Left-Wing Discussion Thread III

[Mattopilos II]

"Academic"

I'm sorry, but I wasn't aware that Sociology is considered anything other than the laughing stock of the social sciences.

Not this bad meme again.

Sanct can't help themselves.

[Mattopilos II]

Oh no, you caught me! I'll go oppress some men while I wait for this whole thing to blow over.

Would you call yourself a feminist to the face of a male victim of domestic abuse who had had to deal with a duluth model intervention programme?
There's plenty of other examples of how you're just waving a confederate flag and expecting people not to judge you negatively. That's merely one issue that makes it inexcusable. I'm sure there were abolitionists in the confederacy too. They simply had the sense not to identify so strongly with a bunch of institutions so clearly antithetical to their apparent beliefs.

Oh come on. I came here to escape this shit, not for migration of threads.

[Ostroeuropa]

In any case, I got distracted defending aillyria.

I've thought about a tweak to inheritance tax i'd institute given the power to do so, allowing stock holders to syndicalize stock worth perhaps 90% or some other lower percentage of the total cash owed, placing it in a trust owned by all a companies workers. I think it would do more to address income inequality than merely seizing cash, though the effects on the govenments budget might be a problem, it seems to me that the rich simply use the governments funds to feed it back into themselves anyway, so a cash tax is an ineffective means of combating inequality compared to the above.

So instead of a CEO dying and paying a few million that just ends up being given to their heir in government contracts, they leave a portion of their company to the workers in perpetuity in a manner that means the stock can't be sold, and collectively belongs to those working there and potentially retirees.

[Cekoviu]

Yes, I would. Being a feminist doesn't automatically make me a supporter of whatever you're babbling about now, and if the man has such a black-and-white view of the world that he doesn't realize that, then I don't care if he's offended by my ideology, because I don't need to be friends with people like that. Sorry if that offends you.

It doesn't offend me. It simply makes me conclude you don't care about being inclusive to men in your movement and aren't interested in their experiences unless they agree with yours, and consequently, aren't actually any good at advocating for equality.

Drive up to the south, shave your head, hang a bunch of confederate flags on the side of a barn and start driving pick up trucks around while cocking shotguns, but inside the barn is a racial equality seminar and you're apparently expecting black people to ignore all the warning signs, walk up to you, and talk to you long enough to realize that.

"Heritage, don't need those kind of friends."

The overwhelming majority of feminists are women. If your aim is gender equality, you kind of do. You can't write it off as men being assholes about it either. There's a lot of very, very good reasons men would be hostile to engaging with feminists or feminist institutions, the duluth model being one.

You care more about dogmatic adherence than outreach required to reach your goal. That doesn't offend me. It disappoints me.

You don't particularly seem to care about outreach to feminist women, so I don't see why you think it should be any different for me. If men wouldn't like to be part of feminism because I don't want to deal with people who are incapable of seeing that there are shades of gray (which is what you seem to think, while being utter BS), then good riddance to them; women can advocate for gender equality on our own.

I honestly don't particularly care if you're "disappointed" either, because the last thing I seek is approval from an MRA who cannot seem to argue without invoking logical fallacies -- equating feminism with white supremacy shows that your worldview is seriously skewed -- and has a rabid hate-on for this "Duluth Model." I've never even heard of that, and yet you seem to think that all feminists are this monolithic block that wants nothing other than to destroy men's lives using this Duluth model. I'll reiterate my point: not everything is black and white and not everybody belonging to an ideology thinks the same way. You of all people should be aware of this, given your somewhat leftist economic stance but staunch opposition to feminism (and from what I can tell, illegal immigration), which shows that leftists aren't all SJWs. Since you seem to be aware of this, I'm inclined to believe that you simply care about destroying feminism at all costs rather than ensuring gender equality or, God forbid, trying to find a common ground and realize that feminists aren't all bad.

And for the record, before you yell about how I'm a hypocrite, I actually try to compromise with the MRM sometimes. Just not people who only care about dismantling feminism and nothing about real men's rights or gender equality. I've argued against forced circumcision here, and about double standards regarding abuse (female-on-male specifically) elsewhere, though you'll have to take my word for the latter because I'm not going to connect this account with any other online accounts I have.

Edit: Also, let's move this to TGs or the feminist thread. Let me know which one you prefer, though I'd prefer the latter so that we're both governed by moderation, preventing things from getting too heated.

[Liriena]

To be fair, even if you don't suscribe to white privilege theory, it makes some sense to acknowledge that not all women experience womanhood the same way and therefor a singular, universal feminism may not be all that practical.

Ok, I do acknowledge that is likely true, however people shouldn't be isolationist and exclude materially related groups (in this case white women and minority women) just because their experiences aren't identical to theirs.

I will admit, I haven't read about white privilege theory in depth, so my knowledge of it is based on my personal observations of it IRL.

Oh, I agree with you. Which is why I really liked Donna Haraway's take on this issue (and yes, I'm going to keep name-dropping Haraway because she's basically one of the only two feminist authors I read intently and with care ). She believed that the solution was coalition through affinity, rather than identity politics.

[Cekoviu]

To be fair, even if you don't suscribe to white privilege theory, it makes some sense to acknowledge that not all women experience womanhood the same way and therefor a singular, universal feminism may not be all that practical.

Ok, I do acknowledge that is likely true, however people shouldn't be isolationist and exclude materially related groups (in this case white women and minority women) just because their experiences aren't identical to theirs.

I will admit, I haven't read about white privilege theory in depth, so my knowledge of it is based on my personal observations of it IRL.

I don't think that's really the point of intersectionality and related theories, at least in the way that I understand them. It's more intended to bring visibility to the fact that people can experience multiple forms of discrimination, but that they can be united in one cause with more awareness (hence "intersectionality" rather than "sectionality").

[The Multiversal Communist Collective]

He's an Argie TV comedian.

Has he done any work in English? Unfortunately, I do not speak Spanish.

[The Multiversal Communist Collective]

Seeing socialists attack feminism is, to be honest, something I never expected to see. However, one learns new things all the time.

[Ostroeuropa]

Seeing socialists attack feminism is, to be honest, something I never expected to see. However, one learns new things all the time.

The rise of the far-right in the modern day is primarily due to the excesses and failures of progressive politics in the context of a capitalist society. The Trump phemonanae is a major expression of it and how socialist economics is a principle held by a sizable amount of the population.

In the UK, most conservatives want railway nationalization, etc. It is only progressive politics that prevents economic progress, which is precisely why the media and elites utilize it and force it down everyones throats.

[Cekoviu]

Seeing socialists attack feminism is, to be honest, something I never expected to see. However, one learns new things all the time.

I think Ostro is a syndicalist, not a socialist. Ailyria, if I'm remembering correctly, doesn't exactly identify as a socialist. I'm not sure what exactly she does identify as politically.

[Ostroeuropa]

Seeing socialists attack feminism is, to be honest, something I never expected to see. However, one learns new things all the time.

I think Ostro is a syndicalist, not a socialist. Ailyria, if I'm remembering correctly, doesn't exactly identify as a socialist. I'm not sure what exactly she does identify as politically.

We're both syndicalists, which is a specific form of socialism.
Idk about Ail, but I avoid socialism as a label because people associate it with State socialism rather than Market socialism, of which syndicalism is a form. But if called a socialist I accept that is technically correct.

[Democratic Communist Federation]

Ailyria, if I'm remembering correctly, doesn't exactly identify as a socialist.

Ailyria identifies as a socialist but not as a communist.

[Ostroeuropa]

Ailyria, if I'm remembering correctly, doesn't exactly identify as a socialist.

Ailyria identifies as a socialist but not as a communist.

Communism is the definition of failure. - Liberty Prime

Wise words.

[Kubra]

Well stop listening to him
of all liberal talk show hosts, John Oliver is the funniest, this is beyond discussion

liberal talk show hosts all suck

something has to fill the gaping void between work and sleep

[FelrikTheDeleted]

Oh come on. I came here to escape this shit, not for migration of threads.

>escaping bullshit on NS
Your expectations were too high, mate.

[Crazed Pirates]

See: when some people of the right take offense at the use of terms like "cisgender" or "white privilege" as if they were personal, individual attacks.

People who hail from countries where being white (especially if you're the most prevalent local flavor of white) actively hobbles you, thanks to your favourite ethnocratic state, tend to dislike "white privelege" as a concept, and folk who come from the Commonwealth of Independent States usually take "DIE CIS SCUM" a little more personal than a common Westerner.

[Northern Davincia]

Ailyria identifies as a socialist but not as a communist.

Communism is the definition of failure. - Liberty Prime

Wise words.

Liberty Prime speaks the truth!

[Democratic Communist Federation]

Liberty Prime speaks the truth!

Until the revolution.

[Liriena]

He's an Argie TV comedian.

Has he done any work in English? Unfortunately, I do not speak Spanish.

There are some sketches of his uploaded with English subtitles. I'll see if I can find them.

[Democratic Communist Federation]

There are some sketches of his uploaded with English subtitles. I'll see if I can find them.

ty.

[Liriena]

There are some sketches of his uploaded with English subtitles. I'll see if I can find them.

ty.

Here are the first two Violencia Rivas sketches:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LY2hDrMScc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWUxmhgWkBU

[The Multiversal Communist Collective]

Here are the first two Violencia Rivas sketches:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LY2hDrMScc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWUxmhgWkBU

He is very talented. Initial impression: His work seems like a combination of left anarchism or autonomist Marxism and Albert Camu's absurdism.

[Liriena]

Here are the first two Violencia Rivas sketches:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LY2hDrMScc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWUxmhgWkBU

He is very talented. Initial impression: His work seems like a combination of left anarchism or autonomist Marxism and Albert Camu's absurdism.

Sounds about right.

I think some of his best material is in his satires of Peronism... but none of them have English subtitles.

[Kubra]

Communism is the definition of failure. - Liberty Prime

Wise words.

Liberty Prime speaks the truth!

>made to invade china
>can't take a few autists LARPing as the American government

Some liberator

[Bakery Hill]

Seeing socialists attack feminism is, to be honest, something I never expected to see. However, one learns new things all the time.

You must have been asleep at the wheel through the 60s, 70s and 80s then.