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The Serbian Empire
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58107
Founded: Apr 18, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby The Serbian Empire » Sat Jun 03, 2017 8:51 pm

Ambarii wrote:
Fartsniffage wrote:
Name a time when internment in the US resulted in a good outcome.

The Civil War.

That was more to keep Confederates captured from rejoining the Confederate Army.
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Ambarii
Envoy
 
Posts: 268
Founded: Apr 07, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Ambarii » Sat Jun 03, 2017 8:55 pm

The Serbian Empire wrote:
Ambarii wrote:The Civil War.

That was more to keep Confederates captured from rejoining the Confederate Army.

And I am suggesting that we lock up jihadists and other extremists to prevent them from committing acts of terror.
Last edited by Ambarii on Sat Jun 03, 2017 8:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Napkiraly
Post Czar
 
Posts: 37450
Founded: Aug 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Napkiraly » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:00 pm

Tekeristan wrote:
Imperializt Russia wrote:Except Americans wouldn't flood in to take those jobs, and the farmers wouldn't want to take them on. Long story short, migrants are better at things like farmwork than the average westerner. They've probably done it back home, and - on average (#NotAll) have a much stronger work ethic than a native. They have come to a different country to work, sometimes for illegally low wages.

Note how the Trump estate is continually filing migrant labour requests for their fucking wineries, when those could be "American jobs".
Even the Trumps know that Americans won't do the work, and they don't want them to because they'd have to pay a decent wage.

Capitalist exploitation.
This is before considering the inevitable issue of what happens when these crops can no longer be effectively or expediently picked.

You're god damn right.
Source: I worked as an agricultural field hand.
I literally don't take anyone's opinion about migrants seriously unless they worked with them. They're amazing people.

Them being good people isn't the issue. If they were pillars of the community I'd still want them deported.

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Grinning Dragon
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10397
Founded: May 16, 2011
Anarchy

Postby Grinning Dragon » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:01 pm

Ambarii wrote:
The Serbian Empire wrote:That was more to keep Confederates captured from rejoining the Confederate Army.

And I am suggesting that we lock up jihadists and other extremists to prevent them from committing acts of terror.

While I don't understand killing for religion, your proposal sets a very dangerous precedent and is akin to setting a forest on fire to prevent a forest fire.

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Tekeristan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5344
Founded: Mar 08, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Tekeristan » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:01 pm

Napkiraly wrote:
Tekeristan wrote:You're god damn right.
Source: I worked as an agricultural field hand.
I literally don't take anyone's opinion about migrants seriously unless they worked with them. They're amazing people.

Them being good people isn't the issue. If they were pillars of the community I'd still want them deported.

For being migrants?
Illegal migrants maybe but just regular migrants?

Why?

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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 41257
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Fartsniffage » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:03 pm

Napkiraly wrote:
Tekeristan wrote:You're god damn right.
Source: I worked as an agricultural field hand.
I literally don't take anyone's opinion about migrants seriously unless they worked with them. They're amazing people.

Them being good people isn't the issue. If they were pillars of the community I'd still want them deported.


Why?

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The East Marches II
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18033
Founded: Mar 11, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby The East Marches II » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:04 pm

Fartsniffage wrote:
Ambarii wrote:When did I say that? IWhat I am suggesting wouldn't even be against the Constitution since it allows for the suspension of habeas corpus. But admittedly, yes, there are quite a few things I would change about the US Constitution. I don't think this is that unusual. For instance, their is quite a large movement of Americans that are opposed to the 2nd ammendment.


Name a time when internment in the US resulted in a good outcome.


Are we counting rounding up the Irish in Chicago during riots?

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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 41257
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Fartsniffage » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:05 pm

The East Marches II wrote:
Fartsniffage wrote:
Name a time when internment in the US resulted in a good outcome.


Are we counting rounding up the Irish in Chicago during riots?


What was the outcome?

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Torrocca
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27688
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:05 pm

Tekeristan wrote:
Napkiraly wrote:Them being good people isn't the issue. If they were pillars of the community I'd still want them deported.

For being migrants?
Illegal migrants maybe but just regular migrants?

Why?

Fartsniffage wrote:
Napkiraly wrote:Them being good people isn't the issue. If they were pillars of the community I'd still want them deported.


Why?


Probably fear.
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NOTICE 1: Anything depicted IC on this nation does NOT reflect my IRL views or values, and is not endorsed by me.
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The East Marches II
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18033
Founded: Mar 11, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby The East Marches II » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:05 pm

Fartsniffage wrote:
The East Marches II wrote:
Are we counting rounding up the Irish in Chicago during riots?


What was the outcome?


No more riots, law and order restored. Then they became the police force.

Edit: Actually this was a poor outcome, you were correct
Last edited by The East Marches II on Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Tekeristan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5344
Founded: Mar 08, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Tekeristan » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:09 pm

Torrocca wrote:
Tekeristan wrote:For being migrants?
Illegal migrants maybe but just regular migrants?

Why?

Fartsniffage wrote:
Why?


Probably fear.

Guessing from the cultural nationalist thing, it has to do more with 'purity'.
Which is ballux, since just from that alone they had no idea how agriculture actually works in this country.

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Torrocca
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27688
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:10 pm

Tekeristan wrote:
Torrocca wrote:

Probably fear.

Guessing from the cultural nationalist thing, it has to do more with 'purity'.
Which is ballux, since just from that alone they had no idea how agriculture actually works in this country.


Well, yeah it might be that too.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
They call me Torra, but you can call me... anytime (☞⌐■_■)☞
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
NOTICE 1: Anything depicted IC on this nation does NOT reflect my IRL views or values, and is not endorsed by me.
NOTICE 2: Most RP and every OOC post by me prior to 2023 are no longer endorsed nor tolerated by me. I've since put on my adult pants!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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The Greater Aryan Race
Senator
 
Posts: 4378
Founded: Mar 21, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby The Greater Aryan Race » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:18 pm

So, what is to be done now? More hemming and hawing by the politicians? More collective shuffling about with hands in pockets, fingers crossed that another attack like this won't happen?
Imperium Sidhicum wrote:So, uh... Is this another one of those threads where everyone is supposed to feel outraged and circle-jerk in agreement of how injust and terrible the described incident is?

Because if it is, I'm probably going to say something mean and contrary just to contradict the majority.

This nation is now IC-ly known as the Teutonic Reich.

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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 41257
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Fartsniffage » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:19 pm

The Greater Aryan Race wrote:So, what is to be done now? More hemming and hawing by the politicians? More collective shuffling about with hands in pockets, fingers crossed that another attack like this won't happen?


What would you suggest?

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Nakena
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15010
Founded: May 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Nakena » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:19 pm

Grinning Dragon wrote:
Ambarii wrote:And I am suggesting that we lock up jihadists and other extremists to prevent them from committing acts of terror.

While I don't understand killing for religion, your proposal sets a very dangerous precedent and is akin to setting a forest on fire to prevent a forest fire.


You're suggesting appeasement then? Appease the islamist in the vain hope that they will refrain from comitting violent acts or provide an environment for those.

Its not going to work too out.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -them.html

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Tekeristan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5344
Founded: Mar 08, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Tekeristan » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:20 pm

The Greater Aryan Race wrote:So, what is to be done now? More hemming and hawing by the politicians? More collective shuffling about with hands in pockets, fingers crossed that another attack like this won't happen?

Pretty much. It'll pass with time.
KEEP CALM AND CARRY ON. GOD SAVE THE QUEEN
Wide spread terror is what they want, that is why they do what they do. Reactionary action is a no good. Instead lets just strengthen our cooperative efforts across nations and keep the police into proper gear for keeping an eye on reasonable suspects.

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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 41257
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Fartsniffage » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:22 pm

Nakena wrote:
Grinning Dragon wrote:While I don't understand killing for religion, your proposal sets a very dangerous precedent and is akin to setting a forest on fire to prevent a forest fire.


You're suggesting appeasement then? Appease the islamist in the vain hope that they will refrain from comitting violent acts or provide an environment for those.

Its not going to work too out.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -them.html


What's the alternative? We can't genocide the Muslim population in the UK. So we keep talking and we keep promoting peace.

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The Greater Aryan Race
Senator
 
Posts: 4378
Founded: Mar 21, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby The Greater Aryan Race » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:32 pm

Fartsniffage wrote:
The Greater Aryan Race wrote:So, what is to be done now? More hemming and hawing by the politicians? More collective shuffling about with hands in pockets, fingers crossed that another attack like this won't happen?


What would you suggest?

The restoration of Diplock courts, the granting of broader search and surveillance powers to the police and military, the reenactment of indefinite detention of suspected terrorists (which would of course mean that the Human Rights Act will have to be repealed), stiffer penalties for aiding, financing or attempting to carry out terrorism and serious efforts to co-opt the different religious leaders (be they Muslim, Christian, Jewish or what have you not) into the state apparatus.

Tekeristan wrote:
The Greater Aryan Race wrote:So, what is to be done now? More hemming and hawing by the politicians? More collective shuffling about with hands in pockets, fingers crossed that another attack like this won't happen?

Pretty much. It'll pass with time.
KEEP CALM AND CARRY ON. GOD SAVE THE QUEEN
Wide spread terror is what they want, that is why they do what they do. Reactionary action is a no good. Instead lets just strengthen our cooperative efforts across nations and keep the police into proper gear for keeping an eye on reasonable suspects.

Reactionary action is at times, much better than just sitting around and offering prayers and positive energy. If there are solutions and methods that would be able to nip the problem of terrorism in the bud, why shouldn't the State pursue these solutions vigorously?
Last edited by The Greater Aryan Race on Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Imperium Sidhicum wrote:So, uh... Is this another one of those threads where everyone is supposed to feel outraged and circle-jerk in agreement of how injust and terrible the described incident is?

Because if it is, I'm probably going to say something mean and contrary just to contradict the majority.

This nation is now IC-ly known as the Teutonic Reich.

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Zanera
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9717
Founded: Jun 28, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Zanera » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:34 pm

Grinning Dragon wrote:
Ambarii wrote:And I am suggesting that we lock up jihadists and other extremists to prevent them from committing acts of terror.

While I don't understand killing for religion, your proposal sets a very dangerous precedent and is akin to setting a forest on fire to prevent a forest fire.


I think that's an actual thing, actually.

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Nationalist Tyrol
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 2
Founded: Jun 03, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Nationalist Tyrol » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:37 pm

I truly wonder who was behind this and what was the motive.

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Nakena
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15010
Founded: May 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Nakena » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:37 pm

Fartsniffage wrote:
Nakena wrote:
You're suggesting appeasement then? Appease the islamist in the vain hope that they will refrain from comitting violent acts or provide an environment for those.

Its not going to work too out.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -them.html


What's the alternative? We can't genocide the Muslim population in the UK. So we keep talking and we keep promoting peace.


The alternative to appeasement would be to set a clear framework of tolerance and rules; specifically making it clear that the followers of radical Islamism in it's various forms are no longer welcome or tolerated and have to submit to the framework or leave.

What the UK and many other european states are currently doing is displaying a great deal of tolerance towards radical Islamism and keeping the more aggressive forms of it under police and intelligence surveillance in the hope that they can track down terrorists timely as long as they keep the whole mess under control.

What they doing is tolerating and managing islamism instead of show it the door.
Last edited by Nakena on Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Ambarii
Envoy
 
Posts: 268
Founded: Apr 07, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Ambarii » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:38 pm

Grinning Dragon wrote:
Ambarii wrote:And I am suggesting that we lock up jihadists and other extremists to prevent them from committing acts of terror.

While I don't understand killing for religion, your proposal sets a very dangerous precedent and is akin to setting a forest on fire to prevent a forest fire.

I'd argue that it sets a very good precedent. That extremism, hate, advocating violence won't be tolerated.

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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 53352
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:38 pm

Ambarii wrote:
Grinning Dragon wrote:While I don't understand killing for religion, your proposal sets a very dangerous precedent and is akin to setting a forest on fire to prevent a forest fire.

I'd argue that it sets a very good precedent. That extremism, hate, advocating violence won't be tolerated.


Thought crime is bad, lets not.
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The Malarttan People
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 116
Founded: May 21, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby The Malarttan People » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:41 pm

Zanera wrote:
Grinning Dragon wrote:While I don't understand killing for religion, your proposal sets a very dangerous precedent and is akin to setting a forest on fire to prevent a forest fire.


I think that's an actual thing, actually.

Sadly, it is a thing so the proposal somehow has a chance of working. In a horribly fucked manner, but somehow working.

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Tarsonis Survivors
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15693
Founded: Feb 03, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Tarsonis Survivors » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:44 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Ambarii wrote:I'd argue that it sets a very good precedent. That extremism, hate, advocating violence won't be tolerated.


Thought crime is bad, lets not.


Technically I think that's pre-crime.

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