Is There Really a Rape Culture?

[Darjihad]

Rape is bad, mmkay?

See, no rape culture here.

[New Edom]

So are you too saying that rape culture as a theory cannot be questioned?

The proper response to a flippant dismissal is not to strawman.

Actually this kind of flippant dismissal relates to more elaborate dismissals that stress the notion that questioning feminism is just being sexist towards women. So it has to be addressed in this manner and I think it's a good question for people who are pro-feminist or feminist. Does every discussion of rape culture have to presume it's true? I don't think it does unless you're actually taking a gender studies course that requires it as a presumption.

[Alvecia]

The proper response to a flippant dismissal is not to strawman.

Actually this kind of flippant dismissal relates to more elaborate dismissals that stress the notion that questioning feminism is just being sexist towards women. So it has to be addressed in this manner and I think it's a good question for people who are pro-feminist or feminist. Does every discussion of rape culture have to presume it's true? I don't think it does unless you're actually taking a gender studies course that requires it as a presumption.

I don't disagree that the discussion is not valuable, I just question your reading of and dealing with said dismissal.

[Chestaan]

In some cases yes. Such as the previous incidents where sports stars had apologists coming out of the woodwork. Also, when young boys are raped by women we see people either congratulating them or saying that they probably wanted it. In fact, whenever men are raped by women we see responses that are less than sympathetic towards the victim. I would say that if anything that is an example of rape culture.

[The Romulan Republic]

The local anti-feminists/MRAs evidently felt that 50,000 wasn't enough.

So are you too saying that rape culture as a theory cannot be questioned?

Obviously not. Anything can be questioned. Do not try to fit me into the persecution complex narrative of "Evil SJWs trying to suppress my free speech"* the Right loves to apply to anyone who suggests racism or sexism might still be a real problem for anyone who isn't a white man.

I'm merely expressing my exasperation at the shear volume of threads rehashing this shit. And, its funny, it seems to me that I see far more threads on this forum attacking feminists/women/"SJWs" than defending them or attacking their opponents.

Its gotten really, really tired seeing people obsessively try to act like feminists are the greatest threat to the world at every opportunity, or that all feminists are man-hating hypocritical oppressors.

*Yes, I am aware that their are some people who try to restrict free speech in the name of progressivism. They are idiots. Their influence is also greatly exaggerated.

[Jumalariik]

In some cases yes. Such as the previous incidents where sports stars had apologists coming out of the woodwork. Also, when young boys are raped by women we see people either congratulating them or saying that they probably wanted it. In fact, whenever men are raped by women we see responses that are less than sympathetic towards the victim. I would say that if anything that is an example of rape culture.

True. If there is any rape culture it is against men.

[Unified Heartless States]

South Africa, and Africa in general, has a real rape culture problem.

[New Edom]

So are you too saying that rape culture as a theory cannot be questioned?

Obviously not. Anything can be questioned. Do not try to fit me into the persecution complex narrative of "Evil SJWs trying to suppress my free speech"* the Right loves to apply to anyone who suggests racism or sexism might still be a real problem for anyone who isn't a white man.

I'm merely expressing my exasperation at the shear volume of threads rehashing this shit. And, its funny, it seems to me that I see far more threads on this forum attacking feminists/women/"SJWs" than defending them or attacking their opponents.

Its gotten really, really tired seeing people obsessively try to act like feminists are the greatest threat to the world at every opportunity, or that all feminists are man-hating hypocritical oppressors.

*Yes, I am aware that their are some people who try to restrict free speech in the name of progressivism. They are idiots. Their influence is also greatly exaggerated.

Alright, but is my thread doing that?

There are two main issues I've brought up here, and yes I am rather obsessed with them becaus I think they're important.

The first is the tendency of feminists to frame all discussions of rape and abuse as being about female victims and male perpetrators. I would like for this to shift and for it to be recognized that there is a consistent failure on the part of our society's broader conversations to focus on women who are abusive and on boys and men as victims, particularly when they're victims of females.

The second is that I think that rape culture theory is not as imnportant as RAINN's approach to wanting to deal with things like campus rape for instance, where practical sollutions in my opinion outweigh social philosophy. The fact that feminists tend to frame such arguments as misogyny or ignorance moves the discussions away from common grounad and solutions towards insisting on cultural shifts as the primary focus, even where the ideas confuse people and cause deeper divisions.

That being said, I hope you can see that the aim here is not simply to attack feminism, but rather a public disagreement with a theory that is used to propose public policy.

[Hirota]

So then as I said in the OP--why does feminism, as a movement, resist focusing on this issue?

Because, for all their posturing about bringing about equality between the sexes, feminist science clearly seeks to enforce gender stereotypes when convenient. Outright lies such as "Women can't be rapists," is proof that they'd rather maintain the stereotypes and keep their fictional boogeymonster of the evil patriarchy in existence because they cannot confront something that simply does not exist.

And of course, when feminists do stray from the orthodoxy, when they heretically suggest men can be victims...they are excommunicated out of the cult. See Erin Pizzey or Karen DeCrow.

[New Edom]

In some cases yes. Such as the previous incidents where sports stars had apologists coming out of the woodwork. Also, when young boys are raped by women we see people either congratulating them or saying that they probably wanted it. In fact, whenever men are raped by women we see responses that are less than sympathetic towards the victim. I would say that if anything that is an example of rape culture.

Sure, there are subcultures that tend to be rather weak ont eh whole consent thing; there are outdated attitudes and there are also people who are really careless about their language. There are victims of women including other women, girls, boys, men and the elderly to consider. Mainstream popular feminism often seems to prefer to avoid dealing with those victims. They also seem to not want to accept that most people frankly disapprove of rape regardless of who the victim is, what they were doing and what they were wearing, but may also disapprove of the victim's actions while acknolwedging them as a victim.

[Wallenburg]

Nope. Rape is a serious crime issue that disproportionately affects women, and a handful of backwards and condemnable groups celebrate it, but it is not a fundamental aspect of our culture. I'd go as far as to say that the perpetuation of rape culture theory has siphoned attention away from efforts that actually make a difference in reducing rape.

Oh, and this might be of interest to you.

[Alvecia]

Obviously not. Anything can be questioned. Do not try to fit me into the persecution complex narrative of "Evil SJWs trying to suppress my free speech"* the Right loves to apply to anyone who suggests racism or sexism might still be a real problem for anyone who isn't a white man.

I'm merely expressing my exasperation at the shear volume of threads rehashing this shit. And, its funny, it seems to me that I see far more threads on this forum attacking feminists/women/"SJWs" than defending them or attacking their opponents.

Its gotten really, really tired seeing people obsessively try to act like feminists are the greatest threat to the world at every opportunity, or that all feminists are man-hating hypocritical oppressors.

*Yes, I am aware that their are some people who try to restrict free speech in the name of progressivism. They are idiots. Their influence is also greatly exaggerated.

Alright, but is my thread doing that?

There are two main issues I've brought up here, and yes I am rather obsessed with them becaus I think they're important.

The first is the tendency of feminists to frame all discussions of rape and abuse as being about female victims and male perpetrators. I would like for this to shift and for it to be recognized that there is a consistent failure on the part of our society's broader conversations to focus on women who are abusive and on boys and men as victims, particularly when they're victims of females.

The second is that I think that rape culture theory is not as imnportant as RAINN's approach to wanting to deal with things like campus rape for instance, where practical sollutions in my opinion outweigh social philosophy. The fact that feminists tend to frame such arguments as misogyny or ignorance moves the discussions away from common grounad and solutions towards insisting on cultural shifts as the primary focus, even where the ideas confuse people and cause deeper divisions.

That being said, I hope you can see that the aim here is not simply to attack feminism, but rather a public disagreement with a theory that is used to propose public policy.

I think my problem with how you frame your argument, and I don't know how many might agree with me, is your blanket use of the term "feminist".

It's who you identify all of the problems with and it how many here would identify themselves, myself included, yet it is not a representative term.

It's like if I used "racist" and "right-winger's" interchangeably because all racists I know of are right wing.

[The New Sea Territory]

Is there really another anti-feminist thread?

So are you saying that the theory of rape culture should just be believed as though it were an often proven scientific theory and never even questioned as you might a scientific theory?

Where did I say this? How dishonest.

I'm simply annoyed that there's a new anti-feminist thread were we basically talk about the same thing every other day.

[Wallenburg]

So are you saying that the theory of rape culture should just be believed as though it were an often proven scientific theory and never even questioned as you might a scientific theory?

Where did I say this? How dishonest.

I'm simply annoyed that there's a new anti-feminist thread were we basically talk about the same thing every other day.

So you are clearly saying that you want to oppress men and perpetuate rape culture theory and reject reality and chop people's dicks off? /sarcasm

[RFI]

"Yes and it's a very serious issue that is rooted in misogyny"
Hence why within a patriarchy cannot exist such thing as a "rape culture against men", at least it cannot exist a rape culture normalizing the "rape" of men by women: rape is dominance, and women are the oppressed class, so there cannot be such thing as "oppressed class that use dominance on the oppressors' class".
Rape of men by women can exist (though it's extremely rare) as an individual crime but it isn't encouraged by societal attitudes.

[Galloism]

Rape of men by women can exist (though it's extremely rare)

You know, making demonstrably false statements that have been proven to you as demonstrably wrong with various sources over many years is really annoying.

[The balkens]

"Yes and it's a very serious issue that is rooted in misogyny"
Hence why within a patriarchy cannot exist such thing as a "rape culture against men", at least it cannot exist a rape culture normalizing the "rape" of men by women: rape is dominance, and women are the oppressed class, so there cannot be such thing as "oppressed class that use dominance on the oppressors' class".
Rape of men by women can exist (though it's extremely rare) as an individual crime but it isn't encouraged by societal attitudes.

^

this right here is why women keep getting away with raping men.

[The balkens]

Rape of men by women can exist (though it's extremely rare)

You know, making demonstrably false statements that have been proven to you as demonstrably wrong with various sources over many years is really annoying.

Its amazing that we have the internet and people STILL choose ignorance when a world of Information, Porn, cat videos, porn, Street fighting videos, porn, rachet shit, more porn and other varieties of porn, exist.

[Miarie]

It only exists in the west in the form of US prisons, other than that it is another pointless buzzword like fascism or cultural marxism.

[Greater Orensta]

No, roll credits

[New Edom]

Alright, but is my thread doing that?

There are two main issues I've brought up here, and yes I am rather obsessed with them becaus I think they're important.

The first is the tendency of feminists to frame all discussions of rape and abuse as being about female victims and male perpetrators. I would like for this to shift and for it to be recognized that there is a consistent failure on the part of our society's broader conversations to focus on women who are abusive and on boys and men as victims, particularly when they're victims of females.

The second is that I think that rape culture theory is not as imnportant as RAINN's approach to wanting to deal with things like campus rape for instance, where practical sollutions in my opinion outweigh social philosophy. The fact that feminists tend to frame such arguments as misogyny or ignorance moves the discussions away from common grounad and solutions towards insisting on cultural shifts as the primary focus, even where the ideas confuse people and cause deeper divisions.

That being said, I hope you can see that the aim here is not simply to attack feminism, but rather a public disagreement with a theory that is used to propose public policy.

I think my problem with how you frame your argument, and I don't know how many might agree with me, is your blanket use of the term "feminist".

It's who you identify all of the problems with and it how many here would identify themselves, myself included, yet it is not a representative term.

It's like if I used "racist" and "right-winger's" interchangeably because all racists I know of are right wing.

I might agree with you if the word were not so prevalently identified with the issues I've named. If you go to 95% of websites, and arguably all of the main hits you get in a search, you'll find feminsts defining rape issues and sexual misconduct issues as part of rape culture. If you look at popular news media sites that present feminist information, you'll find the same thing. I actually often do acknowledge that there are feminists that don't treat the issue this way, but the public voices they represent are a minority and are often attacked by the majority.

[New Edom]

So are you saying that the theory of rape culture should just be believed as though it were an often proven scientific theory and never even questioned as you might a scientific theory?

Where did I say this? How dishonest.

I'm simply annoyed that there's a new anti-feminist thread were we basically talk about the same thing every other day.

Then don't post or read it.

[The balkens]

Where did I say this? How dishonest.

I'm simply annoyed that there's a new anti-feminist thread were we basically talk about the same thing every other day.

Then don't post or read it.

YOU MEAN THERES A CHOICE!?

A BASIC HUMAN FUNCTION!?

HOLY SHIT.

[Wallenburg]

Where did I say this? How dishonest.

I'm simply annoyed that there's a new anti-feminist thread were we basically talk about the same thing every other day.

Then don't post or read it.

"Agree with me or fuck off" isn't an argument.

[Miarie]

Then don't post or read it.

YOU MEAN THERES A CHOICE!?

A BASIC HUMAN FUNCTION!?

HOLY SHIT.

WE DON'T HAVE TO DO THINGS WE DON'T LIKE!?

STOP THE MOTHER FUCKING PRESSES!