chan and you've learned to assume that 4chan = "ironic"?

It’s pretty obvious. They gloated how the main stream media “fell for” their antics during the election.

Usually when you gloat that someone “fell for” something, you weren’t being 100% on the level.

[Cannot think of a name]

Elaborate.

People like Can not and others making some rather high-tier levels of mental gymnastic to justify racism, among other things.

Huh?

[Holy Tedalonia]

People like Can not and others making some rather high-tier levels of mental gymnastic to justify racism, among other things.

Huh?

He's basically saying the left is making up loads of crap to justify being racist.

[Liriena]

So what? Do you believe that most of them are centrists irl? That they don't actually hold any sorts of racial, anti-semitic prejudices? Do you believe that they have no ideology whatsoever? No political opinions, no worldview beyond "for the lulz"?

You might as well send me a picture of Times Square or the LAX terminal and demand I tell you their political opinions.

Implying that there is no explicit text to be read and interpreted here.

And how exactly do you know, for a fact, that the people behind this campaign are merely ironic about their racism and anti-semitism? Just because they are in 4chan and you've learned to assume that 4chan = "ironic"?

It’s pretty obvious. They gloated how the main stream media “fell for” their antics during the election.

Usually when you gloat that someone “fell for” something, you weren’t being 100% on the level.

They don't need to be "100% on the level" for there to be cause for concern. A Pinochet meme is just a meme until the person who posts it goes on to try and unironically argue that "Pinochet saved Chile" and whines that "leftists today should get helicopter rides too".

You're giving them far more leeway than they deserve with their rhetoric, and you are passively enabling the spread of their ideas under the false security that it's all just jokes and memes with no subtext, no serious political goals, no underlying politics whatsoever. Anybody who claims that there is nothing underneath this rhetoric other than empty humour and trolling is either ignorant or pretending to be ignorant at this point.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

How do you?

Answering a question with another question is bad praxis.

You seemed to have some insight into the boards of 4chan that somebody who actually goes there frequently does, so I want sure if you had a firm basis.

If these people are being entirely "ironic" about their worldview, they are doing a terrible job of signalling it,

Why do they have to signal it?

and clearly delineating between what's ironic and what's unironic, specially with regards to this campaign. Which leads me to think that the "irony" is superficial at best. Not to mention the fact that their clearly, unironically stated goal would make it, in my opinion, a pretty fair assumption that these people do, in fact, hold views that are decisively on the "non-normie" right-wing, meaning that they are clearly not "moderates" or "conservatives", let alone liberals or leftists. There are very few options left at that point, and you can't hide behind "just joking" forever, specially if you never, ever stop "joking".

If someone constantly told racist jokes about black people, and never even took a moment to simply say or even imply "I don't actually believe this", what reason to I have to think they are not, in fact, racist?

Let me tell you about "BRAPPPPP".

4chan has multiple porn boards, and naturally they like posting nice butts on them. In fact, sometimes nice butts get posted on the blue boards too, and they don't always get deleted because they're just within the rules. So nice butts are all over 4chan to be admired, and people get off to them. However, once an a while somebody sees a nice butt and thinks to themselves,"How can I ruin the day off every person who gazes upon this nice butt?" So what they do is reply to the post with the nice butt, posting only the word,"BRAPPPPP". And like that, everybody who bothers reading the comments has their day ruined as they imagine the person who owns the nice butt farting.

Another example: the daily dose. On /v/, the board for video games (and is to video games what /pol/ is to politics), somebody comes along on occasion and posts a gif of Piccolo raping Vegeta from Dragon Ball Z. This person posts not only that but other similar pictures with a similar color palette, until eventually you reach the point where just seeing the colors purple and green together causes you to remember the gif.

Now, why would somebody do either of these when they are against both the rules and decency? The same reason /pol/ is a cesspool of political incorrectness: they're assholes.