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Should 3rd Party Voters be blamed for the Trump Victory?

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New Roma Republic
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Should 3rd Party Voters be blamed for the Trump Victory?

Postby New Roma Republic » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:16 pm

On the book of faces, I have seen multiple posts from my Pro-Clinton friends blaming third party voters as the reason Clinton lost. They say things to the effect of "...third party voters: this wasn't the election to express your distaste in the political system" (That partial quote came from a friend of a friend on Facebook). I feel that this is an unfair generalization. Yes, I voted third party. Yes, I realized at the time I was throwing away my vote. And no, I did not vote as a protest to the system. I voted for the candidate who most closely represented my beliefs.

First, let me say that I am a freshman college student studying Aerospace Engineering, 18, and from a affluent area. I am a white, heterosexual male, and I lean center-left, politically. I come from a fairly conservative area, though it has small pockets of vocal liberals. I am registered as a Democrat, but I vote for whoever I like the best. So now that you know a little about me politically, here is why I voted third party:

I could not in good conscious vote for Donald Trump. I cannot get behind someone who says the stuff he says, even if he says it only to get attention.

As for Hillary Clinton, she just doesn't represent who I am. Sure, it would be nice to have the first woman president, however, there is so much corruption surrounding her that I could not vote for her in good conscious either. So I voted for an obscure third party that very few people had heard of. Why? Because he (mostly) represented my views.

Now, I can see why us third party candidates are being blamed; we always get blamed by the losing side. But you must understand, if I hadn't voted third party, I would not have voted for Clinton. Or Trump. I would have abstained from the Presidential election because the choices were so bad. And that is my right. I have the right to make any decision I want, and I made mine wholeheartedly. If I had the chance to do a do over, I would still vote for the person I voted for.

So, NS, what is your take on this? Are third parties to blame for the Trump Presidency? Do most people vote third party just to express their distaste in the electoral system? Please, give your thoughts below!
Last edited by New Roma Republic on Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Karjin
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Postby Karjin » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:18 pm

It certainly hurt. Didn't Utah have an independent actually gain more votes than HRC?
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Postby Reploid Productions » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:20 pm

There are plenty of people to blame for it. 3rd party voters are not blameless, but they carry the least degree of blame in this. Blame the Republicans who for years have been strip-mining the worst the United States has to offer to try and scrape some more votes that made a candidate like Trump viable. Blame the Democrats who badly misread the political climate and decided to field an establishment candidate in a time and place where people are really freaking fed up with establishment politics.

There's plenty of blame to go around. To cast the blame solely on those who voted third party is irresponsible and short-sighted.
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Postby Dooom35796821595 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:20 pm

Blamed? Trump won, that's all there is to it. You can blame the electoral collage, but it won't change who will become POTUS in January.
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New Roma Republic
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Postby New Roma Republic » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:20 pm

Karjin wrote:It certainly hurt. Didn't Utah have an independent actually gain more votes than HRC?

I believe at one point that was the case but I just checked on Google, and only Trump got more votes than HRC

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Postby Tectonix » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:21 pm

It is possible you could blame them. After all, if the amount of votes Johnson received in Florida had went to HRC, she would've won. Same goes for Pennsylvania. Maybe not all of the blame, but a little, sure.
Last edited by Tectonix on Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Cetacea » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:22 pm

unfortunately it was the Democrats who are to blame for loosing the Presidency

they should have supported Bernie as their candidate instead of their 'safe' option

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Postby Arkolon » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:22 pm

According to fivethirtyeight dot com, all of the third party votes going to Clinton wouldn't have flipped enough states to give her the victory. Haven't checked it but it's a respectable enough website.
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:23 pm

No.
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Postby New haven america » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:24 pm

While it did hurt, I don't think they're mainly to blame. The system, former Bernie or Bust voters, the Democratic Party's internal drama, Komy, etc... all had a hand in Trump's win.

I personally place most of my blame on the EC, it's an unneeded system that has lead to the loser of the Popular Vote (You know, the part that should matter) to win multiple times. (Trump is currently the 5th person to get away with this)
Last edited by New haven america on Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:25 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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From: Should 3rd Party Voters be blamed for the Trump Victory?

Postby Xadufell » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:25 pm

No, Hillary allowing is to blame for Trump winning.

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New Roma Republic
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Postby New Roma Republic » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:28 pm

Xadufell, I don't know if you posted the same post 4 times on purpose or if it was an accident. Regardless, do not post the same post more than once, or I will ask you to leave this thread. Thanks

New haven america wrote:While it did hurt, I don't think they're mainly to blame. The system, former Bernie or Bust voters, the Democratic Party's internal drama, Komy, etc... all had a hand in Trump's win.

I personally place most of my blame on the EC, it's an unneeded system that has lead to the loser of the Popular Vote (You know, the part that should matter) to win multiple times. (Trump is currently the 5th person to get away with this)

This seems like a fair assessment. I have never liked the EC, personally, and have always though it should go. The people should choose who the President is. That way your vote will actually matter.
Last edited by New Roma Republic on Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Novus America » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:30 pm

Karjin wrote:It certainly hurt. Didn't Utah have an independent actually gain more votes than HRC?


Without him she would have lost just as badly. Said third party candidate drew votes away from Trump. There is no reason to think most third party voters would have voted HRC. Sure she lost because not enough people voted for her. But that is her fault, not ours, for pushing us away.
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Postby Tectonix » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:30 pm

Not only that Xadufell, but the mods may intervene, so...
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Postby The Liberated Territories » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:30 pm

If your candidate is so bad that she loses to Trump despite third party votes, then that is your fault. You don't own anyone's vote. If Gayjay wasnt on the ballot I probably would of voted Constitution or some other party.
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:30 pm

New Roma Republic wrote:Xadufell, I don't know if you posted the same post 4 times on purpose or if it was an accident. Regardless, do not post the same post more than once, or I will ask you to leave this thread. Thanks

New haven america wrote:While it did hurt, I don't think they're mainly to blame. The system, former Bernie or Bust voters, the Democratic Party's internal drama, Komy, etc... all had a hand in Trump's win.

I personally place most of my blame on the EC, it's an unneeded system that has lead to the loser of the Popular Vote (You know, the part that should matter) to win multiple times. (Trump is currently the 5th person to get away with this)

This seems like a fair assessment. I have never liked the EC, personally, and have always though it should go. The people should choose who the President is. That way your vote will actually matter.


That's not how General works.
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Postby Reploid Productions » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:31 pm

New Roma Republic wrote:Xadufell, I don't know if you posted the same post 4 times on purpose or if it was an accident. Regardless, do not post the same post more than once, or I will ask you to leave this thread. Thanks

Just a heads-up, there is no thread ownership in NSG. You have no control over who is permitted to post or to demand someone leave. If rulebreaking occurs, pop over to the Moderation forum to report it. I already sent up a flare on the spam for one of my colleagues, since as a thread participant, I have to abstain from doing modstuff on it.
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Postby Tectonix » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:31 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
New Roma Republic wrote:Xadufell, I don't know if you posted the same post 4 times on purpose or if it was an accident. Regardless, do not post the same post more than once, or I will ask you to leave this thread. Thanks


This seems like a fair assessment. I have never liked the EC, personally, and have always though it should go. The people should choose who the President is. That way your vote will actually matter.


That's not how General works.

General?
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Postby Muinordgrad » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:31 pm

Why is a Trump victory something that someone needs to take the "blame" for? He still has a congress full of people he has insulted to keep most of his ambitions in check, and at least he didn't do any crime while in office. The Democrats had Bernie and they blew it. Try again in 2020 where hopefully someone will understand what the American people actually want.
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Postby New Roma Republic » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:33 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
New Roma Republic wrote:Xadufell, I don't know if you posted the same post 4 times on purpose or if it was an accident. Regardless, do not post the same post more than once, or I will ask you to leave this thread. Thanks


This seems like a fair assessment. I have never liked the EC, personally, and have always though it should go. The people should choose who the President is. That way your vote will actually matter.


That's not how General works.


Reploid Productions wrote:
New Roma Republic wrote:Xadufell, I don't know if you posted the same post 4 times on purpose or if it was an accident. Regardless, do not post the same post more than once, or I will ask you to leave this thread. Thanks

Just a heads-up, there is no thread ownership in NSG. You have no control over who is permitted to post or to demand someone leave. If rulebreaking occurs, pop over to the Moderation forum to report it. I already sent up a flare on the spam for one of my colleagues, since as a thread participant, I have to abstain from doing modstuff on it.



Ah. That shows you how much I time I spend on this part of NS
Last edited by New Roma Republic on Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Washington Resistance Army
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:33 pm

Tectonix wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
That's not how General works.

General?


The part of the forum we reside in?
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Tectonix
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Postby Tectonix » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:35 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Tectonix wrote:General?


The part of the forum we reside in?

Oh, thought you meant something about the election ;)
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Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:36 pm

Tectonix wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
That's not how General works.

General?



Nation States General.




Anyway.

No, third party voters should not be blamed.

A 200 year old system that ignores the popular vote and the toxicity of this election is to blame

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Postby Isle of Shadows » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:36 pm

[quote="New Roma Republic";p="30365790"][/quote]
When you vote for third party, the third party gets more funding for the next election. (I got this small info from a video by gradeAunderA) So I don't think you threw away your vote. You are basically giving the third party a better chance next time of winning with the funding.

People might say, "This is the worst election ever! I should vote for the lesser evil!" Then... an even shitter election comes around... that would made me wish I voted for a 3rd party with similar views to me the previous election.

Honestly... (and I hope I don't get crucified by NS for this... I'm new here so I don't know if this place has any political leaning) I voted for Trump. However, I'm an Asian female... Why would I vote for someone who says all these sexist things? I would rather vote for someone who simply says sexist things than someone who defends rapists... and didn't divorce her husband for probably being a rapist. Why would I vote for someone who says all these ____ things? My answer would be similar to the previous one. I am more scared of someone who bites than barks. Why didn't I vote third party then? I'm a conservative. No one in the third party reflects my views at all... and I don't want to fund them either. If I DID find myself having a lot of similar views as the third party... I would vote them every single time... just in case a particularly shitty election happens in the future.

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Postby Socialist Nordia » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:37 pm

I sort of blame them, especially the stein people, but more so I blame America's god-awful voting system. The electoral college stole the election from the plurality, but If America had instant runnoff I'm sure most 3rd party voters would have chosen Hillary as a second option just in case.
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