Trump to move US embassy to Jerusalem

[Novus America]

You are supporting something that supports something you object to, even though you're trying to weasel around it. That sounds hypocritical to me.

Again, what you're saying would be valid if and only if what I meant by the words "National Socialism" was or included "racism and ethnic cleansing". I don't, so it's not.

Since you and I use the term "National Socialism" differently, it makes no sense to keep pushing this. I say "dog", you hear "cat" - this back and forth won't get us anywhere.

What I do explicitly and unambiguosly state is that I oppose racism, period. Therefore, opposing the racism I see in Israel is nothing if not consistent - the opposite of hypocrisy.

Ethnic cleansing and racism is a fundamental aspect of National Socialism. It is a vital part, and always has been. Again Hitler literally coined the term. He created it. What you claim to view it as does not change what it is. National Socialism is literally built around the concept of a ethnostate. That is its very presmise, its very reason to exist.

And yes bias is important as you admit. Herein lies the problem. People are going to have a hard time talking rationally or taking seriously somoeone with extreme bias, especially one that makes them angry.

Again, you and I understand two very different things by the term "National Socialism". The fact that you see it to mean "cat", while I see it to mean "dog", does not mean I am being a hypocrite for stating that I both support it and am "anti-cat". This metaphor has run its course, I think.

In any case, this entire thing is completely irrelevant to the topic. I've addressed your concerns. If there is to be any further debate about this, it must happen elsewhere, not here.

And as per my edit, I will not debate with you further on any subject.

[Aelex]

What's so bad with moving the embassy to the rightful capital of Israel?

[Syrixia]

What's so bad with moving the embassy to the rightful capital of Israel?

^

[Proctopeo]

You are supporting something that supports something you object to, even though you're trying to weasel around it. That sounds hypocritical to me.

Again, what you're saying would be valid if and only if what I meant by the words "National Socialism" was or included "racism and ethnic cleansing". I don't, so it's not.

Since you and I use the term "National Socialism" differently, it makes no sense to keep pushing this. I say "dog", you hear "cat" - this back and forth won't get us anywhere.

What I do explicitly and unambiguosly state is that I oppose racism, period. Therefore, opposing the racism I see in Israel is nothing if not consistent - the opposite of hypocrisy.

Ethnic cleansing and racism is a fundamental aspect of National Socialism. It is a vital part, and always has been. Again Hitler literally coined the term. He created it. What you claim to view it as does not change what it is. National Socialism is literally built around the concept of a ethnostate. That is its very presmise, its very reason to exist.

And yes bias is important as you admit. Herein lies the problem. People are going to have a hard time talking rationally or taking seriously somoeone with extreme bias, especially one that makes them angry.

Again, you and I understand two very different things by the term "National Socialism". The fact that you see it to mean "cat", while I see it to mean "dog", does not mean I am being a hypocrite for stating that I both support it and am "anti-cat". This metaphor has run its course, I think.

In any case, this entire thing is completely irrelevant to the topic. I've addressed your concerns. If there is to be any further debate about this, it must happen elsewhere, not here.

I will cease to argue this as it is clearly going nowhere, although I will reiterate one of my points.

even though you're trying to weasel around it

Now, back to the main topic.

[Yorkers]

It did exist before Hitler took the helm.

Unlike "Palestinian" as a unique ethnicity or culture.

I don't like Israel that much but this made me laugh.

[Gauthier]

Unlike "Palestinian" as a unique ethnicity or culture.

I don't like Israel that much but this made me laugh.

Who wouldn't laugh at the Palestinians being stripped of all legitimacy and rendered persona non grata untermenschen?

[Yorkers]

I don't like Israel that much but this made me laugh.

Who wouldn't laugh at the Palestinians being stripped of all legitimacy and rendered persona non grata untermenschen?

He's got a point. Before the 1940s, there were no "Palestinians" as a people. They were just Arabs.

[Gauthier]

Who wouldn't laugh at the Palestinians being stripped of all legitimacy and rendered persona non grata untermenschen?

He's got a point. Before the 1940s, there were no "Palestinians" as a people. They were just Arabs.

And before 1776 there were no Americans, they were just British.

[Proctopeo]

I don't like Israel that much but this made me laugh.

Who wouldn't laugh at the Palestinians being stripped of all legitimacy and rendered persona non grata untermenschen?

It is clear that the only true untermenschen here are the strawmen. Grab the heugabeln und fackeln!

He's got a point. Before the 1940s, there were no "Palestinians" as a people. They were just Arabs.

And before 1776 there were no Americans, they were just British.

The difference is that "Palestinian" was created in a direct response to the establishment of Israel, while "American" was created as part of a revolution.

[Yorkers]

He's got a point. Before the 1940s, there were no "Palestinians" as a people. They were just Arabs.

And before 1776 there were no Americans, they were just British.

Let me help you brush up on your history.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Revolution

[Wanderjar]

He's got a point. Before the 1940s, there were no "Palestinians" as a people. They were just Arabs.

And before 1776 there were no Americans, they were just British.

Even that's a stretch, they identified more as New Yorker, Bostonian, Virginian or in general with their state. They might've, if pressed, conceded 'I am English' or 'I am Scottish', but likely not British, and certainly not at first inquiry. It would've probably gone more 'I am Christian. I am Virginian. I am English.' Remember, this is the 18th century, there was no such thing as nationalism yet, and patriotism had a different connotation than it does today.

[Gauthier]

And before 1776 there were no Americans, they were just British.

Let me help you brush up on your history.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Revolution

Ah, Might Makes Right. Plus nobody really hated Israel enough to back the Palestinians full bore.

[Wanderjar]

Let me help you brush up on your history.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Revolution

Ah, Might Makes Right. Plus nobody really hated Israel enough to back the Palestinians full bore.

I think the Egyptians, Syrians, Arab Legion, Jordanians, Iraqis, Saudis, and many others would disagree with you on that one. They simply couldn't defeat Israel.

[Yorkers]

Let me help you brush up on your history.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Revolution

Ah, Might Makes Right. Plus nobody really hated Israel enough to back the Palestinians full bore.

The American Revolution had been brewing for decades and the idea of there being an American identity had been formulating since at least the Seven Years War.

Apples to oranges.

[Major-Tom]

I don't like Israel that much but this made me laugh.

Who wouldn't laugh at the Palestinians being stripped of all legitimacy and rendered persona non grata untermenschen?

Uhhhhh....yeah, thats what happened, totally.

When a hostile foreign authority continually harms your country, you have every right to defend yourself. Israel should just annex the West Bank as soon as possible.

[Gauthier]

Ah, Might Makes Right. Plus nobody really hated Israel enough to back the Palestinians full bore.

I think the Egyptians, Syrians, Arab Legion, Jordanians, Iraqis, Saudis, and many others would disagree with you on that one. They simply couldn't defeat Israel.

A collection of countries with shit militaries are comparable with continental powers with an established military and economic resources?

[Gauthier]

Who wouldn't laugh at the Palestinians being stripped of all legitimacy and rendered persona non grata untermenschen?

Uhhhhh....yeah, thats what happened, totally.

When a hostile foreign authority continually harms your country, you have every right to defend yourself. Israel should just annex the West Bank as soon as possible.

Doesn't annexation require granting citizenship to the annexed?

[Proctopeo]

I think the Egyptians, Syrians, Arab Legion, Jordanians, Iraqis, Saudis, and many others would disagree with you on that one. They simply couldn't defeat Israel.

A collection of countries with shit militaries are comparable with continental powers with an established military and economic resources?

Nobody specified that the backing had to be good, but that it had to exist and had to be a substantial effort.
Wow, all the goalpoasts are on wheels today!

[Major-Tom]

Uhhhhh....yeah, thats what happened, totally.

When a hostile foreign authority continually harms your country, you have every right to defend yourself. Israel should just annex the West Bank as soon as possible.

Doesn't annexation require granting citizenship to the annexed?

Yes. If they integrate, fantastic, if not, they can go to Jordan or some other place.

[Gauthier]

A collection of countries with shit militaries are comparable with continental powers with an established military and economic resources?

Nobody specified that the backing had to be good, but that it had to exist and had to be a substantial effort.
Wow, all the goalpoasts are on wheels today!

As opposed to calling a Yugo on cinder blocks a Lamborghini on the other end.

[Proctopeo]

Nobody specified that the backing had to be good, but that it had to exist and had to be a substantial effort.
Wow, all the goalpoasts are on wheels today!

As opposed to calling a Yugo on cinder blocks a Lamborghini on the other end.

[Gauthier]

Doesn't annexation require granting citizenship to the annexed?

Yes. If they integrate, fantastic, if not, they can go to Jordan or some other place.

With the small detail of Netanyahu and Friends not wanting to grant the Palestinians citizenship for fear of diluting Israel's ethnic ideal purity and voting blocs.

[Herskerstad]

Yes. If they integrate, fantastic, if not, they can go to Jordan or some other place.

With the small detail of Netanyahu and Friends not wanting to grant the Palestinians citizenship for fear of diluting Israel's ethnic ideal purity and voting blocs.

Israel got a fairly significant Arab population, just over a fifth or so. The reason they probably won't want a Palestinian or Arab majority is precisely the reason of how Israeli's would be treated in current Palestinian-controlled areas, which most certainly does not have the same proportion of Jews or Israelis for predictable reasons.

[Novus America]

Who wouldn't laugh at the Palestinians being stripped of all legitimacy and rendered persona non grata untermenschen?

Uhhhhh....yeah, thats what happened, totally.

When a hostile foreign authority continually harms your country, you have every right to defend yourself. Israel should just annex the West Bank as soon as possible.

Thing is some Israelis want to. Some do not. Some only want to Annex part. Some nothing at all. And they do not want to upset the demographic balance. So until they actually decide on what their end game is it cannot be done.

Same problem Germany had in WWI. The got a huge amount of land. Never decided exactly what to do with it. Though he he lost it before it became a long term issue.

[Crockerland]

Nobody specified that the backing had to be good, but that it had to exist and had to be a substantial effort.
Wow, all the goalpoasts are on wheels today!

As opposed to calling a Yugo on cinder blocks a Lamborghini on the other end.

So you just start saying nonsense when someone calls your mobile goalposts out?