Attack Helicopter

[New Clearland]

For the past years a meme has been circulating on the internet that reads "I sexually identify as an attack helicopter." It was created as a humorous reaction to the numerous different gender identities being pushed forward by the LGBT community that now number in the dozens. With so many fringe genders being pushed forward, many people believe it has gone out of hand. What do you think?

Personally, I understand the struggles of the LGBT community and sympathize with them, but I do feel that this whole gender identity thing is being blown out of proportion.

[Spartan Hellas]

Don't we already have this thread?

[Zakuvia]

It's navalist as well. I see those attack helicopters soaring in the air, unaware all the time of their aerial privilege. What can an aircraft carrier do to avoid these kinds of microaggressions?

On a serious note, yes, the ignorance of science in the name of not damaging the emotions of histrionics is grating beyond reason. If it's not completely logically inconsistent, it's reminiscent of nothing less than that MadTV skit of that mentally ill child dancing in place and shouting 'look what I can do'.

Someone whose name escapes me now put it best. This movement is for people who can't accept that normativity is acceptable. They have to be individuals, and god help you if you can't accept their special status. One self-absorbed personality latches onto another, and another and eventually people mistake this nonsense as having validity.

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go terrorize some fishing vessels with my other carrierkin.

[New Clearland]

It's navalist as well. I see those attack helicopters soaring in the air, unaware all the time of their aerial privilege. What can an aircraft carrier do to avoid these kinds of microaggressions?

On a serious note, yes, the ignorance of science in the name of not damaging the emotions of histrionics is grating beyond reason. If it's not completely logically inconsistent, it's reminiscent of nothing less than that MadTV skit of that mentally ill child dancing in place and shouting 'look what I can do'.

Someone whose name escapes me now put it best. This movement is for people who can't accept that normativity is acceptable. They have to be individuals, and god help you if you can't accept their special status. One self-absorbed personality latches onto another, and another and eventually people mistake this nonsense as having validity.

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go terrorize some fishing vessels with my other carrierkin.

Very good point.

[Jovian Socialist Republic]

I really don't give a crap about what people identify as. They can identify as genderfluid, fire hydrant, pickup truck, I don't care what people are, it's their identity, not mine.

[Valgora]

You need to add at least one more answer for the poll - "No, as long as the number of genders doesn't go crazy"


In my opinion, there is sex which is determined by chromosomes, then there is gender which is determined by physical and/or mental attributes.

I think that there is more than 2 genders but only to a certain point.
I'd definitely agree that there is possibly 3 genders, not 100% sure about 4 or 5, and 6 or above is just getting crazy.
I also don't think anyone can truly be gender fluid, where they just change gender when ever they want (gender fluid doesn't apply to those who have dissociative identity disorder and one of the identities is a gender that is different than the person with DID).

[Pavelania]

I only see 2 biologic genders/sexes, Male and Female. All those other "genders" are not genders, I see them more as just names you give yourself or a preference. Example, being straight, gay, or bi are preferences. Outside of my beliefs in Christianity, I strongly dislike LGBTs because I just can't wrap my mind around how you can be attracted to the same freaking sex/gender as you! I also find it very disgusting. This whole LGBT gender and pronouns thing is getting out of hand.

[Noraika]

Personally, I don't think it's really any problem at all. For decades now the scientific and medical community has observed that gender identity exists on a spectrum, not as two binary options, so in that case, like sexuality, or any spectrum, there are an near infinite number of points on the line in which a person can identify, and thus a near infinite ways in which gender can emerge and develop as male, female, or any combination, as well as certain allocation for observation of individuals who are not on the spectrum of gender at all.

All of this develops after and separate to sex, and the more detailed knowledge of gender identity as male, female, and non-binary forms, is merely the manifestation of this element of human diversity. It's the same as how sexuality can vary considerably between person to person. It's certainly no problem, at least I have never found it too cause any issue in terms of my experience with gender-variant individuals. In fact, I find the complexity of human beings in this manner absolutely fascinating and very good. [1]

[Ifreann]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

[Khasinkonia]

It's navalist as well. I see those attack helicopters soaring in the air, unaware all the time of their aerial privilege. What can an aircraft carrier do to avoid these kinds of microaggressions?

On a serious note, yes, the ignorance of science in the name of not damaging the emotions of histrionics is grating beyond reason. If it's not completely logically inconsistent, it's reminiscent of nothing less than that MadTV skit of that mentally ill child dancing in place and shouting 'look what I can do'.

Someone whose name escapes me now put it best. This movement is for people who can't accept that normativity is acceptable. They have to be individuals, and god help you if you can't accept their special status. One self-absorbed personality latches onto another, and another and eventually people mistake this nonsense as having validity.

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go terrorize some fishing vessels with my other carrierkin.

Personally, I think a healthy balance needs to be reached. The state of being transgender and wishing to change gender and/or sex is one thing, many studies have proven it to be legitimate. Androgeny is a bit more gray area. It's arguably the most indesputably benign to all sides of the argument, so science or no science, it's easier to just let them live in such a state than bothering to open any cans of worms on the subject. Gender fluidity and such things seem less logical to an outside observer, so logic would dictate that it ought to be considered less legitimate than the former two mentioned. Honestly, though, I think the whole debate is a bit overdone. It'd be much easier if we had one catch-all pronoun like hän. Then, we'd have the pronoun issue out of the way. Then, to tackle the bathroom topic that seems to be raising hell across the board for different reasons, we could just make the stalls go from the floor to the ceiling and have one unisex bathroom, sans urinals. And there you have it folks, now only the moral conservatives are upset. Alternatively, we could dust off the old law books and see what they did in the olden days. Then we'd have the opposite problem. This is why we can't have nice things folks, this is why.

[Noraika]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

Not really. In face of the psychological and medicinal evidence and expertise it's entirely legitimate. I've yet to see any real argument against their existence that warrants the opposition they face. Usually it's just feeling inconvenienced or overwhellmed by it, which, while understandable, does not negate the legitimacy of this element of human diversity.

[Imperializt Russia]

It's navalist as well. I see those attack helicopters soaring in the air, unaware all the time of their aerial privilege. What can an aircraft carrier do to avoid these kinds of microaggressions?

On a serious note, yes, the ignorance of science in the name of not damaging the emotions of histrionics is grating beyond reason. If it's not completely logically inconsistent, it's reminiscent of nothing less than that MadTV skit of that mentally ill child dancing in place and shouting 'look what I can do'.

Someone whose name escapes me now put it best. This movement is for people who can't accept that normativity is acceptable. They have to be individuals, and god help you if you can't accept their special status. One self-absorbed personality latches onto another, and another and eventually people mistake this nonsense as having validity.

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go terrorize some fishing vessels with my other carrierkin.

Mmm, yes, tell me about this science, Dr Carrier.

Are you conflating gender with sex? Or just don't care to spend thirty seconds skimming wikipedia as to why there is more than three alleged options?

[The Holy Therns]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

No we don't, but we just wouldn't be us if we didn't do it anyway, would we?

[Ardrentt]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

I think the meme is more focused on people who don't fit into the binary definitions of gender so neatly, which a lot of trans people don't, but the perception is that they're probably trying to to some degree: It's probably more referring to those who might identify as bigender or agender and the like.

[Noraika]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

I think the meme is more focused on people who don't fit into the binary definitions of gender so neatly, which a lot of trans people don't, but the perception is that they're probably trying to to some degree: It's probably more referring to those who might identify as bigender or agender and the like.

With that said, even non-binary and fluid experiences of gender identity are equally seen as valid within the medical and scientific literature, and included in the definitions and understandings of gender identity. I mean I can understand that those aspects are probably more difficult and foreign to wrap our heads around, but there are not illegitimate by that difficulty others may have with it.

[Ifreann]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

No we don't, but we just wouldn't be us if we didn't do it anyway, would we?

This is true.

---

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

I think the meme is more focused on people who don't fit into the binary definitions of gender so neatly, which a lot of trans people don't, but the perception is that they're probably trying to to some degree: It's probably more referring to those who might identify as bigender or agender and the like.

Probably.

[Zakuvia]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

Absolutely not. Transgendered people aren't what's at issue here. What's at issue are people coattailing on the strides we've made in acknowledging transgender acceptance to put the focus on themselves. If you see the word 'demi-' or 'pan-' before a gender or noun that has nothing to do with a gender being used in its stead, then you know what I'm talking about.

[Imperializt Russia]

I only see 2 biologic genders/sexes, Male and Female. All those other "genders" are not genders, I see them more as just names you give yourself or a preference. Example, being straight, gay, or bi are preferences. Outside of my beliefs in Christianity, I strongly dislike LGBTs because I just can't wrap my mind around how you can be attracted to the same freaking sex/gender as you! I also find it very disgusting. This whole LGBT gender and pronouns thing is getting out of hand.

Hi there.

Gender and sex isn't the same thing, and no matter which, there objectively aren't only two.
Sexuality isn't a choice, I'm amazed this conversation needs to be had in [current year] but oh well.
In any case, homosexuality and bisexuality occurs with surprising regularity in the animal world. It's entirely "natural" before you try making that argument.

Anyway.
There are three sexes and three genders, at minimum. Sex is biological and quantifiable. Male, female, and intersex. Intersex covers a bevy of disparate possibilities that are - objectively - neither conclusively male nor female. They are between the sexes, hence intersex.
This ranges from "hermaphrodites" who have both sets of sex organs (or parts of both) to people with the "wrong" sex organs - for example, male chromosomes, male secondary sexual characteristics and appearance, yet wholly female sex organs (or not at all).

There are similarly three genders at minimum - male, female and "transgender". Since being trans is seen in society as being exclusively the belief that one should be the opposite sex and with a view to transitioning to that opposite sex, it's no longer seen as a fit label for the people who are "transgender" and do not fit this very narrow definition. This is why the term "non-binary" is common.

Gender is not biological. It is a social and psychological construct. It has no relevant meaning, outside of perceived societal roles.

[Ariasteppe]

The vast, vast majority of trans people identify as either binary, or some trivial non-binary id (i.e. neutral, agender, genderqueer). I'm a representative for trans people on a university LGBT committee and so have met literally hundreds of trans people across the spectrum, especially the more outspoken ones, and I have yet to meet someone identify as something nontrivial or even going by pronouns other than she/he/they in my years of doing this. Look, creatively-minded teenagers and parody sockpuppets on Tumblr do not a community make, and I really resent the spotlighting of this and the asking of the rest of us to apologise for it.

[Imperializt Russia]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

Absolutely not. Transgendered people aren't what's at issue here. What's at issue are people coattailing on the strides we've made in acknowledging transgender acceptance to put the focus on themselves. If you see the word 'demi-' or 'pan-' before a gender or noun that has nothing to do with a gender being used in its stead, then you know what I'm talking about.

I do not know what you're talking about. Could you make a concise summary of what you're talking about, because I don't think it's (at all) clear in either of your posts.

[Ardrentt]

I think the meme is more focused on people who don't fit into the binary definitions of gender so neatly, which a lot of trans people don't, but the perception is that they're probably trying to to some degree: It's probably more referring to those who might identify as bigender or agender and the like.

With that said, even non-binary and fluid experiences of gender identity are equally seen as valid within the medical and scientific literature, and included in the definitions and understandings of gender identity. I mean I can understand that those aspects are probably more difficult and foreign to wrap our heads around, but there are not illegitimate by that difficulty others may have with it.

Well, a lot of the people studying this are probably going to be seen as being political in their work, so even if it were absolutely true (Which I generally go with the point of "It probably is."), a lot of those who are actually opposed to this aren't going to really shift their perspective.

[Frank Zipper]

Is this that person again who switches poll questions around so they always look like they are winning?

[Valgora]

Is this that person again who switches poll questions around so they always look like they are winning?

I don't think that that's possible.
I think every change to the poll results in the votes getting reset to 0.

[Ardrentt]

It's navalist as well. I see those attack helicopters soaring in the air, unaware all the time of their aerial privilege. What can an aircraft carrier do to avoid these kinds of microaggressions?

On a serious note, yes, the ignorance of science in the name of not damaging the emotions of histrionics is grating beyond reason. If it's not completely logically inconsistent, it's reminiscent of nothing less than that MadTV skit of that mentally ill child dancing in place and shouting 'look what I can do'.

Someone whose name escapes me now put it best. This movement is for people who can't accept that normativity is acceptable. They have to be individuals, and god help you if you can't accept their special status. One self-absorbed personality latches onto another, and another and eventually people mistake this nonsense as having validity.

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go terrorize some fishing vessels with my other carrierkin.

Personally, I think a healthy balance needs to be reached. The state of being transgender and wishing to change gender and/or sex is one thing, many studies have proven it to be legitimate. Androgeny is a bit more gray area. It's arguably the most indesputably benign to all sides of the argument, so science or no science, it's easier to just let them live in such a state than bothering to open any cans of worms on the subject. Gender fluidity and such things seem less logical to an outside observer, so logic would dictate that it ought to be considered less legitimate than the former two mentioned. Honestly, though, I think the whole debate is a bit overdone. It'd be much easier if we had one catch-all pronoun like hän. Then, we'd have the pronoun issue out of the way. Then, to tackle the bathroom topic that seems to be raising hell across the board for different reasons, we could just make the stalls go from the floor to the ceiling and have one unisex bathroom, sans urinals. And there you have it folks, now only the moral conservatives are upset. Alternatively, we could dust off the old law books and see what they did in the olden days. Then we'd have the opposite problem. This is why we can't have nice things folks, this is why.

"They" is usually used as a third person pronoun in the LGBT community afaik, since it's already within the English language; many have tried invented pronouns and they generally do not go far because, y'know, creatures of habit.

Is this that person again who switches poll questions around so they always look like they are winning?

I guess to be fair, the statistic feels very much expected...?

[Ifreann]

Do we really need to debate the merits of mockingly suggesting that trans people are insane or deluded?

Absolutely not. Transgendered people aren't what's at issue here. What's at issue are people coattailing on the strides we've made in acknowledging transgender acceptance to put the focus on themselves. If you see the word 'demi-' or 'pan-' before a gender or noun that has nothing to do with a gender being used in its stead, then you know what I'm talking about.

Somehow I do not think that people who claim to sexually identify as attack helicopters are narrowly only targeting the people whose gender identities or sexualities you think are absurd and contrived to make them seem special and unique rather than normal and boring.