Robert E. Lee Day

[Arlenton]

Rommel wasn't a Nazi.

Are we thinking of different Rommels?

You must be linking to the wrong Rommel. I can't think of a Nazi Rommel.

[Arlenton]

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but wasn't it normal for officers to be a part of the Nazi Party? Rommel may have been a part of the Party, but he didn't live up to their ideology.

Rommel was not a member of the Nazi Party.

[Neutraligon]

I'd support it he's a Southern hero

Why should the Union, the thing he fought against have a holiday for someone who was basically a traitor? It would be like asking GB to have a day for people like the founding fathers.

[Jamzmania]

I'd support it he's a Southern hero

Why should the Union, the thing he fought against have a holiday for someone who was basically a traitor? It would be like asking GB to have a day for people like the founding fathers.

I don't really expect REL Day to be a federal holiday, personally.

[Empire of Cats]

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but wasn't it normal for officers to be a part of the Nazi Party? Rommel may have been a part of the Party, but he didn't live up to their ideology.

Rommel was not a member of the Nazi Party.

I stand corrected.

[USS Monitor]

Because he's the most famous Confederate general, so obviously politics is involved.

Yeah, so why is there a Robert E. Lee day but not, say, an Eisenhower day?

Because it's celebrated in parts of the South that want to rise again, but can't get it up. It's not a national holiday. Up here in the People's Republic of Nigger-Loving Yankee Devils, today is Martin Luther King Jr. Day.

We do celebrate Washington's birthday, and he was both a general and a president.

[Genivaria]

Are we thinking of different Rommels?

You must be linking to the wrong Rommel. I can't think of a Nazi Rommel.

Well in fairness he didn't seem to have much against the idea of Fascism since he never said anything against it.
He also support the Nazi's rise to power.

On the other hand he disobeyed direct orders from Hitler to execute non-white POW's and was known for caring for his men, hating the SS, and being honorable towards prisoners.

In between the wars:

His regiment was involved in quelling riots and civil disturbances that were occurring throughout Germany at this time.[28] Wherever possible, he avoided the use of force in these confrontations.[29] He decided against storming the city of Lindau that had been taken by revolutionary communists.[30] Instead, Rommel negotiated with the city council and managed to return it to the legitimate government through diplomatic means.

This is not what I think of when I think of a Nazi response towards civil unrest.

The worst you can say is that Rommel is possibly the most well behaved fascist in the history of the ideology, and even that's a stretch because he never really called himself a fascist.

[The Liberated Territories]

Happy Robert E. Lee day, then.

[Arlenton]

Yeah, so why is there a Robert E. Lee day but not, say, an Eisenhower day?

Because it's celebrated in parts of the South that want to rise again, but can't get it up. It's not a national holiday. Up here in the People's Republic of Nigger-Loving Yankee Devils, today is Martin Luther King Jr. Day.

We do celebrate Washington's birthday, and he was both a general and a president.

I celebrate both.

[USS Monitor]

Today is Robert E. Lee day.

Robert E. Lee was the premier General of the Confederated States of America, and the most famous aside from General "stonewall" Jackson who died heroically for his great cause.

Robert E Lee was a great man and general who is still celebrated to this very day.

It is sad some lawmakers want to remove his holiday.

How do you feel about the confederacy, about the 'civil rights' movement, and about the legacy of Robert E. Lee, the South's greatest General?

Why would the US honor him with a holiday?
For starters, there were greater and more notable leaders (both military and political) in the USA that do not have a holiday.
The other thing being that he gained most of his glory and fame fighting against the USA. He is far more remembered as the man who aged war against the Union, rather than the officer who fought in the Mexican war.

All things said, there are people who are more deserving of a holiday, none of which went to war against the Union. The man can be respected for his leadership and deeds in battle, but again, a holiday seems too much in this case.

That's why this isn't a national holiday.

[Genivaria]

Why would the US honor him with a holiday?
For starters, there were greater and more notable leaders (both military and political) in the USA that do not have a holiday.
The other thing being that he gained most of his glory and fame fighting against the USA. He is far more remembered as the man who aged war against the Union, rather than the officer who fought in the Mexican war.

All things said, there are people who are more deserving of a holiday, none of which went to war against the Union. The man can be respected for his leadership and deeds in battle, but again, a holiday seems too much in this case.

That's why this isn't a national holiday.

Honestly I don't care for the idea of setting aside a holiday just for a single general, it smacks too much of militarism for my liking.
A great social figure like MLK on the other hand is acceptable.

[The Great Devourer of All]

Are we thinking of different Rommels?

Nope, one in the same. Rommel was a pretty well known critic of the Nazi regime, he absolutely hated how the Nazis treated Jews and other groups and he never joined the party. He was actually a pretty decent guy from everything I know.

Cool. I'd support a Rommel holiday.

[Wiepolskie]

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but wasn't it normal for officers to be a part of the Nazi Party? Rommel may have been a part of the Party, but he didn't live up to their ideology.

Rommel was not a member of the Nazi Party.

He was a fervent Nazi ideologue, to the point that Hitler even considered him as a potential successor. He isn't the epitome of the apolitical German general, he wasn't even that good of one.

[Genivaria]

Rommel was not a member of the Nazi Party.

He was a fervent Nazi ideologue, to the point that Hitler even considered him as a potential successor. He isn't the epitome of the apolitical German general, he wasn't even that good of one.

Source?
And he was considered as Hitler's replacement by the people trying to assassinate Hitler.

[USS Monitor]

That's why this isn't a national holiday.

Honestly I don't care for the idea of setting aside a holiday just for a single general, it smacks too much of militarism for my liking.
A great social figure like MLK on the other hand is acceptable.

I don't think I'd be bothered by it if there was a holiday celebrating Sherman, but it's not something we actually need. Can't think of any other generals who deserve it except ones like Washington or Grant or Eisenhower that also had political careers.

[USS Monitor]

Rommel was not a member of the Nazi Party.

He was a fervent Nazi ideologue, to the point that Hitler even considered him as a potential successor. He isn't the epitome of the apolitical German general, he wasn't even that good of one.

You're thinking of someone else. Maybe Himmler or Goering.

[Ashmoria]

Seems to me he already has his day, it's called Memorial Day or Veteran's Day, in which all those who have died, including confederate soldiers are celebrated. Why the need to celebrate him and him alone?

memorial day is (technically speaking) for those who died in war.

lee survived the war.

[Wiepolskie]

He was a fervent Nazi ideologue, to the point that Hitler even considered him as a potential successor. He isn't the epitome of the apolitical German general, he wasn't even that good of one.

Source?
And he was considered as Hitler's replacement by the people trying to assassinate Hitler.

It seems that I was mistaken on him being fervent, but he was partial to the regime and party. He certainly wasn't apolitical, but this myth that he was is distorting his figure.

Also, he wasn't involved in the July Plot at all. He was approached, but rejected it.

He was a fervent Nazi ideologue, to the point that Hitler even considered him as a potential successor. He isn't the epitome of the apolitical German general, he wasn't even that good of one.

You're thinking of someone else. Maybe Himmler or Goering.

I see what you mean, but those were both inner party members. In terms of military commanders, Rommel was involved, but not an ideologue, with the Nazis.

[Yoshida (Ancient)]

Because it's celebrated in parts of the South that want to rise again, but can't get it up.

Most parts of the South tend to be heavily patriotic, with Southerners making up a sizeable portion serving in the US army. It's doubtful that many (if any) parts want to secede again. Else that would be eaten up by the mainstream media. More likely people just respect Lee because of his reputation as a good general and a Southern patriot (though whether he deserves that reputation is irrelevant to me - I don't think Rommel deserves his, generals tend to be talked up based on PR).

[Aryan Nation]

Lee was a traitor to his nation. He was the military arm of a rebellion that supported the institution of slavery. Celebrating his birthday is celebrating sedition, and should be treated as such.

George washington was a traitor to his nation. He was the military arm of a rebellion that supported the institution of slavery. Celebrating him is like celebrating sedition, and should be treated as such.

After all, the United Kingdom was the legitimate government.

This wasn't 2017, this was 1860. The idea of the United States being a 'nation' above your own state was a very alien idea to many people. People had more loyalty to their State. To them, that was their country.

Most the southerners who fought didn't even own any slaves.

These weren't deplorable fucking terrorists, these were brave men who stood up for what they believed in and died for it. Better than those ISIS guys who'd just car bomb a bunch of people.

[MERIZoC]

I say we could keep it.

He was a traitor.

Why you guys don't just celebrate Benedict Arnold Day?

Bad take.

Lee wasn't a bad guy because he took up arms against the US (who cares?) but because he was defending slavery.

[Aryan Nation]

He was a traitor.

Why you guys don't just celebrate Benedict Arnold Day?

Bad take.

Lee wasn't a bad guy because he took up arms against the US (who cares?) but because he was defending slavery.

Wasn't the U.S. defending slavery during the war of 1812? When Britain had dissolved slavery at that point but the U.S. maintained it? Were the soldiers of the U.S. not defending slavery?

Because if the rightful government, the United Kingdom, had won, Slavery would have been illegal.

[Aryan Nation]

Because it's celebrated in parts of the South that want to rise again, but can't get it up.

Most parts of the South tend to be heavily patriotic, with Southerners making up a sizeable portion serving in the US army. It's doubtful that many (if any) parts want to secede again. Else that would be eaten up by the mainstream media. More likely people just respect Lee because of his reputation as a good general and a Southern patriot (though whether he deserves that reputation is irrelevant to me - I don't think Rommel deserves his, generals tend to be talked up based on PR).

I'm from the South, most southerners are patriotic to a degree, that's true, but many are still sympathetic to the southern cause. Even if they consider themselves 'patriotic'.

Funny thing is, the confederates saw themselves as patriotic, heirs to George Washington. To them, it was the North that strayed from the ideas of the founding fathers.

Southerners tend to be overrepresented in the Armed Forces because southerners tend to be poorer than northerners. Who gets conscripted into the military, or tends to join the military when they have no other good options? Poor people.

Where are the poorest regions in the U.S.? The South. On top of that, there is a strong military tradition down here, that actually helped during the Civil War. A whole lot more yankees died than confederates.

[Yoshida (Ancient)]

He was a traitor.

Why you guys don't just celebrate Benedict Arnold Day?

Bad take.

Lee wasn't a bad guy because he took up arms against the US (who cares?) but because he was defending slavery.

Secession was about slavery, but the war was not, and Lee's reasons for fighting on the side of the South had more to do with a love for his home state than it did for any anti-abolition sentiment. Which is a no-brainer, nobody wants to have to shoot at their friends and family.

[Neutraligon]

Lee was a traitor to his nation. He was the military arm of a rebellion that supported the institution of slavery. Celebrating his birthday is celebrating sedition, and should be treated as such.

George washington was a traitor to his nation. He was the military arm of a rebellion that supported the institution of slavery. Celebrating him is like celebrating sedition, and should be treated as such.

There is a reason he does not have a holiday in Great Britain.

After all, the United Kingdom was the legitimate government.

Correct, which is why he does not have a holiday in that nation. Meanwhile not only do I feel that the Confederacy was not a legitimate state, it lost, and there is no reason for the US to celebrate those who are a traitor to it.

This wasn't 2017, this was 1860. The idea of the United States being a 'nation' above your own state was a very alien idea to many people. People had more loyalty to their State. To them, that was their country.

So? Then he should have protected only Virginia instead of leading the army of a rebels from all over

Most the southerners who fought didn't even own any slaves.

Irrelevant due to the fact that most states named slavery directly into their reason for trying to leave the union

These weren't deplorable fucking terrorists, these were brave men who stood up for what they believed in and died for it. Better than those ISIS guys who'd just car bomb a bunch of people.

You think ISIS isn't standing up for what they believe in and dying for it? That is exactly what they are doing. The only difference is in who is considered a legitimate target and how far they are willing to go for their cause.