Trump MAGAthread VII

[Athrax]

I certainly hope he pulls through. It might be best for him to retire, if only for the sake of his family.

"For family reasons" is the cover-all excuse for retirements of many sorts (avoiding an impending election loss, avoiding partisan damage from a scandal etc) but in the case of a politician who might not have long to live, it's a good and legitimate reason. So, well said.

His chances of recovery might be better without the stress of being Senator. But maybe the opposite, too, it might be a sense of duty which keeps him alive at all. I don't know him well enough to say.

I imagine he'll signal an intent to step down in order to give prep time for his replacement, but then he'll step down. Seems most likely to me, but who knows

[AiliailiA]

"For family reasons" is the cover-all excuse for retirements of many sorts (avoiding an impending election loss, avoiding partisan damage from a scandal etc) but in the case of a politician who might not have long to live, it's a good and legitimate reason. So, well said.

His chances of recovery might be better without the stress of being Senator. But maybe the opposite, too, it might be a sense of duty which keeps him alive at all. I don't know him well enough to say.

I imagine he'll signal an intent to step down in order to give prep time for his replacement, but then he'll step down. Seems most likely to me, but who knows

Well yes, but I think that can wait until about November this year ... one year out should be enough time for the state party to put forward a decent slate for the primaries next year. Giving them too much time could be bad, they'd get a front runner long before the party base are taking an interest.

As I said in the other thread, it might be better for McCain personally if he stood down sooner. If he's going to fight the cancer, make that his full time job. Also get in some fly fishing or whatever it is he does for fun, it's what I'd do ... but then, I've never had the work ethic or the consistency of purpose to be a politician, and I never pretended otherwise.

[Bombadil]

"The Republicans never discuss how good their healthcare bill is, & it will get even better at lunchtime.."

I.. can't.. even..

[Myrensis]

I certainly hope he pulls through. It might be best for him to retire, if only for the sake of his family.

"For family reasons" is the cover-all excuse for retirements of many sorts (avoiding an impending election loss, avoiding partisan damage from a scandal etc) but in the case of a politician who might not have long to live, it's a good and legitimate reason. So, well said.

His chances of recovery might be better without the stress of being Senator. But maybe the opposite, too, it might be a sense of duty which keeps him alive at all. I don't know him well enough to say.

I suspect the announcement will be sooner rather than later. Not to be the downer, but the type of cancer he has has a very poor prognosis even for much younger healthier people. 5 year survival rate is around 5%, median survival is 14 months with treatment.

Miracles are possible though, and I'll certainly hope he gets one. Any respect I had for the man has long evaporated, but I wouldn't wish this on anyone.

"The Republicans never discuss how good their healthcare bill is, & it will get even better at lunchtime.."

I.. can't.. even..

Yes, I think we all remember how hard President Trump has been out there promoting the benefits of this bill to the people.

By which I mean he whined periodically on Twitter about how he was sitting in his big boy chair with a big boy pen waiting to sign any big boy bill they gave him, no questions asked.

[Galloism]

Trump warns Mueller not to probe into his finances

President Trump warned the special counsel investigating Russia not to look into his business or personal finances during an interview on Wednesday.

Trump was asked by The New York Times whether Robert Mueller would be crossing a red line if it expanded his probe into the Trump family empire.

“I would say yes,” Trump said about the red line. “I think that’s a violation. Look, this is about Russia.”

The Times also reported that Trump criticized Mueller for running an office rife with conflicts of interest.

Trump did not say what he would do if Mueller subpoenaed financial records. However, the president reportedly considered firing the special counsel in the past.

The president has repeatedly refused to release his tax returns or the financial information for his sprawling real estate empire.

[Camicon]

Trump warns Mueller not to probe into his finances

President Trump warned the special counsel investigating Russia not to look into his business or personal finances during an interview on Wednesday.

Trump was asked by The New York Times whether Robert Mueller would be crossing a red line if it expanded his probe into the Trump family empire.

“I would say yes,” Trump said about the red line. “I think that’s a violation. Look, this is about Russia.”

The Times also reported that Trump criticized Mueller for running an office rife with conflicts of interest.

Trump did not say what he would do if Mueller subpoenaed financial records. However, the president reportedly considered firing the special counsel in the past.

The president has repeatedly refused to release his tax returns or the financial information for his sprawling real estate empire.

Jesus fucking Christ, how can Trump be this stupid?

[Myrensis]

Trump warns Mueller not to probe into his finances

President Trump warned the special counsel investigating Russia not to look into his business or personal finances during an interview on Wednesday.

Trump was asked by The New York Times whether Robert Mueller would be crossing a red line if it expanded his probe into the Trump family empire.

“I would say yes,” Trump said about the red line. “I think that’s a violation. Look, this is about Russia.”

The Times also reported that Trump criticized Mueller for running an office rife with conflicts of interest.

Trump did not say what he would do if Mueller subpoenaed financial records. However, the president reportedly considered firing the special counsel in the past.

The president has repeatedly refused to release his tax returns or the financial information for his sprawling real estate empire.

Yes, obviously Mueller looking into his finances would totally be straying from his mandate to investigate Russian interference in the election. I mean, when has anyone ever tried to use money to influence anyone or anything? That's just crazy talk!

[Zeinbrad]

Trump warns Mueller not to probe into his finances

President Trump warned the special counsel investigating Russia not to look into his business or personal finances during an interview on Wednesday.

Trump was asked by The New York Times whether Robert Mueller would be crossing a red line if it expanded his probe into the Trump family empire.

“I would say yes,” Trump said about the red line. “I think that’s a violation. Look, this is about Russia.”

The Times also reported that Trump criticized Mueller for running an office rife with conflicts of interest.

Trump did not say what he would do if Mueller subpoenaed financial records. However, the president reportedly considered firing the special counsel in the past.

The president has repeatedly refused to release his tax returns or the financial information for his sprawling real estate empire.

"Can you please not look at the bloodied knife in my hand"

[Camicon]

Trump warns Mueller not to probe into his finances

Yes, obviously Mueller looking into his finances would totally be straying from his mandate to investigate Russian interference in the election. I mean, when has anyone ever tried to use money to influence anyone or anything? That's just crazy talk!

It's time to play: WHICH STUPENDOUSLY STUPID LIE WILL TRUMP CHOOSE!?

YOUR OPTIONS ARE...

A) "You shouldn't be looking into my 'self-funded' campaign, because my personal finances had nothing to do with my campaign"

... OR...

B) "I wasn't involved in my presidential campaign at all, you have no right to look into my personal business'

[Galloism]

Trump warns Mueller not to probe into his finances

Jesus fucking Christ, how can Trump be this stupid?

Even his allies talk about it.

When I floated this idea to Capitol Hill Republicans, they generally found it preposterous. They were willing to allow for the possibility that some Trump campaign officials might have inappropriately cooperated with Russians, but they said the president and his team were simply too incompetent to pull off a high-level House of Cards-style conspiracy. At worst, they seemed to believe Team Trump’s collusion amounted to a “conspiracy of dunces” (as a recent Ross Douthat column termed it)—embarrassing and unseemly, sure, but certainly not so grave as to demand blowing up the entire GOP agenda to address it.

“I think most of us agree that if something did happen, it wasn’t anything malicious … it’s just chalked up to [Trump and his advisers] not being very smart,” one senior Senate aide told me. “When people are pointing to Carter Page as someone who colluded, I don’t have any problem believing that… There are so many people who associate themselves with campaigns that are clowns.” Even the meeting Donald Trump Jr. orchestrated with a Kremlin-linked lawyer was seen as evidence of bumbling ineptitude more than high crimes and misdemeanors.

[Camicon]

Jesus fucking Christ, how can Trump be this stupid?

Even his allies talk about it.

When I floated this idea to Capitol Hill Republicans, they generally found it preposterous. They were willing to allow for the possibility that some Trump campaign officials might have inappropriately cooperated with Russians, but they said the president and his team were simply too incompetent to pull off a high-level House of Cards-style conspiracy. At worst, they seemed to believe Team Trump’s collusion amounted to a “conspiracy of dunces” (as a recent Ross Douthat column termed it)—embarrassing and unseemly, sure, but certainly not so grave as to demand blowing up the entire GOP agenda to address it.

“I think most of us agree that if something did happen, it wasn’t anything malicious … it’s just chalked up to [Trump and his advisers] not being very smart,” one senior Senate aide told me. “When people are pointing to Carter Page as someone who colluded, I don’t have any problem believing that… There are so many people who associate themselves with campaigns that are clowns.” Even the meeting Donald Trump Jr. orchestrated with a Kremlin-linked lawyer was seen as evidence of bumbling ineptitude more than high crimes and misdemeanors.

The mistake they make is in implying that bumbling ineptitude which results in high crimes and misdemeanors is less of a transgression than intentionally committing high crimes and misdemeanors. Shit fucking happened, whether or not it was intended is rather beside the point when it comes to assessing present and future costs and damages.

Whether Trump's collusion with Russia was intentional or not (pro-tip: it was), it is worth blowing up the GOP's agenda to address it. The fact that they won't speaks to how massively corrupt, from top to bottom, the entire party is.

[Myrensis]

Trump warns Mueller not to probe into his finances

Jesus fucking Christ, how can Trump be this stupid?

Well remember, as a man born with a silver spoon in his mouth who has always been able to bully people into submission with his money and leave others holding the bag for his failures, Trump naturally views himself as a tough guy.

So while you and I and everyone with more than a couple of functional brain cells to rub together sees the President of the United States blatantly and petulantly threatening to shut down an independent investigation that involves him if he doesn't like where it's leading, in Donnie's mind I'm sure he imagines that he just put Mueller on notice, and that Mueller is probably home right now crying and shaking in fear of mighty President Trump.

[Bombadil]

Jesus fucking Christ, how can Trump be this stupid?

Even his allies talk about it.

When I floated this idea to Capitol Hill Republicans, they generally found it preposterous. They were willing to allow for the possibility that some Trump campaign officials might have inappropriately cooperated with Russians, but they said the president and his team were simply too incompetent to pull off a high-level House of Cards-style conspiracy. At worst, they seemed to believe Team Trump’s collusion amounted to a “conspiracy of dunces” (as a recent Ross Douthat column termed it)—embarrassing and unseemly, sure, but certainly not so grave as to demand blowing up the entire GOP agenda to address it.

“I think most of us agree that if something did happen, it wasn’t anything malicious … it’s just chalked up to [Trump and his advisers] not being very smart,” one senior Senate aide told me. “When people are pointing to Carter Page as someone who colluded, I don’t have any problem believing that… There are so many people who associate themselves with campaigns that are clowns.” Even the meeting Donald Trump Jr. orchestrated with a Kremlin-linked lawyer was seen as evidence of bumbling ineptitude more than high crimes and misdemeanors.

Well he's a businessman not a politician, as a businessman you take any information you can, sign deals and generally try to barge your way through life - a politician has at least an understanding of being bound by rules and that you need to compromise rather than order people around - i think he's just completely unused to thinking in terms of politics.

..and that would be excusable if his business was an honest one, alas he's as dishonest and prone to failure in business as he is in politics.

[AiliailiA]

Yes, I think we all remember how hard President Trump has been out there promoting the benefits of this bill to the people.

By which I mean he whined periodically on Twitter about how he was sitting in his big boy chair with a big boy pen waiting to sign any big boy bill they gave him, no questions asked.

You nailed it. He did make suggestions early on (keeping coverage for existing conditions, keeping young adults on parents' plans) which are actually good, but it's well past the point now where Trump's stunted understanding of (anything?) health insurance and Obamacare itself can add anything meaningful to the Republican party's struggle with itself. He will sign whatever they give him.

And if he doesn't, or they give him a budget (might be even harder than health care) and he vetoes that, they will just turn on him. Being in government is no use if they can't govern. There will be all-public hearings on his Russia connections and if they find anything they will literally impeach him. Because the worst that can happen is Pence losing re-election two years later, and in the meantime they can get some of their (god awful) Republican agenda actually passed and signed.

[Galloism]

Even his allies talk about it.

The mistake they make is in implying that bumbling ineptitude which results in high crimes and misdemeanors is less of a transgression than intentionally committing high crimes and misdemeanors. Shit fucking happened, whether or not it was intended is rather beside the point when it comes to assessing present and future costs and damages.

Whether Trump's collusion with Russia was intentional or not (pro-tip: it was), it is worth blowing up the GOP's agenda to address it. The fact that they won't speaks to how massively corrupt, from top to bottom, the entire party is.

There's a funny thing that months ago John Oliver called this "Stupid Watergate", an event with all the importance and gravity of Watergate, but where everyone involved is stupid and bad at everything.

John Oliver might be a Time Lord.

[Camicon]

The mistake they make is in implying that bumbling ineptitude which results in high crimes and misdemeanors is less of a transgression than intentionally committing high crimes and misdemeanors. Shit fucking happened, whether or not it was intended is rather beside the point when it comes to assessing present and future costs and damages.

Whether Trump's collusion with Russia was intentional or not (pro-tip: it was), it is worth blowing up the GOP's agenda to address it. The fact that they won't speaks to how massively corrupt, from top to bottom, the entire party is.

There's a funny thing that months ago John Oliver called this "Stupid Watergate", an event with all the importance and gravity of Watergate, but where everyone involved is stupid and bad at everything.

John Oliver might be a Time Lord.

John Oliver for the 14th Doctor? I would watch the shit out of Doctor Who if they did that.

[Ism]

There's a funny thing that months ago John Oliver called this "Stupid Watergate", an event with all the importance and gravity of Watergate, but where everyone involved is stupid and bad at everything.

John Oliver might be a Time Lord.

John Oliver for the 14th Doctor? I would watch the shit out of Doctor Who if they did that.

I mean...

[Gauthier]

Why is 'state's rights' only used when someone's trying to shit on individual rights?

Because it feels less authoritarian for the virtuous state governments to be the ones infringing on people's rights than for the evil swampy federal government to do it.

Americans are weird like that, apparently.

Don't forget states that throw a pissy fit about cities that say trans people can go where they want and pass laws overriding the cities as well as a dick police bill.

[Gauthier]

Trump is still salty about Sessions' recusal

The more he talks, the harder it is to believe claims that he's playing some sort of multidimensional mind game with us.

And we realize by "multidimensional" they meant "Connect 4".

[Camicon]

Because it feels less authoritarian for the virtuous state governments to be the ones infringing on people's rights than for the evil swampy federal government to do it.

Americans are weird like that, apparently.

Don't forget states that throw a pissy fit about cities that say trans people can go where they want and pass laws overriding the cities as well as a dick police bill.

Don't forget refusing to let municipalities increase the minimum wage beyond that set by the state.

[Senkaku]

Why is 'state's rights' only used when someone's trying to shit on individual rights?

Because it feels less authoritarian for the virtuous state governments to be the ones infringing on people's rights than for the evil swampy federal government to do it.

Americans are weird like that, apparently.

Remember: it's better to have your neighbors oppress you than to have some stranger thousands of miles away try to govern you decently.

Jesus fucking Christ, how can Trump be this stupid?

Even his allies talk about it.

When I floated this idea to Capitol Hill Republicans, they generally found it preposterous. They were willing to allow for the possibility that some Trump campaign officials might have inappropriately cooperated with Russians, but they said the president and his team were simply too incompetent to pull off a high-level House of Cards-style conspiracy. At worst, they seemed to believe Team Trump’s collusion amounted to a “conspiracy of dunces” (as a recent Ross Douthat column termed it)—embarrassing and unseemly, sure, but certainly not so grave as to demand blowing up the entire GOP agenda to address it.

“I think most of us agree that if something did happen, it wasn’t anything malicious … it’s just chalked up to [Trump and his advisers] not being very smart,” one senior Senate aide told me. “When people are pointing to Carter Page as someone who colluded, I don’t have any problem believing that… There are so many people who associate themselves with campaigns that are clowns.” Even the meeting Donald Trump Jr. orchestrated with a Kremlin-linked lawyer was seen as evidence of bumbling ineptitude more than high crimes and misdemeanors.

"It's not that they conspired to betray their country, they just sorta bumbled into it because they're so dumb, so it's fine!"

The mistake they make is in implying that bumbling ineptitude which results in high crimes and misdemeanors is less of a transgression than intentionally committing high crimes and misdemeanors. Shit fucking happened, whether or not it was intended is rather beside the point when it comes to assessing present and future costs and damages.

Whether Trump's collusion with Russia was intentional or not (pro-tip: it was), it is worth blowing up the GOP's agenda to address it. The fact that they won't speaks to how massively corrupt, from top to bottom, the entire party is.

There's a funny thing that months ago John Oliver called this "Stupid Watergate", an event with all the importance and gravity of Watergate, but where everyone involved is stupid and bad at everything.

John Oliver might be a Time Lord.

His comparison gets more and more apt with every passing hour, tbh. Why can't we have a fun international conspiracy for once? Something with car chases and globe-trotting adventure and sex and cutting-edge gadgetry, not just some unbelievably stupid people having some boring-ass meetings or calls or emails with intelligence apparatchiks and bankers and then blabbing about it left and right.

[Cannot think of a name]

Even his allies talk about it.

Well he's a businessman not a politician, as a businessman you take any information you can, sign deals and generally try to barge your way through life - a politician has at least an understanding of being bound by rules and that you need to compromise rather than order people around - i think he's just completely unused to thinking in terms of politics.

..and that would be excusable if his business was an honest one, alas he's as dishonest and prone to failure in business as he is in politics.

I'm kind of tired of this excuse. Business owners have to follow rules, there are limits to the way they can legally acquire information. Business owners have to work with other business people which sometimes includes compromise. And even if these excuses weren't bullshit, his entire pitch has been that a business person would be better at the job specifically because they're a business person and not a...politician. Now that he's abysmally bad at this job like everyone who opposed this dumbass thinking said he would be we're being told, "You have to understand, he's a business man...he doesn't know how this works..." WE KNOW, goddammit. We fucking said this would happen.

Also...while I'm at it...business people have transitioned to politics a lot and none of them were this fucking inept at it. I didn't want Romney to be president, but he didn't shit his pants every second day in the office he held. Like, this excuse doesn't work on any level.

Not that all of these things are on you, Bombadil, at this point I'm raging against this idea writ large not specifically your argument.

[Bombadil]

Well he's a businessman not a politician, as a businessman you take any information you can, sign deals and generally try to barge your way through life - a politician has at least an understanding of being bound by rules and that you need to compromise rather than order people around - i think he's just completely unused to thinking in terms of politics.

..and that would be excusable if his business was an honest one, alas he's as dishonest and prone to failure in business as he is in politics.

I'm kind of tired of this excuse. Business owners have to follow rules, there are limits to the way they can legally acquire information. Business owners have to work with other business people which sometimes includes compromise. And even if these excuses weren't bullshit, his entire pitch has been that a business person would be better at the job specifically because they're a business person and not a...politician. Now that he's abysmally bad at this job like everyone who opposed this dumbass thinking said he would be we're being told, "You have to understand, he's a business man...he doesn't know how this works..." WE KNOW, goddammit. We fucking said this would happen.

Also...while I'm at it...business people have transitioned to politics a lot and none of them were this fucking inept at it. I didn't want Romney to be president, but he didn't shit his pants every second day in the office he held. Like, this excuse doesn't work on any level.

Not that all of these things are on you, Bombadil, at this point I'm raging against this idea writ large not specifically your argument.

*keys CtoaNs VW*

[AiliailiA]

Don't forget states that throw a pissy fit about cities that say trans people can go where they want and pass laws overriding the cities as well as a dick police bill.

Don't forget refusing to let municipalities increase the minimum wage beyond that set by the state.

Fuck yeah. I was outraged when I learned they could do that, and anyone making the argument "government is best which rules least" should absolutely reject it.

I suppose they justify it as protecting someone's rights ("someone" including businesses as people), the way states without unfair dismissal laws call that "right to work", but oh my. Sometimes the appeal to "rights" is just the refuge of a scoundrel.

[Corrian]

Remember, the "Small government" and "states rights" and "government should stay out of your business" party is doing all of these things.

Though I guess "States rights" doesn't include "city rights"