Transgender Discussion Thread III: Vote in our poll!

[The Serbian Empire]

Hoping someone who's been on HRT longer than me can offer some advice. I've got this sort of intermittent muscular ache in my ribs, I'd almost think I'd pulled an intracostal muscle or something - except it's located directly under my right breast, so maybe it's a trans thing? I've heard of course that growing breasts can be sore and achy but this is not exactly the sensation I was expecting, so I'm not sure.

That sounds like breast growth deep inside or muscle atrophy from estrogen. Either way, it's a sign of feminization.

[Aphryss]

Hoping someone who's been on HRT longer than me can offer some advice. I've got this sort of intermittent muscular ache in my ribs, I'd almost think I'd pulled an intracostal muscle or something - except it's located directly under my right breast, so maybe it's a trans thing? I've heard of course that growing breasts can be sore and achy but this is not exactly the sensation I was expecting, so I'm not sure.

That sounds like breast growth deep inside or muscle atrophy from estrogen. Either way, it's a sign of feminization.

Yeah, I asked a trans friend of mine on Twitter and she said the same thing. It was just unexpected because I was expecting "sore like an overworked muscle" not "sore like maybe I injured something". Anyway, yay, things are happening!

[Khalisako]

It is apparently a normal thing with femalization. My upper body strength plummeted after the estrogen started morphing things. I found, durring breast grwoth, that the boob area was tender and kinda ached to the touch. That went away tho. They also drained clear liquid from the nipple for a month or whatever.

Think of it as going thorugh second puberty.

[The Serbian Empire]

It is apparently a normal thing with femalization. My upper body strength plummeted after the estrogen started morphing things. I found, durring breast grwoth, that the boob area was tender and kinda ached to the touch. That went away tho. They also drained clear liquid from the nipple for a month or whatever.

Think of it as going thorugh second puberty.

This is what most people have described HRT as. The second puberty.

[Vassenor]

Well, tucking, taping and padding made me feel a whole lot better after I hit a dysphoria spike. Plus I managed to get tucked first time without having to fight it this time, so I must be getting better at it.

[Hetalia Dakota 2 II]

Well, tucking, taping and padding made me feel a whole lot better after I hit a dysphoria spike. Plus I managed to get tucked first time without having to fight it this time, so I must be getting better at it.

I've never bothered with ticking seems like a LOT of work, I'm glad you were able to figure it out and are feeling better

[Vassenor]

Well, tucking, taping and padding made me feel a whole lot better after I hit a dysphoria spike. Plus I managed to get tucked first time without having to fight it this time, so I must be getting better at it.

I've never bothered with ticking seems like a LOT of work, I'm glad you were able to figure it out and are feeling better

I mean for some of the stuff I want to cosplay it's kind of essential. Like when I'm wearing this and thus don't have a skirt to hide stuff under.

Or when I'm wearing jeans like I am now.

[Hetalia Dakota 2 II]

I've never bothered with ticking seems like a LOT of work, I'm glad you were able to figure it out and are feeling better

I mean for some of the stuff I want to cosplay it's kind of essential. Like when I'm wearing this and thus don't have a skirt to hide stuff under.

Or when I'm wearing jeans like I am now.

I hear ya, I probably should do it some, seldom have had the need personally

[Torsiedelle]

Feminization from HRT sounds painful, lol.

Although my upper body is shit anyways, no matter how many pushups or how much lifting I do. I guess estrogen would only held with my figure if I did that, if I ever do it.

Hi hi. I've not posted here in a bit. I'm a lurker, lol.

[The Rich Port]

Feminization from HRT sounds painful, lol.

Although my upper body is shit anyways, no matter how many pushups or how much lifting I do. I guess estrogen would only held with my figure if I did that, if I ever do it.

Hi hi. I've not posted here in a bit. I'm a lurker, lol.

It is good that you have posted.

Although, yeah... Isn't that, technically, what it is?

Second puberty, I mean.

[The Serbian Empire]

Feminization from HRT sounds painful, lol.

Although my upper body is shit anyways, no matter how many pushups or how much lifting I do. I guess estrogen would only held with my figure if I did that, if I ever do it.

Hi hi. I've not posted here in a bit. I'm a lurker, lol.

Breast growth and muscle break down. At the same time, I've heard that sometimes a trans man's nipple will invert and become painful on T.

[Khalisako]

Feminization from HRT sounds painful, lol.

Although my upper body is shit anyways, no matter how many pushups or how much lifting I do. I guess estrogen would only held with my figure if I did that, if I ever do it.

Hi hi. I've not posted here in a bit. I'm a lurker, lol.

Not sue how worknig out and exercise go on mtf HRT. If I recall correctly your body gets more toned than overtly swole. Not sure. The whole experience isn't unpleasantly painful tho... Until you get to the bit about removing unwanted hair and such. Tho, my ex-electrolisis provider said that if you refrain from eating sweets for a while before the procedure, that the pain will be lesser.

The mental bit of it is a bit tricky I find. I told my "friends" about my transition and they just thought I'd gone completely mad and was raving mad nonesense. Some authority figures pinned it as schizophrenia. Eventually it gets to a point where you simply cannot hide that you're changing sexes. I've found that it even gets to a point where your past relationships don't matter if they're the ones you've had at a distance for a while, because I've been around people I grew up with that don't even recognize me. They see somebody else. A stranger. I've only bothered to reconnect with one of my childhood friends. She knew I would end up like this fro mthe very beginning, so we're fine.

It's like character assassination, I guess. I found it to be like a total reset, another starting point to develop a truer, more real me. Because when I was a male, my life was always dominated by meth and abusive authority figures that happered the development of a self, I guess. It was the drugs speaking all the years. To the point that I was a skinny, vacant zombie. I was a totally different person when I could escape them for short amounts of time. The drugs were like a mask, so when it was gone I was left with a very undeveloped mess that the Transsexual thing helped make some sense out of.

I even went to the extent of burning my childhood photos. Erase everything. My mother said, "You're killing my baby! Stop it!"

So she keeps them hidden at all times, even tho the person in them is effectively dead and will never come back, really.

The transsexual thing definitely can give one some special opportunities in life. I've even found that with my new legal identity I cannot use pay pal and such, because to them, I don't exist.

[Yuteland]

Hello everyone.
Before you read this I just want to make sure I'm not trying to anger anyone nor be offensive in any way. The question I'm asking here is serious and I'm doing it out of genuine lack of understanding. I too have my own gender identity problems. Here it goes, then...
Isn't it a form of sexism to even talk about gender identity? If you are biologically female or male, claiming you identify yourself as the opposite of your biological sex isn't the same as stating gender roles do exist? Because if you do have a female body but you do say you're male, you're basically stating that something else besides the body defines what a male and a female are.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's perfectly acceptable for a person to not feel well in the body they have and luckily we have the means to allow one to change it's biological sex but saying "I'm a woman trapped in a man's body" isn't practically the same as saying "I'm a black man trapped in a white man's body"?
Most transgender people are also the ones who strive for gender equality and this just seems wrong to me.
Again, I'm sorry if I offended you in any way. If I did, I certainly didn't mean to. I'm really just trying to understand if I'm missing something here.

[Philjia]

Hello everyone.
Before you read this I just want to make sure I'm not trying to anger anyone nor be offensive in any way. The question I'm asking here is serious and I'm doing it out of genuine lack of understanding. I too have my own gender identity problems. Here it goes, then...
Isn't it a form of sexism to even talk about gender identity? If you are biologically female or male, claiming you identify yourself as the opposite of your biological sex isn't the same as stating gender roles do exist? Because if you do have a female body but you do say you're male, you're basically stating that something else besides the body defines what a male and a female are.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's perfectly acceptable for a person to not feel well in the body they have and luckily we have the means to allow one to change it's biological sex but saying "I'm a woman trapped in a man's body" isn't practically the same as saying "I'm a black man trapped in a white man's body"?
Most transgender people are also the ones who strive for gender equality and this just seems wrong to me.
Again, I'm sorry if I offended you in any way. If I did, I certainly didn't mean to. I'm really just trying to understand if I'm missing something here.

A significant proportion of trans people experience dysphoria; they feel that their bodies are wrong, and are often repulsed by them.

[Yuteland]

A significant proportion of trans people experience dysphoria; they feel that their bodies are wrong, and are often repulsed by them.

I understand very well what it is to experience gender dysphoria. That doesn't answer my question.
It's perfectly valid for a person to feel dissatisfaction and/or discomfort in one's biological body but the concept of non-biological gender is humanly constructed by traditional stereotypes.

[Philjia]

A significant proportion of trans people experience dysphoria; they feel that their bodies are wrong, and are often repulsed by them.

I understand very well what it is to experience gender dysphoria. That doesn't answer my question.
It's perfectly valid for a person to feel dissatisfaction and/or discomfort in one's biological body but the concept of non-biological gender is humanly constructed by traditional stereotypes.

We are the sum of both our genes and our experience. While upbringing clearly has a strong influence on us, the way we are put together as an organism will influence us. The point is not that anyone can act in anyway; it is that anyone may act in any way.

[The Serbian Empire]

Feminization from HRT sounds painful, lol.

Although my upper body is shit anyways, no matter how many pushups or how much lifting I do. I guess estrogen would only held with my figure if I did that, if I ever do it.

Hi hi. I've not posted here in a bit. I'm a lurker, lol.

Not sue how worknig out and exercise go on mtf HRT. If I recall correctly your body gets more toned than overtly swole. Not sure. The whole experience isn't unpleasantly painful tho... Until you get to the bit about removing unwanted hair and such. Tho, my ex-electrolisis provider said that if you refrain from eating sweets for a while before the procedure, that the pain will be lesser.

The mental bit of it is a bit tricky I find. I told my "friends" about my transition and they just thought I'd gone completely mad and was raving mad nonesense. Some authority figures pinned it as schizophrenia. Eventually it gets to a point where you simply cannot hide that you're changing sexes. I've found that it even gets to a point where your past relationships don't matter if they're the ones you've had at a distance for a while, because I've been around people I grew up with that don't even recognize me. They see somebody else. A stranger. I've only bothered to reconnect with one of my childhood friends. She knew I would end up like this fro mthe very beginning, so we're fine.

It's like character assassination, I guess. I found it to be like a total reset, another starting point to develop a truer, more real me. Because when I was a male, my life was always dominated by meth and abusive authority figures that happered the development of a self, I guess. It was the drugs speaking all the years. To the point that I was a skinny, vacant zombie. I was a totally different person when I could escape them for short amounts of time. The drugs were like a mask, so when it was gone I was left with a very undeveloped mess that the Transsexual thing helped make some sense out of.

I even went to the extent of burning my childhood photos. Erase everything. My mother said, "You're killing my baby! Stop it!"

So she keeps them hidden at all times, even tho the person in them is effectively dead and will never come back, really.

The transsexual thing definitely can give one some special opportunities in life. I've even found that with my new legal identity I cannot use pay pal and such, because to them, I don't exist.

It's like one starts a new life.

[Yuteland]

We are the sum of both our genes and our experience. While upbringing clearly has a strong influence on us, the way we are put together as an organism will influence us. The point is not that anyone can act in anyway; it is that anyone may act in any way.

I'm sorry. I do not follow. Can you elaborate, please?

[Vassenor]

So yeah, it looks like my plans to have a chance at doing my first attempt at long term presentation away from anyone who knows me got torpedoed.

[Nature-Spirits]

Hello everyone.
Before you read this I just want to make sure I'm not trying to anger anyone nor be offensive in any way. The question I'm asking here is serious and I'm doing it out of genuine lack of understanding. I too have my own gender identity problems. Here it goes, then...
Isn't it a form of sexism to even talk about gender identity? If you are biologically female or male, claiming you identify yourself as the opposite of your biological sex isn't the same as stating gender roles do exist? Because if you do have a female body but you do say you're male, you're basically stating that something else besides the body defines what a male and a female are.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's perfectly acceptable for a person to not feel well in the body they have and luckily we have the means to allow one to change it's biological sex but saying "I'm a woman trapped in a man's body" isn't practically the same as saying "I'm a black man trapped in a white man's body"?
Most transgender people are also the ones who strive for gender equality and this just seems wrong to me.
Again, I'm sorry if I offended you in any way. If I did, I certainly didn't mean to. I'm really just trying to understand if I'm missing something here.

*deep breath*

This is rhetoric that is often espoused up by TERFs: That trans people, in existing, reinforce gender stereotypes. This argument completely ignores the incredible breadth of trans experiences. To pretend that trans women identify as women because they feel more at ease in a feminine presentation, fulfilling the female gender role, ignores the fact that many trans women are not traditionally feminine. (The same goes for trans men and masculinity, and nonbinary people and androgyny/rejection of gender roles.)

And comparing gender to race is entirely lacking in nuance. Gender is partially based in culture, true, but it is also (and, I would say, moreso) based in self-conception. It is not inherited. Race, on the other hand, is an inherited trait that is also based in culture, but less so in self-conception. (My understanding of race, I will state upfront, is less nuanced than my understanding of gender; I am a white person in a country where white people make up the majority. Additionally, I have not read into race theory [I'm unsure of the proper nomenclature] nearly as much as I have into gender theory.)

In a nutshell: Fuck Germaine Greer, long live Kate Bornstein.

[Nature-Spirits]

So yeah, it looks like my plans to have a chance at doing my first attempt at long term presentation away from anyone who knows me got torpedoed.

Would you like to elaborate?

[Captain Albert Alexander Hamilton]

Finally got a real binder. Feels kind of weird but it's nice. Can actually look at myself in a mirror with it on.

[Nature-Spirits]

Finally got a real binder. Feels kind of weird but it's nice. Can actually look at myself in a mirror with it on.

Hooray!

[Sotral]

Hello everyone.
Before you read this I just want to make sure I'm not trying to anger anyone nor be offensive in any way. The question I'm asking here is serious and I'm doing it out of genuine lack of understanding. I too have my own gender identity problems. Here it goes, then...
Isn't it a form of sexism to even talk about gender identity? If you are biologically female or male, claiming you identify yourself as the opposite of your biological sex isn't the same as stating gender roles do exist? Because if you do have a female body but you do say you're male, you're basically stating that something else besides the body defines what a male and a female are.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's perfectly acceptable for a person to not feel well in the body they have and luckily we have the means to allow one to change it's biological sex but saying "I'm a woman trapped in a man's body" isn't practically the same as saying "I'm a black man trapped in a white man's body"?
Most transgender people are also the ones who strive for gender equality and this just seems wrong to me.
Again, I'm sorry if I offended you in any way. If I did, I certainly didn't mean to. I'm really just trying to understand if I'm missing something here.

It's pretty simple for me.

Being referred to as my assigned gender or thinking about myself as that gender hurts me. Conversely, being referred to in ungendered way (such as by using they/them, or calling me person rather than man/woman) makes me feel good about myself.

That, and there's an inherent feeling of wrongness if I try to think of myself as a man/woman. Do you have a gender you're sure you're not? Try convincing yourself that's what you are. It might inspire a similar feeling of wrongness in you.

Gender roles and stereotypes don't factor into it. I actually do any number of things associated with my assigned gender, because I enjoy those things and it's silly (to say the least) to demand that I stop because I'm not a man/woman.

[Yuteland]

This is rhetoric that is often espoused up by TERFs: That trans people, in existing, reinforce gender stereotypes.

I would never say that. I don't think it's the existence of trans people that reinforce gender stereotypes, but this conception that gender is something non-biological.
If gender =/= sex, than how come is gender not a conception based on the behaviors which are supposedly acceptable for people based on their sex?

To pretend that trans women identify as women because they feel more at ease in a feminine presentation, fulfilling the female gender role, ignores the fact that many trans women are not traditionally feminine.

Those trans women that are not or don't try to be "traditionally feminine" conform to their own perception of what it is to be feminine. That's also gender rolling.

And comparing gender to race is entirely lacking in nuance.

I just compared them because they're both things you cannot choose, but you can choose to not like the way nature sorted you out (and I find that perfectly acceptable, btw).