Transgender Discussion Thread III: Vote in our poll!

[Vassenor]

And what about people who don't pass, maybe won't ever pass, and don't feel comfortable in male bathrooms? Is the fact some cis women might be uncomfortable because a woman with male features enters a public bathroom more important than the health of the latter (I remember, but can't cite off the top of my head, a study stating about 8% of trans women have kidney problems because of this)?

At least one woman I know of, a cis butch lesbian, was harassed by other women in a public bathroom because she looked out of place.

Why are we even still bothering with segregated bathrooms when the equipment needed to pee and poo is the same for everyone?

What? No it is not. Vagina and a Penis are not the same

You don't pee out of your vagina.

[Anarcha Feminist Gynarchy]

What? No it is not. Vagina and a Penis are not the same

Urethra is the same thing.

Nope. How is it the same? When a man can stand and pee and a woman is forced to sit

[Anarcha Feminist Gynarchy]

What? No it is not. Vagina and a Penis are not the same

You don't pee out of your vagina.

I know, but that area

[Mechanisburg]

And what about people who don't pass, maybe won't ever pass, and don't feel comfortable in male bathrooms? Is the fact some cis women might be uncomfortable because a woman with male features enters a public bathroom more important than the health of the latter (I remember, but can't cite off the top of my head, a study stating about 8% of trans women have kidney problems because of this)?

At least one woman I know of, a cis butch lesbian, was harassed by other women in a public bathroom because she looked out of place.

Why are we even still bothering with segregated bathrooms when the equipment needed to pee and poo is the same for everyone?

What? No it is not. Vagina and a Penis are not the same

I'm pretty sure the porcelain throne vagina-peeps and penis-peeps sacrifice their pee and poo is the same.

[Anarcha Feminist Gynarchy]

What? No it is not. Vagina and a Penis are not the same

I'm pretty sure the porcelain throne vagina-peeps and penis-peeps sacrifice their pee and poo is the same.

Well saying one is supposed to go into the other. No

[Mechanisburg]

I'm pretty sure the porcelain throne vagina-peeps and penis-peeps sacrifice their pee and poo is the same.

Well saying one is supposed to go into the other. No

I don't quite follow.

I'll rephrase: there are no necessary fixtures that differ between male and female bathrooms. One can do the job in both just as well, regardless of one's genital configuration. Proper stalls and a toilet are everything one could need to attend to one's excretory needs.

[Khalisako]

Sorry... that one's not working. v.v Too sheer and too... tight. Plus, that spider man pattern is something I think people'll only asociate with masculinity.

What kinds of normal outfits do you have? I remember one of your picturs of you wearing normal clothes and you looked just fine, really.

Was looking more into how effective the tuck job was than the costume.

Eehhh... I dunno...

Have you found the right type of undergarment, to help you with concealing the nethers better without having to have your legs clamped together like that? Looks uncomfrtable.

[Val Halla]

Was looking more into how effective the tuck job was than the costume.

Eehhh... I dunno...

Have you found the right type of undergarment, to help you with concealing the nethers better without having to have your legs clamped together like that? Looks uncomfrtable.

Tucking is hard :/

[Vassenor]

Was looking more into how effective the tuck job was than the costume.

Eehhh... I dunno...

Have you found the right type of undergarment, to help you with concealing the nethers better without having to have your legs clamped together like that? Looks uncomfrtable.

At the moment it's a mixture of sports tape and an item of shapewear that extends between the legs. Was just stood like that because that just seems to be how I settle in all my costume photos.

[Mechanisburg]

Eehhh... I dunno...

Have you found the right type of undergarment, to help you with concealing the nethers better without having to have your legs clamped together like that? Looks uncomfrtable.

Tucking is hard :/

If it's hard you are not doing it right.

Sorry. Couldn't resist.

[Neutraligon]

Really, what makes being uncomfortable with someone due to race and different from due to sex?

As to your above answer, how would a sign stop someone from raping a person?

Race is a social construct while sex is a biological construct. A sign wont stop someone. But transgender bathrooms encourage it. I think I may have a solution to this problem

Why does it matter if race is a social construct? Why would trans bathrooms encourage it?

[Mechanisburg]

Race is a social construct while sex is a biological construct. A sign wont stop someone. But transgender bathrooms encourage it. I think I may have a solution to this problem

Why does it matter if race is a social construct? Why would trans bathrooms encourage it?

I'd also argue that sex itself is a social construct. In plenty of cases (1%, I think, according to the ISNA) identification is not easy and people mostly fudge it ("looks like a pee-pee to me, let's call him John"). One cannot also point at anything and say "that's male, that's female" - chromosomes are not enough, the SRY gene is not enough (and besides, karyotypes are not usually done), genitals are not enough (5-alpha-reductase, CAIS, various intersex conditions), secondary sexual characteristics are not enough (gynaecomastia and PCOS), fertility is not enough.

What is even sex?

[Val Halla]

Tucking is hard :/

If it's hard you are not doing it right.

Sorry. Couldn't resist.

bad joke, for shame

but yeah I am not good at it

[Captain Albert Alexander Hamilton]

I'm trying so hard to stay positive but I can't. I'm trying to remain hopeful but there isn't any hope left. I'm terrified for the future. I want to say it's going to get better but it's not. Everything is falling apart all at once. I really wanted to have a positive update but all possible optimism has been drained from me.

[Reploid Productions]

Utter lunacy. Nothing you do can do will ever change your chromosomes, which determine one's sex. Saying "I'm a walrus!" doesn't make me a walrus, no matter how much I want to be a walrus.

Go ahead, refute my argument.

Oh no, I'm a transphobe! I see that you have resorted to childish name-calling. Do you know that transphobia actually means fear of movement? Learn Latin, please.

Listen to your friend, lest you make a fool of yourself.

But it's fun to debunk gender theory and watch people try to defend it.

I never said I had finished disproving it.

I wrote debunk, not debunked. Get your tenses correct.

Your first post by itself was tapdancing up to the line, but not crossing it. Your subsequent posts, however, full of snide remarks and an outright confirmation of your trollish intention in posting in such a manner make the pattern clear and send your overall conduct dancing over the line.

*** Walrusvylon, WARNED for trolling/flamebaiting. ***

You can argue why you feel gender and biological sex are one in the same, or that gender is not a social construct, and you can do so without the baity commentary and deliberate riling up of your opponents. This is a debate forum, if your sources are debunked, then the appropriate response isn't to resort to snide baiting of the folks who disagree with you. Please review the site rules at your earliest convenience.

Nah, I don't have the time to waste to teach you everything from middle school onwards, nor you are paying me to do so.

And you should not be responding in kind. You can argue that he is arguing from a position of ignorance or inaccurate information without the cheap digs at his intelligence. One flamebait does not excuse another flamebait. The only reason you're spared the official warning text is that you don't already have a warn record.


~Evil Forum Empress Rep Prod the Ninja Mod
~She who wields the Banhammer; master of the mighty moderation no-dachi Kiritateru Teikoku

[Valanora]

I'm trying so hard to stay positive but I can't. I'm trying to remain hopeful but there isn't any hope left. I'm terrified for the future. I want to say it's going to get better but it's not. Everything is falling apart all at once. I really wanted to have a positive update but all possible optimism has been drained from me.

I understand this feeling well, it's the same one I've been feeling since the election and the results that put into power not only Trump but a unified government of a party who has no intention of ever being supportive of even our mere existence. While there is no one thing I can point out to say to stay hopeful, that is what must be done. For if we meekly withdraw and admit defeat, then we are already defeated and the darkness of this situation goes ever the more dense.

[Khalisako]

Eehhh... I dunno...

Have you found the right type of undergarment, to help you with concealing the nethers better without having to have your legs clamped together like that? Looks uncomfrtable.

Tucking is hard :/

Wouldn't know... too well. I don't think too much about that.

[The Serbian Empire]

Tucking is hard :/

If it's hard you are not doing it right.

Sorry. Couldn't resist.

If it's getting hard and becoming visible, the solution is more tape.

[Mechanisburg]

Nah, I don't have the time to waste to teach you everything from middle school onwards, nor you are paying me to do so.

And you should not be responding in kind. You can argue that he is arguing from a position of ignorance or inaccurate information without the cheap digs at his intelligence. One flamebait does not excuse another flamebait. The only reason you're spared the official warning text is that you don't already have a warn record.

Gotcha. But I would like to point out that it wasn't a dig at his intelligence, but rather at the fact he was being intellectually lazy and arguing from a position of ignorance without bothering to read up on what he was talking about - information is plentiful and accessible, and I expect a person capable of posting on a forum, forming coherent phrases and whatnot to be able to at least read a Wikipedia page.

[Liriena]

Gender and sex aren't the same thing.

Gender: Whether you feel Male or Female or inbetween.

Sex: Whether you have dude or lady parts

Gender is a construct of your mind, while sex is a construct of genetics. You can't change chromosomes, but you can change parts to bring mind in line with body. Saying otherwise is lunacy.

Edit: ninja'd, drat.

Gender is your imagination. It doesn't make it reality. What gender you feel you are is irrelevant.

No. Again: https://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/resources/sexuality-definitions.pdf

If you think you know better than the American Psychological Association, then by all means show us your credentials and your peer reviewed papers.

Mutilating your body doesn't help, either: http://www.sexchangeregret.com/research

Check this out: https://www.acpeds.org/the-college-spea ... s-children

The first website is not a reliable source (and as a retort, here's the World Professional Association for Transgender Health), and the American College of Pediatricians is not an actual professional organization. It's just a right-wing advocacy group posing as a professional organization.

[Liriena]

I think transphobes trying to delegitamise us also need to learn this

Oh no, I'm a transphobe! I see that you have resorted to childish name-calling. Do you know that transphobia actually means fear of movement? Learn Latin, please.

Appeals to etymology are lame. Also, showing prejudice towards trans people can be accurately described as transphobia. It's not an insult, but the appropriate technical term for a certain type of behavior.

[Liriena]

I already said I don't want to get into this argument. I was trying to dissuade the other guy from coming here and stirring shit up, because it's pointless.

But it's fun to debunk gender theory and watch people try to defend it.

Fun for you because it doesn't really affect your quality of life in any way, shape or form. For thousands of other people, however, this is a very important subject with deep and far-reaching consequences in their lives.

So... maybe show a bit of empathy for a change before you try and demean other people's identity with smug ignorance for your own amusement.

[Corrian]

I feel like I should join these topics, too. I like to keep up to date on current affairs in all of these things.

Recently I've been learning about Gavin Grimm, the one trying to bring transgender rights to the Supreme Court. Hope it goes through.

[Liriena]

the people who kept saying "lol trump supports lgbt stfu" will ignore this and keep claiming it

Yes but the thing is women, with a vagina, dont want men in the women's restroom. If you look like a man, act, express like a man. Do you think that he should be allowed into the women's restroom, just because he says that he is a woman?

Yes, because people's freedoms should not be limited on the basis of offending your failing to abide by your personal standards of femininity.

[Corrian]

Don't some countries have nothing but gender neutral bathrooms? And last I checked, there are gender neutral bathrooms in certain places in the US. Well, both genders (if you go off the basic 2). Last I checked, the world hadn't ended because of it.