Russian ship near the coast

[Neuwland]

Why would keeping Russia behind the Urals lead to more bloodshed? If we look at history it would have been great if Germany won WW1 but if they won WW2 they would have changed the world into something better. If America instead of wanting to force Democracy down their throats would have sit back and enjoyed the fire works we could have supported the KMT in China which was already friendly with Germany they could have taken over parts of Siberia and Korea, Japan could have been divided between the 3 China, America, and Germany. India would be an independent nation free of Socialism the Muslims in the Middle East would be united under a Pan-Islamist rule were they could run a Caliphate like they want, in Europe the European countries would be stable unlike today and America wouldn't have to change it's overall domestic policies or even adopt a National Socialist Government all it had to do was cooperate same with Britain and even France.

No no, by WW2, China and Germany weren't that chummy. Besides, Germany (back in WW2) were allies with Japan. Furthermore, in WW2, you guys had a large Jewish population yourselves. What would they do if they realised you were helping the Third Reich? And theocracies never work. Hell, Iran treated it's female population better under their old Shah (the equivalent of a King) than under today's theocracy.

Each region has a working government that works for them in the Middle East a Theocracy is the only solution look at the Arab spring and their tries at democracy. Had we left the Taliban in power Afghanistan would have rebuilt as for ISIS if we ignored them and let them take over Iraq and Syria they'd eventually crush the Kurdish Communists, Assad, the FSA, and Iran our airstrikes only antagonize them and give them a reason to conduct terrorist attacks they claim every time it is in response to our actions. So let them do what they want besides I'm sure if we played our cards right they'd be a useful proxy to maintain order. As for Germany and Japan the Germans made a major mistake favoring the Japanese they should have maintained the roots in China, factions in the KMT supported Germany already the Germans trained the Chinese army therefore it'd make more sense for Germany to have China go to war with Japan, IIRC neither Mussolini or Franco deported their Jews to Germany for extermination and we very well could have done the same.

[Novus America]

Frankly, this horrifies me, since this happens to be my own State, especially knowing how cozy russia and the trump Bannon administration are. I don't want Russia spying on my State!

Umm legally they have every right too. They are following international law.
But seems Trump and Russia are already having a falling out.

We do also have legal right to send a ship to keep an eye on them though.

[Novus America]

Send a submarine to shadow it. Gather Intel on it. Sure they can spy from there, but we can spy right back and should. We have every right to follow it at a close but safe distance.

The ship Russia was using was a ship spying on a submarine base they would have noticed. I would have sent spy planes.

It would notice a plane as well. And being noticed is the point. You want them to know they are being watched. But sending spy planes is reasonable and legal.

Problem with planes is their lack of loiter time. A plane can hang around it only a few hours. Not days or weeks. Hence why we need airships back. They would be great for this stuff.
We need these back. In modernized form.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/N-class_blimp

[Neuwland]

Let them play it, they do it all the time it's stale and boring and means nothing.

May I ask why you are so aggressive towards the Russian federation , as stated countries do things like this quite commonly. We test the Russians , the Russians test us , Guatemala often tests the patience of Belize , and North Korea does the same to South Korea and Japan. It's Just what nations do to see how others will react.

Therefore we should do the same and one up them until we become dominate, have you ever played Victoria 2?

[Neuwland]

Frankly, this horrifies me, since this happens to be my own State, especially knowing how cozy russia and the trump Bannon administration are. I don't want Russia spying on my State!

Umm legally they have every right too. The are following international law.
But seems Trump and Russia are already having a falling out.

Trump is rather anti-Iran as he is anti-China both of whom are under Russia's influence.

[Militant Costco]

Send a submarine to shadow it. Gather Intel on it. Sure they can spy from there, but we can spy right back and should. We have every right to follow it at a close but safe distance.

The ship Russia was using was a ship spying on a submarine base they would have noticed. I would have sent spy planes.

I would have just trolled them and send a spy ship to trail the other spy ship and I would have our spy ship play loud rock and roll music or Trump's speeches within yards of their vessel and bait them into hacking our spy ship for intel, only to download porn.

[Neuwland]

The ship Russia was using was a ship spying on a submarine base they would have noticed. I would have sent spy planes.

It would notice a plane as well. And being noticed is the point. You want them to know they are being watched. But sending spy planes is reasonable and legal.

Problem with planes is their lack of loiter time.

It would be just some minor counter-intel to understand what is going on better.

[Neuwland]

The ship Russia was using was a ship spying on a submarine base they would have noticed. I would have sent spy planes.

I would have just trolled them and send a spy ship to trail the other spy ship and I would have our spy ship play loud rock and roll music or Trump's speeches within yards of their vessel and bait them into hacking our spy ship for intel, only to download porn.

That would be pretty amusing actually, I'd actually support this, it's better than no action.

[Novus America]

Umm legally they have every right too. The are following international law.
But seems Trump and Russia are already having a falling out.

Trump is rather anti-Iran as he is anti-China both of whom are under Russia's influence.

Well true except that Russia is under Chinese influence, not the other way around.

[The Corparation]

Send a submarine to shadow it. Gather Intel on it. Sure they can spy from there, but we can spy right back and should. We have every right to follow it at a close but safe distance.

The ship Russia was using was a ship spying on a submarine base they would have noticed. I would have sent spy planes.

I'd give even odds that they have had a sub shadowing it for at least some of its mission. As for noticing the sub, you'd be surprised. A modern US Navy submarine is quieter than ocean background noise and has a minuscule magnetic signature. A ship built for ELINT would lack the equipment to detect, much less track a submarine tailing it unless it overhear communications to/from that submarine. That said they're probably operating under the assumption that their every move is being watched because so whether or not they notice doesn't matter.

[Neuwland]

Trump is rather anti-Iran as he is anti-China both of whom are under Russia's influence.

Well true except that Russia is under Chinese influence, not the other way around.

The point is they back each other and Trump is getting a serious wake up call now that the honeymoon stage is over and he's connecting the dots as to who's who and their histories.

[Novus America]

It would notice a plane as well. And being noticed is the point. You want them to know they are being watched. But sending spy planes is reasonable and legal.

Problem with planes is their lack of loiter time.

It would be just some minor counter-intel to understand what is going on better.

Fair enough. We have the P-8 and older P-3s for that. But I would want a constant watch to follow it the whole time it is anywhere near the US. The plane is fine, but I would prefer something staying with it longer.

Sending a P-8 to check it out would be perfectly reasonable and legal.

[Neuwland]

It would be just some minor counter-intel to understand what is going on better.

Fair enough. We have the P-8 and older P-3s for that. But I would want a constant watch to follow it the whole time it is anywhere near the US. The plane is fine, but I would prefer something staying with it longer.

Sending a P-8 to check it out would be perfectly reasonable and legal.

The thing is though, from what I've heard so far nothing has happened of this nature not even a comment from Trump or a call to Moscow. If this was 1985 Regen would have called up the Soviets, this was called 'trust but verify' and this is a good philosophy to have and should have been done.

[Redsection]

May I ask why you are so aggressive towards the Russian federation , as stated countries do things like this quite commonly. We test the Russians , the Russians test us , Guatemala often tests the patience of Belize , and North Korea does the same to South Korea and Japan. It's Just what nations do to see how others will react.

Therefore we should do the same and one up them until we become dominate, have you ever played Victoria 2?

No , and it isn't really smart to try and compare a game to Real World politics. And what is the point of upping Russia if they didn't even come into our waters ? Besides we already won the Cold War , the Soviet Union collapsed and what's left is a reformed and different government.

[Novus America]

The ship Russia was using was a ship spying on a submarine base they would have noticed. I would have sent spy planes.

I would have just trolled them and send a spy ship to trail the other spy ship and I would have our spy ship play loud rock and roll music or Trump's speeches within yards of their vessel and bait them into hacking our spy ship for intel, only to download porn.

While hilarious that would not be very professional and getting that close would be incredibly dangerous. Within yards means you are going to crash. Ships are tricky, because the ocean moves.

[Bhikkustan]

Meanwhile in the new Nazi colonies...

Okay, this would have benefited Germany in all reality. It's survival of the fittest is all I can really say.

Wait WTF?
emphasis mine.

The holocaust was just natural selection people. Hitler wasn't bad. He was just doing what mother nature intended...

[USHALLNOTPASS]

No no, by WW2, China and Germany weren't that chummy. Besides, Germany (back in WW2) were allies with Japan. Furthermore, in WW2, you guys had a large Jewish population yourselves. What would they do if they realised you were helping the Third Reich? And theocracies never work. Hell, Iran treated it's female population better under their old Shah (the equivalent of a King) than under today's theocracy.

Each region has a working government that works for them in the Middle East a Theocracy is the only solution look at the Arab spring and their tries at democracy. Had we left the Taliban in power Afghanistan would have rebuilt as for ISIS if we ignored them and let them take over Iraq and Syria they'd eventually crush the Kurdish Communists, Assad, the FSA, and Iran our airstrikes only antagonize them and give them a reason to conduct terrorist attacks they claim every time it is in response to our actions. So let them do what they want besides I'm sure if we played our cards right they'd be a useful proxy to maintain order. As for Germany and Japan the Germans made a major mistake favoring the Japanese they should have maintained the roots in China, factions in the KMT supported Germany already the Germans trained the Chinese army therefore it'd make more sense for Germany to have China go to war with Japan, IIRC neither Mussolini or Franco deported their Jews to Germany for extermination and we very well could have done the same.

I'm not saying that you would've deported your Jews to Germany, I'm saying that there probably would be riots. China was in no shape to fight Japan at the start of WW2. China had no experience in the type of warfare present in WW2, they had a few German trained divisions, but the rest were poorly trained and equipped. Why, you had Chinese suicide bombers being used to destroy tanks. Thus, why would Germany want to waste resources on China? As a Chinese person myself, I can say that Japan didn't completely annex China because the Chinese military essentially drew the war out and used attrition. China then was also riddled with corruption, which thus caused Joseph Stilwell, the American General sent to China, to essentially give up. Afghanistan was your excuse to target Al Qaeda operatives who later fled the country. And you can't ignore ISIS, or ISIL, if they have claimed committed terrorist attacks in allied territory. Have you also considered the fact that Syria and Iraq would be screwed over more under ISIS? Following your logic, the Middle East would be better if the US did not invade Iraq.

[Saiwania]

There isn't any need to view this with alarm in my opinion. This is probably because the US regularly deploys naval assets near Russia's coasts and they're only responding in kind because Russia is sure to maintain the leverage they already have if not increase it further. Instead of viewing Russia as an eternal rival, it'd be better for the US to be able to find quid pro quos that it can offer Russia to win their cooperation on whatever common ground can be found.

[Bhikkustan]

Each region has a working government that works for them in the Middle East a Theocracy is the only solution look at the Arab spring and their tries at democracy. Had we left the Taliban in power Afghanistan would have rebuilt as for ISIS if we ignored them and let them take over Iraq and Syria they'd eventually crush the Kurdish Communists, Assad, the FSA, and Iran our airstrikes only antagonize them and give them a reason to conduct terrorist attacks they claim every time it is in response to our actions. So let them do what they want besides I'm sure if we played our cards right they'd be a useful proxy to maintain order. As for Germany and Japan the Germans made a major mistake favoring the Japanese they should have maintained the roots in China, factions in the KMT supported Germany already the Germans trained the Chinese army therefore it'd make more sense for Germany to have China go to war with Japan, IIRC neither Mussolini or Franco deported their Jews to Germany for extermination and we very well could have done the same.

Following your logic, the Middle East would be better if the US did not invade Iraq.

It would, but that is off topic.

[Neuwland]

Therefore we should do the same and one up them until we become dominate, have you ever played Victoria 2?

No , and it isn't really smart to try and compare a game to Real World politics. And what is the point of upping Russia if they didn't even come into our waters ? Besides we already won the Cold War , the Soviet Union collapsed and what's left is a reformed and different government.

If you ever played it you'd know that there are great powers and secondary powers this is ranked by prestige when a nation loses prestige it loses it's status to the point where advisers are banned embassies are closed etc. It's the same in real life Russia has stripped us of our great power status they have taken us under their sphere of influence and they very well are going to start banning embassies and telling our allies to go away. In fact the Russian embassy had ties to the Trump campaign this is an example of influence building and what happens when other advisors are phased out. It's may sound far-fetched but I think the comparison is rather relevant.

The point of upping Russia is to prove a point

[USHALLNOTPASS]

Following your logic, the Middle East would be better if the US did not invade Iraq.

It would, but that is off topic.

Yeah, it would...but y'know...this guy has some pretty unintentionally laughable new world order views.

[Militant Costco]

I would have just trolled them and send a spy ship to trail the other spy ship and I would have our spy ship play loud rock and roll music or Trump's speeches within yards of their vessel and bait them into hacking our spy ship for intel, only to download porn.

While hilarious that would not be very professional and getting that close would be incredibly dangerous. Within yards means you are going to crash. Ships are tricky, because the ocean moves.

1. We aren't the nation that rammed a guided-missile cruiser (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4jQhnXrWbg) or flew fighter jets within feet of another ship in a combat zone (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbLbJZ7beFI). I hardly would call my maneuver dangerous.

2. Not professional enough? Being professional is boring. It's time for America to have fun with it's ridiculously large military.

3. Aircraft Carriers and Supply Ships sail within feet of each others for hours during resupplying and refueling. Yet you don't ever hear of a collision between the two. Ships roll and pitch, but they don't have problems going in straight lines for hours, that's practically what they're designed for.

[Neuwland]

Each region has a working government that works for them in the Middle East a Theocracy is the only solution look at the Arab spring and their tries at democracy. Had we left the Taliban in power Afghanistan would have rebuilt as for ISIS if we ignored them and let them take over Iraq and Syria they'd eventually crush the Kurdish Communists, Assad, the FSA, and Iran our airstrikes only antagonize them and give them a reason to conduct terrorist attacks they claim every time it is in response to our actions. So let them do what they want besides I'm sure if we played our cards right they'd be a useful proxy to maintain order. As for Germany and Japan the Germans made a major mistake favoring the Japanese they should have maintained the roots in China, factions in the KMT supported Germany already the Germans trained the Chinese army therefore it'd make more sense for Germany to have China go to war with Japan, IIRC neither Mussolini or Franco deported their Jews to Germany for extermination and we very well could have done the same.

I'm not saying that you would've deported your Jews to Germany, I'm saying that there probably would be riots. China was in no shape to fight Japan at the start of WW2. China had no experience in the type of warfare present in WW2, they had a few German trained divisions, but the rest were poorly trained and equipped. Why, you had Chinese suicide bombers being used to destroy tanks. Thus, why would Germany want to waste resources on China? As a Chinese person myself, I can say that Japan didn't completely annex China because the Chinese military essentially drew the war out and used attrition. China then was also riddled with corruption, which thus caused Joseph Stilwell, the American General sent to China, to essentially give up. Afghanistan was your excuse to target Al Qaeda operatives who later fled the country. And you can't ignore ISIS, or ISIL, if they have claimed committed terrorist attacks in allied territory. Have you also considered the fact that Syria and Iraq would be screwed over more under ISIS? Following your logic, the Middle East would be better if the US did not invade Iraq.

The world didn't know about the camps until allied soldiers found them when invading Germany, China could have been in shape to fight Japan had Germany intervened and sent enough equipment for China to sustain a modern army and unify the warlords. The corruption in China is not our problem our problem was Japan. Afghanistan was not my excuse to target Al-Qaeda because like I said I would have never supported Israel's creation or the Gulf War thus the organization would have very little to have against us, their rhetoric is based on our Federal Reserve system which I oppose, our war stationing of troops in Saudi Arabia to fight Iraq which I wouldn't have done, so in reality they'd probably still be in Sudan or Afghanistan running religious institutions, plus we would have supported them against the Soviets. I wouldn't have the allies that we have they are all terrible they are literally carbon-copies of each other they are all just small European nations with ultra-liberal governments all claiming to be socialist, I don't like our allies or care for them, I wouldn't make alliances with a bunch of countries and claim to be their defenders this is where isolationism is useful, as for ISIS running Iraq or Syria in a theoretical world where we do leave them alone and they defeated every faction that opposed and stayed in Iraq and Syria (or the greater Levant) they'd run it just fine, like I said they'd be a proxy like Pinochet or Baptista. Plus having them run this ultra-conservative nation claiming to be the Caliphate would be useful in terms of giving Muslims who are disatisifed with our governments a place to go to live while serving our interests, they could export oil from Iraq and Syria, and they could replace the Saudis or we could use them both ISIS would also act as a buffer against Iran, ISIS would also take the place of the Ottoman Empire if we where successful in restoring the Central Powers.

[The Corparation]

While hilarious that would not be very professional and getting that close would be incredibly dangerous. Within yards means you are going to crash. Ships are tricky, because the ocean moves.

1. We aren't the nation that rammed a guided-missile cruiser (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4jQhnXrWbg) or flew fighter jets within feet of another ship in a combat zone (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbLbJZ7beFI). I hardly would call my maneuver dangerous.

2. Not professional enough? Being professional is boring. It's time for America to have fun with it's ridiculously large military.

3. Aircraft Carriers and Supply Ships sail within feet of each others for hours during resupplying and refueling. Yet you don't ever hear of a collision between the two. Ships roll and pitch, but they don't have problems going in straight lines for hours, that's practically what they're designed for.

1) We were playing bumper cars with their "Fishing Trawlers" before everyone sat down and agreed that both sides needed to cut it out. There just aren't as many videos of the US caused collisions. As for buzzing ships with fighter, the US does similar things with helicopters.
3) They do so only through frequent communication between the two vessels and having someone constantly be guiding the helm.

[Constantinopolis]

While this would make a very interesting RP scenario millions dying in an repeat of WWI is less than ideal. We have international law for a reason. It is actually a pragmatic thing.

My evil hypothetical alter ego would be down with this. But in real life it is not the right, nor sane thing to do.

There cannot be a "repeat of WWI", because WWI was made possible by the existence of multiple, more-or-less-equally powerful, empires that were struggling for global dominance.

That is simply not the world we live in any more. Today there is a single global hegemonic power (the United States) and a number of vastly inferior mini-empires that can jockey for position with each other but have no hope of challenging the hegemon.