Right-Wing Discussion Thread VIII: McCarthy Was Right

[Bakery Hill]

The heir to the throne must be of royal blood. A commoner adopted by a royal does not become royal. Our ruling dynasty goes back some 1,500 years to the founding of the Royal House of Wessex.

Not by blood they don't.

[Yoshida (Ancient)]

Of course they'd have to abdicate. It used to be that they weren't even allowed to marry divorced people either. Monarchs are supposed to uphold standards of their church.

Then Parliament and the monarch should see about separating church and state for good. Put someone else in charge of the church if they insist on having it somehow intertwined with government.

Why? The Anglican religion is a core part of the history and identity of the UK.

[Old Tyrannia]

It seems highly unlikely that something like that would ever happen, though. I think all members of the monarchy understand their unwritten boundaries.

The Queen vetoed the Iraq War, I think.

The Queen has never refused to grant royal assent to a bill. And she certainly didn't veto the Iraq War, given we were involved in it.

[Bakery Hill]

It seems highly unlikely that something like that would ever happen, though. I think all members of the monarchy understand their unwritten boundaries.

The Queen vetoed the Iraq War, I think.

*spills muesli*

[The V O I D]

Sauce?

1. http://www.allianzusa.com/lovefamilymoney/insights/shifting-structure-of-the-modern-american-family/

Also, regardless, homosexuals don't magically become heterosexual and go have straight relationships/marriages just because statistics say traditional families are "better off."

2. Don't worry, we have First Citizen Pence to take care of those types.

And, oh gee, I wonder why nontraditional families struggle when they are in the minority since LGBT people are also in the minority, and when many countries ban them from even being able to start families. WHAT A SURPRISE.

3. It goes without saying that I'm referring to pro-LGBT Western countries, America in particular.

1. That sauce looks iffy and biased. I don't trust it.

2. Yeah, sure; conversion camps for everyone, right? Because torturing people for not being normal is good!

3. Even in America and western countries, LGBT people and families are a minority compared to traditional families. My point stands.

[Italios]

It seems highly unlikely that something like that would ever happen, though. I think all members of the monarchy understand their unwritten boundaries.

The Queen vetoed the Iraq War, I think.

I have no idea if she did, but I think the issue VOID was about problems with religious interference in the monarchy. If she did veto it, I think a solid "back off" from politicians would've been nice.

[The V O I D]

Then Parliament and the monarch should see about separating church and state for good. Put someone else in charge of the church if they insist on having it somehow intertwined with government.

Why? The Anglican religion is a core part of the history and identity of the UK.

You say that like it makes me start caring what happens when a nation decides to secularize, even if it used to be religious.

[Old Tyrannia]

The heir to the throne must be of royal blood. A commoner adopted by a royal does not become royal. Our ruling dynasty goes back some 1,500 years to the founding of the Royal House of Wessex.

Not by blood they don't.

Yes they do. Elizabeth II is directly descended from Cerdic, first King of Wessex, as has been every West Saxon, English and British monarch since his reign with the sole exception of William I, William II and Henry I, the last of whom married into the West Saxon royal line to secure the legitimacy of the new Norman dynasty in the eyes of the English.

[The V O I D]

Eh, not really.

A monarch can still be a monarch without being of a religion.

In the Church of England, the Monarch is the head of the Church, and in most constitutional monarchy, I think it's the same.

Sounds troublesome.

Just be a secular republic instead, then.

[Southerly Gentleman]

1. http://www.allianzusa.com/lovefamilymoney/insights/shifting-structure-of-the-modern-american-family/


2. Don't worry, we have First Citizen Pence to take care of those types.


3. It goes without saying that I'm referring to pro-LGBT Western countries, America in particular.

1. That sauce looks iffy and biased. I don't trust it.

2. Yeah, sure; conversion camps for everyone, right? Because torturing people for not being normal is good!

3. Even in America and western countries, LGBT people and families are a minority compared to traditional families. My point stands.

1. Allianz is iffy and biased?

2. It's not torture.

3. Groups don't fail simply because they are minorities. White Europeans, despite being by far a minority when they came to the Americas, civilized and overtook the entire continent. I'll need a better argument than "LGBT people and families underperform because they're a minority!"

[Bakery Hill]

Not by blood they don't.

Yes they do. Elizabeth II is directly descended from Cerdic, first King of Wessex, as has been every West Saxon, English and British monarch since his reign with the sole exception of William I, William II and Henry I, the last of whom married into the West Saxon royal line to secure the legitimacy of the new Norman dynasty in the eyes of the English.

I'm going to trust you know more on this issue than I do, but if you'd be so kind give me a hand here.

How does Henry's heir, Stephen of Blois, connect back to the House of Wessex?

(or am I thinking Henry II? I really don't understand the Anarchy at all)

[Gauliscia]

Yes they do. Elizabeth II is directly descended from Cerdic, first King of Wessex, as has been every West Saxon, English and British monarch since his reign with the sole exception of William I, William II and Henry I, the last of whom married into the West Saxon royal line to secure the legitimacy of the new Norman dynasty in the eyes of the English.

I'm going to trust you know more on this issue than I do, but if you'd be so kind give me a hand here.

How does Henry's heir, Stephen of Blois, connect back to the House of Wessex?

(or am I thinking Henry II? I really don't understand the Anarchy at all)

I think some of the norman nobles married anglo-saxons... I could be wrong but that may explain it..

[The V O I D]

1. That sauce looks iffy and biased. I don't trust it.

2. Yeah, sure; conversion camps for everyone, right? Because torturing people for not being normal is good!

3. Even in America and western countries, LGBT people and families are a minority compared to traditional families. My point stands.

It's not torture.

Okay, name how being psychologically abused and forced to change something that is not changeable, as well as electric shock therapy and burn therapy/pain therapy, as well as "corrective sexual" therapy isn't torture. PLEASE. I'd LOVE to hear your explanation.

Conversion therapy is torture and has been proven not to work. If anything, it just ends in a higher risk for suicide in the individual. Might as well send them off to death camps if you're going to advocate for conversion therapy.

[Bakery Hill]

I'm going to trust you know more on this issue than I do, but if you'd be so kind give me a hand here.

How does Henry's heir, Stephen of Blois, connect back to the House of Wessex?

(or am I thinking Henry II? I really don't understand the Anarchy at all)

I think some of the norman nobles married anglo-saxons... I could be wrong but that may explain it..

If that's the case "direct descent" is a really generous way of looking at it.

[Yoshida (Ancient)]

In the Church of England, the Monarch is the head of the Church, and in most constitutional monarchy, I think it's the same.

Sounds troublesome.

Just be a secular religious republic instead, then.

Sounds about right.

[Italios]

1. That sauce looks iffy and biased. I don't trust it.

2. Yeah, sure; conversion camps for everyone, right? Because torturing people for not being normal is good!

3. Even in America and western countries, LGBT people and families are a minority compared to traditional families. My point stands.

1. Allianz is iffy and biased?

2. It's not torture.

3. Groups don't fail simply because they are minorities. White Europeans, despite being by far a minority when they came to the Americas, civilized and overtook the entire continent. I'll need a better argument than "LGBT people and families underperform because they're a minority!"

Can you suggest one way to "rehabilitate" LGBT+ people that does not use any kind of emotional or physical torture, especially methods that work?

It's common knowledge that LGBT+ youth often face discrimination from their families, which already takes away the leg up that most young people get when starting out on their own lives (source). This lack of support already gives them a disadvantage and leaves them less likely to find a job that provides enough income to support a family. The article provided also stated that LGBT+ people were less likely to be given a job, so there's also that. Bullying, especially in middle and high school, can leave emotional damage on people with long-term negative effects such as depression that become a fallback later in life. This kind of abuse can continue in the workplace which is just as damaging. While the disadvantages of being an LGBT+ person can seem too ludicrous to believe, or not obvious, the fact is that their sexuality is a burden that is not their fault.

[Old Tyrannia]

Yes they do. Elizabeth II is directly descended from Cerdic, first King of Wessex, as has been every West Saxon, English and British monarch since his reign with the sole exception of William I, William II and Henry I, the last of whom married into the West Saxon royal line to secure the legitimacy of the new Norman dynasty in the eyes of the English.

I'm going to trust you know more on this issue than I do, but if you'd be so kind give me a hand here.

How does Henry's heir, Stephen of Blois, connect back to the House of Wessex?

Stephen de Blois was not related to the House of Wessex, but I do not regard him as a legitimate monarch. The rightful heir was the Holy Roman Empress Matilda, eldest daughter of Henry I, and it was her son Henry II who eventually took the throne and continued the royal line of descent from Cerdic. Since then no one not descended from the House of Wessex has sat on the English throne- nor has anyone not descended from the family of the first King of Scots, Kenneth MacAlpin, ever sat on the Scottish throne; even Edward I of England was a descendent of the House of Alpin.

[Old Tyrannia]

I think some of the norman nobles married anglo-saxons... I could be wrong but that may explain it..

If that's the case "direct descent" is a really generous way of looking at it.

If you want, I can spell out generation by generation the line of descent from the last West Saxon king to be directly related to the modern royal family, King Edmund Ironside, and Queen Elizabeth II. It would take a bit more research but I could probably do it all the way back to King Cerdic himself.

[Yoshida (Ancient)]

If that's the case "direct descent" is a really generous way of looking at it.

If you want, I can spell out generation by generation the line of descent from the last West Saxon king to be directly related to the modern royal family, King Edmund Ironside, and Queen Elizabeth II. It would take a bit more research but I could probably do it all the way back to King Cerdic himself.

Who cares though? Why is tradition so important that it cannot be changed?

[Southerly Gentleman]

It's not torture.

Okay, name how being psychologically abused and forced to change something that is not changeable, as well as electric shock therapy and burn therapy/pain therapy, as well as "corrective sexual" therapy isn't torture. PLEASE. I'd LOVE to hear your explanation.

Conversion therapy is torture and has been proven not to work. If anything, it just ends in a higher risk for suicide in the individual. Might as well send them off to death camps if you're going to advocate for conversion therapy.

Of course it's abuse -- I was being facetious. Besides, why does the plight of LGBT people matter to you, given your admitted sociopathic disorder? Perhaps there's something you're not telling us.

[Bakery Hill]

I'm going to trust you know more on this issue than I do, but if you'd be so kind give me a hand here.

How does Henry's heir, Stephen of Blois, connect back to the House of Wessex?

Stephen de Blois was not related to the House of Wessex, but I do not regard him as a legitimate monarch.

So it's that subjective is it? I thought you were above such things.

The rightful heir was the Holy Roman Empress Matilda, eldest daughter of Henry I, and it was her son Henry II who eventually took the throne and continued the royal line of descent from Cerdic. Since then no one not descended from the House of Wessex has sat on the English throne- nor has anyone not descended from the family of the first King of Scots, Kenneth MacAlpin, ever sat on the Scottish throne; even Edward I of England was a descendent of the House of Alpin.

Okay, so how does she go back to Cerdic? Through Scotland?

[Itoshiki]

But there are so many poor countries with educated people clamoring to get in that you could get the best of both :^)

Also that plan doesn't involve enough Wahhabis for Europe. It's not in vogue to be reasonable over there. Real bleeding hearts want the full ME experience.

Less educated = more likely to reproduce to nourish the state with future cannon fodders. Though maybe well-educated people from say Saudi Arabia are fine.

"Full ME experience" which is why German population is decreasing. France and Sweden do nothing wrong, they will be the heir of European future, but even then all Eurabia will reach German tier and then declining.

[Gauliscia]

If you want, I can spell out generation by generation the line of descent from the last West Saxon king to be directly related to the modern royal family, King Edmund Ironside, and Queen Elizabeth II. It would take a bit more research but I could probably do it all the way back to King Cerdic himself.

Who cares though? Why is tradition so important that it cannot be changed?

Its important to know who your leaders are/were. If Britain was still pagan, we could make it so that the Queen is descended from a God, thereby enabling greater reverence.

[The V O I D]

Okay, name how being psychologically abused and forced to change something that is not changeable, as well as electric shock therapy and burn therapy/pain therapy, as well as "corrective sexual" therapy isn't torture. PLEASE. I'd LOVE to hear your explanation.

Conversion therapy is torture and has been proven not to work. If anything, it just ends in a higher risk for suicide in the individual. Might as well send them off to death camps if you're going to advocate for conversion therapy.

Of course it's abuse -- I was being facetious. Besides, why does the plight of LGBT people matter to you, given your admitted sociopathic disorder? Perhaps there's something you're not telling us.

There's nothing I haven't said here. I have already stated before that despite my utter disgust with most/nearly all humans I am somehow still attracted to them.

I have openly stated that I'm pretty sure I'm bisexual.

Your point?

[Bakery Hill]

If that's the case "direct descent" is a really generous way of looking at it.

If you want, I can spell out generation by generation the line of descent from the last West Saxon king to be directly related to the modern royal family, King Edmund Ironside, and Queen Elizabeth II. It would take a bit more research but I could probably do it all the way back to King Cerdic himself.

I wouldn't want you to go to all that much trouble for little old me.

But if you ever do it for some other project, I'd be interested to see. I'm a republican but I do like genealogy.