Antifa listed as a terrorist organisation in New Jersey

[War Gears]

They've had this coming for quite awhile now.

Not sure if it's entirely accurate, but I definitely see the argument they have, since Antifa's goal is basically to use violence to intimidate people to prevent them from expressing their views.

They're ancoms LARPing as vigilantes in the name of anti-fascism while acting like the National Socialist Party in Daesh-inspired clothing.

... You aren't wrong.

[Chan Island]

Wait, the Klan *isn't* a domestic terrorist organization?

I hate swearing online but here's an exception. F*** the Klan. They are domestic terrorists.

There isn't a Klan anymore. That was broken to pieces years ago and hasn't reformed. There are several such groups scattered disparately around the country. Most are just bitch and moan clubs, but those that have taken or encouraged action are usually tagged as domestic terrorists pretty quickly

Oh, thanks for clearing that up.

[Salus Maior]

Then don't affiliate with Antifa.

"Don't affiliate with jews"

Not equivalent.

Political groups disassociate themselves from other political groups all the time. This is not even close to race or religion.

[Aigania]

Anti-fascism is considered terrorism in the United States?

Yes, and in Nazi Germany, as well.

And with that we can close the thread.

No surprising as long as one knows history (real) of where sympathies lies.
Ah, the smell of Freedom TM in the morning.

"(US, often pejorative) One who opposed fascism at a time when the United States government was still on relatively friendly terms with fascist Italy and (to a lesser extent) Nazi Germany, especially a supporter of the Second Spanish Republic in the Spanish Civil War."

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/premature_antifascist

First as tragedy, lately as a farce.

[Imperializt Russia]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupation_of_the_Malheur_National_Wildlife_Refuge

Not really.

Yes, it is. This is a deflection, Red Herring, "Not a real Scotsman" , basically whatever you can think of. Instead of focusing on Antifa, the subject matter, you brought up something completely unrelated. How do some crazy ( I want to say Libertarians?) taking over Federal property compare to thugs smashing windows, lighting fires and burning police cruisers? Attacking innocent people? Stop deflecting and focus on the subject.

Well, it's not "No True Scotsman" arguing, that's literally incorrect.

Siezing federal property from the state with armed force, and occupying that property under threat of firing upon those in service to the state in furthering political goals is...
Well, that's literally terrorism. Certainly a seditious act.
Very, very literally.

[TURTLESHROOM II]

Antifa IS a terrorist organization. Terrorism is the use of violence or threat of violence to advance a political point or persuade a government to do or not do something. That fits Antifa to a "T".

It needs to be declared a terrorist organization nationwide.

[Sareva]

Wait, the Klan *isn't* a domestic terrorist organization?

I hate swearing online but here's an exception. F*** the Klan. They are domestic terrorists.

There isn't a Klan anymore. That was broken to pieces years ago and hasn't reformed. There are several such groups scattered disparately around the country. Most are just bitch and moan clubs, but those that have taken or encouraged action are usually tagged as domestic terrorists pretty quickly

The Klan has been relegated to a Useless Ass in political debate. It's no longer capable of anything.

[Imperializt Russia]

"Don't affiliate with jews"

Not equivalent.

Political groups disassociate themselves from other political groups all the time. This is not even close to race or religion.

The Jews were turned into a political group in Nazi Germany, and wilful social or financial association with Jews was discouraged and in many cases criminally punished.

[Neo Balka]

Then don't affiliate with Antifa.

"Don't affiliate with jews"

Is antifa an ethno-religious group?

no?

Is antifa a bunch of communist pricks?

Yes.

[Athrax]

There isn't a Klan anymore. That was broken to pieces years ago and hasn't reformed. There are several such groups scattered disparately around the country. Most are just bitch and moan clubs, but those that have taken or encouraged action are usually tagged as domestic terrorists pretty quickly

In the same way there isn't one organised Antifa. Despite what all the commentators seem to think.

Yeah, this declaration seems kinda weird on the face of it. It's like people calling for BLM to be called a terror or hate group while failing to realize that there is no single BLM. I think this is more of a "groups that tend to follow or identify with this name and ideology can be considered terror groups"

[Vassenor]

Antifa IS a terrorist organization. Terrorism is the use of violence or threat of violence to advance a political point or persuade a government to do or not do something. That fits Antifa to a "T".

It needs to be declared a terrorist organization nationwide.

There's a lot of organisations that need to be declared terrorists then by these standards.

[Salus Maior]

Yes, it is. This is a deflection, Red Herring, "Not a real Scotsman" , basically whatever you can think of. Instead of focusing on Antifa, the subject matter, you brought up something completely unrelated. How do some crazy ( I want to say Libertarians?) taking over Federal property compare to thugs smashing windows, lighting fires and burning police cruisers? Attacking innocent people? Stop deflecting and focus on the subject.

Well, it's not "No True Scotsman" arguing, that's literally incorrect.

Siezing federal property from the state with armed force, and occupying that property under threat of firing upon those in service to the state in furthering political goals is...
Well, that's literally terrorism. Certainly a seditious act.
Very, very literally.

And that situation was taken care of a long time ago.

[Athrax]

There isn't a Klan anymore. That was broken to pieces years ago and hasn't reformed. There are several such groups scattered disparately around the country. Most are just bitch and moan clubs, but those that have taken or encouraged action are usually tagged as domestic terrorists pretty quickly

Oh, thanks for clearing that up.

Of course. Didn't need you thinking we were quite that bad

[Imperializt Russia]

"Don't affiliate with jews"

Is antifa an ethno-religious group?

no?

Is antifa a bunch of communist pricks?

Yes.

The Nuremburg race laws weren't very ethnoreligious in their application, though that's more due to racist pseudoscience being, well, racist pseudoscience.

[Salus Maior]

Not equivalent.

Political groups disassociate themselves from other political groups all the time. This is not even close to race or religion.

The Jews were turned into a political group in Nazi Germany, and wilful social or financial association with Jews was discouraged and in many cases criminally punished.

Again, not equivalent.

Nobody turned Antifa into a political group, it is one. An unpopular one that uses violence to get what it wants. And people can freely choose to associate with it or not, you don't get to choose if you're a Jew or not in the Nazi context.

[Imperializt Russia]

Well, it's not "No True Scotsman" arguing, that's literally incorrect.

Siezing federal property from the state with armed force, and occupying that property under threat of firing upon those in service to the state in furthering political goals is...
Well, that's literally terrorism. Certainly a seditious act.
Very, very literally.

And that situation was taken care of a long time ago.

Remind me when Cliven Bundy was charged, tried and convicted of seditious conspiracy and his affiliates being labelled terrorists, if you will.

[Neo Balka]

Is antifa an ethno-religious group?

no?

Is antifa a bunch of communist pricks?

Yes.

The Nuremburg race laws weren't very ethnoreligious in their application, though that's more due to racist pseudoscience being, well, racist pseudoscience.

Didnt know the US was nazi germany.

Or modern day UK with all the cameras you have around and terror attacks STILL happen.

amaze.

[Sareva]

Yes, it is. This is a deflection, Red Herring, "Not a real Scotsman" , basically whatever you can think of. Instead of focusing on Antifa, the subject matter, you brought up something completely unrelated. How do some crazy ( I want to say Libertarians?) taking over Federal property compare to thugs smashing windows, lighting fires and burning police cruisers? Attacking innocent people? Stop deflecting and focus on the subject.

Well, it's not "No True Scotsman" arguing, that's literally incorrect.

Siezing federal property from the state with armed force, and occupying that property under threat of firing upon those in service to the state in furthering political goals is...
Well, that's literally terrorism. Certainly a seditious act.
Very, very literally.

Okay, wrong term used.

Do I believe Antifa is a terrorist group? No, they are practically useless and only a threat when you're alone and surrounded. My point was that by bringing up that dumb shit with Ted Bundy, how was it relevant to Antifa smashing shit and attacking people? What does Ted Bundy have to do with the actions of losers and anarcho-communists who don't really understand what anarcho-communism is?

Yeah, Ted Bundy committed terrorist actions and more or less deserved what he gained. Is it relevant to Antifa on the context of the subject? Not particularly.

[Imperializt Russia]

The Jews were turned into a political group in Nazi Germany, and wilful social or financial association with Jews was discouraged and in many cases criminally punished.

Again, not equivalent.

Nobody turned Antifa into a political group, it is one. An unpopular one that uses violence to get what it wants. And people can freely choose to associate with it or not, you don't get to choose if you're a Jew or not in the Nazi context.

So all antifa is complicit in "Antifa" violence but God help me if I point out that "open carry protesters" support Trump and also use the implicit threat of lethal force.

[Salus Maior]

And that situation was taken care of a long time ago.

Remind me when Cliven Bundy was charged, tried and convicted of seditious conspiracy and his affiliates being labelled terrorists, if you will.

Remind me when Bundy's movement got traction across the country and globally, intervening in protests and seeking to shut down peoples political views through violence.

[Imperializt Russia]

Well, it's not "No True Scotsman" arguing, that's literally incorrect.

Siezing federal property from the state with armed force, and occupying that property under threat of firing upon those in service to the state in furthering political goals is...
Well, that's literally terrorism. Certainly a seditious act.
Very, very literally.

Okay, wrong term used.

Do I believe Antifa is a terrorist group? No, they are practically useless and only a threat when you're alone and surrounded. My point was that by bringing up that dumb shit with Ted Bundy, how was it relevant to Antifa smashing shit and attacking people? What does Ted Bundy have to do with the actions of losers and anarcho-communists who don't really understand what anarcho-communism is?

Yeah, Ted Bundy committed terrorist actions and more or less deserved what he gained. Is it relevant to Antifa on the context of the subject? Not particularly.

Ted Bundy is a sexual serial killer from Canada.

Aamon Bundy led the Malheur standoff, and is the son of Cliven Bundy, whose ranch has been in a 20-year legal standoff with the federal government over land use rights. This culminated in an armed standoff in 2014(?).

[Neo Balka]

Remind me when Cliven Bundy was charged, tried and convicted of seditious conspiracy and his affiliates being labelled terrorists, if you will.

Remind me when Bundy's movement got traction across the country and globally, intervening in protests and seeking to shut down peoples political views through violence.

Antifa at least weaponized bike locks.

[Minzerland II]

Because the Klan is currently in decline and hasn't intimidated their opposition through violence like ANTIFA has.

I'm unsure as to whether New Jersey's decision is accurate, but ANTIFA is far more the terrorist organisation than the Ku Klux Klan.

They fight people at protests and break signs, are those who participated in the Baltimore riots terrorists? Is Greenpeace?

It's partisan bullshit. As said, Christieland.

ANTIFA actively attacks and intimidates their political opponents on a consistent basis, the Baltimore riots are not comparable.

Did I agree to the decision? No, I didn't; in fact, I even said that I am unsure of the accuracy. So why lambast me over labelling ANTIFA a terrorist organisation?

[Imperializt Russia]

The Nuremburg race laws weren't very ethnoreligious in their application, though that's more due to racist pseudoscience being, well, racist pseudoscience.

Didnt know the US was nazi germany.

Or modern day UK with all the cameras you have around and terror attacks STILL happen.

amaze.

Wow, it's almost like CCTV is meant to record crimes happening or something so there's evidence of it.

[Salus Maior]

Again, not equivalent.

Nobody turned Antifa into a political group, it is one. An unpopular one that uses violence to get what it wants. And people can freely choose to associate with it or not, you don't get to choose if you're a Jew or not in the Nazi context.

So all antifa is complicit in "Antifa" violence but God help me if I point out that "open carry protesters" support Trump and also use the implicit threat of lethal force.

I'm no fan of Trump or Trump supporters so you're not going to see me defending them. But I'm not going to not criticize Antifa when it's clearly doing wrong things as well.