Are gun laws constitutional?

[Sovaal]

Potthan » Mon Jul 03, 2017 6:58 pm
Let's sit down and actually discuss this. Quoting the excerpt from the 2nd amendment, "The right to bear arms shall not be infringed". Now law books aren't like religious texts, they aren't up for interpretation. We all know they meant all arms.

Now quote the reason "a well organized militia". Therefore regulations that one needs to complete a safety exam of at least comparative level to the driving test are perfectly constitutional. Name one state in the Union where that happens. USA consists of either mad evil Liberals banning everything or mad evil GOP arming every criminal, lunatic and incompetent. 2nd Amendment is dead and gone.

High prices for weapons likewise violates the Constitution. Weapons should be available to all like Education, Sewers, Healthcare etc.

Now law books aren't like religious texts, they aren't up for interpretation.

Oh yes they are! That is what SCOTUS is there for. With the stroke of a pen, SCOTUS can easily write a big huge "not" all over the 2nd Amendment and confirm the current state of affairs and it will be perfectly constitutional.

Current SCOTUS won't do there. They are all Trump minions, they will interpret bearing arms is a Right for Citizens; only Trump minions are Citizens; therefore non-minions must be dis-armed; Democrats will kneel and worship Trump for achieving the biggest dis-armament of US citizens in History.

Some guns arw high priced sure, but plenty are fairly cheap as well.

And Trump isn't Caligula, and there is a current theory that the appointment og his horse was more a jab at the Senate than due to insanity.

[Auristania]

Now quote the reason "a well organized militia". Therefore regulations that one needs to complete a safety exam of at least comparative level to the driving test are perfectly constitutional. Name one state in the Union where that happens. USA consists of either mad evil Liberals banning everything or mad evil GOP arming every criminal, lunatic and incompetent. 2nd Amendment is dead and gone.

High prices for weapons likewise violates the Constitution. Weapons should be available to all like Education, Sewers, Healthcare etc.

Oh yes they are! That is what SCOTUS is there for. With the stroke of a pen, SCOTUS can easily write a big huge "not" all over the 2nd Amendment and confirm the current state of affairs and it will be perfectly constitutional.

Current SCOTUS won't do there. They are all Trump minions, they will interpret bearing arms is a Right for Citizens; only Trump minions are Citizens; therefore non-minions must be dis-armed; Democrats will kneel and worship Trump for achieving the biggest dis-armament of US citizens in History.

Some guns arw high priced sure, but plenty are fairly cheap as well.

And Trump isn't Caligula, and there is a current theory that the appointment og his horse was more a jab at the Senate than due to insanity.

AK-47 Kalashnikov is cheap and easy to learn, a fitting weapon for Peasants. IE a Communist weapon. And that is why bosses and liberals ban the Kalashnikov.

Caligula elected his horse as consul because he could. He gloated. Gloating, anyone can do, sane and insane alike.

[Sovaal]

Some guns arw high priced sure, but plenty are fairly cheap as well.

And Trump isn't Caligula, and there is a current theory that the appointment og his horse was more a jab at the Senate than due to insanity.

AK-47 Kalashnikov is cheap and easy to learn, a fitting weapon for Peasants. IE a Communist weapon. And that is why bosses and liberals ban the Kalashnikov.

Caligula elected his horse as consul because he could. He gloated. Gloating, anyone can do, sane and insane alike.

Well made American Ak's are actually fairly expensive, an AR is a better weapon for the American Yeoman in my opinion. An technology has no political loyalty.

[Auristania]

I ain't a gun expert. I have heard AK-47 is cheap and easy to learn = a fitting Peasant weapon. If there is a better, cheaper, easier to learn weapon available, I wanna know.

[Telconi]

I ain't a gun expert. I have heard AK-47 is cheap and easy to learn = a fitting Peasant weapon. If there is a better, cheaper weapon available, I wanna know.

There are many, especilly in the States.

[Sovaal]

I ain't a gun expert. I have heard AK-47 is cheap and easy to learn = a fitting Peasant weapon. If there is a better, cheaper, easier to learn weapon available, I wanna know.

Small arms in general are fairly easy to use, if they weren't, then whats the point of outfitting armies with them?

[Bakery Hill]

Look at these fake socialists.

That should have been sent at Liberalter's way and not mine.

I was supporting your argument comrade.

[Big Brain City]

"Real Socialists", as you put it, know the necessity of weaponization for revolutionary activity.

Just because Socialist organizations (like the Communist Party of the United States of America) are bought out by the Democrats to use lesser-evil arguments in support of their preferred candidates, does not mean Socialists who do not affiliate with these organizations have to abandon a key part of the ideology.

I'd also like to point out, I said "if" for a reason.

Look at these fake socialists.

That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there.

The workers must be armed and organized. The whole proletariat must be armed at once with muskets, rifles, cannon and ammunition… Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary.

fucking paramilitaries

[Genivaria]

‘Guns are fine — racism is not’: Armed redneck lefties are waging a different kind of war on Fascism
This is just awesome.

A well-armed organization of anti-racists are using gun culture to organize rural white voters against the administration of President Donald Trump.

“Redneck Revolt is a national network of community defense projects from a broad spread of political, religious, and cultural backgrounds. It is a pro-worker, anti-racist organization that focuses on working class liberation from the oppressive systems which dominate our lives,” the organization’s website states. “In states where it is legal to practice armed community defense, many branches choose to become John Brown Gun Clubs, training ourselves and our communities in defense and mutual aid.”

The name harkens back to the 1921 “Battle of Blair Mountain” when some 10,000 United Mine Workers of America staged the largest labor uprising in US history, with many miners wearing red bandanas around their necks. Over one million rounds of ammunition were fired before President Warren Harding sent in federal troops. Over sixty people died in the battle and almost 1,000 miners were arrested.

Such radical history is now being used to reach out to white working class voters.

“We use gun culture as a way to relate to people,” Redneck Revolt organizer Max Neely told Alternet. “Our basic message is: guns are fine, but racism is not.”

Guns culture provides the group with an organizing avenue.

“Redneck Revolt inserts themselves into overwhelmingly white spaces—NASCAR races, gun shows, flea markets in rural communities, and country music concerts—to offer a meaningful alternative to the white supremacist groups who often also recruit in those spaces,” Jared Ware of Shadowproof explained. “Redneck Revolt’s anti-racist, anti-capitalist message seems to be taking hold in communities across the United States. The organization had just 13 chapters in January but has nearly tripled its chapters nationally in the last 6 months. The group now has 34 different branches, 26 of which are in states that voted for Trump.”

“People need to be able to defend themselves. [We] live in a country in the world where people of color and LGBTQ people are routinely victimized and systematically victimized by the people who claim to be there for their defense,” a Pittsburgh, PA Redneck Revolt organizer named Shaun told Shadowproof. We provide free basic firearms training to pretty much everyone who needs it. We focus on trying to provide [self-defense training] when asked for [by] communities of color and LGBTQ folks.”

“White supremacy is essentially a fight to be the best treated dog in the kennel,” Shaun tells potential recruits. “It’s that way because a vastly small percentage of the population hordes access to resources and they’re able to do this because they’ve managed to get one half of the working class to turn against the other half in exchange for basically preferential treatment.”

Redneck Revolt seeks to change the calculation.

“I grew up playing in the woods, floating coolers of beer down a river, shooting off fireworks, just generally raising hell, all that kind of stuff,” Neely told Alternet. “Things most people would consider a part of redneck culture. We’re trying to acknowledge the ways we’ve made mistakes and bought into white supremacy and capitalism, but also give ourselves an environment in which it’s OK to celebrate redneck culture.”

[Aethrys]

Second amendment could do with minor amending itself. I see no issue with rescinding the right to bear arms from convicted violent felons or those not mentally competent, for instance.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Second amendment could do with minor amending itself. I see no issue with rescinding the right to bear arms from convicted violent felons or those not mentally competent, for instance.

It's already illegal for those people to own weapons.

[The Ninja5 Empire]

Depends on the state. Regardless of what I think, citizens having the right to bare arms is constitutional so maybe not.

[Liberalter]

That should have been sent at Liberalter's way and not mine.

I was supporting your argument comrade.

Look at these fake socialists.

fucking paramilitaries

again things have changed since the 1800s. Modern guns have become much more deadly than the muskets of the 1800s.

[Liberalter]

‘Guns are fine — racism is not’: Armed redneck lefties are waging a different kind of war on Fascism
This is just awesome.

A well-armed organization of anti-racists are using gun culture to organize rural white voters against the administration of President Donald Trump.

“Redneck Revolt is a national network of community defense projects from a broad spread of political, religious, and cultural backgrounds. It is a pro-worker, anti-racist organization that focuses on working class liberation from the oppressive systems which dominate our lives,” the organization’s website states. “In states where it is legal to practice armed community defense, many branches choose to become John Brown Gun Clubs, training ourselves and our communities in defense and mutual aid.”

The name harkens back to the 1921 “Battle of Blair Mountain” when some 10,000 United Mine Workers of America staged the largest labor uprising in US history, with many miners wearing red bandanas around their necks. Over one million rounds of ammunition were fired before President Warren Harding sent in federal troops. Over sixty people died in the battle and almost 1,000 miners were arrested.

Such radical history is now being used to reach out to white working class voters.

“We use gun culture as a way to relate to people,” Redneck Revolt organizer Max Neely told Alternet. “Our basic message is: guns are fine, but racism is not.”

Guns culture provides the group with an organizing avenue.

“Redneck Revolt inserts themselves into overwhelmingly white spaces—NASCAR races, gun shows, flea markets in rural communities, and country music concerts—to offer a meaningful alternative to the white supremacist groups who often also recruit in those spaces,” Jared Ware of Shadowproof explained. “Redneck Revolt’s anti-racist, anti-capitalist message seems to be taking hold in communities across the United States. The organization had just 13 chapters in January but has nearly tripled its chapters nationally in the last 6 months. The group now has 34 different branches, 26 of which are in states that voted for Trump.”

“People need to be able to defend themselves. [We] live in a country in the world where people of color and LGBTQ people are routinely victimized and systematically victimized by the people who claim to be there for their defense,” a Pittsburgh, PA Redneck Revolt organizer named Shaun told Shadowproof. We provide free basic firearms training to pretty much everyone who needs it. We focus on trying to provide [self-defense training] when asked for [by] communities of color and LGBTQ folks.”

“White supremacy is essentially a fight to be the best treated dog in the kennel,” Shaun tells potential recruits. “It’s that way because a vastly small percentage of the population hordes access to resources and they’re able to do this because they’ve managed to get one half of the working class to turn against the other half in exchange for basically preferential treatment.”

Redneck Revolt seeks to change the calculation.

“I grew up playing in the woods, floating coolers of beer down a river, shooting off fireworks, just generally raising hell, all that kind of stuff,” Neely told Alternet. “Things most people would consider a part of redneck culture. We’re trying to acknowledge the ways we’ve made mistakes and bought into white supremacy and capitalism, but also give ourselves an environment in which it’s OK to celebrate redneck culture.”

Redneck Revolt isn't intellectual. Noam Chomsky is.

[Sovaal]

I was supporting your argument comrade.

fucking paramilitaries

again things have changed since the 1800s. Modern guns have become much more deadly than the muskets of the 1800s.

Repeating rifles have been around for a while, and the 1800's is a long time.]

[Genivaria]

‘Guns are fine — racism is not’: Armed redneck lefties are waging a different kind of war on Fascism
This is just awesome.

Redneck Revolt isn't intellectual. Noam Chomsky is.

Well if you were TRYING to sound elitist good job.

[Aethrys]

Second amendment could do with minor amending itself. I see no issue with rescinding the right to bear arms from convicted violent felons or those not mentally competent, for instance.

It's already illegal for those people to own weapons.

Yes, but the wording gives rise to the argument that such laws could be considered unconstitutional.

[Constantinopolis]

Do Americans have a constitutional right to own ballistic missiles?

The question of the OP is equivalent to the question above.

After all, "arms" aren't limited to guns. If it's unconstitutional to restrict the ownership or use of "arms" in general, then it's unconstitutional to restrict the ownership and use of ballistic missiles. Or tanks.

It's almost as if the Second Amendment was written in a time when the most powerful weapons weren't anywhere near the power level of present-day weapons, so the people who wrote it couldn't imagine the problems that would arise from individual ownership of "arms" in general. Go figure.

For the record, I believe that the ownership and use of muskets should indeed be completely unrestricted.

[Ifreann]

‘Guns are fine — racism is not’: Armed redneck lefties are waging a different kind of war on Fascism
This is just awesome.

You know what they say. If your enemy has a good idea, steal it.

---

Second amendment could do with minor amending itself. I see no issue with rescinding the right to bear arms from convicted violent felons or those not mentally competent, for instance.

It's already illegal for those people to own weapons.

Boo, stop taking away people's means for self-defence. Just because they might not be capable of keeping and handling a firearm safely, or because they might use their firearms to commit crimes, they have to rely on the police for defence?

---

‘Guns are fine — racism is not’: Armed redneck lefties are waging a different kind of war on Fascism
This is just awesome.

Redneck Revolt isn't intellectual. Noam Chomsky is.

I know where I'd be putting my money if they're competing on efficacy.

[Catochristoferson]

Boo, stop taking away people's means for self-defence. Just because they might not be capable of keeping and handling a firearm safely, or because they might use their firearms to commit crimes, they have to rely on the police for defence?

When seconds count, the police are minutes away.

[Constantinopolis]

Additionally, many wrongly argue that it was made for people to combat and defend themselves against criminals and that "an AR-15 is overkill." However, the 2nd amendment was placed to keep the citizens of America armed in case another revolution or a coup was deemed necessary by the majority. This is populism 101.

But here's the thing about revolutions: Every successful revolutionary group in history, even before modern technology, was always vastly outgunned by government forces. To win a revolution you have to be able to defeat a superior military force. That's why revolutions are hard. If you think you can win a revolution through conventional warfare, you're not gonna have a fun time.

When the two sides are evenly matched and fighting each other conventionally, it's not called a revolution, it's called a civil war.

[Ifreann]

Boo, stop taking away people's means for self-defence. Just because they might not be capable of keeping and handling a firearm safely, or because they might use their firearms to commit crimes, they have to rely on the police for defence?

When seconds count, the police are minutes away.

So I've been told, but I guess people just don't feel that strongly about ex-cons or the mentally disabled being able to defend themselves in those critical seconds.

[Aclion]

It's already illegal for those people to own weapons.

Yes, but the wording gives rise to the argument that such laws could be considered unconstitutional.

No it doesn't, that's a loss of rights as part of the administration of justice following due process.

[Catochristoferson]

When seconds count, the police are minutes away.

So I've been told, but I guess people just don't feel that strongly about ex-cons or the mentally disabled being able to defend themselves in those critical seconds.

Because people who are depressed clearly can't be trusted with guns. Oh, and breaking the law automatically makes you a bad person, regardless of what law was being broken.

[Tekeristan]

I'm a libertarian socialist who loves guns.