Far-Right German Soldiers' False Flag Plot Foiled

[Improved werpland]

https://www.google.com/amp/www.foxnews.com/world/2017/05/09/germany-arrests-second-soldier-in-alleged-far-right-plot.amp.html
https://www.google.com/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/german-soldiers-false-flag-arrests-refugees-assassinate-plot-far-right-left-wing-politicians-terror-a7726676.html%3Famp

BERLIN – German authorities arrested a second soldier Tuesday on allegations he was part of a far-right plot to assassinate prominent political figures and blame the attack on refugees in a case that has raised concerns about extremism within the country's military.Maximilian T., 27, was arrested in the southwestern city of Kehl on charges of preparing an act of violence, federal prosecutor's spokeswoman Frauke Koehler said.

His apprehension follows the arrest last month of 28-year-old Lt. Franco A., a Bundeswehr soldier stationed with a Franco-German brigade in Illkirch, just across the border from Kehl in France. Their last names weren't released in line with privacy laws.

In a case authorities have called "more than strange," A. is alleged to have managed to pass himself off as a Syrian refugee in the state of Hesse at the end of 2015 and be granted a place at a home for asylum-seekers, as well as state financial aid for migrants. Though stationed with the Bundeswehr in France, he lived sporadically at the refugee home and T. is alleged to have covered him, at times, when he was absent from the barracks, prosecutors said.

What makes this even more surprising is that Franco A. wrote a thesis on ”political change and subversion strategy“ and had "HH" (Heil Hitler) inscribed on his barracks wall. Is the German military really that bad that they can be infiltrated by Nazis?

Thoughts?

[Wysten]

https://www.google.com/amp/www.foxnews.com/world/2017/05/09/germany-arrests-second-soldier-in-alleged-far-right-plot.amp.html
https://www.google.com/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/german-soldiers-false-flag-arrests-refugees-assassinate-plot-far-right-left-wing-politicians-terror-a7726676.html%3Famp

BERLIN – German authorities arrested a second soldier Tuesday on allegations he was part of a far-right plot to assassinate prominent political figures and blame the attack on refugees in a case that has raised concerns about extremism within the country's military.Maximilian T., 27, was arrested in the southwestern city of Kehl on charges of preparing an act of violence, federal prosecutor's spokeswoman Frauke Koehler said.

His apprehension follows the arrest last month of 28-year-old Lt. Franco A., a Bundeswehr soldier stationed with a Franco-German brigade in Illkirch, just across the border from Kehl in France. Their last names weren't released in line with privacy laws.

In a case authorities have called "more than strange," A. is alleged to have managed to pass himself off as a Syrian refugee in the state of Hesse at the end of 2015 and be granted a place at a home for asylum-seekers, as well as state financial aid for migrants. Though stationed with the Bundeswehr in France, he lived sporadically at the refugee home and T. is alleged to have covered him, at times, when he was absent from the barracks, prosecutors said.

What makes this even more surprising is that Franco A. wrote a thesis on ”political change and subversion strategy“ and had "HH" (Heil Hitler) inscribed on his barracks wall. Is the German military really that bad that they can be infiltrated by Nazis?

Thoughts?

Well in today's Germany with refugees coming in and crime via those refugees increasing such as rape and murder and a government that does not want to address the issue under "political correctness" one can see how easy it is for far right groups like the Nazis to infiltrate the military and convince men of the armed forces to "Protect the People" but committing crimes against Muslims. This is further increased by the frustration you can see from both police and the armed forces in not protecting its citizens due to the attacker being Muslim.

[Ifreann]

I don't know if two guys really counts as being infiltrated by Nazis.

[Uxupox]

its coming

[The East Marches II]

Any Army will appeal to its traditions to give a sense or history and context to themselves. It is only natural the German army would look to the Wehrmacht. Some people go too far down the rabbit hole. It is unfortunate this occured. I also believe there is more to the story than they are letting on from what I read in German papers on the matter.

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

[Uxupox]

Any Army will appeal to its traditions to give a sense or history and context to themselves. It is only natural the German army would look to the Wehrmacht. Some people go too far down the rabbit hole. It is unfortunate this occured. I also believe there is more to the story than they are letting on from what I read in German papers on the matter.

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

The German military is literally baggage at this point. Probably is more detrimental than a positive effect on other allies.

[Saiwania]

The German government has no case and I insist that these heroic soldiers did nothing wrong. I'm sure this is all made up to further the left's grip of power over Germany, when it is at a time when the Merkel government is incompetent as hell and there is a desperate need to take power away from her and any like minded politicians. The German state will only ever become better with a more nationalist agenda. The best that could possibly happen is dismantling the EU and turning away all middle eastern refugees.

[Frank Zipper]

Are they being charged with terrorism?

[Ifreann]

The German government has no case and I insist that these heroic soldiers did nothing wrong. I'm sure this is all made up to further the left's grip of power over Germany, when it is at a time when the Merkel government is incompetent as hell and there is a desperate need to take power away from her and any like minded politicians.

Do you have any basis for this insistence other than the presumed alignment of your politics and views on race?

[The East Marches II]

Any Army will appeal to its traditions to give a sense or history and context to themselves. It is only natural the German army would look to the Wehrmacht. Some people go too far down the rabbit hole. It is unfortunate this occured. I also believe there is more to the story than they are letting on from what I read in German papers on the matter.

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

The German military is literally baggage at this point. Probably is more detrimental than a positive effect on other allies.

I agree

[Improved werpland]

Any Army will appeal to its traditions to give a sense or history and context to themselves. It is only natural the German army would look to the Wehrmacht. Some people go too far down the rabbit hole. It is unfortunate this occured. I also believe there is more to the story than they are letting on from what I read in German papers on the matter.

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

What have you read that makes you think there is more?

[Ifreann]

Any Army will appeal to its traditions to give a sense or history and context to themselves. It is only natural the German army would look to the Wehrmacht. Some people go too far down the rabbit hole. It is unfortunate this occured. I also believe there is more to the story than they are letting on from what I read in German papers on the matter.

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

What have you read that makes you think there is more?

Well for one I'm betting these soldiers have last names that aren't just a single letter.

[The East Marches II]

Any Army will appeal to its traditions to give a sense or history and context to themselves. It is only natural the German army would look to the Wehrmacht. Some people go too far down the rabbit hole. It is unfortunate this occured. I also believe there is more to the story than they are letting on from what I read in German papers on the matter.

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

What have you read that makes you think there is more?

Not to go full tinfoil but the guy had the support from his unit from what I understand. He had a former French military pistol from surplus stocks, that he was given that without questions asked raises eyebrows. He was known as an exemplary soldier and a man who knew his business. The Bundeswehr sorts it's guys out with some serious ideological tests. Apparently a Colonel in his unit tried to intervene on his behalf to cover up things. I don't think he'd risk his neck unless there was more to it. The idea he was missing from barracks without people knowing about it strange too because he was supposedly in Alsace by day and in Austria by night. That's impossible to manage. Either it was sanctioned or there is a very very serious rot at the heart of the German Army. Especially so since this was a rather top notch group he was with.

From what I was reading previously on this matter, forgive me as I don't have a proper source, my brother who lives in Europe brings me German language papers when he visits so I can keep up on the news in Europe. I'll see if I can find the digital versions of the stories when I get home and post them in the thread.

The story is strange and while I can believe a guy got radicalized, there are holes in it. Hence my thinking there is more to it.

[The Holy Therns]

The German government has no case and I insist that these heroic soldiers did nothing wrong. I'm sure this is all made up to further the left's grip of power over Germany, when it is at a time when the Merkel government is incompetent as hell and there is a desperate need to take power away from her and any like minded politicians. The German state will only ever become better with a more nationalist agenda. The best that could possibly happen is dismantling the EU and turning away all middle eastern refugees.

Figures you'd drop in.

[Conserative Morality]

Not to go full tinfoil but the guy had the support from his unit from what I understand. He had a former French military pistol from surplus stocks, that he was given that without questions asked raises eyebrows. He was known as an exemplary soldier and a man who knew his business. The Bundeswehr sorts it's guys out with some serious ideological tests. Apparently the Colonel in his unit tried to intervene on his behalf to cover up things. I don't think he'd risk his neck unless there was more to it. The idea he was missing from barracks without people knowing about it strange too because he was supposedly in Alsace by day and in Austria by night. That's impossible to manage. Either it was sanctioned or there is a very very serious rot at the heart of the German Army. Especially so since this was a rather top notch group he was with.

From what I was reading previously on this matter, forgive me as I don't have a proper source, my brother who lives in Europe brings me German language papers when he visits so I can keep up on the news in Europe. I'll see if I can find the digital versions of the stories when I get home and post them in the thread.

The story is strange and while I can believe a guy got radicalized, there are holes in it. Hence my thinking there is more to it.

You said before

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

But honestly what you just described sounds like an actual reason to go a-purging. You don't let institutions get questionable loyalties or ideas about where they stand in the order of things.

[The East Marches II]

Not to go full tinfoil but the guy had the support from his unit from what I understand. He had a former French military pistol from surplus stocks, that he was given that without questions asked raises eyebrows. He was known as an exemplary soldier and a man who knew his business. The Bundeswehr sorts it's guys out with some serious ideological tests. Apparently the Colonel in his unit tried to intervene on his behalf to cover up things. I don't think he'd risk his neck unless there was more to it. The idea he was missing from barracks without people knowing about it strange too because he was supposedly in Alsace by day and in Austria by night. That's impossible to manage. Either it was sanctioned or there is a very very serious rot at the heart of the German Army. Especially so since this was a rather top notch group he was with.

From what I was reading previously on this matter, forgive me as I don't have a proper source, my brother who lives in Europe brings me German language papers when he visits so I can keep up on the news in Europe. I'll see if I can find the digital versions of the stories when I get home and post them in the thread.

The story is strange and while I can believe a guy got radicalized, there are holes in it. Hence my thinking there is more to it.

You said before

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

But honestly what you just described sounds like an actual reason to go a-purging. You don't let institutions get questionable loyalties or ideas about where they stand in the order of things.

There are alot of closet wehraboos in the German Army I've learned from experience. They are the only ones willing to join their military since the end of conscription. My fear is that they will botch the purge, not replace the men lost with capable soldiers loyal strictly to the Bundesrepublik . I don't have confidence in their ability to execute anything these days really. Rot is just replaced with another sort of rot.

[Sanctissima]

Not to go full tinfoil but the guy had the support from his unit from what I understand. He had a former French military pistol from surplus stocks, that he was given that without questions asked raises eyebrows. He was known as an exemplary soldier and a man who knew his business. The Bundeswehr sorts it's guys out with some serious ideological tests. Apparently the Colonel in his unit tried to intervene on his behalf to cover up things. I don't think he'd risk his neck unless there was more to it. The idea he was missing from barracks without people knowing about it strange too because he was supposedly in Alsace by day and in Austria by night. That's impossible to manage. Either it was sanctioned or there is a very very serious rot at the heart of the German Army. Especially so since this was a rather top notch group he was with.

From what I was reading previously on this matter, forgive me as I don't have a proper source, my brother who lives in Europe brings me German language papers when he visits so I can keep up on the news in Europe. I'll see if I can find the digital versions of the stories when I get home and post them in the thread.

The story is strange and while I can believe a guy got radicalized, there are holes in it. Hence my thinking there is more to it.

You said before

On another note, I heard from a friend in their Army that they are turning the barracks upside down. Any old pictures or even trainint films are being confiscated. Unfortunately given Germany's penchant for bad ideas these days I fear that this will be used as an excuse to purge it's Army and further cripple it's fighting power at a time when we need it at some level of usefulness for the Russians.

But honestly what you just described sounds like an actual reason to go a-purging. You don't let institutions get questionable loyalties or ideas about where they stand in the order of things.

Honestly, if you can't even maintain the support of your military, perhaps you have bigger internal problems that need to be addressed.

[Ifreann]

What have you read that makes you think there is more?

Not to go full tinfoil but the guy had the support from his unit from what I understand. He had a former French military pistol from surplus stocks, that he was given that without questions asked raises eyebrows.

Clearly there were some flaws with the plan, given that these two were caught, but how do you frame Syrian refugees for assassinations if you use a gun that only a soldier could realistically acquire?

Maybe I'm just a natural criminal mastermind, but that seems stupid to me.

He was known as an exemplary soldier and a man who knew his business. The Bundeswehr sorts it's guys out with some serious ideological tests. Apparently the Colonel in his unit tried to intervene on his behalf to cover up things. I don't think he'd risk his neck unless there was more to it. The idea he was missing from barracks without people knowing about it strange too because he was supposedly in Alsace by day and in Austria by night. That's impossible to manage. Either it was sanctioned or there is a very very serious rot at the heart of the German Army. Especially so since this was a rather top notch group he was with.

From what I was reading previously on this matter, forgive me as I don't have a proper source, my brother who lives in Europe brings me German language papers when he visits so I can keep up on the news in Europe. I'll see if I can find the digital versions of the stories when I get home and post them in the thread.

The story is strange and while I can believe a guy got radicalized, there are holes in it. Hence my thinking there is more to it.

Sounds like the Bundeswehr might need a bit of a purge.

[Conserative Morality]

Honestly, if you can't even maintain the support of your military, perhaps you have bigger internal problems that need to be addressed.

If the military is getting too big for its britches, then you clamp down on the military. We live in an era of civilian governments, and if a nation's military has a problem with that, then the military needs to get fucked. Hard. I have no intention of seeing a repeat of Japanese government by assassination, or Freikorps-style meddling. Do you?

[Ifreann]

You said before


But honestly what you just described sounds like an actual reason to go a-purging. You don't let institutions get questionable loyalties or ideas about where they stand in the order of things.

Honestly, if you can't even maintain the support of your military, perhaps you have bigger internal problems that need to be addressed.

Perhaps not. The approval of soldiers isn't necessarily a good barometer of a government quality.

[Conserative Morality]

Clearly there were some flaws with the plan, given that these two were caught, but how do you frame Syrian refugees for assassinations if you use a gun that only a soldier could realistically acquire?

Maybe I'm just a natural criminal mastermind, but that seems stupid to me.

When performing a false flag operation, the goal is to create a cover or smoke screen for other activity and demonization, not to create an actual coherent narrative. You don't need to convince the opposition. You don't even need to convince your own side. You just need to make an excuse.

[The East Marches II]

Maybe I'm just a natural criminal mastermind, but that seems stupid to me.

There is a large illegal gun trade in continental Europe so it's possible that it could be passed off as an weapon that could be aqquired on the street. Plus there are still stockpiles of weapons NATO left behind all over the places found from time to time

He was known as an exemplary soldier and a man who knew his business. The Bundeswehr sorts it's guys out with some serious ideological tests. Apparently the Colonel in his unit tried to intervene on his behalf to cover up things. I don't think he'd risk his neck unless there was more to it. The idea he was missing from barracks without people knowing about it strange too because he was supposedly in Alsace by day and in Austria by night. That's impossible to manage. Either it was sanctioned or there is a very very serious rot at the heart of the German Army. Especially so since this was a rather top notch group he was with.

From what I was reading previously on this matter, forgive me as I don't have a proper source, my brother who lives in Europe brings me German language papers when he visits so I can keep up on the news in Europe. I'll see if I can find the digital versions of the stories when I get home and post them in the thread.

The story is strange and while I can believe a guy got radicalized, there are holes in it. Hence my thinking there is more to it.

Sounds like the Bundeswehr might need a bit of a purge.

Bit of one but not run out its best people who did not do anything wrong.

[Sanctissima]

Honestly, if you can't even maintain the support of your military, perhaps you have bigger internal problems that need to be addressed.

If the military is getting too big for its britches, then you clamp down on the military. We live in an era of civilian governments, and if a nation's military has a problem with that, then the military needs to get fucked. Hard. I have no intention of seeing a repeat of Japanese government by assassination, or Freikorps-style meddling. Do you?

Eh, Germany's military is already quite pacified. Pacified to a point where they couldn't withstand an invasion by a foreign army, but sure, insubordination does need to be deal with.

That being said, if the response is to simply hamstring the military to the point it is irrelevant, without dealing with the actual reasons why Germany's army is repeatedly having these issues, then the problem isn't really being solved.

Honestly, if you can't even maintain the support of your military, perhaps you have bigger internal problems that need to be addressed.

Perhaps not. The approval of soldiers isn't necessarily a good barometer of a government quality.

It tends to be indicative of national decay.

All armies are intended to protect their nations from foreign threats. If one cannot trust one's own army to do this, and must maintain a vigilant eye to ensure it doesn't target the government it is suppose to serve, then perhaps there are larger societal problems that need to be addressed.

[Wysten]

Also with the weapons issue there have been reports of from Sweden from some of the riots that they were using AKs so the weapons will not be the problem

[The East Marches II]

Honestly, if you can't even maintain the support of your military, perhaps you have bigger internal problems that need to be addressed.

If the military is getting too big for its britches, then you clamp down on the military. We live in an era of civilian governments, and if a nation's military has a problem with that, then the military needs to get fucked. Hard. I have no intention of seeing a repeat of Japanese government by assassination, or Freikorps-style meddling. Do you?

A small bit of me wants to see it