NationStates

Don't just say remove the electoral college cause it favors the republicans, you know theres more to do than that. What would you personally do to put forth a fair electoral system in the United States? Besides the electoral college, you may want to put your opinions on
-Referendums
-Prisoner Voting Rights
-Superdelegates
-Third Parties
-E-Democracy
-Voter IDs
-Run off voting

We need much stricter laws against campaign finance. The amount of dark money that is funneled into both parties in this country is absurd, absolutely absurd. There needs to be tighter restrictions on lobbying, and cutting bureaucracy in general, that way civil servants can be held accountable for their actions. In layman's terms, gutting many existing federal and state agencies, in large part because they're ineffective, but also for the sake of transparency.

What really, really, really would change a lot are simple limits on donations a candidate or party can receive. I love capitalism, but I hate crony capitalism, wherein the interests of non-governmental groups ultimately dictate our policies. That is what we're seeing right now, and the Democrats and Republicans are both equally guilty of this shit.

Deport George Soros, and dismantle his network of agitators and covert ops.

The United States of the South Pole wrote:Don't just say remove the electoral college cause it favors the republicans, you know theres more to do than that. What would you personally do to put forth a fair electoral system in the United States? Besides the electoral college, you may want to put your opinions on
-Referendums
-Prisoner Voting Rights
-Superdelegates
-Third Parties
-E-Democracy
-Voter IDs
-Run off voting

... America isn't a democracy, it is a republic. Secondly, the electoral college has been around since the start of the nation, so I am unsure what you mean by, restore.

Krande Indtopia wrote:Deport George Soros, and dismantle his network of agitators and covert ops.

Both Soros and the Koch Brothers, they're both the scapegoats for corrupt influences in politics, and while they are despicable human beings, there are hundreds of others out there.

Krande Indtopia wrote:Deport George Soros, and dismantle his network of agitators and covert ops.

Oh boy... How about instead of paranoia over freaking GEORGE SOROS for crying out loud we actually discuss meaningful changes like abolishing the electoral college and maybe (though this will probably never happen) shifting to an unicameral parliamentary system instead of our ridiculous two-party disaster?

Republic of the Cristo wrote:

The United States of the South Pole wrote:Don't just say remove the electoral college cause it favors the republicans, you know theres more to do than that. What would you personally do to put forth a fair electoral system in the United States? Besides the electoral college, you may want to put your opinions on
-Referendums
-Prisoner Voting Rights
-Superdelegates
-Third Parties
-E-Democracy
-Voter IDs
-Run off voting

... America isn't a democracy, it is a republic. Secondly, the electoral college has been around since the start of the nation, so I am unsure what you mean by, restore.

I'm not against the electoral college because it gave us two unpopular republicans in recent years, I'm against it because it upholds the two party system and intentionally ignores the votes of contrarians in more solid red or blue states. You can't tell me theres no one thing you would change about the voting system? One thing you distrust?

Don't forget that the electoral college was designed to select the leader of a tiny backwater agrarian republic, not the industrialized superpower we are today.

We should obviously support whoever it is you like. They can do no wrong. The other guy winning is undemocratic.

The United States of the South Pole wrote:

Republic of the Cristo wrote:
... America isn't a democracy, it is a republic. Secondly, the electoral college has been around since the start of the nation, so I am unsure what you mean by, restore.

I'm not against the electoral college because it gave us two unpopular republicans in recent years, I'm against it because it upholds the two party system and intentionally ignores the votes of contrarians in more solid red or blue states. You can't tell me theres no one thing you would change about the voting system? One thing you distrust?

Of course, but I was pointing out the flaws in your statement.

Republic of the Cristo wrote:

The United States of the South Pole wrote:Don't just say remove the electoral college cause it favors the republicans, you know theres more to do than that. What would you personally do to put forth a fair electoral system in the United States? Besides the electoral college, you may want to put your opinions on
-Referendums
-Prisoner Voting Rights
-Superdelegates
-Third Parties
-E-Democracy
-Voter IDs
-Run off voting

... America isn't a democracy, it is a republic. Secondly, the electoral college has been around since the start of the nation, so I am unsure what you mean by, restore.

The United States' federal republic is a type of representative democracy.

Montchevre wrote:Don't forget that the electoral college was designed to select the leader of a tiny backwater agrarian republic, not the industrialized superpower we are today.

The electoral college was made to represent otherwise unrepresented underdogs that would otherwise not be considered by a one party state. I believe the opposite is true now and that a run off electoral system would be better considering the founding father's fear of a one party state has expanded into a fear of a two party state. However, a major criticism I have of the left is their hypocritical ability to totally ignore the founding father's ideal of giving a voice and chance to the underrepresentation. Even worse when they consider voting limits based on age or purposefully immigrating thousands of minority guaranteed democrat voters to more conservative states for their own gain. Hell, does anyone else remember that Black Ethnic State we had a while back in which it was actually the Democrats voicing praise for Segregation?

Krande Indtopia wrote:Deport George Soros, and dismantle his network of agitators and covert ops.

(((Soros))) best man ever in the modern world, 10/10 will keep covertly funding global liberal zionist elite as an evil billionaire and fighting fascist gommunism

I would submit that America is already a vibrant democracy -- we simply lack adequate public participation.

In presidential years, just over half of Americans cast ballots. In midterm elections, ~35 percent of eligible voters in this country make their voices heard. In primary elections, the numbers are closer to 8-10 percent (meaning that Trump and Clinton were nominated by a VERY small section of the people). These are unacceptable figures. There is nothing that actively hinders most adult citizens from getting out to the polls. Absentee voting via mail is available in all U.S. states, and early voting is conducted in 37. This means that people who say they "don't have the time" are either uninformed at best, or justifying their civic apathy at worst.

People constantly complain about how the U.S. is the only developed country on Earth to not provide things like paid sick leave, and millions more are worried that we will lose the single biggest step towards universal health care that we've ever taken. Yet many of these same folks stay home on election day and complain about how the system is "rigged." Well, I have tough words for them: you are the reason the system is broken. You are the reason why we can't get policies that majorities of Americans believe in. When you don't vote, people you disagree with win. That's the way it works! I'm sure that many people who supported Sanders stayed home during primary season given the low turnout figures. Imagine if every single one of them actually stood up for what they believed in, instead of retreating to their computers ranting about a rigged system. We might have had a President Sanders right now. Obama defeated Clinton in 2008, despite the Democratic establishment actively supporting Hillary. This was because Obama was one of the few candidates to inspire mass participation.

I know, I know. Republican gerrymandering has made it impossible for Dems to win in many districts (especially in the midterms). However, I look at the fact that redistricting is controlled by state legislatures, and the fact that Democrats can run successful underdog campaigns against the GOP in viable seats. We've done it before! This means that the only way you'll beat gerrymandering is if you fight tooth and nail for candidates who want to reform the system. You might lose, but you also might win. If you stay home, you'll definitely lose. Concerned that the wealthy buy all the elections? I'd refer you to the many politicians in this country who have won elections against all the odds. Bernie Sanders in his first congressional race, David Brat (a Tea Partier who beat the House Majority Leader in a primary), etc. People's participation does matter, and does make a difference. Oh, and Democratic appointees to the Supreme Court were the ones who voted to uphold campaign finance reform. Republican appointees gutted it. So party control does make a difference.

To be clear, I'm not upset with people who have been disenfranchised by voter ID laws, bans against non-violent felons, etc. I empathize with their situations and bear them no ill will. As for the people who don't vote to make some sort of "statement," yet are active in pushing policies -- I have no words at all.

TL;DR -- the only reason why American democracy seems so broken is because people don't participate enough.

Campaign finance reform, abolish the electoral college, end gerrymandering, eliminate voter ID laws, proportional representation, abolish the Senate, enfranchise convicts and former convicts, expand suffrage to those 16 and older, eliminate super delegates and caucuses, expand early and absentee voting, restore the Voting Rights Act in full, etc. These are all things that will fix our democracy.

Republic of the Cristo wrote:... America isn't a democracy, it is a republic.

You clearly don't know what a republic is then. Let me put it this way: all republics are democracies, but not all democracies are republics. It's like squares and rectangles. "That shape isn't a rectangle, it's a square!"

I didn't know that the US didn't have democracy. When was my right to vote taken away?

>prisoner voting rights

no.

Republic of the Cristo wrote:

The United States of the South Pole wrote:Don't just say remove the electoral college cause it favors the republicans, you know theres more to do than that. What would you personally do to put forth a fair electoral system in the United States? Besides the electoral college, you may want to put your opinions on
-Referendums
-Prisoner Voting Rights
-Superdelegates
-Third Parties
-E-Democracy
-Voter IDs
-Run off voting

... America isn't a democracy, it is a republic. Secondly, the electoral college has been around since the start of the nation, so I am unsure what you mean by, restore.

For the one billionth time I have to explain this. Here goes again, a republic is a type of democracy. Not all democracies are republics but all republic are democracies. Please don't ever bring up this fallacy again, merci!!

Referendums - theyre ok
Prisoner Voting Rights - lolno
Superdelegates - meh, whatever goes
Third Parties - theyre alright
E-Democracy - lolno
Voter IDs - yes, just make it easier to access for citiens
Run off voting - meh

Montchevre wrote:

Krande Indtopia wrote:Deport George Soros, and dismantle his network of agitators and covert ops.

Oh boy... How about instead of paranoia over freaking GEORGE SOROS for crying out loud we actually discuss meaningful changes like abolishing the electoral college and maybe (though this will probably never happen) shifting to an unicameral parliamentary system instead of our ridiculous two-party disaster?

The unicameral legislature has nothing to do with a two-party system. Several states have a bicameral legislature and a multi-party system. The voting system needs to change not the legislature

Balkenreich wrote:>prisoner voting rights

no.

I do think that prisoners should be granted the right to vote while in prison. However only the ones that are not held in maximum security will get to vote, and for the time being it should be a state by state thing.

Thermodolia wrote:

Montchevre wrote:Oh boy... How about instead of paranoia over freaking GEORGE SOROS for crying out loud we actually discuss meaningful changes like abolishing the electoral college and maybe (though this will probably never happen) shifting to an unicameral parliamentary system instead of our ridiculous two-party disaster?

The unicameral legislature has nothing to do with a two-party system. Several states have a bicameral legislature and a multi-party system. The voting system needs to change not the legislature

I'm speculating that they were emphasizing the proportional nature of a parliament when writing that. And very few states have more than the two big wigs in their legislature.

Thermodolia wrote:

Balkenreich wrote:>prisoner voting rights

no.

I do think that prisoners should be granted the right to vote while in prison. However only the ones that are not held in maximum security will get to vote, and for the time being it should be a state by state thing.

The right to vote is one of those things that should be lost in prison.

The United States has never had pure democracy, nor should it ever. The United States is not a rule of the mob, nor is it a dictatorship. It is a Republic and operates very well under this system. What you're talking about is not "restoration", it is radical reform.

-Electoral College: Dismantle and replace it with a two-round popular vote.
-Referendums: No. Not for the federal level, state and local is fine but federal would be a nightmare.
-Prisoner Voting Rights: Yes but only for those not in maximum security and state by state laws should apply.
-Superdelegates: Party thing. The federal government should not regulate how political parties are run.
-Third Parties: Yup.
-E-Democracy: For. Though it needs to be a state by state thing.
-Voter IDs: No.
-Run off voting: There should be automatic run-off if the candidate doesn't receive 51%.
-First Past the Post voting system: We need to get rid of it except for when voting for the president and the governors. All legislators must be elected by IRV or instant-runoff voting.

That's just my $.02