"Men Must Approve Abortion, Women Are Hosts"

[Utceforp]

I've thought about it. My mum aborted her pregnancy before me. It doesn't bother me all that much, I wouldn't have known it.

It's not so much it bothers me as it's like, I don't know, best I can explain it is when I've been shot at it came close to my head. Like, it's not upsetting just...damn.

I mean you could say the same thing about your parents never conceiving you, or never even meeting.

[Internationalist Bastard]

Does anyone else feel weird thinking about abortion, like the, there was a solid chance I could've been aborted weird feeling?

...I've never had that, but it sounds rather awful. Is everything okay?

No I'm fine, just part of being an orphan, I always wondered it. Like I said, it's just weird feeling

[Lady Scylla]

I've thought about it. My mum aborted her pregnancy before me. It doesn't bother me all that much, I wouldn't have known it.

It's not so much it bothers me as it's like, I don't know, best I can explain it is when I've been shot at it came close to my head. Like, it's not upsetting just...damn.

You're not high are you? Honestly asking. Don't take that as an insult or anything.

[Kazarogkai]

Their has been some pretty solid research into artificial wombs. Though still more or less hypothetical it's not at all unlikely something like it will be available to people before the first half of this century is up. Theoretically it could be used as an alternative to abortion, placing the unwanted fetus into said artificial womb to be incubated till "birth". Conservatives are happy since no babies are being "murdered", Liberals are happy because bodily autonomy is preserved. Everybody is happy/wins. Just a thought.

except for perhaps the tax payers paying to keep an extra 750,000 babies born every year whose parents don't want them. or all those unwanted, unloved children being born each and every year forever.

Can't make everyone happy now can we eh?

Stronger social services can help deal with the former rather nicely though. A nurse is no worse than a mother in terms of holding a baby. Remember the israeli Kibbutz? They seemed to have done well enough more or less with their communal raising of children.

Plus a silver lining: People are having far to few children in order to properly sustain our current social safety net which relies on a healthy healthy worker to pensioner ratio. This could be a solution, albeit a rather crude one for this particular problem.

[Internationalist Bastard]

Does anyone else feel weird thinking about abortion, like the, there was a solid chance I could've been aborted weird feeling?

There's a solid chance your father might have had a headache that night.

You can think about that if you prefer.

You don't know why that is so funny to me, and I'm not going to say it because it's super dark

[Luminesa]

...I've never had that, but it sounds rather awful. Is everything okay?

No I'm fine, just part of being an orphan, I always wondered it. Like I said, it's just weird feeling

[Lady Scylla]

...I've never had that, but it sounds rather awful. Is everything okay?

No I'm fine, just part of being an orphan, I always wondered it. Like I said, it's just weird feeling

Clearly you were destined to be The Batman.

[Paledonn]

Because men wouldn't be traumatized to learn that their unborn child was killed. And because beating to death a woman who shows her face in public is equal to the inconvenience of getting a form signed. 1st world problems hard.

I've heard women say they're traumatized when their man has a vasectomy. She doesn't deserve damages, nor should he require her permission.

A fetus does not exist in a vasectomy. You are not reacting to something that has happened, that is preventative. There was no news, pregnancy, or new life in the world. Your analogy does not stand.

[Ashmoria]

Does anyone else feel weird thinking about abortion, like the, there was a solid chance I could've been aborted weird feeling?

I was born in 1957 the last of 7 children. if my mother had had a choice I certainly wouldn't be here now.

[Internationalist Bastard]

It's not so much it bothers me as it's like, I don't know, best I can explain it is when I've been shot at it came close to my head. Like, it's not upsetting just...damn.

You're not high are you? Honestly asking. Don't take that as an insult or anything.

No, unless I did take to much meds today, I do that sometimes. But this is something I always think of when I think of abortion

[Wallenburg]

I certainly don't like the wording-a mother is not a "host", like a seahorse. She's a person, and she should be on equal footing with her husband. While the idea, which is giving a father an equal say in the life of the fetus, is not a bad one, calling the mom a "host" is an immediate turn-off. It gives the idea of a fruitful marriage between a man and a woman, which should be something that is celebrated, the tone of it being a parasite injecting harmful fluids into the woman. It's counterproductive for any Christian senator to refer to a woman as such.

That's an interesting take on this. I would imagine that the letter of the law, as it must be less flowery and more detail-oriented, would use language that we as average citizens might find off-putting or even offensive.

I've thought about it. My mum aborted her pregnancy before me. It doesn't bother me all that much, I wouldn't have known it.

It's not so much it bothers me as it's like, I don't know, best I can explain it is when I've been shot at it came close to my head. Like, it's not upsetting just...damn.

Ah, so it's sort of a numb, somewhat shocking sensation? I can understand that. I get that feeling every now and then when I remember that once I die, there's nothing waiting for me.

[Neutraligon]

No I'm fine, just part of being an orphan, I always wondered it. Like I said, it's just weird feeling

Clearly you were destined to be The Batman.

Hey! That's my name.

[Internationalist Bastard]

No I'm fine, just part of being an orphan, I always wondered it. Like I said, it's just weird feeling

Clearly you were destined to be The Batman.

Pfft I wish. I'm more like Superman.

[Galloism]

I've heard women say they're traumatized when their man has a vasectomy. She doesn't deserve damages, nor should he require her permission.

A fetus does not exist in a vasectomy. You are not reacting to something that has happened, that is preventative. There was no news, pregnancy, or new life in the world. Your analogy does not stand.

Sure it does.

X person is doing Y thing with their own body. No one is entitled to damages.

[Ashmoria]

did you miss where I said I don't have a problem with it?

So you're ok with what are colloquially known as "paper abortions"?

no i am OK with a father being able to take an infant to the firehouse in extreme circumstances just like a woman can.

otherwise children have a right to the support of both parents and the father will have to go to court to find a way out of it.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

With less than 10 calories, if that many.

For your claims of it being costly, the human body is extremely efficient at what it does.

Source?

Of what? That the human body is efficient? Any physiology book will tell you that much.

That men use less than 10 calories per second to create said sperm? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spermatogenesis

For context, my estimate of 10 calories (or 10kcal) is based upon the energy required for a cell to undergo mitosis and meiosis. For context, mitosis takes about 1/2 hour for somatic cells, so for a gamete cell like spermatocytes we can estimate about half of that, or a quarter of an hour. A typical cell division consumes 10 exp 7 ATP per second.

For reference, there are 7.3 calories (this is 7.3cals, not kcals) in one mole of ATP (6.02214179 × 10 exp 23 molecules of ATP), so you need a shitload of ATP before you can even get to 7.3 calories, and cell division only expends 10 exp 7. In one second, your body expends 15,000,000,000 ATP units in the mitosis part of spermatogenesis, assuming meiosis takes double the amount of ATP units: 45,000,000,000 ATP units. This is your total cost to create 1500 spermatids per second.

For context, 6.02214179 x 10 exp 23 is a fuckload of 0s.

[Lady Scylla]

You're not high are you? Honestly asking. Don't take that as an insult or anything.

No, unless I did take to much meds today, I do that sometimes. But this is something I always think of when I think of abortion

I doubt it's meds. I only asked because on of my friends always types like that when they're high. I was going to tell you to go lie down, but nevermind.

I think the closest I could relate are those that were my friends who joined service, where I was 'denied'. After a few of them were killed, it just didn't feel quite right, and in someways, I felt like I should've been the one in the casket.

[Walrusvylon]

Does anyone else feel weird thinking about abortion, like the, there was a solid chance I could've been aborted weird feeling?

...I've never had that, but it sounds rather awful. Is everything okay?

I know, it is awful.

You're lucky your mom was pro-life.

[Galloism]

So you're ok with what are colloquially known as "paper abortions"?

no i am OK with a father being able to take an infant to the firehouse in extreme circumstances just like a woman can.

otherwise children have a right to the support of both parents and the father will have to go to court to find a way out of it.

Then you're ok with children being murdered, but only if it's mostly fathers doing the murdering.

Mothers need a way out, but fathers... fuck em, I don't care how many dead kids there are.

Hypocrisy.

[Neutraligon]

...I've never had that, but it sounds rather awful. Is everything okay?

I know, it is awful.

You're lucky your mom was pro-life.

My mother was and is pro-choice, and she very well could have ended up aborting me due to her pregnancy causing her to be very very sick. Oh and...pro-life people have abortions.

[Wallenburg]

...I've never had that, but it sounds rather awful. Is everything okay?

I know, it is awful.

You're lucky your mom was pro-life.

Pro-life people have had abortions.

[Utceforp]

No I'm fine, just part of being an orphan, I always wondered it. Like I said, it's just weird feeling

Clearly you were destined to be The Batman.

You kind of need to be rich for that...

[Walrusvylon]

Source?

Of what? That the human body is efficient? Any physiology book will tell you that much.

That men use less than 10 calories per second to create said sperm? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spermatogenesis

For context, my estimate of 10 calories (or 10kcal) is based upon the energy required for a cell to undergo mitosis and meiosis. For context, mitosis takes about 1/2 hour for somatic cells, so for a gamete cell like spermatocytes we can estimate about half of that, or a quarter of an hour. A typical cell division consumes 10 exp 7 ATP per second.

For reference, there are 7.3 calories in one mole of ATP (6.02214179 × 10 exp 23 molecules of ATP), so you need a shitload of ATP before you can even get to 7.3 calories, and cell division only expends 10 exp 7. In one second, your body expends 15,000,000,000 ATP units in the mitosis part of spermatogenesis, assuming meiosis takes double the amount of ATP units: 45,000,000,000 ATP units.

For context, 6.02214179 x 10 exp 23 is a fuckload of 0s.

Maybe it doesn't take a lot of calories, but that sperm has to be made of something.

[Luminesa]

I certainly don't like the wording-a mother is not a "host", like a seahorse. She's a person, and she should be on equal footing with her husband. While the idea, which is giving a father an equal say in the life of the fetus, is not a bad one, calling the mom a "host" is an immediate turn-off. It gives the idea of a fruitful marriage between a man and a woman, which should be something that is celebrated, the tone of it being a parasite injecting harmful fluids into the woman. It's counterproductive for any Christian senator to refer to a woman as such.

That's an interesting take on this. I would imagine that the letter of the law, as it must be less flowery and more detail-oriented, would use language that we as average citizens might find off-putting or even offensive.

It's not so much it bothers me as it's like, I don't know, best I can explain it is when I've been shot at it came close to my head. Like, it's not upsetting just...damn.

Ah, so it's sort of a numb, somewhat shocking sensation? I can understand that. I get that feeling every now and then when I remember that once I die, there's nothing waiting for me.

Any good Christian senator should recognize, in making a pro-life/anti-abortion law, the dignity and the roles of BOTH parents, as equals in the making and life of the child. A Christian doubly has a duty to understand this, given that Christians (or at least Catholics and Orthodox) uphold Mary not just as a "host", but as the Mother of God, and St. Joseph is not just some dude, but the Universal Patron of the Church (at least of the Catholic Church, though he's not quite on the same level as Mary). It's incredibly problematic, then, for a person who claims to be pro-life to reduce the life-giving abilities of the mother to that of essentially a vase or a cabinet.

[Ashmoria]

no i am OK with a father being able to take an infant to the firehouse in extreme circumstances just like a woman can.

otherwise children have a right to the support of both parents and the father will have to go to court to find a way out of it.

Then you're ok with children being murdered, but only if it's mostly fathers doing the murdering.

Mothers need a way out, but fathers... fuck em, I don't care how many dead kids there are.

Hypocrisy.

wow where did that come from?

what way out does a mother have that a father doesn't?