US passes UN vote banning Israeli settlements

[Gauthier]

Well the Arabs were celebrating.

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Naaah, obviously Those Dirty Durka Durkas were celebrating that they were one step closer to driving them Jews into the sea. *nod*

[FelrikTheDeleted]

Well the Arabs were celebrating.

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Hopefully.

[Renewed]

Well the Arabs were celebrating.

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

we all know that that won't happen. Even if it did, there won't be peace for long.
Even if a two state solution did happen, Iran won't stop its threats to Israel.

[Ostehaar]

Well the Arabs were celebrating.

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Exactly. Thank god for people who speak with sense around here.

[Uxupox]

Well the Arabs were celebrating.

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Then why doesn't the Gaza Palestinians accept the peace initiative while the West Bank Palestinians and the Israeli government accept it?

[Ifreann]

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Naaah, obviously Those Dirty Durka Durkas were celebrating that they were one step closer to driving them Jews into the sea. *nod*

I mean, some of them might, but that's not actually going to happen.

---

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Hopefully.

Yes, hopefully.

Of course, hope is a mistake.

[Aelex]

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

>Implying the Israelis have ANY reason to agree to a "peaceful" two-state solution.

[FelrikTheDeleted]

Naaah, obviously Those Dirty Durka Durkas were celebrating that they were one step closer to driving them Jews into the sea. *nod*

I mean, some of them might, but that's not actually going to happen.

---

Hopefully.

Yes, hopefully.

Of course, hope is a mistake.

Hope, a mistake? Care to elaborate?

[Gondolaulus]

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Then why doesn't the Gaza Palestinians accept the peace initiative while the West Bank Palestinians and the Israeli government accept it?

The majority of the Gaza Palestinians support it, even the Gaza Authority. However, it's Netanyahu and Hamas cockblocking the initiative.

[Ostehaar]

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

>Implying the Israelis have ANY reason to agree to a "peaceful" two-state solution.

A better solution being to keep living in a constant war situation and allocating resources to a piece of land populated mainly by Palestinians..?

[Ifreann]

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

>Implying the Israelis have ANY reason to agree to a "peaceful" two-state solution.

Well if they think they can get away with taking land by force and shipping in their own civilians until the rest of the world gives in and recognises it as Israeli territory then I imagine they might prefer to stick with that course.

[Renewed]

>Implying the Israelis have ANY reason to agree to a "peaceful" two-state solution.

Well if they think they can get away with taking land by force and shipping in their own civilians until the rest of the world gives in and recognises it as Israeli territory then I imagine they might prefer to stick with that course.

Any land taken during a war, rightfully belongs to the nation who took it, especially if the nation did not start the war.

[Imperializt Russia]

Uhh, they've already thrown the tantrum.
Has Hamas ever been actually declared to be an unlawful combatant?
A bus ride? What else are they supposed to give them?

This isn't a generic disagreement. Palestine is continually denied statehood by Israel's actions, including Israel's constant expansion into territories it does not have the legal right to expand into.

Then again, that's how America started so no wonder they usually veto this shit.

They are a terrorist organization. So they are an illegal enemy combatant.

Is that America's label or the UN's? Important difference.

Hamas was (is?) the elected government of whatever the area known as Palestine is officially called, and so far as I'm aware, those elections were recognised.

[Imperializt Russia]

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Then why doesn't the Gaza Palestinians accept the peace initiative while the West Bank Palestinians and the Israeli government accept it?

I'm going to assume it has something to do with the two recent wars Israel waged in Gaza.

[Ostehaar]

>Implying the Israelis have ANY reason to agree to a "peaceful" two-state solution.

Well if they think they can get away with taking land by force and shipping in their own civilians until the rest of the world gives in and recognises it as Israeli territory then I imagine they might prefer to stick with that course.

You're talking about "shipping in" as if the Israeli government forces people to move there. No, most Israelis are not insane and don't want to live in the West Bank.

[Renewed]

I mean, didn't the Soviets take control of the land they conquered in world War 2, isn't Pakistan controlling land it took over in Kashmir, and isn't Russia keeping the land it took from Ukraine. So if they can do it, why not Israel.

[Imperializt Russia]

Well if they think they can get away with taking land by force and shipping in their own civilians until the rest of the world gives in and recognises it as Israeli territory then I imagine they might prefer to stick with that course.

You're talking about "shipping in" as if the Israeli government forces people to move there. No, most Israelis are not insane and don't want to live in the West Bank.

There wouldn't be continual expansion of the territories, if there weren't people queuing up to live in it.

[Philjia]

Sure, but not because they expected Israel to turn around and pull out of the territories they're occupying. This is a small step towards convincing Israel to agree to a peaceful two-state solution.

Then why doesn't the Gaza Palestinians accept the peace initiative while the West Bank Palestinians and the Israeli government accept it?

Hamas won't ever back a policy that allows Israel to exist, and the citizens of Gaza are unlikely to reject Hamas until Israel stops using disproportionate force in retaliation to Hamas led terrorist attacks, and the Israeli government is unlikely to do that since the indiscriminate bombing plays fairly well to the Israeli electorate.

[Uxupox]

Then why doesn't the Gaza Palestinians accept the peace initiative while the West Bank Palestinians and the Israeli government accept it?

The majority of the Gaza Palestinians support it, even the Gaza Authority. However, it's Netanyahu and Hamas cockblocking the initiative.

If the majority of the Gaza Palestinians support it then Hamas wouldn't be in power (Hamas is a clear rejector of any peace proposal with Israel). Netanyahu has expressed that Israel would accept the proposal but if changes are made to the proposal (Various Israeli officials have stated that the acceptance of the current proposal is the death of modern state of Israel) such as not restoring the 1967 borders and leaving the Golan heights.

So one can assume that the roadblock to peace is a territorial dispute that still exists from 50 years before.

Then why doesn't the Gaza Palestinians accept the peace initiative while the West Bank Palestinians and the Israeli government accept it?

Hamas won't ever back a policy that allows Israel to exist, and the citizens of Gaza are unlikely to reject Hamas until Israel stops using disproportionate force in retaliation to Hamas led terrorist attacks, and the Israeli government is unlikely to do that since the indiscriminate bombing plays fairly well to the Israeli electorate.

I would take this more seriously if Israel did not practice warning the area three days before of a bombing.

[Imperializt Russia]

I mean, didn't the Soviets take control of the land they conquered in world War 2, isn't Pakistan controlling land it took over in Kashmir, and isn't Russia keeping the land it took from Ukraine.

The Soviet Union fell, Kashmir is disputed to this day, and we're honestly unsure if the west will have to fight a war in Eastern Europe over that last one.

None of them are accepted by the international community.

[Renewed]

You're talking about "shipping in" as if the Israeli government forces people to move there. No, most Israelis are not insane and don't want to live in the West Bank.

There wouldn't be continual expansion of the territories, if there weren't people queuing up to live in it.

the Jews are coming back because of increasing anti-semitism in the places they live in.

[Renewed]

I mean, didn't the Soviets take control of the land they conquered in world War 2, isn't Pakistan controlling land it took over in Kashmir, and isn't Russia keeping the land it took from Ukraine.

The Soviet Union fell, Kashmir is disputed to this day, and we're honestly unsure if the west will have to fight a war in Eastern Europe over that last one.

None of them are accepted by the international community.

Why doesn't the UN have resoultions on that then?

[Imperializt Russia]

The majority of the Gaza Palestinians support it, even the Gaza Authority. However, it's Netanyahu and Hamas cockblocking the initiative.

If the majority of the Gaza Palestinians support it then Hamas wouldn't be in power (Hamas is a clear rejector of any peace proposal with Israel). Netanyahu has expressed that Israel would accept the proposal but if changes are made to the proposal (Various Israeli officials have stated that the acceptance of the current proposal is the death of modern state of Israel) such as not restoring the 1967 borders and leaving the Golan heights.

So one can assume that the roadblock to peace is a territorial dispute that still exists from 50 years before.

Hamas isn't just about "fuck Israel". They flood a lot of money into social healthcare and schooling. Not exactly sustainable economics, but there'd be even shittier schools, construction and hospitals if they weren't in power.

[Aelex]

Well if they think they can get away with taking land by force and shipping in their own civilians until the rest of the world gives in and recognises it as Israeli territory then I imagine they might prefer to stick with that course.

Seems like the best and most sensible course of action. :^)

[Ostehaar]

You're talking about "shipping in" as if the Israeli government forces people to move there. No, most Israelis are not insane and don't want to live in the West Bank.

There wouldn't be continual expansion of the territories, if there weren't people queuing up to live in it.

Nope. What fuels the settlement movement is ideological passion and a place among those in charge. Most Israelis would rather not live in a war zone surrounded by Arabs. These aren't guesses - I know my own society.