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Left-Wing Discussion Thread II: Behind 700,000 Bunkers

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Preferred economic system?

Welfare Capitalism
93
23%
Market Socialism
62
15%
Mutualism
10
2%
Syndicalism
40
10%
Communalism
13
3%
State Planning
36
9%
Decentralised Planning
27
7%
Higher Phase Communism
38
9%
Left-wing Market Anarchism
15
4%
Other
67
17%
 
Total votes : 401

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High Qaamat
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Postby High Qaamat » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:46 pm

Tekeristan wrote:What the hell even is the "skeptic" community?

"rational" atheists who call themselves liberals but are right leaning and yell at little girls to tell them feminism sucks

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War Gears
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Founded: Jul 02, 2017
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Postby War Gears » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:47 pm

United Muscovite Nations wrote:
War Gears wrote:
I view it the same way I do golden showers, 2 girls 1 cup, and other such fetishes. If you're into that sort of thing, it's okay. But don't bring me into it.

I find those things immoral because I view them as insulting to the dignity of humanity.


I would like to say so as well. But to be honest it's probably just got to do with an evolutionary aversion to those things stemming from the need for hygiene and trying to justify it in much more pretty wording. That's not a good reason to outlaw it.
Parasparopagraho Jīvānām.

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Tekeristan
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Posts: 5344
Founded: Mar 08, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tekeristan » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:48 pm

United Muscovite Nations wrote:
War Gears wrote:
The same could be said about video games or television. The degree of resources put into those things are wasted a lot more than they are by a small minority.

Really, it's pretty obvious you just find the whole thing disgusting and are just trying really hard, at the expense of logical consistency, to come up with a reason to condemn it.

If someone spends an excessive amount of money on video games and television, that is also sinful.

And theyll pay for it in the end, by their own terms?
Lord knows i had and have addictions.
Exploitative markets dont help much tho.

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High Qaamat
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Founded: Oct 25, 2017
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Postby High Qaamat » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:49 pm

War Gears wrote:
United Muscovite Nations wrote:I find those things immoral because I view them as insulting to the dignity of humanity.


I would like to say so as well. But to be honest it's probably just got to do with an evolutionary aversion to those things stemming from the need for hygiene and trying to justify it in much more pretty wording. That's not a good reason to outlaw it.

Human dignity and preventing people from self harm/depravity isn't a good reason?

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War Gears
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Founded: Jul 02, 2017
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Postby War Gears » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:49 pm

United Muscovite Nations wrote:
War Gears wrote:
The same could be said about video games or television. The degree of resources put into those things are wasted a lot more than they are by a small minority.

Really, it's pretty obvious you just find the whole thing disgusting and are just trying really hard, at the expense of logical consistency, to come up with a reason to condemn it.

If someone spends an excessive amount of money on video games and television, that is also sinful.


It's more likely that people spend more time and money on media than they do building suits.
Parasparopagraho Jīvānām.

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War Gears
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Founded: Jul 02, 2017
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Postby War Gears » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:50 pm

High Qaamat wrote:
War Gears wrote:
I would like to say so as well. But to be honest it's probably just got to do with an evolutionary aversion to those things stemming from the need for hygiene and trying to justify it in much more pretty wording. That's not a good reason to outlaw it.

Human dignity and preventing people from self harm/depravity isn't a good reason?


Human dignity and depravity aren't things that you can quantify by law, without getting into philosophical and religious territory that people in a secular country want to steer clear of.
Parasparopagraho Jīvānām.

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Tekeristan
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Posts: 5344
Founded: Mar 08, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tekeristan » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:51 pm

High Qaamat wrote:
War Gears wrote:
I would like to say so as well. But to be honest it's probably just got to do with an evolutionary aversion to those things stemming from the need for hygiene and trying to justify it in much more pretty wording. That's not a good reason to outlaw it.

Human dignity and preventing people from self harm/depravity isn't a good reason?

Dignity is subjective and different to each person. To me the idea is a bit ballux because how people try to use it as reasoning or justification.
Actually, community can prevent the latter. Ive made some damn good friends who are in the fur community. People like to help each other. Most people are fine.

Trust me, ive seen the bad. People wearing suits and being all huggy isnt that. But everyone judges groups by their worst anyway. In the end it isnt my business.
Last edited by Tekeristan on Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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High Qaamat
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Founded: Oct 25, 2017
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Postby High Qaamat » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:53 pm

War Gears wrote:
High Qaamat wrote:Human dignity and preventing people from self harm/depravity isn't a good reason?


Human dignity and depravity aren't things that you can quantify by law, without getting into philosophical and religious territory that people in a secular country want to steer clear of.

>secular
>borders

You don't know me.

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War Gears
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Founded: Jul 02, 2017
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Postby War Gears » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:56 pm

High Qaamat wrote:
War Gears wrote:
Human dignity and depravity aren't things that you can quantify by law, without getting into philosophical and religious territory that people in a secular country want to steer clear of.

>secular
>borders

You don't know me.


I also don't care about you.
Parasparopagraho Jīvānām.

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Trotskylvania
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Posts: 17217
Founded: Jul 07, 2006
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Postby Trotskylvania » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:57 pm

Liriena wrote:
Bakery Hill wrote:Good idea. And we can have a debate down the local about whether furries are fucked up or not. Good luck comrade. :^)

No need for a debate on furries. It's all fairly simple: all furries are wonderful... except this one.

Ahem
Your Friendly Neighborhood Ultra - The Left Wing of the Impossible
Putting the '-sadism' in Posadism


"The hell of capitalism is the firm, not the fact that the firm has a boss."- Bordiga

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Tekeristan
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Posts: 5344
Founded: Mar 08, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tekeristan » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:58 pm

High Qaamat wrote:
War Gears wrote:
Human dignity and depravity aren't things that you can quantify by law, without getting into philosophical and religious territory that people in a secular country want to steer clear of.

>secular
>borders

You don't know me.

Religious oppression, hmmm...

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Valgora
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Founded: Mar 23, 2016
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Postby Valgora » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:59 pm

Trotskylvania wrote:
Liriena wrote:No need for a debate on furries. It's all fairly simple: all furries are wonderful... except this one.

Ahem


:rofl:
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High Qaamat
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Posts: 73
Founded: Oct 25, 2017
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Postby High Qaamat » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:59 pm

War Gears wrote:
High Qaamat wrote:>secular
>borders

You don't know me.


I also don't care about you.

in the arms of an angel

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Bakery Hill
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Posts: 11973
Founded: Jul 03, 2016
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Postby Bakery Hill » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:01 pm

High Qaamat wrote:
War Gears wrote:
Human dignity and depravity aren't things that you can quantify by law, without getting into philosophical and religious territory that people in a secular country want to steer clear of.

>secular
>borders

You don't know me.

Against secularism and borders? Heavens preserve.
Founder of the Committee for Proletarian Morality - Winner of Best Communist Award 2018 - Godfather of NSG Syndicalism

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War Gears
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Founded: Jul 02, 2017
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Postby War Gears » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:01 pm

Trotskylvania wrote:
Liriena wrote:No need for a debate on furries. It's all fairly simple: all furries are wonderful... except this one.

Ahem


I don't know which is sadder. That someone wrote this, or you spent so much time dissecting it.
Parasparopagraho Jīvānām.

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Trotskylvania
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Posts: 17217
Founded: Jul 07, 2006
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Postby Trotskylvania » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:01 pm

Valgora wrote:
Trotskylvania wrote:Ahem


:rofl:

I've never been one for half-measures
Your Friendly Neighborhood Ultra - The Left Wing of the Impossible
Putting the '-sadism' in Posadism


"The hell of capitalism is the firm, not the fact that the firm has a boss."- Bordiga

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United Muscovite Nations
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Posts: 25657
Founded: Feb 01, 2017
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Postby United Muscovite Nations » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:03 pm

Trotskylvania wrote:
Liriena wrote:No need for a debate on furries. It's all fairly simple: all furries are wonderful... except this one.

Ahem

Without further adieu, I present to you:

Hans “Furry Fetish”, Defender of the Third Reich


Image
Grumpy Grandpa of the LWDT and RWDT
Kantian with panentheist and Christian beliefs. Rawlsian Socialist. Just completed studies in History and International Relations. Asexual with sex-revulsion.
The world is grey, the mountains old, the forges fire is ashen cold. No harp is wrung, no hammer falls, the darkness dwells in Durin's halls...
Formerly United Marxist Nations, Dec 02, 2011- Feb 01, 2017. +33,837 posts
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Trotskylvania
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Founded: Jul 07, 2006
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Postby Trotskylvania » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:04 pm

War Gears wrote:
Trotskylvania wrote:Ahem


I don't know which is sadder. That someone wrote this, or you spent so much time dissecting it.

Evil must be punished
United Muscovite Nations wrote:
Trotskylvania wrote:Ahem

Without further adieu, I present to you:

Hans “Furry Fetish”, Defender of the Third Reich


Image

There was no bottom to the rabbit hole. I'll finish it eventually, but the author pulled the work from Amazon to rework it and excise the erotic elements. I like to think I played a part in that.
Your Friendly Neighborhood Ultra - The Left Wing of the Impossible
Putting the '-sadism' in Posadism


"The hell of capitalism is the firm, not the fact that the firm has a boss."- Bordiga

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Grenartia
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42977
Founded: Feb 14, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Grenartia » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:24 pm

Bakery Hill wrote:
Liriena wrote:The living proof of a theory of mine: by sheer statistic probability, there's probably at least one white supremacist in every decently sized group, no matter how diametrically opposed to that group's very identity it may seem.

The far right can keep furries and anime.

https://www.newstatesman.com/science-te ... -alt-right


Not the fucking anime! You've gone too far!

Liriena wrote:
Bakery Hill wrote:That doesn't conform with all the furries I have been unlucky enough to come across.

*shrug*

Bakery Hill wrote:I would encourage you to stop comrade.

Don't make me choose between Marxism and furries, dude. :(


Not my personal cup of tea, but I harbor no ill will to furries.

United Muscovite Nations wrote:
Liriena wrote:*shrug*


Don't make me choose between Marxism and furries, dude. :(

Whatever the verb form of furry that I'm allowed to say on here is a bourgeois degeneracy. It's excessive and wasteful.


Anything that doesn't involve Orthodox Christianity and heterosexual vanilla sex in the missionary position for the sole purpose of procreation (with the lights off), is bourgeois degeneracy to you. You'd probably even ban handholding.

Bakery Hill wrote:
Liriena wrote:Yes. :P

Then to be quite honest, you are probably not a good socialist. The freedom to be seuxally weird is being placed in a lot of SJ left discourse alongside issues that actually important in social life which is distressing.


No, its not. If anything your position is distressing. You seek to free the people from one set of chains, only to keep them locked up in another.

Tekeristan wrote:I dont care for "degeneracy" cause it aint my business. Leave people be i say, majority of people are fine.


Honestly, the only time I've ever seen anybody unironically condemn "degeneracy" (the definition of which apparently shifts and changes such that it depends on the phase of the moon, the time of day, and the position of a random electron in a random atom in the person's brain), they've either been a fascist or a closet fascist.

War Gears wrote:
Tekeristan wrote:I dont care for "degeneracy" cause it aint my business. Leave people be i say, majority of people are fine.


I view it the same way I do golden showers, 2 girls 1 cup, and other such fetishes. If you're into that sort of thing, it's okay. But don't bring me into it.


Indeed.

United Muscovite Nations wrote:
War Gears wrote:
I view it the same way I do golden showers, 2 girls 1 cup, and other such fetishes. If you're into that sort of thing, it's okay. But don't bring me into it.

I find those things immoral because I view them as insulting to the dignity of humanity.


Considering how much you hate this stuff, I cannot help but to picture you, much like a closeted gay televangelist, being a secret furry who has a fetish for trans girls and watersports.

High Qaamat wrote:
Tekeristan wrote:What the hell even is the "skeptic" community?

"rational" atheists who call themselves liberals but are right leaning and yell at little girls to tell them feminism sucks


Quite.

Trotskylvania wrote:
Liriena wrote:No need for a debate on furries. It's all fairly simple: all furries are wonderful... except this one.

Ahem


Its glorious!
Impeach Humanity, Legalize Death Stars, Life is TheftWis/Gren 2016 Something all cisgender allies should start doing. I wear teal, blue & pink for Swith. ⚧Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed biology and know gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧
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Please use they/them/their when referencing me, as I do NOT appreciate the other pronouns.
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Grenartia
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Grenartia » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:28 pm



To be entirely fair, Hitler was pretty pro-animal rights. So, I mean, I guess, in a twisted sense, they could see certain anthropomorphized animals as equal to Aryans.
Impeach Humanity, Legalize Death Stars, Life is TheftWis/Gren 2016 Something all cisgender allies should start doing. I wear teal, blue & pink for Swith. ⚧Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed biology and know gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧
"Don't take life so serious. It isn't permanent."-Dyakovo
I'm a pansexual Androgyne. Also a Christian.
Please use they/them/their when referencing me, as I do NOT appreciate the other pronouns.
Textbook definition of irony
Quotes of awesomeness

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Tekeristan
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Founded: Mar 08, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tekeristan » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:31 pm

Grenartia wrote:


To be entirely fair, Hitler was pretty pro-animal rights. So, I mean, I guess, in a twisted sense, they could see certain anthropomorphized animals as equal to Aryans.

My general theory is that a decent number of people who join fur groups are seeking community, same to far right groups as well - assured acceptance, if you will.
It is because of this the existance of unironic nazi furs doesnt surprise me. I would almost call it double dipping. Fascinating tbh.

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United Muscovite Nations
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 25657
Founded: Feb 01, 2017
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Postby United Muscovite Nations » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:33 pm

Grenartia wrote:
Anything that doesn't involve Orthodox Christianity and heterosexual vanilla sex in the missionary position for the sole purpose of procreation (with the lights off), is bourgeois degeneracy to you. You'd probably even ban handholding.



Considering how much you hate this stuff, I cannot help but to picture you, much like a closeted gay televangelist, being a secret furry who has a fetish for trans girls and watersports.

How very mature of you. Also, handholding is wholesome.
Grumpy Grandpa of the LWDT and RWDT
Kantian with panentheist and Christian beliefs. Rawlsian Socialist. Just completed studies in History and International Relations. Asexual with sex-revulsion.
The world is grey, the mountains old, the forges fire is ashen cold. No harp is wrung, no hammer falls, the darkness dwells in Durin's halls...
Formerly United Marxist Nations, Dec 02, 2011- Feb 01, 2017. +33,837 posts
Borderline Personality Disorder, currently in treatment. I apologize if I blow up at you. TG me for info, can't discuss publicly because the mods support stigma on mental illness.

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Trotskylvania
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Founded: Jul 07, 2006
Ex-Nation

Postby Trotskylvania » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:34 pm

Tekeristan wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
To be entirely fair, Hitler was pretty pro-animal rights. So, I mean, I guess, in a twisted sense, they could see certain anthropomorphized animals as equal to Aryans.

My general theory is that a decent number of people who join fur groups are seeking community, same to far right groups as well - assured acceptance, if you will.
It is because of this the existance of unironic nazi furs doesnt surprise me. I would almost call it double dipping. Fascinating tbh.

One furry in the thread posited that Nazi furries proliferated because the furry community was very big on a sort of naive tolerance back in the day. It was always "to each his own", and so one could be an outright Nazi and make that part of the kink and people would be compelled by the social contract to just roll with it. This made it easy Nazis to organize and proliferate among the milleau.
Your Friendly Neighborhood Ultra - The Left Wing of the Impossible
Putting the '-sadism' in Posadism


"The hell of capitalism is the firm, not the fact that the firm has a boss."- Bordiga

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Trotskylvania
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Posts: 17217
Founded: Jul 07, 2006
Ex-Nation

Postby Trotskylvania » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:35 pm

Grenartia wrote: You'd probably even ban handholding.

*takes off gimp mask* Get that lewd shit out of here.
Last edited by Trotskylvania on Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Your Friendly Neighborhood Ultra - The Left Wing of the Impossible
Putting the '-sadism' in Posadism


"The hell of capitalism is the firm, not the fact that the firm has a boss."- Bordiga

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Tekeristan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5344
Founded: Mar 08, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tekeristan » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:36 pm

Trotskylvania wrote:
Grenartia wrote: You'd probably even ban handholding.

Get that lewd shit out of here.

i.. i l-like to hold hands..

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