NATION

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* NSG PEACE PRIZE 2016 (Seventh Edition) *

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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New Werpland
Senator
 
Posts: 4647
Founded: Dec 11, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby New Werpland » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:15 pm

Bakery Hill wrote:
New Werpland wrote:Err yea just one thing. The YPG are not angels, they are the least bad militia group in Syria. Not necessarily worthy of a peace prize for that, especially when we consider who they affiliate with. Personally, I think they've been the subject of too much lionization at this point.

Is it really necessary to hail the Syrian branch of a school bombing terrorist organization as having made great contribution to human rights and peace? Why not leave them be and avoid whitewashing?

This is true, they do work quite closely with the US air force...

Well at least they don't practice terrorism...
Last edited by New Werpland on Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Bakery Hill
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Postby Bakery Hill » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:16 pm

New Werpland wrote:
Bakery Hill wrote:This is true, they do work quite closely with the US air force...

Well at least they don't practice outright terrorism...

The Air Force? Only the good and wholesome kind.

Who are the people that they YPG affiliate with that you disapprove of, out of interest?
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New Werpland
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Founded: Dec 11, 2014
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Postby New Werpland » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:18 pm

Bakery Hill wrote:
New Werpland wrote:Well at least they don't practice outright terrorism...

The Air Force? Only the good and wholesome kind.

Who are the people that they YPG affiliate with that you disapprove of, out of interest?

The Kurdistan Workers' Party dear.

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Bakery Hill
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Postby Bakery Hill » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:21 pm

New Werpland wrote:
Bakery Hill wrote:The Air Force? Only the good and wholesome kind.

Who are the people that they YPG affiliate with that you disapprove of, out of interest?

The Kurdistan Workers' Party dear.

Oh yes, they've done some pretty bad things. But they're not the same organisation they were in the 80s and 90s thankfully.
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New Werpland
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Postby New Werpland » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:24 pm

Bakery Hill wrote:
New Werpland wrote:The Kurdistan Workers' Party dear.

Oh yes, they've done some pretty bad things. But they're not the same organisation they were in the 80s and 90s thankfully.

Yes now their wunderkind has become a grassroots libertarian socialist who reads Nietzsche whilst they continue to do bad things.

Maybe this isn't the right place for this discussion?

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Bakery Hill
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Postby Bakery Hill » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:26 pm

New Werpland wrote:
Bakery Hill wrote:Oh yes, they've done some pretty bad things. But they're not the same organisation they were in the 80s and 90s thankfully.

Yes now their wunderkind has become a grassroots libertarian socialist who reads Nietzsche whilst they continue to do bad things.

Maybe this isn't the right place for this discussion?

No, perhaps not haha
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Socialist Tera
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Postby Socialist Tera » Sat Oct 01, 2016 10:50 pm

Shofercia wrote:The Kurds that defended Kobane for actually doing something useful instead of nonstop yapping about Human Rights while attempting to escalate the war, and for their ability to compromise and unite the others around them, for their cause, giving women equal rights and not dealing with those who deny women equal rights despite the "moderate" label, and running a secular democracy in the midst of a bloody Civil War.

Fourth this one.
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The Conez Imperium
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Postby The Conez Imperium » Sat Oct 01, 2016 11:04 pm

Socialist Tera wrote:
Shofercia wrote:The Kurds that defended Kobane for actually doing something useful instead of nonstop yapping about Human Rights while attempting to escalate the war, and for their ability to compromise and unite the others around them, for their cause, giving women equal rights and not dealing with those who deny women equal rights despite the "moderate" label, and running a secular democracy in the midst of a bloody Civil War.

Fourth this one.


I'm pretty certain that they are able to do "something useful" because they have the firepower to do so.

Hmm. I don't support this nomination as giving a peace prize to Kurds is rather generalistic. What are we defining as kurds? The ethnicity? The government (if they have one)? The army soldiers who defended Kobane? This nomination seems like a sympathy vote rather than actual recognition for "the extraordinary contribution given to the cause of human rights and/or peace".

Moreover, if we are arguing about the line of the "Kurds" giving women equality, then what makes their action particularly commendable compared to other organisations that advocate for equality?
Last edited by The Conez Imperium on Sat Oct 01, 2016 11:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Shamhnan Insir
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Postby Shamhnan Insir » Sat Oct 01, 2016 11:33 pm

I nominated Medicines sans Frontiers last year for their outstanding work and dedication to treating wounded and sick people in some of the worst places and conflicts on the planet.

However I would like to ask if it would be possible to nominate CITES for their work in protecting non-human animals? Recently they upheld a ban on ivory exporting in Africa, improved security and protective status of all pangolin species and also gave protection to Europes only non-human primate living in the wild, the Barbary Macaque.

We live on a planet full of people, however the ones that often suffer the most are the other species we share it with.
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Risottia
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Risottia » Sat Oct 01, 2016 11:59 pm

New Werpland wrote:
Bakery Hill wrote:Oh yes, they've done some pretty bad things. But they're not the same organisation they were in the 80s and 90s thankfully.

Yes now their wunderkind has become a grassroots libertarian socialist who reads Nietzsche whilst they continue to do bad things.

Maybe this isn't the right place for this discussion?

Partly. It's the right place to determine whether the YPG and other Kurdish militias and movements deserve the Peace Prize - and whether and what parts of the Kurdish movement should be excluded.
It's not the right place to bitch about the long history of the Kurdish movement.

Try to be reasonable.

Shamhnan Insir wrote:However I would like to ask if it would be possible to nominate CITES for their work in protecting non-human animals? Recently they upheld a ban on ivory exporting in Africa, improved security and protective status of all pangolin species and also gave protection to Europes only non-human primate living in the wild, the Barbary Macaque.
We live on a planet full of people, however the ones that often suffer the most are the other species we share it with.

I'm afraid this goes beyond the purpose of the Prize. Unless you can show a direct causal link between non-human welfare and human rights or peace.
Your nomination, so far, would fit better in an Environment Prize - maybe we could create one, what do you think?
Last edited by Risottia on Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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European Guilds
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Founded: Aug 12, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby European Guilds » Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:25 am

Shofercia wrote:
European Guilds wrote:I would like to nominate the Syrian Civil Defense, AKA the White Helmets.They are an organization of Syrian volunteers who act as first responders after a bombardment to save people from the rubble and have saved thousands of lives.


By executing them: https://www.sott.net/article/319963-Fak ... s-in-Syria

A range of Syrian women have denounced the US-UK funded group the 'White Helmets', led by a former British soldier and recently revealed to be financed by USAID. They come from all the country's communities (e.g. Sunni, Alawi, Druze, Christian) but, like most Syrians, prefer to identify simply as Syrian. Their comments follow the release of a range of evidence (Beeley 2015; Hands off Syria 2016) which show that the White Helmets - who present as 'heroes' rescuing civilians from the destruction of war - are in fact armed, partisan, western government funded and participating with Jabhat al Nusra (al Qaeda) in sectarian celebrations and executions...

Rana from Damascus says: 'they are an armed force [which has] covered themselves under the wing of 'humanitarian' organization. In rural Idlib they did so many executions against Syrian civilians that doesn't support the fake revolution. Their main support and fund comes from US government and UK government.'A White Helmets (2015) video from Douma (NE Damascus countryside) shows the aftermath of a Syrian Government attack on Jabhat al Nusra and Jaysh al Islam terrorist groups, which had sent rockets and mortars into Damascus almost every day for several years, killing hundreds of people. The young men donning 'White Helmets' jackets to rescue their colleagues are indistinguishable from Islamist fighters. Portraying Islamist casualties as civilians is a long tradition in the war on Syria. US journalist Nir Rosen (2012) wrote some years back that 'dead opposition fighters ... [are often] described as innocent civilians killed by security forces'.

Sott.net? Really? The "news"site associated with Jadczyk and his wife?
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Last edited by European Guilds on Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Napkiraly
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Founded: Aug 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Napkiraly » Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:28 am

Shrillland wrote:Juan Manuel Santos, President of the Republic of Colombia, and the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia, more commonly known as FARC, for their efforts in ending a civil conflict that had lasted for over six decades, and for bringing forth a new, more stable, prosperous, and hopeful era for their nation.

I second this nomination.

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Neutraligon
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Founded: Oct 01, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby Neutraligon » Sun Oct 02, 2016 1:03 am

I would like to nominate doctors without borders. They are a group of doctors dedicated to helping people no matter where they are in the world, and no matter the side they are on. They go into some of the most dangerous places often with very little in the way of equipment to try and heal the sink and injured. When they do this in war zones, they do so at the risk of their own lives.
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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Sun Oct 02, 2016 1:52 am

Neutraligon wrote:I would like to nominate doctors without borders. They are a group of doctors dedicated to helping people no matter where they are in the world, and no matter the side they are on. They go into some of the most dangerous places often with very little in the way of equipment to try and heal the sink and injured. When they do this in war zones, they do so at the risk of their own lives.


They won last year.
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Scandinavian Nations
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Postby Scandinavian Nations » Sun Oct 02, 2016 1:56 am

I would like to nominate Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi for his efforts and accomplishments in bringing the civilized peoples of the world a little bit closer together.

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Neutraligon
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Founded: Oct 01, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby Neutraligon » Sun Oct 02, 2016 1:59 am

Philjia wrote:
Neutraligon wrote:I would like to nominate doctors without borders. They are a group of doctors dedicated to helping people no matter where they are in the world, and no matter the side they are on. They go into some of the most dangerous places often with very little in the way of equipment to try and heal the sink and injured. When they do this in war zones, they do so at the risk of their own lives.


They won last year.

Oops, nevermind.
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European Guilds
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Founded: Aug 12, 2016
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Postby European Guilds » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:00 am

Scandinavian Nations wrote:I would like to nominate Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi for his efforts and accomplishments in bringing the civilized peoples of the world a little bit closer together.

Eh, his nomination was rejected in the 2014 edition, for obvious reasons, so I assume it'll be the same this time.

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Bakery Hill
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Ex-Nation

Postby Bakery Hill » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:11 am

The Conez Imperium wrote:
Socialist Tera wrote:Fourth this one.


I'm pretty certain that they are able to do "something useful" because they have the firepower to do so.

Yep, that's generally how it works.

Hmm. I don't support this nomination as giving a peace prize to Kurds is rather generalistic. What are we defining as kurds? The ethnicity? The government (if they have one)? The army soldiers who defended Kobane? This nomination seems like a sympathy vote rather than actual recognition for "the extraordinary contribution given to the cause of human rights and/or peace".

There are Kurds fighting for ISIS, so yes of course. We could rather say Rojava/North Syrian Federation or TEV-DEM (Movement for a Democratic Society) then? Because I assure, they've been doing a whole lot of amazing things on social level apart from killing ISIS. They're implementing a program of equal rights for all through grass root democracies whilst rebuilding their towns and cities AND sheltering millions of displaced people from the rest of Syria.

Moreover, if we are arguing about the line of the "Kurds" giving women equality, then what makes their action particularly commendable compared to other organisations that advocate for equality?

Because they're doing very radically progressive and effective things in one of the most violent and reactionary regions in the world at the moment.
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Frank Zipper
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Founded: Nov 16, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Frank Zipper » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:32 am

I seriously cannot think of anyone to nominate. Rather depressing.
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European Guilds
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Founded: Aug 12, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby European Guilds » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:34 am

Frank Zipper wrote:I seriously cannot think of anyone to nominate. Rather depressing.

Then support one of the nominations that you like?

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Eol Sha
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Founded: Aug 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Eol Sha » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:37 am

Arch said this last year after the poll ended:
The Archregimancy wrote:Clearly having nasty extremists bomb heritage sites on a recurring basis isn't enough.

Next year - going for third time lucky with Blue Shield - I'm going to have to try and arrange for NATO to accidentally bomb a significant World Heritage site during the poll process while a Blue Shield team is working there.

Which isn't to remotely criticise MSF, who are a fantastic organisation; but I can't help but feel that they might not have run away with this poll without the appalling incident in Kunduz.

Can we blame him for Palmyra? :p

On another note, are nominations limited to actions of the past year?
Last edited by Eol Sha on Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
You'd better believe I'm a bitter Bernie Sanders supporter. The Dems fucked up and fucked up hard. Hopefully they'll learn that neoliberalism and maintaining the status quo isn't the way to win this election or any other one. I doubt they will, though.

"What's the number one method of achieving civil rights in America? Don't scare the white folks." ~ Eol Sha

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Minzerland II
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Founded: Aug 27, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Minzerland II » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:44 am

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:I would like to nominate Project Semicolon.

Why?
The vision is that together we can achieve lower suicide rates in the US and around the world;
That together we can start a conversation about suicide, mental illness and addiction that can't be stopped;

We envision love and hope and we declare that hope is alive;

We envision a society that openly addresses the struggle with mental illness, suicide and addiction;

We envision a conversation embraced by churches and addressed with love;

We envision a society that sees their value and embraces it;

We envision a community that comes together and stands together in support of one another;

We envision a world where an escape is not found within drugs or alcohol;

We envision a world where self-destruction is no longer a escape to be used;

We envision a revolution of LOVE and declare that our stories are not over yet;

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I second this.
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Yootxtlalkaan
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Posts: 170
Founded: Oct 10, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Yootxtlalkaan » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:44 am

i nominate the #blacklivesmatter movement, for its bringing attention to the excessively brutal terroristic methods of so-called police forces across the u.s.a., for its steadfast advocacy of criminal justice reform, and for its revival and continuation of the black civil rights movement of the 1960s.

(and i know i can't officially second it, but i thoroughly approve of the nomination of the rojavan freedom fighters also)
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Risottia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54298
Founded: Sep 05, 2006
New York Times Democracy

Postby Risottia » Sun Oct 02, 2016 3:06 am

Eol Sha wrote:On another note, are nominations limited to actions of the past year?


No. Just remember that you can nominate only people who are still alive and organisations who are still active at the moment of nomination.
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Eol Sha
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Founded: Aug 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Eol Sha » Sun Oct 02, 2016 3:07 am

Risottia wrote:
Eol Sha wrote:On another note, are nominations limited to actions of the past year?


No. Just remember that you can nominate only people who are still alive and organisations who are still active at the moment of nomination.

Alright. Cool.
You'd better believe I'm a bitter Bernie Sanders supporter. The Dems fucked up and fucked up hard. Hopefully they'll learn that neoliberalism and maintaining the status quo isn't the way to win this election or any other one. I doubt they will, though.

"What's the number one method of achieving civil rights in America? Don't scare the white folks." ~ Eol Sha

Praise be to C-SPAN - Democrats Should Listen to Sanders - How I Voted on November 8, 2016 - Trump's Foreign Policy: Do Stupid Shit - Trump's Clock is Ticking

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