Invasion of North Korea

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

It'll be like Operation Downfall.

[Insaeldor]

It'll be like Operation Downfall.

I would go that far, mainly because the technological superiority of the western allies is enough to nuturalize a good portion of there defensive capabilities. Doesn't mean it wouldn't take thousands of lives and years of work to actually liberate and stabilize the place but I do not think we could equate the two.

[Redsection]

I support a full invasion of North Korea , in the long run its worth it and it also takes one less communist / socialist state off of the map. North Korean citizens will need to be placed inside of Re-education camps of course and then there is the cost of rebuilding and modernizing but I think it could be done. As for the nuclear weapons problem I am sure a coalition of special forces from Japan , South Korea , and the United States could take care of those facilities before the main offensive.

[Unnamedland]

Many people seem to be ignoring the fact that North Korea has nukes and would launch them at South Korea and Japan if invaded.

[Gim]

Many people seem to be ignoring the fact that North Korea has nukes and would launch them at South Korea and Japan if invaded.

Well, U.S. is backing South Korea and Japan, and U.S. has nuclear weapons. So, it's more of a deterrent, rather than an all-out war.

[Insaeldor]

Many people seem to be ignoring the fact that North Korea has nukes and would launch them at South Korea and Japan if invaded.

The combat capability of these stockpile is questionable at best. And given the fact that the highest estimate for DPRK WMDs is roughly 7 I would be hard for quick strike aircraft to dismantal their launching stations and render their arsenal unusable.

[Gim]

Does Alexander the Great have a claim, according to your argument?
Perhaps, China and Korea both have claims, but wouldn't the original owner of a territory have the upper hand?

No, Alexander the Great has no claim. He's dead.

China has the rightful claim to the land, because they are the ones who actually own the land. If a majority of people residing within the "disputed" territory are in favor of leaving China and rejoining Korea, then you would have an argument. Otherwise, you're fighting a losing battle.

The Yanbian has many native Koreans living in the place. That is why the territory dispute is in question.

[Insaeldor]

No, Alexander the Great has no claim. He's dead.

China has the rightful claim to the land, because they are the ones who actually own the land. If a majority of people residing within the "disputed" territory are in favor of leaving China and rejoining Korea, then you would have an argument. Otherwise, you're fighting a losing battle.

The Yanbian has many native Koreans living in the place. That is why the territory dispute is in question.

Yanbain Autonomous Korean Prefecture is still 60% Korean, it's also an artificial entity created to give the Korean majority an autonomous prefecture. No different than the Jewish Autonomous Oblast in the Soviet Union.

That said we're continuing a massive derailment lets get things back in track.

[Gim]

The Yanbian has many native Koreans living in the place. That is why the territory dispute is in question.

Yanbain Autonomous Korean Prefecture is still 60% Korean, it's also an artificial entity created to give the Korean majority an autonomous prefecture. No different than the Jewish Autonomous Oblast in the Soviet Union.

That said we're continuing a massive derailment lets get things back in track.

I apologize for the derailment, but I don't apologize for the claims I've conveyed. I hope you respect my claim as much as I respect yours. Thank you.

[Insaeldor]

Yanbain Autonomous Korean Prefecture is still 60% Korean, it's also an artificial entity created to give the Korean majority an autonomous prefecture. No different than the Jewish Autonomous Oblast in the Soviet Union.

That said we're continuing a massive derailment lets get things back in track.

I apologize for the derailment, but I don't apologize for the claims I've conveyed. I hope you respect my claim as much as I respect yours. Thank you.

I'm not required to respect anything, honestly the amount of times you've either completely ignored massive aspect of arguments made or to cherry pick shows that you'd don't really respect our claims.

[Gim]

I apologize for the derailment, but I don't apologize for the claims I've conveyed. I hope you respect my claim as much as I respect yours. Thank you.

I'm not required to respect anything, honestly the amount of times you've either completely ignored massive aspect of arguments made or to cherry pick shows that you'd don't really respect our claims.

I don't want to derail this thread, so I'll say it only once more. I backed my claims through Wikipedia. I didn't see any primary or secondary source from you. Respecting an unsubstantiated batch of claims is a considerable generosity I have upon you. Let's not argue further.

[Insaeldor]

If want to take it to TG then I'll gladly continue it there.

[Gim]

If want to take it to TG then I'll gladly continue it there.

I'm finished with this already. You're more than welcome to TG me.

[Novus America]

Many people seem to be ignoring the fact that North Korea has nukes and would launch them at South Korea and Japan if invaded.

As we have been over nukes are not the only or even primary problem. We never invaded them before they had nukes.

[Secundus Imperium Romanum]

Many people seem to be ignoring the fact that North Korea has nukes and would launch them at South Korea and Japan if invaded.

Exactly, one should not attack a country controlled by a mad and spoiled dictator who has nuclear bombs, I think for an invasion to succeed, it is first: to create and support rebel forces and to plan the assassination of King Jong-Un, equal What they did in Iraq and Syria.

[Gim]

Many people seem to be ignoring the fact that North Korea has nukes and would launch them at South Korea and Japan if invaded.

Exactly, one should not attack a country controlled by a mad and spoiled dictator who has nuclear bombs, I think for an invasion to succeed, it is first: to create and support rebel forces and to plan the assassination of King Jong-Un, equal What they did in Iraq and Syria.

The South Korean government actually is holding a clandestine mission to assassinate Kim. Not much has been disclosed for obvious reasons.

[Secundus Imperium Romanum]

The South Korean government actually is holding a clandestine mission to assassinate Kim. Not much has been disclosed for obvious reasons.

Yes, the population there hates the current regime, the poverty there is so great that people steal grass squares to eat in their homes, making the population revolt after his death would be easy

[Gim]

The South Korean government actually is holding a clandestine mission to assassinate Kim. Not much has been disclosed for obvious reasons.

Yes, the population there hates the current regime, the poverty there is so great that people steal grass squares to eat in their homes, making the population revolt after his death would be easy

SK or NK?

[Secundus Imperium Romanum]

NK

[Gim]

NK

Ah, okay, but how do you know the people there do not like the current regime?

[Dylar]

NK

Ah, okay, but how do you know the people there do not like the current regime?

If memory serves correctly, I think that the NK government actually brainwashes their citizens into liking their communist government. Here's this propaganda video: America in the eyes of North Korea.

[Gim]

Ah, okay, but how do you know the people there do not like the current regime?

If memory serves correctly, I think that the NK government actually brainwashes their citizens into liking their communist government. Here's this propaganda video: America in the eyes of North Korea.

I get your point. I guess it is intuitive that they hate the regime in their minds.

[A Humanist Resurrection]

Honestly, it's a Kobayashi Maru, a no-win scenario.

Especially if you live in Seoul. Or Tokyo. And probably even Taipei (as open war with China - what an invasion of the DPRK really means - will remove any obligation on the part of the mainland in that area too).

And, of course, once these three global financial alpha cities are rubble, the rest of the world will become fairly unpleasant as well.

Big, BIG mess.

With the absence of nuclear weapons, DPRK would've been obliterated a long time ago, and Korea would have been united.

The DPRK's nuclear weapons program does not prevent a unified Korea. China's does, because China will not tolerate sharing a land border with the United States/Republic of Korea.

North Korea stays where it is, or China annexes the entire Korean peninsula. With the resulting global war making a huge mess in the process.

Luckly, with all its financial ties, China is probably sane enough to do everything possible to avoid such a doomsday scenario.

You know why China doesn't want Korea as its border neighbour? China took a great deal of territory away from Korea, and having Korea at its borders would bolster Korea to claim its rightful territories.

China wants the DPRK on its border because it doesn't want the US/RoK on its border. This is why Beijing has been the DPRK's closest ally since ever.

Any scenario involving the removal of the DPRK that doesn't end in Armageddon involves China giving up its interests voluntarily.

So 0% chance.

[The Realm of Lordaeron]

Honestly, it's a Kobayashi Maru, a no-win scenario.

Especially if you live in Seoul. Or Tokyo. And probably even Taipei (as open war with China - what an invasion of the DPRK really means - will remove any obligation on the part of the mainland in that area too).

And, of course, once these three global financial alpha cities are rubble, the rest of the world will become fairly unpleasant as well.

Big, BIG mess.

With the absence of nuclear weapons, DPRK would've been obliterated a long time ago, and Korea would have been united.

The DPRK's nuclear weapons program does not prevent a unified Korea. China's does, because China will not tolerate sharing a land border with the United States/Republic of Korea.

North Korea stays where it is, or China annexes the entire Korean peninsula. With the resulting global war making a huge mess in the process.

Luckly, with all its financial ties, China is probably sane enough to do everything possible to avoid such a doomsday scenario.

China does not have the military capability to defeat the U.S. and it's allies, at this point.

China would suffer enormous casualties and lose not only the entire peninsula, but have it's entire economy destroyed. China would be reverted to third world status for many decades.

China may take some risks, but this isn't the 20th century China under Mao Zedong. I don't think China will sink all it's progress over North Korea.

[A Humanist Resurrection]

China does not have the military capability to defeat the U.S. and it's allies, at this point.

It does, however, have the capability to make a big fucking mess, if anyone insists on putting it's back against a wall.

China would suffer enormous casualties and lose not only the entire peninsula, but have it's entire economy destroyed. China would be reverted to third world status for many decades.

Well, sure, but the point is that China isn't the only player who would be in sad shape, should it come down to it. Which is precisely why all the players have adopted "appease DPRK" as the winning strategy.

Regardless of who "wins" or "loses" an invasion of DPRK, for more than fifty years now everyone seems to think it would be a really bad idea.