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The #MeToo Campaign (Updated)

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Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16683
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:01 pm

Gravlen wrote:Because the law doesn't target men, it targets the penis. A woman with a penis raping someone would be equally punishable as a man with a penis raping someone.


Until such an event occurs, you're going to have to concede that laws that are specifically constructed as to make forced penetration a lesser crime than rape, assuming that it's recognised as a crime in the first place, are designed to target men.

Once again, stop defending rapists.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

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Chestaan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6606
Founded: Sep 30, 2011
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Chestaan » Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:20 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:
Gravlen wrote:Because the law doesn't target men, it targets the penis. A woman with a penis raping someone would be equally punishable as a man with a penis raping someone.


Until such an event occurs, you're going to have to concede that laws that are specifically constructed as to make forced penetration a lesser crime than rape, assuming that it's recognised as a crime in the first place, are designed to target men.

Once again, stop defending rapists.



Exactly. It's like saying that gay marriage bans affect straight people just as much as gay people, because straight people are not allowed to marry those of the same gender either!
Council Communist
TG me if you want to chat, especially about economics, you can never have enough discussions on economics.Especially game theory :)
Economic Left/Right: -9.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.62

Our demands most moderate are, we only want the Earth - James Conolly

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Lord of The Rings
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 401
Founded: May 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Lord of The Rings » Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:04 pm

Just a redicilous campaign in which people's lives get ruined, sometimes justified, but often not.

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Chessmistress
Senator
 
Posts: 4767
Founded: Mar 16, 2015
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Chessmistress » Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:40 pm

I have to praise Gravlen, she's really good at making clear some important differences, and her arguments are full of logic and common sense.


Ostroeuropa wrote:
Gravlen wrote:Or rather, are you aware that we treat interpersonal violence differently? That not all violence are the same? That you'll not get the same punishment for slapping someone as for stabbing them?

We do. I know, it's a concept which is difficult to grasp, but we do. Because the problems are different.


Should adultery by a woman be considered worse than adultery by a man?


No.
I know that you're going to relate it with pregnancies, I know what your goal is...I have some news: when it comes to fatherhood the social construct aspect is much more prevalent than the biological bond (mainly due there isn't pregnancy), that's why some countries, like France, banned paternity tests.
Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed law and know that, in Canada, gender and sex are the same thing

OOC:
Radical Feminist, caring about the oppressed gender, that's why I have a strong sense of justice.

PRO:
Radical Feminism (proudly SWERF - moderately TERF),
Gender abolitionism,
birth control and population control,
affirmative ongoing VERBAL consent,
death penalty for rapists.

AGAINST:
patriarchy,
pornography,
heteronormativity,
domestic violence and femicide.


Favorite Quotes: http://www.nationstates.net/nation=ches ... /id=403173

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Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16683
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:25 pm

Chessmistress wrote:I have to praise Gravlen, she's really good at making clear some important differences, and her arguments are full of logic and common sense.


How is it common sense to deny the fact that men are capable of being raped? How is it common sense to defend biased sentencing in courts? How is it common sense to keep perpetuating negative social stereotypes and blatantly sexist social standards against men? I'll answer for you: it's not common sense. It's not logical and if either if you actually gave a damn about gender equality, both of you would see this and acknowledge this instead of just burying your heads in the proverbial sand. But thank you for putting a sex to the name. Now I know exactly how to approach them in future.

The only logic here is that it is logical for women to try and claim that forced penetration, or any other non-consensual sexual act performed by a woman, isn't rape on the basis that they don't want to be held to the same standards as men when it comes to punishing those that commit it, because women would lose the advantages of having a judicial system that favours them purely for being women.

I know that you're going to relate it with pregnancies, I know what your goal is...I have some news: when it comes to fatherhood the social construct aspect is much more prevalent than the biological bond (mainly due there isn't pregnancy), that's why some countries, like France, banned paternity tests.


Fatherhood isn't a social construct, it's a bond between the father and child that exists if the father wishes to be with the child and raise it. From a feminist perspective, it makes sense to ban paternity tests because it enables women to control men, and to force them into providing child support (read a stable income without having to work for it) or to trap men in relationships.

Both defending rapists and forcing men into providing women with income or be trapped in a controlling and likely abusive relationship is actually beneficial for me because not only does it prove that what I have been saying about feminists is right, but also it means more and more men are seeing the proverbial writing on the wall and are vowing to stay away from women. Hence why we see things like MGTOW exist: because it's becoming way too dangerous to become involved with women. And the great thing is, I don't have to do jack to get people to see just how screwed they are and how screwed society is.

Keep doing God's work you two.
Last edited by Costa Fierro on Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

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New Edom
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 22150
Founded: Mar 14, 2011
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby New Edom » Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:46 pm

Chessmistress wrote:I have to praise Gravlen, she's really good at making clear some important differences, and her arguments are full of logic and common sense.


Ostroeuropa wrote:
Should adultery by a woman be considered worse than adultery by a man?


No.
I know that you're going to relate it with pregnancies, I know what your goal is...I have some news: when it comes to fatherhood the social construct aspect is much more prevalent than the biological bond (mainly due there isn't pregnancy), that's why some countries, like France, banned paternity tests.


What you're saying is actually not quite true.

Paternity testing is regulated by the state and only allowed in certain cases:

1. Without a court order the express consent of the person must be obtained in writing before the carrying out of the examination, after the person has been duly informed of its nature and its purpose.
2. With a court order (if consent could not be obtained)

This is partially due to the official desire to "preserve the peace" within French families, with the French government citing psychologists who state that fatherhood is determined by society, rather than biology. French men often circumvent these laws by sending samples of DNA to foreign laboratories, but risk prosecution if caught. The maximum penalty for carrying out secret paternity testing is one year in prison and a €15,000 fine


So:

1. Psychologists saying something is so is not necessarily so. I couldn't find enough supporting information for this, so if you have more I'd appreciate that.

2. I looked at what French Civil Law says, and apparently the main concern is not the man OR the woman, but the child and their right to know or not know who their father or mother are.

However I know what you're thinking here: that removing paternity laws makes things so much better for women, because they are less accountable to men. This is why, of course, you feminists need to keep softening people up for feminist ideas, so that it seems natural to change laws to suit feminist oriented women.
"The three articles of Civil Service faith: it takes longer to do things quickly, it's far more expensive to do things cheaply, and it's more democratic to do things in secret." - Jim Hacker "Yes Minister"

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Chestaan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6606
Founded: Sep 30, 2011
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Chestaan » Wed Nov 15, 2017 9:29 am

Chessmistress wrote:I have to praise Gravlen, she's really good at making clear some important differences, and her arguments are full of logic and common sense.


Ostroeuropa wrote:
Should adultery by a woman be considered worse than adultery by a man?


No.
I know that you're going to relate it with pregnancies, I know what your goal is...I have some news: when it comes to fatherhood the social construct aspect is much more prevalent than the biological bond (mainly due there isn't pregnancy), that's why some countries, like France, banned paternity tests.


Possibly the best argument against Gravlen's defence of a state denying men can be raped is that Chessmistress agrees with him/her.
Council Communist
TG me if you want to chat, especially about economics, you can never have enough discussions on economics.Especially game theory :)
Economic Left/Right: -9.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.62

Our demands most moderate are, we only want the Earth - James Conolly

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