Islamic Discussion Thread ٣

[Baltenstein]

What's this thread's opinion of Erdogan?

He would make for an entertaining Saturday Cartoon character.

[Aulus Maximus]

Here you go

Now that's a development.

Unfortunately for Mohammad VI calling yourself "Khalifa" doesn't automatically make you rightfully a Caliph.

Might makes right.

[HR Manager]

I'm assuming Wiz Khalifa is not, indeed, a legitimate Khalifa.

[Mujahidah]

I'm assuming Wiz Khalifa is not, indeed, a legitimate Khalifa.

No.

And before you ask, no.

[Aulus Maximus]

What is IDT's opinion on musical instruments for dhikr? Haram or halal?

I personally think musical instruments can help the believer engage in dhikr, but then again I'm no Muslim.

[Hindia Belanda]

Here you go

Now that's a development.

Unfortunately for Mohammad VI calling yourself "Khalifa" doesn't automatically make you rightfully a Caliph.

Personally, the title of caliph doesn't mean shit because it is theologically illegitimate, as per my school of jurisprudence.

What is IDT's opinion on musical instruments for dhikr? Haram or halal?

I personally think musical instruments can help the believer engage in dhikr, but then again I'm no Muslim.

I don't see why they should be haram tbqh. Hell, I've been to a sufi gathering where they did dhikr accompanied by violins and percussions.

[Aulus Maximus]

To which Tariqat did you go? Naqshbandi?

[Hindia Belanda]

To which Tariqat did you go? Naqshbandi?

Idk which specific tariqat they were. It was mixed-gender so probably not the mainstream ones.

[Aulus Maximus]

To which Tariqat did you go? Naqshbandi?

Idk which specific tariqat they were. It was mixed-gender so probably not the mainstream ones.

That's not Naqshbandi then, yeah.

[Al-Ismailiyya]

False.

Oh you can show a source than?

So, you dismiss everything I had previously said because one Muslim states a contradictory one very hesitantly?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakat#Amount

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jizya#Rate_of_jizya_tax

There is also the fact that all adult Muslims must pay zakat while only working, financially stable adult males must pay jizya and even then they can get exempted through military service.

[Negarakita]

What's this thread's opinion of Erdogan?

Erdoğan Reis!
I love him. Bringing turkey back to being Turkish.

[Aulus Maximus]

What's this thread's opinion of Erdogan?

Erdoğan Reis!
I love him. Bringing turkey back to being Turkish.

Tbh Turkey was already pretty Turk before Erdogan. Turkish nationalism is a core element of the Atatürk's Republican principles.

If at all Erdogan gave minorities somewhat more rights, ie Kurdish television and radio times.

[Kartofian]

Hello, I was wondering whether anyone familiar with Islamic, or Arabic, history would recommend a book, or another resource, to me.

In retrospect this sounds like a pretty disrespectful request: asking on an Islamic thread, where many posters are practicing Muslims, to name and recommend the works of their biggest heretics is weird. But please take no offense - I genuinely want to learn - but my knowledge on where to start is scant. I do not believe, per say, and yes I know that this essentially disqualifies me from being a Muslim; but I don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater.

I heard about some Islamic thinker, might have even read it here on NSG whilst lurking, that was a scholar who routinely and openly dissed the religious authorities - was he also a non-believer? or did he think they were unjust? If anyone knows of who I am talking about I would greatly appreciate any information.

I was also wondering whether there were any cultural (hazy word I know) interpretations of Islam, rather than purely theistic ones.

[Al-Ismailiyya]

Hello, I was wondering whether anyone familiar with Islamic, or Arabic, history would recommend a book, or another resource, to me.

In retrospect this sounds like a pretty disrespectful request: asking on an Islamic thread, where many posters are practicing Muslims, to name and recommend the works of their biggest heretics is weird. But please take no offense - I genuinely want to learn - but my knowledge on where to start is scant. I do not believe, per say, and yes I know that this essentially disqualifies me from being a Muslim; but I don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater.

I heard about some Islamic thinker, might have even read it here on NSG whilst lurking, that was a scholar who routinely and openly dissed the religious authorities - was he also a non-believer? or did he think they were unjust? If anyone knows of who I am talking about I would greatly appreciate any information.

I was also wondering whether there were any cultural (hazy word I know) interpretations of Islam, rather than purely theistic ones.

I don't think your question sounded disrespectful Anyhow, yes. Many of Islam's greatest scholars ran afoul of the authorities of their time. Just as in Europe with ones like Copernicus and Galileo.

One example, Ibn Rushd, known as Averroes the Commentator in the West, was a renowned scholar of Aristotelian philosophy who for a time enjoyed the favor of the Almohad Caliph Abu Yaqub Yusuf but when Abu Yaqub died, his successor tried Ibn Rushd and ordered his works burned and banished him.

As to whether he was a non-believer, it is not my place to say as an apostate. However, even when I was a Muslim, I held that belief that it was no one's place to call anyone else a non-believer as that right is reserved to God alone.

As for good books on the history of Islam, No God but God by Reza Aslan is a good one about the history of Islam and early Islam specifically. Servants of Allah by Sylviane A. Diouf is a good one on the history of Islam in the US. And the Encyclopaedia of Islam published by Brill(?) is a decent overall source on Islam. Of course, I also recommend reading the Quran and ahadith to gain knowledge on the faith itself. It's useful knowledge even for a non-believer.

I hope this was helpful.

[Seraven]

What's this thread's opinion of Erdogan?

Well, he's great, he's competent, he tries to leading a better Islamic Turkey. But he also oppressed well...journalists, Kurdish. I find he is a mixed-reception political figure.

The Kafir, methinks. As far as I know, they pay more in Jizya form.

Well there ya go, it is a means of oppression that encourages conversion.

It really is...not.

The Kafir, methinks. As far as I know, they pay more in Jizya form.

False.

I'm pretty sure I remember it is like that.

[Seraven]

Erdoğan Reis!
I love him. Bringing turkey back to being Turkish.

Tbh Turkey was already pretty Turk before Erdogan. Turkish nationalism is a core element of the Atatürk's Republican principles.

If at all Erdogan gave minorities somewhat more rights, ie Kurdish television and radio times.

Ataturk is more secular and pro-West in his interpretations of Turkey's governance policy.

I was also wondering whether there were any cultural (hazy word I know) interpretations of Islam, rather than purely theistic ones.

Well, there are nominal Muslims (they are Muslims, but they do not practice Islamic ways, and rather more like practicing on the culture of Islam like Ramadan).

[Aulus Maximus]

Hello, I was wondering whether anyone familiar with Islamic, or Arabic, history would recommend a book, or another resource, to me.

In retrospect this sounds like a pretty disrespectful request: asking on an Islamic thread, where many posters are practicing Muslims, to name and recommend the works of their biggest heretics is weird. But please take no offense - I genuinely want to learn - but my knowledge on where to start is scant. I do not believe, per say, and yes I know that this essentially disqualifies me from being a Muslim; but I don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater.

I heard about some Islamic thinker, might have even read it here on NSG whilst lurking, that was a scholar who routinely and openly dissed the religious authorities - was he also a non-believer? or did he think they were unjust? If anyone knows of who I am talking about I would greatly appreciate any information.

I was also wondering whether there were any cultural (hazy word I know) interpretations of Islam, rather than purely theistic ones.

I don't think your question sounded disrespectful Anyhow, yes. Many of Islam's greatest scholars ran afoul of the authorities of their time. Just as in Europe with ones like Copernicus and Galileo.

One example, Ibn Rushd, known as Averroes the Commentator in the West, was a renowned scholar of Aristotelian philosophy who for a time enjoyed the favor of the Almohad Caliph Abu Yaqub Yusuf but when Abu Yaqub died, his successor tried Ibn Rushd and ordered his works burned and banished him.

As to whether he was a non-believer, it is not my place to say as an apostate. However, even when I was a Muslim, I held that belief that it was no one's place to call anyone else a non-believer as that right is reserved to God alone.

As for good books on the history of Islam, No God but God by Reza Aslan is a good one about the history of Islam and early Islam specifically. Servants of Allah by Sylviane A. Diouf is a good one on the history of Islam in the US. And the Encyclopaedia of Islam published by Brill(?) is a decent overall source on Islam. Of course, I also recommend reading the Quran and ahadith to gain knowledge on the faith itself. It's useful knowledge even for a non-believer.

I hope this was helpful.

This, Ibn Arabi is also interesting with his notion of wajjad al wujud, aka default Sufi metaphysics (not all Sufis adhere to it but hey).

And not everyone here is Muslim, having knowledge of said religion or its aspects =/= believing in said religion.

Tbh Turkey was already pretty Turk before Erdogan. Turkish nationalism is a core element of the Atatürk's Republican principles.

If at all Erdogan gave minorities somewhat more rights, ie Kurdish television and radio times.

Ataturk is more secular and pro-West in his interpretations of Turkey's governance policy.

I don't deny that. I'm just saying that the issue of Turk nationalism was more prevelant under CHP rule. Kurds are being treated better now under Erdogan.

The AKP did a lot of good things for Turkey, but I don't support Erdogan to whatever he is doing now.

[The Alma Mater]

I don't deny that. I'm just saying that the issue of Turk nationalism was more prevelant under CHP rule. Kurds are being treated better now under Erdogan.

So the reports of ethnic cleansing are untrue ?

[Asmundia]

I don't deny that. I'm just saying that the issue of Turk nationalism was more prevelant under CHP rule. Kurds are being treated better now under Erdogan.

So the reports of ethnic cleansing are untrue ?

They aren't false, per se, they're not as extreme as pre Turkey Erdogan. At least, by some accounts. Personally I don't like the guy. Too much of an asshole, and too much of an, excuse me for stating this in ths fucking IDT, Islamist.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

السلام وعليكم

Does anyone here know a good halal scanner which can scan all products? Because i am trying to scan Dutch food products but my halal scanner says they can't find the product

Why do you even need to have Halaal food? What makes it better or safer?

[Mujahidah]

السلام وعليكم

Does anyone here know a good halal scanner which can scan all products? Because i am trying to scan Dutch food products but my halal scanner says they can't find the product

Why do you even need to have Halaal food? What makes it better or safer?

Because Larin and myself are Muslims and Halal food is compliant with our religious dietary laws. Its like asking a Jew "Why do you need to keep Kosher anyway?"

[Asmundia]

السلام وعليكم

Does anyone here know a good halal scanner which can scan all products? Because i am trying to scan Dutch food products but my halal scanner says they can't find the product

Why do you even need to have Halaal food? What makes it better or safer?

They're not 'Safer', or 'Better'. They're halaal. That means that Muslims can eat them.

[Asmundia]

السلام وعليكم

Does anyone here know a good halal scanner which can scan all products? Because i am trying to scan Dutch food products but my halal scanner says they can't find the product

I'm pretty sure most products mention what sort of foodstuff they're made of. Not like there are that many Haraam foodstuff around. Most people don't make foodstuff from human flesh/blood/etc, and they generally mention if the meat is pork or not.

EDIT: That said, I doubt people mention if the animal was killed with Zibh, so I'm not sure if it stands. Follow the rule of doubt. Generally speaking, if you're not sure it's probably not Haraam.

[The Alma Mater]

السلام وعليكم

Does anyone here know a good halal scanner which can scan all products? Because i am trying to scan Dutch food products but my halal scanner says they can't find the product

I am afraid the chances of finding "true" halal meat that is affordable in the Netherlands in supermarkets is nonexistant. Almost all meat in there is from intensive animal farming and as such does not meet the "the animal needs to have had a good life" requirement of halal meat.

The meat that does meet that requirement is sponsored by the government on the condition it is not slaughtered unsedated -and therefor is never slaughtered according to the Islamic rites.

So.. buy it from a butcher you trust. Or go vegan

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Why do you even need to have Halaal food? What makes it better or safer?

Because Larin and myself are Muslims and Halal food is compliant with our religious dietary laws. Its like asking a Jew "Why do you need to keep Kosher anyway?"

x said so is never a good justification for anything.