Elections, Hacking, Russia, And Trump: This Is Serious

[Hittanryan]

Are you sure it isn't that Trump is a con artist and a demagogue with no coherent policy plan?

I was only talking about criticisms with a basis in reality, I guess you never heard of his ethics reform plan?

His word and vague plans are worthless. How's draining the swamp going? Mexico going to pay for the wall, huh? What happened to the tariff on Carrier's imports?

And ethics reform? Congressional Republicans want to abolish the independent Office of Congressional Ethics and become self-policing.

[Liriena]

WikiLeaks opposes leaking of CIA report

That's suspiciously hypocritical.

Why did the CIA go to NBC before DJT?

Who gives a single solitary cuss?

Also, they went to the Washington Post first. The fact that you went straight for NBC tells me that your only source on the matter were probably Trump's ignorant tweets.

[Salandriagado]

WikiLeaks opposes leaking of CIA report

That's suspiciously hypocritical.

Why did the CIA go to NBC before DJT?

Because Trump has been refusing intelligence briefings. At a (fairly confident) guess: the briefing where he would have been told didn't happen because he's a fucking moron and refuses intelligence briefings, and the public release happened on schedule.

[Cannot think of a name]

You not keeping up with the rest of the class isn't really a short coming on my part.

Your use of the word class really highlights your illusory superiority.

To this day no one has demonstrated to me anything in her thirty some odd year political career where this played out as they wanted those lines interpreted, where she said one thing publicly but did something entirely different in practice instead of her acknowledging the nuance of diplomacy and how you approach things depending on who you are talking to as the realities of getting something done.

Maybe one day. Maybe one day.

How could you prove the fact that she hasn't acted on public policies?

The same way that you track any politicians record. I mean, you know you're on the internet, right? Voting records for senators are public as are most of their speeches?

Her failure to act and keep her campaign promises can be easily brushed off as the work of her opponents preventing her.

Being part of a democratic republic does have that sticky issue of you don't always get your way, that's true. But again, voting records are public, as are any bills that she introduced, sponsored, or co-authored. The argument isn't that she didn't succeed, but in fact had a different agenda, right? I mean...the context of that one line is in a larger discussion about the passage of the 13th amendment after having seen Lincon where she specifically talked about the importance of different pitches in order to move something through the halls of government, but lets wander down this dead end some more anyway. All we need is a stated public policy and then a policy that is the opposite that she voted for, sponsored, co-wrote...whatever. All things public record. Hop to. I mean, you're not. There will be some pointless bravado, some asides, you'll restate your premise like it's a rebuttal. It'll be a fun little soul sucking dance.

All you're doing is advocating for politicians to continue this policy of making unkeepable promises and applauding their deception as diplomatic prowess and nuance.

Nope.

Saying one thing to the general populace with the intention of doing something else is lying,

And in no way what she actually said.

no matter what pleasent words she uses to frame it.

No matter how desperately you try and frame it as such.

[The Black Forrest]

Are you sure it isn't that Trump is a con artist and a demagogue with no coherent policy plan?

I was only talking about criticisms with a basis in reality, I guess you never heard of his ethics reform plan?

Ethics reform? Sorry his cabinet choices show he is not serious at all.

[The Black Forrest]

WikiLeaks opposes leaking of CIA report

That's suspiciously hypocritical.

"The Obama admin/CIA is illegally funneling TOP SECRET//COMINT information..."

I am so confused.

[Geilinor]

WikiLeaks opposes leaking of CIA report

That's suspiciously hypocritical.

"The Obama admin/CIA is illegally funneling TOP SECRET//COMINT information..."

I am so confused.

Assange doesn't get the point. The government can choose to give up classified information. He can't steal it.

[Grave_n_idle]

If it was so fucking obvious that I'm incorrect, and what I'm saying has no basis, because it's just that blatantly obvious, then why do people agree with me?

Anyone who has even a highschool level of Chemistry education knows that Fluoride isn't being added to the water supply as a mind-control agent (even if simply because sodium hexafluorosilicate can't cause mindcontrol effects) - and yet I had that exact discussion with someone about a week ago.

'People' will 'agree' with the stupidest shit. It's not a metric of how good an argument is.

[Hittanryan]

I had to loop back around to this because it was so profoundly stupid I kind of skipped over it.

Holy fucking shit...'people agree with you' is your...I mean, you're using logic that PT Barnum explained over a hundred years ago? Jesus fuck...that's your A game? Dude.

Not even close. That's some grade a random ass shit right there.

If it was so fucking obvious that I'm incorrect, and what I'm saying has no basis, because it's just that blatantly obvious, then why do people agree with me? Why was this news a part of the snowball that buried Hillary Clinto and lead to Donald Trump's election? There's a very obvious reason why what she said bothers people, I don't have to please you by giving what you petulantly demand.

[The Conez Imperium]

Where? Where are these hacked emails that influenced the election from? I subscribe to the idea that Assange isn't lying, and not a single other site has released emails from Hillary. So if I'm correct then they're making a false claim about Russia doing the hacking. Sure, maybe they influenced the election with trolls, but Assange stands by the fact Russia didn't give him the emails. He has a better record than the CIA or FBI, he gains nothing by lying for Russia, he has never had any affiliation with them until he started releasing Clinton's emails.

Personally I don't know where these leaked emails are but my opinion is based off the NSA/CIA/FBI's own opinion. Read the report. https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/ICA_2017_01.pdf. I think you should trust the American intelligence community since they are experts at removing governments...

We assess Russian intelligence services collected against the US primary campaigns, think tanks, and lobbying groups they viewed as likely to shape future US policies. In July 2015, Russian intelligence gained access to Democratic National Committee (DNC) networks and maintained that access until at least June 2016.

The General Staff Main Intelligence Directorate (GRU)probably began cyber operations aimed at the US election by March 2016. We assess that the GRU operations resulted in the compromise of the personal e-mail accounts of Democratic Party officials and political figures. By May, the GRU had exfiltrated large volumes of data from the DNC. Public Disclosures of Russian-Collected Data.We assess with high confidence that the GRU used the Guccifer 2.0 persona, DCLeaks.com, and WikiLeaksto release US victim data obtained in This report is a declassified version of a highly classified assessment; its conclusions are identical to those in the highly classified assessment but this version does not include the full supporting information on key elements of the influence campaign.3cyber operations publicly and in exclusives to media outlets.

Guccifer 2.0, who claimed to be an independent Romanian hacker, made multiple contradictory statements and false claims about his likely Russian identity throughout the election. Press reporting suggests more than
one person claiming to be Guccifer 2.0 interacted with journalists.

Content that we assess was taken from e-mail accounts targeted by the GRU in March 2016 appeared on DCLeaks.com starting in June. We assess with high confidence that the GRU relayed material it acquired from the DNC and senior Democratic officials to WikiLeaks. Moscow most likely chose WikiLeaks because of its self-proclaimed reputation for authenticity.Disclosures through WikiLeaks did not contain any evident forgeries. In early September, Putinsaid publicly it was important the DNC data was exposed to WikiLeaks, calling the search for the source of the leaks a distractionand denying Russian “state-level” involvement.
The Kremlin’s principal international propaganda outlet RT (formerly Russia Today) has actively collaborated with WikiLeaks and RT’s editor-in-chief visited WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange at the Ecuadorian Embassy in London in August 2013, where they discussed renewing his broadcast contract with RT, according to Russian and Western media. Russian media subsequently announced that RT had become"the only Russian media company" to partner with WikiLeaks and had received access to "new leaks of secret information."RT routinely gives Assange sympathetic coverage and provides him a platform to denounce the
United States.

[Lady Scylla]

So it seems Paul Ryan is hiding in his office from the army of people outside that wanted to deliver planned parenthood petitions.

[Opfornia]

snip

Yeah, I am just going to restate what I had previously, because I already explained why it would be too difficult to prove when a politician isn't actively reaching toward their campaign promise. She herself, in paid speeches to wealthy dinners, already revealed that she uses a private/public policies, that's literally the proof I need to show.

Now you, in your incredibly insulated liberal mind set, may not see it as lying when the politicians you like are doing it, but telling the general populace one thing while privately going for another, is a clear cut example of lying. Keep saying no though, it will make you right.

[Opfornia]

If it was so fucking obvious that I'm incorrect, and what I'm saying has no basis, because it's just that blatantly obvious, then why do people agree with me?

Anyone who has even a highschool level of Chemistry education knows that Fluoride isn't being added to the water supply as a mind-control agent (even if simply because sodium hexafluorosilicate can't cause mindcontrol effects) - and yet I had that exact discussion with someone about a week ago.

'People' will 'agree' with the stupidest shit. It's not a metric of how good an argument is.

I'm mocking how it was so fucking obvious that I could just show factual evidence to prove my point. I already rough out the facts, I showed what she said in her email, arguing semantics with someone who you know will never agree with you is ridiculous. I don't have to explain why I think what she did was wrong, it is entirely obvious why others feel like me.

[Opfornia]

Where? Where are these hacked emails that influenced the election from? I subscribe to the idea that Assange isn't lying, and not a single other site has released emails from Hillary. So if I'm correct then they're making a false claim about Russia doing the hacking. Sure, maybe they influenced the election with trolls, but Assange stands by the fact Russia didn't give him the emails. He has a better record than the CIA or FBI, he gains nothing by lying for Russia, he has never had any affiliation with them until he started releasing Clinton's emails.

Personally I don't know where these leaked emails are but my opinion is based off the NSA/CIA/FBI's own opinion. Read the report. https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/ICA_2017_01.pdf. I think you should trust the American intelligence community since they are experts at removing governments...

The CIA's report hangs off the basis that Assange was given the emails by Russian state actors, Julian denies the Russians had any involvement at all. Intelligence agencies all have political agendas, he NSA/CIA/FBI have all been political tools before and have lied to the American public. Julian has never had to lie about a source ever before, and his credibility has never been called into question until he involved himself in the 2016 election. This man is the whistle blower god, you can't trust the agencies to tell you themselves when they were lying, Bush found that out in Iraq.

[Lady Scylla]

snip

Yeah, I am just going to restate what I had previously, because I already explained why it would be too difficult to prove when a politician isn't actively reaching toward their campaign promise. She herself, in paid speeches to wealthy dinners, already revealed that she uses a private/public policies, that's literally the proof I need to show.

Now you, in your incredibly insulated liberal mind set, may not see it as lying when the politicians you like are doing it, but telling the general populace one thing while privately going for another, is a clear cut example of lying. Keep saying no though, it will make you right.

Hardly lying, really. Everyone has public/private policies and positions. That's not all that uncommon. Also, I'm a fan of horse meat, so if you'd kindly hop off real quick, I'd like to butcher it for some food.

[Lady Scylla]

Anyone who has even a highschool level of Chemistry education knows that Fluoride isn't being added to the water supply as a mind-control agent (even if simply because sodium hexafluorosilicate can't cause mindcontrol effects) - and yet I had that exact discussion with someone about a week ago.

'People' will 'agree' with the stupidest shit. It's not a metric of how good an argument is.

I'm mocking how it was so fucking obvious that I could just show factual evidence to prove my point. I already rough out the facts, I showed what she said in her email, arguing semantics with someone who you know will never agree with you is ridiculous. I don't have to explain why I think what she did was wrong, it is entirely obvious why others feel like me.

Actually you do. It's considered a common courtesy and general ethics when debating to back your opinions up, if you can't, then we're left to see them as nothing more than anecdotes with little value to the discussion. If you've a problem with that, you're welcome to leave. And if you do, I suggest taking the snide arrogance with you.

[Lady Scylla]

National Intelligence has declassified a report on the Russian hacking allegations

From NY Times

[Lady Scylla]

After a FOIA request was lodged on the Ethic Commission, information released reveals the OCE has had difficulty gaining access to Trump transition team.

[Salandriagado]

snip

Yeah, I am just going to restate what I had previously, because I already explained why it would be too difficult to prove when a politician isn't actively reaching toward their campaign promise. She herself, in paid speeches to wealthy dinners, already revealed that she uses a private/public policies, that's literally the proof I need to show.

Now you, in your incredibly insulated liberal mind set, may not see it as lying when the politicians you like are doing it, but telling the general populace one thing while privately going for another, is a clear cut example of lying. Keep saying no though, it will make you right.

Her, and literally every other person who has ever lived, me and you very much included.

[Cannot think of a name]

snip

Yeah, I am just going to restate what I had previously, because I already explained why it would be too difficult to prove when a politician isn't actively reaching toward their campaign promise. She herself, in paid speeches to wealthy dinners, already revealed that she uses a private/public policies, that's literally the proof I need to show.

Now you, in your incredibly insulated liberal mind set, may not see it as lying when the politicians you like are doing it, but telling the general populace one thing while privately going for another, is a clear cut example of lying. Keep saying no though, it will make you right.

I always appreciate the "LALALALAICAN'THEARYOU" approach. Nothing says "I'm full of shit" faster.

[Opfornia]

It's a good thing Hillary supporters are perfectly fine with being lied to, it probably happens a lot to them.

[PaNTuXIa]

It's a good thing Hillary supporters are perfectly fine with being lied to, it probably happens a lot to them.

Clinton supporters BTFO

[Valrifell]

It's a good thing Trump supporters are perfectly fine with being lied to, it probably happens a lot to them.

FTFY.

[The Rich Port]

It's a good thing Hillary supporters are perfectly fine with being lied to, it probably happens a lot to them.

I voted Bernie Sanders.

Pot calling the kettle "biased".

[PaNTuXIa]

It's a good thing Hillary supporters are perfectly fine with being lied to, it probably happens a lot to them.

I voted Bernie Sanders.

Oh man, you must be such a rebel.