Trump to move US embassy to Jerusalem

[Internationalist Bastard]

I'm not saying it's illegal. I'm saying it going to be a big deal, more then "some people being upset"

Some people consider it a big deal, sure. But it is 100% legal. Yes it will improve our ties with Israel, while making many Palestinian Arabs upset.

Not just Palestinians, not just Arabs.

[Crockerland]

Israeli conquest of Jerusalem (in response to Jordanian aggression): 1967
Declaration of a Palestinian state by the PLO: 1988

A correct analogy would be:
This half of the sandbox is Billy's sandbox, that half is Susies.
Susie tried to take Billy's half, so he kicked her out and took her half
Susise left and no longer wants that side of the sandbox
Billy claims the whole sandbox is his
Susie's cousin, Abdul, declares that what was once Susies side of the sandbox is now his

It's still an occupation. There's a reason we haven't solved this yet.

Because the Palestinians have consistently denied offers for a two-state solution

[Montchevre]

It's still an occupation. There's a reason we haven't solved this yet.

And we will never solve it. Because both Billy and Abdul have split personalities, and cannot actually decide what they actually want.

Exactly! Between Meretz and Likud for the Israelis and Hamas and the PA for the Palestinians, there's so much infighting that force is the only thing that happens.

I like your 2020 ticket btw.

[Novus America]

And we will never solve it. Because both Billy and Abdul have split personalities, and cannot actually decide what they actually want.

Yes. And aggravating the situation like this will not help.

Well, debatable
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/mon ... 9c32135aa3

But the situation is beyond redeeming anyways, no matter what, both sides will be unhappy.

[Internationalist Bastard]

It's still an occupation. There's a reason we haven't solved this yet.

Because the Palestinians have consistently denied offers for a two-state solution

Because Israel has commited warcrimes.
This is a two way street, and we need to look both ways before we cross. Corny line but it's a solid metaphor

[Jamzmania]

Some people consider it a big deal, sure. But it is 100% legal. Yes it will improve our ties with Israel, while making many Palestinian Arabs upset.

Not just Palestinians, not just Arabs.

I don't think anyone else is going to make a huge deal about it, though. There might be some rhetoric, but little to no action.

[The Conez Imperium]

It's still an occupation. There's a reason we haven't solved this yet.

Because the Palestinians have consistently denied offers for a two-state solution

It's in their constitution that Jerusalem is their capital city. I don't know the Palestinian perspective but I can imagine that this is a very very important issue - like how China sees a non-recognised Taiwan as key to maintaining her legitimacy.

[Internationalist Bastard]

Not just Palestinians, not just Arabs.

I don't think anyone else is going to make a huge deal about it, though. There might be some rhetoric, but little to no action.

Not politically no. But souring relations is hardly an ideal start

[Jamzmania]

I don't think anyone else is going to make a huge deal about it, though. There might be some rhetoric, but little to no action.

Not politically no. But souring relations is hardly an ideal start

I think a little bit of soured relations while doing the right thing is a fair deal.

[South Park Labourite]

This is a terrible idea. I support Israel, but I also support a two-state solution (however far that may be). This may kill it off forever.

[Welsh lands]

Oh well, in the end he will be his own worst enemy.

[Jamzmania]

This is a terrible idea. I support Israel, but I also support a two-state solution (however far that may be). This may kill it off forever.

It's been dead for a long while. "Forever," however, seems a bit hysterical.

[Crockerland]

Because the Palestinians have consistently denied offers for a two-state solution

Because Israel has commited warcrimes.

So has half of the rest of the world, including America and definitely including Palestine, the latter having war tactics almost entirely consisting of murdering civilians at random, that isn't a free ticket to reject peace and still attempt to play the victim.

[Novus America]

This is a terrible idea. I support Israel, but I also support a two-state solution (however far that may be). This may kill it off forever.

I fail to see how this kills a two state solution, as current two state solutions recognized Israeli control of part of the city, and the UN has done so as well.

Unless it is built in East Jerusalem, then it really would upend things. Still not end a two state solution, as a Arab state could exist without Jerusalem, though obviously they would not like it.

[Internationalist Bastard]

Not politically no. But souring relations is hardly an ideal start

I think a little bit of soured relations while doing the right thing is a fair deal.

Well then consider something else.
Radical Islamic Terrorism.
The Palestine situation is seen by many radicals as a prime of corrupt Western Imperialists destroying their way of life. Such a move can boost recruitment, and might encourage more anti American moves

[Internationalist Bastard]

Because Israel has commited warcrimes.

So has half of the rest of the world, including America and definitely including Palestine, the latter having war tactics almost entirely consisting of murdering civilians at random, that isn't a free ticket to reject peace and still attempt to play the victim.

"Everyone's doing it" is hardly a fair reason

[Novus America]

Some people consider it a big deal, sure. But it is 100% legal. Yes it will improve our ties with Israel, while making many Palestinian Arabs upset.

Not just Palestinians, not just Arabs.

The rest do not care enough for it to have a big difference long term.

[Crockerland]

I think a little bit of soured relations while doing the right thing is a fair deal.

Well then consider something else.
Radical Islamic Terrorism.

As opposed to moderate Islamic terrorism?
"mild injury to America!"

The Palestine situation is seen by many radicals as a prime of corrupt Western Imperialists destroying their way of life. Such a move can boost recruitment, and might encourage more anti American moves

Israel evicting all of it's settlers from the Gaza strip led to a massive boost in terrorism. We won't let the terrorists intimidate us.

[South Park Labourite]

This is a terrible idea. I support Israel, but I also support a two-state solution (however far that may be). This may kill it off forever.

I fail to see how this kills a two state solution, as current two state solutions recognized Israeli control of part of the city, and the UN has done so as well.

Unless it is built in East Jerusalem, then it really would upend things. Still not end a two state solution, as a Arab state could exist without Jerusalem, though obviously they would not like it.

Honestly I've lost enough hope to the point that I wouldn't blink an eye if Israeli law was just imposed on West Bank and we let people like Ayelet Shaked have their way with Palestine. At least it'll kill off Israel-Palestine as an issue, because one won't exist.

[Novus America]

I think a little bit of soured relations while doing the right thing is a fair deal.

Well then consider something else.
Radical Islamic Terrorism.
The Palestine situation is seen by many radicals as a prime of corrupt Western Imperialists destroying their way of life. Such a move can boost recruitment, and might encourage more anti American moves

The very existence of Israel upsets said radicals. This will not change their minds, either way.

[Crockerland]

Not just Palestinians, not just Arabs.

The rest do not care enough for it to have a big difference long term.

The regressives do, but they'll hate us either way so it doesn't really matter.

[Internationalist Bastard]

Well then consider something else.
Radical Islamic Terrorism.
The Palestine situation is seen by many radicals as a prime of corrupt Western Imperialists destroying their way of life. Such a move can boost recruitment, and might encourage more anti American moves

The very existence of Israel upsets said radicals. This will not change their minds, either way.

Anger drives terrorism. Note I said boosts.

[Jamzmania]

I think a little bit of soured relations while doing the right thing is a fair deal.

Well then consider something else.
Radical Islamic Terrorism.
The Palestine situation is seen by many radicals as a prime of corrupt Western Imperialists destroying their way of life. Such a move can boost recruitment, and might encourage more anti American moves

Just about any move we make is bound to encourage more terrorism. If moving an embassy to the capital of a country is going to push someone over the edge to terrorism, their move to terrorism was inevitable anyway.

[Crockerland]

So has half of the rest of the world, including America and definitely including Palestine, the latter having war tactics almost entirely consisting of murdering civilians at random, that isn't a free ticket to reject peace and still attempt to play the victim.

"Everyone's doing it" is hardly a fair reason

I made no attempt to justify Israeli war crimes, I just noted that neither side is innocent of war crimes (the Palestinian war crimes are obviously vastly greater in frequency, number, and probably severity than Israeli ones) and that they are not an excuse whatsoever to reject a two-state solution.

[Novus America]

I fail to see how this kills a two state solution, as current two state solutions recognized Israeli control of part of the city, and the UN has done so as well.

Unless it is built in East Jerusalem, then it really would upend things. Still not end a two state solution, as a Arab state could exist without Jerusalem, though obviously they would not like it.

Honestly I've lost enough hope to the point that I would blink an eye if Israeli law was just imposed on West Bank and we let people like Ayelet Shaked have their way with Palestine. At least it'll kill off Israel-Palestine as an issue, because one won't exist.

Well not exactly, because there would still be a state of Palestine in Gaza.
But if Israel did decide on, and unilaterally impose final borders, it could de fact force a de facto solution. In time borders become reality merely by being enforced. See for example the post WWII European borders. A lot of people hated them at first, as they were unilaterally imposed at gunpoint, but they became reality in time, and few now dispute them.

I am not saying this is morally right, but it would be the only way to bring about some sort of lasting resolution.