Can Feminism Be Reduced to a Catchphrase?

[New Edom]

In response to queries about whether or not feminists hate men, many feminists, including Gloria Steinem, the website Everyday Feminism, Emma Watson and others will reduce feminism to a simple definition, to quote emma Watson:

For the record, feminism by definition is: “The belief that men and women should have equal rights and opportunities. It is the theory of the political, economic and social equality of the sexes.” http://www.unwomen.org/en/news/stories/2014/9/emma-watson-gender-equality-is-your-issue-too

Indeed many on this website have used a similar response to anyone stating concerns about feminist activism or ideas--that the basic knock down argument to start with is that one: How can you be against this idea? And that's a good question actually--is that all there is to feminist policy?

Well, we have a good example right now in Canada's own Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau. Trudeau has gone out of his way to champion feminism; he has created Canada's first 50/50 female cabinet. He has stated he is a feminist, going so far even as to weigh in on Gamergate with a total support apparently for Sarkeesian and Quinn. He has urged men to support feminism and supported popular 3rd Wave feminist ideas like 'not interupting women' and things like that. So if all you have to do is support equality and broad popular feminist ideas to be a male feminist, he's done that. And as n article I'm going to link to says

The Liberals swept in, reversing policies, among them returning advocacy funding to groups representing women and girls and lifting a restriction on foreign aid dollars funding abortion services offshore. Committees to address murdered and missing Indiginous women (MMIW), pay inequity, electoral reform and gender-based analysis were formed.

So what do leading Canadian feminist have to say about that?

“ ‘Feminist’ Justin Trudeau delivers a deeply unfeminist first budget,” Rabble proclaimed. Kate McInturff, a senior researcher at the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives who specializes in gender inequity and public policy, delivered a scathing critique in “Budget 2016: Not enough Real Change™ for women.” She found a gender divide in the 43,000 new jobs promised in 2016 and 100,000 in 2017-18, many from infrastructure spending. This is great for creating jobs in construction, which is 88.5 per cent male, she writes.

BTW, Rabble.ca is a site that largely posts radical feminist ideas only, just about never the ideas of egalitarians who favour woemn's rights like libertarians or liberal feminists. But anyway you can read the article for yourselves: by not solving all of mainstream feminism in Canada's demands right away, Justin Trudeau is not feminist enough, so he's a 'fake feminist'. So according to that notion then, it is not just the broad principle it is particular policies and ideas that certain feminists proclaim to be relevant that apparently makes you a feminst or not.

What do the rest of you think? Can anyone measure up to what idealists demand? Is this reasonable? And most importantly of all, should we start to refuse to accept it when feminists avoid being pinned down about what they want by hiding behind a catcphrase?

Personally, I think that the old slogans, "votes for Women!" and "The personal is political" should be changed to suit the mood of the 3rd Wave and should be called "Purity and perfection or nothing!"

[Galloism]

I humbly submit as a catchphrase: "dear merciful God, not again!"

Nana sayeth in a song: "It's the circle of poo, and it stains us all!"

[Socialist Nordia]

catchphrase
Spell it right.

[United Marxist Nations]

I'd rather the number of threads on feminism be reduced.

[Socialist Nordia]

I'd rather the number of threads on feminism be reduced.

There is a general feminism thread, but we still end up with multiple threads of feminism all over the place.

[Uxupox]

Houdini.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

I humbly submit as a catchphrase: "dear merciful God, not again!"

Nana sayeth in a song: "It's the circle of poo, and it stains us all!"

Sing to the theme of The Lion King.

And it continues: "Through this repetition! Could you please stoooooopppp?!"

[Grinstead]

do you have to make a thread on feminism every single goddamned week

[New Edom]

do you have to make a thread on feminism every single goddamned week

I don't make one every week. What I do is tackle the issues one by one within the general subject to avoid having them get lost in the overall shuffle. It's more like about one a month.

[New Edom]

I humbly submit as a catchphrase: "dear merciful God, not again!"

Nana sayeth in a song: "It's the circle of poo, and it stains us all!"

Sing to the theme of The Lion King.

And it continues: "Through this repetition! Could you please stoooooopppp?!"

If you cannot see the importance of the subject, then why piss on my boots? Go put your own boots on.

[New Edom]

I'd rather the number of threads on feminism be reduced.

There is a general feminism thread, but we still end up with multiple threads of feminism all over the place.

No, they are particular subjects. Feminism is a general movement, and it does different things and proposes different policies. There are multple threads about conflicts between political parties, about different initiatives by political leaders. This is no different.

[Futrellia]

There is a general feminism thread, but we still end up with multiple threads of feminism all over the place.

No, they are particular subjects. Feminism is a general movement, and it does different things and proposes different policies. There are multple threads about conflicts between political parties, about different initiatives by political leaders. This is no different.

Feminism is cancer.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Sing to the theme of The Lion King.

And it continues: "Through this repetition! Could you please stoooooopppp?!"

If you cannot see the importance of the subject, then why piss on my boots? Go put your own boots on.

It gets to be much ado about nothing when you're this obsessed. Give it a rest. Go out, engage in activism, have a beer, fuck.

Really, you're too obsessed.

[Futrellia]

“I need feminism because we need more sexy blond female CEO’s but not more female miners and other jobs in those kinds of fields. They’re not glamorous enough. Women shouldn’t have to get on their knees and work hard unless they want to get backstage at a Weeknd concert.”

Feminism in a nutshell.

[Luminesa]

Not interrupting women is a third-wave feminist idea?

I thought that was always a thing. If I'm talking, I AM TALKING.

[New Edom]

If you cannot see the importance of the subject, then why piss on my boots? Go put your own boots on.

It gets to be much ado about nothing when you're this obsessed. Give it a rest. Go out, engage in activism, have a beer, fuck.

Really, you're too obsessed.

Actually, no. I'm interested. I'm discussing the issues. And what the hell do you care? If you're not interested, go write somewhere else. When last I checked, you and I were not drinking buddies or something, so you don't have to put up with me if you don't want to. Just don't respond. The big difference between me and the shit stirrers I wrote about here is that I'm not trying to cost you money. You don't HAVE to respond to me, so if you don't like it, don't.

[New Edom]

“I need feminism because we need more sexy blond female CEO’s but not more female miners and other jobs in those kinds of fields. They’re not glamorous enough. Women shouldn’t have to get on their knees and work hard unless they want to get backstage at a Weeknd concert.”

Feminism in a nutshell.

Well essentially that's the issue with the construction worker thing--if women want to make more money, woring harder and bigger risk jobs naturally pay more.

[New haven america]

Meh.

[New Edom]

Not interrupting women is a third-wave feminist idea?

I thought that was always a thing. If I'm talking, I AM TALKING.

According to spokespersons for 3rd wave feminism, men are almost always rude and mean to women. So it's not that 'being mean is bad' it's 'most men re mean' or 'most men allow mean men to be mean'. Justin Trudeau is a white night showing us all the way. Except it's not good enough apparently because his government's commission, costing tons of taxpayer's money, hasn't offered immediate solutions to problems which are proposed to have existed for several decades instantly, so he's a fake feminist.

[Kaldrussia]

Heya. Your friendly neighborhood communist here, to talk about feminism.

First off, explaining what my ideology has to do with this. Communism means that everyone is equal and gets equal pay for the work they do for the commune, right? Well, apparently that belief isn't communist (which can be traced back to primitive communism and hunter-gatherer societies), but feminist (which can be traced back to 1837, with the term being coined by a socialist), and thus can't be used in any other context that isn't feminist.

Secondly, feminism is the left on drugs. By that I mean that most of the stuff wrong with the entire leftist movement is augmented in feminism. The (far) left is disorganized wether there should or shouldn't be a State, feminism is divided on its very definition. There's not a lack of examples, and still no prominent feminist voice spoke out against these cases-only antifeminists.

Also, poking the majority for rights that are privileges has proved to do no good at all.

On a last note, if I remember correctly, the last time thousands of people of a very specific ethnic group with a certain gender grouped up to share such ideals, 'Sieg Heil' was the standard greeting.

Sorry that it's short, it's 3 AM and I'm very tired. But I hope I got the point across.

[The Ukrainian Workers Republic]

I am a feminist, but not in the West. I am a feminist in the Middle East, but not North America or Europe. There is no reason to BE a feminist in the West, they are already equal.
(BTW I can't stand the Canadian prime minister. He is an idiot.

[Futrellia]

Past Topic Names You've posted on:
Can Feminism be Reduced to a Catchphrase
Is Heterosexual hook up culture fuelling rapes on campuses
Are Women Oppressed in the West
Is there Really a rape culture
Do you have to be Feminist to be Egalitarian?
LGBT+ Rights Survey

Why are you so interested in that particular subject? Do you truly believe women are being oppressed? Why is there a woman running for Office of the President of the United States? Why has there been a female Secretary of State. Why are there so many f**king female police officers in my city's Police Department? Why are there female State Troopers in the great State of Texas i live in? Why are there female Ranch owners in Texas? Why are there Females in the Infantry Divisions of the US Army? Why are there female wrestlers in WWE? Why are there female MMA fighters in the UFC?

I'm pretty sure you catch my point. Women can do everything men can do if they really want to. Jesus Christ.

[Futrellia]

Heya. Your friendly neighborhood communist here, to talk about feminism.

First off, explaining what my ideology has to do with this. Communism means that everyone is equal and gets equal pay for the work they do for the commune, right? Well, apparently that belief isn't communist (which can be traced back to primitive communism and hunter-gatherer societies), but feminist (which can be traced back to 1837, with the term being coined by a socialist), and thus can't be used in any other context that isn't feminist.

Secondly, feminism is the left on drugs. By that I mean that most of the stuff wrong with the entire leftist movement is augmented in feminism. The (far) left is disorganized wether there should or shouldn't be a State, feminism is divided on its very definition. There's not a lack of examples, and still no prominent feminist voice spoke out against these cases-only antifeminists.

Also, poking the majority for rights that are privileges has proved to do no good at all.

On a last note, if I remember correctly, the last time thousands of people of a very specific ethnic group with a certain gender grouped up to share such ideals, 'Sieg Heil' was the standard greeting.

Sorry that it's short, it's 3 AM and I'm very tired. But I hope I got the point across.

Killed it.

[Futrellia]

I am a feminist, but not in the West. I am a feminist in the Middle East, but not North America or Europe. There is no reason to BE a feminist in the West, they are already equal.
(BTW I can't stand the Canadian prime minister. He is an idiot.

Killed it.

[Bogdanov Vishniac]

Bit disingenous not posting the actual article, methinks.

Back in October, Canadians elected a prime minister who was 100 per cent more feminist than the last one. Justin Trudeau has been lauded around the world for his love of women and their empowerment, and was recently a featured speaker on the subject at the UN.

And sure, when compared to Harper, Trudeau is pretty good. The rhetoric has changed from someone who probably despises women to someone who probably doesn't. It's a start, but it's hardly change you can take to the bank.

Last week, the Liberals launched their first budget. It's the first concrete example of how feminist a prime minister Trudeau really is. Reading through it, it's clear why "Because it's 2016" was not chosen to be the budget's title (OK, that also might have to do with the fact that many of the spending promises are for after 2016, but anyway.)

The budget changes direction from Harper but it's hardly a feminist budget.

Kate McInturff at the CCPA broke down what Trudeau's "Real Change" looks like for women. Spoiler alert: it's minimal. High scores on smoke and mirrors, low scores on actual Real Change.

Nowhere is the promise of Real Change more hollow than in the money promised for Indigenous people and communities. Pam Palmater breaks down the numbers and demonstrates that the promises made during the election campaign were lip service only. The money allocated in the budget doesn't come close to what the Liberals promised. Most damning is the lack of funding for Indigenous children. As Palmater says, the honeymoon is over.

This is where the question about representation clashes with the actual policies of an administration. As we argued recently about Christy Clark and her imaginary feminist credentials, the labels rarely matter. Or, they matter, but barely. Unless someone's self-proclaimed cred or commitment has been tested in action, talk minus action equals zero, as DOA reminds us.

What's fascinating about Trudeau's feminist rhetoric is that he clearly sees a use for it and it must be beyond a crass political play, since feminism isn't yet the hot vote getter that it really should be. But Trudeau is perfectly exemplifying a trap that many feminist men fall into: you can claim you're feminist all you want but the women need to see some results.

It's especially interesting considering the flap that Trudeau got into for promising (perfectly reasonably) that his cabinet would be 50 per cent women. If we believe that representation matters (which it does) we have to also be critical in measuring the results of that representation. If having near-gender parity in Cabinet was important, that has to be because we anticipate a different way of doing things, or a more feminist way of operating, when self-proclaimed feminists are at the helm.

Of course, the reality is that the system is stacked up against women, and politicians aren't exempt from this. If they announce that they want to confront sexism within the system (even if it's minor, like calling oneself a feminist over and over), they have to target programs that women need. Otherwise, they're disingenuous (at best).

The most obvious program is a national child-care strategy. Nothing makes working harder than being saddled with a bunch of kids, and for too many families, women are forced to leave the workforce. The child-care supplement is not a replacement for a national strategy. It's like handing families money and telling them to make it work, without ensuring that there's a space or a daycare that they can access.

And the lack of spending on health care (a social service that employs a majority of women, and where volunteer caretakers are majority women) speaks volumes. With the old-age tsunami sweeping ever closer to us, women will be expected to take on more and more unpaid or low-paid work to help care for the ailing or aged.

While Trudeau was clear when he told Bloomberg news to not expect "anything sexy" in his government's first budget (blarg), it's not unreasonable to remind the guy that feminism certainly can be sexy. And, when it comes to public policy, sexiness or not, you have to walk your talk.

Besides: what's the point in having a feminist prime minister if his government does unfeminist things?

Pretty much nothing in the Rabble article is an unreasonable criticism of the Grits. Neither is it nearly as angry as the Macleans article seems to want to portray it as.