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PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:29 pm
by Ostroeuropa
The Parkus Empire wrote:
Crysuko wrote:by practicing the very imperialism they decried

Marxist internationalism is imperialism?


Arguably any set of affairs imposed on a populace by an external force are imperialism, since even if they aim to create an equal relation between the two it will be from the perspective of the victorious power, who will be ignorant of particulars to the local area and its customs.

The MacCarthur rule of Japan is perhaps the best example of foreign occupation not being imperialistic in nature, and that's only if you ignore the defense aspect. Which could theoretically be improved upon utilizing the same model. Though then again, it was Japan which insisted they no longer have an army, provided the US defend them.

MacCarthur did so by being a dictatorial guiding hand akin to a somewhat more powerful and benevolent constiutional monarch, seeking out local japanese to build up their country and only removing or vetoing those who were fascistic as fuck or commies.

Commies moving in even in the best case scenario might be like "We come to liberate, comrades, where is the car manufacturers union? We wish to converse with them." and not paying heed to the fact that while THEIR country chiefly produces cars, the occupied one is a fridge maker, and giving more time to the car manufacturers and such.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:30 pm
by Cekoviu
United Muscovite Nations wrote:
Cekoviu wrote:Are you serious or joking right now? I honestly can't tell.

If the revolution doesn't spread it will die.

Good.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:30 pm
by El Hamidah
The Parkus Empire wrote:
El Hamidah wrote:Who cares what Egoists think.

All nominalists obviously should.

Good thing I'm not a nominalist

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:32 pm
by Genivaria
The Parkus Empire wrote:
Genivaria wrote:Now you get it.

What about liberal internationalism?

Considering that it doesn't propose the conquest of foreign peoples and territory...no.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:33 pm
by El Hamidah
The Parkus Empire wrote:
Crysuko wrote:by practicing the very imperialism they decried

Marxist internationalism is imperialism?

Nationalist expansionism is.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:36 pm
by Genivaria
El Hamidah wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:Marxist internationalism is imperialism?

Nationalist expansionism is.

Not really.
Empire by definition is the rule over different cultures and people's.
The Roman Republic was expansionist, but wasn't really Imperial until it expanded into Spain and North Africa.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:36 pm
by The Parkus Empire
El Hamidah wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:Marxist internationalism is imperialism?

Nationalist expansionism is.

What about Marxist expansionism?

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:40 pm
by Crysuko
The Parkus Empire wrote:
El Hamidah wrote:Nationalist expansionism is.

What about Marxist expansionism?

Marxism is about spreading the revolution to the international stage, not grabbing for land and power.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:41 pm
by The New Sea Territory
No response on the Makhno stuff it seems.

Anyway, I've begun translating some of his essays. It's an interesting process. I might see if, over the next few months, I can put together a collection of either Makhnovist or broadly Russian anarchist essays.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:41 pm
by The Parkus Empire
El Hamidah wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:All nominalists obviously should.

Good thing I'm not a nominalist

You said "who cares" not "I don't care"

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:42 pm
by Crysuko
The New Sea Territory wrote:No response on the Makhno stuff it seems.

Anyway, I've begun translating some of his essays. It's an interesting process. I might see if, over the next few months, I can put together a collection of either Makhnovist or broadly Russian anarchist essays.

that would be pretty nice

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:48 pm
by The Parkus Empire
Genivaria wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:What about liberal internationalism?

Considering that it doesn't propose the conquest of foreign peoples and territory...no.

Economically it does. Owning land has not been the focal point of wealth for a long time now.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:12 pm
by Crysuko
The Parkus Empire wrote:
Genivaria wrote:Considering that it doesn't propose the conquest of foreign peoples and territory...no.

Economically it does. Owning land has not been the focal point of wealth for a long time now.

it's not as much owning land as exploiting the people working on it

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:16 pm
by The Parkus Empire
Crysuko wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:Economically it does. Owning land has not been the focal point of wealth for a long time now.

it's not as much owning land as exploiting the people working on it

Then do not give them a job, problem solved.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:25 pm
by Genivaria
The Parkus Empire wrote:
Genivaria wrote:Considering that it doesn't propose the conquest of foreign peoples and territory...no.

Economically it does. Owning land has not been the focal point of wealth for a long time now.

So then not Imperialism, that's called Capitalism.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:26 pm
by Kubra
Proctopeo wrote:

In Kaiserreich, syndicalists have the tendency to show up when things are bad and make things even worse.
the problem is solved by playing as syndicalists

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:29 pm
by The Parkus Empire
Genivaria wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:Economically it does. Owning land has not been the focal point of wealth for a long time now.

So then not Imperialism, that's called Capitalism.

Neocolonialism is a form of capitalism, yeqh

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:42 pm
by Crysuko
Kubra wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:In Kaiserreich, syndicalists have the tendency to show up when things are bad and make things even worse.
the problem is solved by playing as syndicalists

Or better yet, be an actual syndicalist :^)

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 3:07 pm
by Improved werpland
The New Sea Territory wrote:No response on the Makhno stuff it seems.

Anyway, I've begun translating some of his essays. It's an interesting process. I might see if, over the next few months, I can put together a collection of either Makhnovist or broadly Russian anarchist essays.

Someone hasn't done that already?

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 3:51 pm
by Proctopeo
Kubra wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:In Kaiserreich, syndicalists have the tendency to show up when things are bad and make things even worse.
the problem is solved by playing as syndicalists

The problem is solved by playing as Huey Long and going on a crusade against the syndies while making every man a king!

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 3:54 pm
by Kubra
Proctopeo wrote:
Kubra wrote: the problem is solved by playing as syndicalists

The problem is solved by playing as Huey Long and going on a crusade against the syndies while making every man a king!
until they show up when things are bad and make things even worse

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 3:56 pm
by Crysuko
Kubra wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:The problem is solved by playing as Huey Long and going on a crusade against the syndies while making every man a king!
until they show up when things are bad and make things even worse

in an endless cycle

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 3:58 pm
by Proctopeo
Crysuko wrote:
Kubra wrote: until they show up when things are bad and make things even worse

in an endless cycle

when every man is a king, syndicalism won't need to exist

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 4:00 pm
by Crysuko
Proctopeo wrote:
Crysuko wrote:in an endless cycle

when every man is a king, syndicalism won't need to exist

>when

PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 4:02 pm
by Kubra
Proctopeo wrote:
Crysuko wrote:in an endless cycle

when every man is a king, syndicalism won't need to exist
Well I get to have vassal dukes