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Is "Conversion Therapy" Child Abuse?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Should "conversion therapy" be considered child abuse?

Yes
289
81%
No
58
16%
Unsure/ undecided
12
3%
 
Total votes : 359

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Socialist Nordia
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Is "Conversion Therapy" Child Abuse?

Postby Socialist Nordia » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:36 am

http://www.hrc.org/resources/the-lies-a ... ve-therapy
So-called “conversion therapy,” sometimes known as “reparative therapy,” is a range of dangerous and discredited practices that falsely claim to change a person’s sexual orientation or gender identity or expression. Such practices have been rejected by every mainstream medical and mental health organization for decades, but due to continuing discrimination and societal bias against LGBTQ people, some practitioners continue to conduct conversion therapy. Minors are especially vulnerable, and conversion therapy can lead to depression, anxiety, drug use, homelessness, and suicide.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/ ... y-platform

Let me start by saying this: Gay conversion does not work. Homosexuality is not a choice that can be discouraged, nor a mental illness to be cured. That being said, it's distressing to see that a major US political party is considering showing support for this in its platform. Even more disturbing, is that only a handful of states have banned this procedure, leaving the majority of the American LGBT population at risk.

Aside from its futility, conversion therapy can cause intense mental stress, along with depression and suicidal thoughts. The long term mental damage is a horrible consequence.

In my view, sending your child to one of these "conversion therapy" camps is not religious freedom, nor parental rights. It is simply psychological abuse. Conversion therapy should be banned, and considered a form of child abuse. The mental and emotional damage caused is immense, and sometimes irreparable. Those who send allow their children to suffer this damage should potentially lose custody.

Please discuss.
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Belgi
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Postby Belgi » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:39 am

it does work - if what you want is create a homicidal suicidal maniac. then it totally works.

... also don't vote trump... or hilary. just... don't vote. then they can't blame you for anything. you're fucked either way. :(

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Yodle
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Postby Yodle » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:41 am

Belgi wrote:it does work - if what you want is create a homicidal suicidal maniac. then it totally works.

... also don't vote trump... or hilary. just... don't vote. then they can't blame you for anything. you're fucked either way. :(

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Socialist Nordia
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Postby Socialist Nordia » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:41 am

Belgi wrote:it does work - if what you want is create a homicidal suicidal maniac. then it totally works.

... also don't vote trump... or hilary. just... don't vote. then they can't blame you for anything. you're fucked either way. :(

Often conversion therapy scares people into hiding their homosexuality, but it never actually changes it. I'm not sure why you brought up Trump and Hillary, but whatever.
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Postby Socialist Nordia » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:42 am

ALL DISCUSSION OF THE 2016 ELECTION SHOULD STOP. THAT IS IN MY SIG, NOT THE TOPIC OF THE THREAD.
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Postby Yodle » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:45 am

Socialist Nordia wrote:ALL DISCUSSION OF THE 2016 ELECTION SHOULD STOP. THAT IS IN MY SIG, NOT THE TOPIC OF THE THREAD.

Sorry XDD Conversion therapy is extremely disturbing, I think I read somewhere that they're trying to classify it as a "medical treatment" so that parents can force their kids to undergo it against their will (since parents have the medical authority over their children if they're still under 18).
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Socialist Nordia
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Postby Socialist Nordia » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:49 am

Yodle wrote:
Socialist Nordia wrote:ALL DISCUSSION OF THE 2016 ELECTION SHOULD STOP. THAT IS IN MY SIG, NOT THE TOPIC OF THE THREAD.

Sorry XDD Conversion therapy is extremely disturbing, I think I read somewhere that they're trying to classify it as a "medical treatment" so that parents can force their kids to undergo it against their will (since parents have the medical authority over their children if they're still under 18).

It's sick. This is by no means a legitimate medical procedure.
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Postby Gauthier » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:49 am

The Republican Party platform previewed so far makes it clear they consider conversion therapy a valid option for families.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be a pan-Islamic plot and proof of Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of loners who do not represent their belief system at all.
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Postby Oil exporting People » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:56 am

Socialist Nordia wrote:Let me start by saying this: Gay conversion does not work.


Except for numerous ex-Gay individuals, such as "Roe".

Homosexuality is not a choice that can be discouraged, nor a mental illness to be cured.


Show me the proof being Gay isn't a choice. After 25 years of research, they've yet to find the "gay gene".

Even more disturbing, is that only a handful of states have banned this procedure, leaving the majority of the American LGBT population at risk.


If an adult person who identifies as Gay wants to undergo the therapy, I don't see any reason to prevent that. As for underage individuals, as long as there is nothing like electro-shock or such going on, I again see no issues.
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Postby Unified Governments » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:59 am

Yodle wrote:
Belgi wrote:it does work - if what you want is create a homicidal suicidal maniac. then it totally works.

... also don't vote trump... or hilary. just... don't vote. then they can't blame you for anything. you're fucked either way. :(

Vote third party! Jill Stein 2016

*gag*

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Postby Nariterrr » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:01 pm

If you want to convert to heterosexuality as an adult, that's your free will and I can't stop you.

You want your children to do that, HELL NO.
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Postby Gauthier » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:03 pm

Sending your child to psychological torture because you suspect he or she might be "fruity". Real parental love there folks. *snort*
Crimes committed by Muslims will be a pan-Islamic plot and proof of Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of loners who do not represent their belief system at all.
The probability of one's participation in homosexual acts is directly proportional to one's public disdain and disgust for homosexuals.
If a political figure makes an accusation of wrongdoing without evidence, odds are probable that the accuser or an associate thereof has in fact committed the very same act, possibly to a worse degree.
Where is your God-Emperor now?

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Postby Godular » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:03 pm

Gauthier wrote:The Republican Party platform previewed so far makes it clear they consider conversion therapy a valid option for families.


Which only serves to further evidence a marked detachment from reality.

Conversion therapy is an abomination to the degree that it tempts me to return to religion long enough that I can take seriously the idea that those who operate such a horrid practice or take advantage of it will be VERY surprised when they discover where they wind up after they part from this mortal coil.

But I can't do that, so I'll settle for the hope to see justice done.
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Postby Gauthier » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:04 pm

Godular wrote:
Gauthier wrote:The Republican Party platform previewed so far makes it clear they consider conversion therapy a valid option for families.


Which only serves to further evidence a marked detachment from reality.

Conversion therapy is an abomination to the degree that it tempts me to return to religion long enough that I can take seriously the idea that those who operate such a horrid practice or take advantage of it will be VERY surprised when they discover where they wind up after they part from this mortal coil.

But I can't do that, so I'll settle for the hope to see justice done.


Just keep in mind the Inverse Function of Homosexuality. It's just a matter of time before it catches up to at least one gay conversion outfit.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be a pan-Islamic plot and proof of Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of loners who do not represent their belief system at all.
The probability of one's participation in homosexual acts is directly proportional to one's public disdain and disgust for homosexuals.
If a political figure makes an accusation of wrongdoing without evidence, odds are probable that the accuser or an associate thereof has in fact committed the very same act, possibly to a worse degree.
Where is your God-Emperor now?

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Postby Godular » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:05 pm

Gauthier wrote:
Godular wrote:
Which only serves to further evidence a marked detachment from reality.

Conversion therapy is an abomination to the degree that it tempts me to return to religion long enough that I can take seriously the idea that those who operate such a horrid practice or take advantage of it will be VERY surprised when they discover where they wind up after they part from this mortal coil.

But I can't do that, so I'll settle for the hope to see justice done.


Just keep in mind the Inverse Function of Homosexuality. It's just a matter of time before it catches up to at least one gay conversion outfit.


I prefer to call it the Shakespearian Protest Rule.
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Socialist Nordia
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Postby Socialist Nordia » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:09 pm

Oil exporting People wrote:
Socialist Nordia wrote:Let me start by saying this: Gay conversion does not work.


Except for numerous ex-Gay individuals, such as "Roe".

Homosexuality is not a choice that can be discouraged, nor a mental illness to be cured.


Show me the proof being Gay isn't a choice. After 25 years of research, they've yet to find the "gay gene".

Even more disturbing, is that only a handful of states have banned this procedure, leaving the majority of the American LGBT population at risk.


If an adult person who identifies as Gay wants to undergo the therapy, I don't see any reason to prevent that. As for underage individuals, as long as there is nothing like electro-shock or such going on, I again see no issues.


I mean, you could just trust the LGB community and their personal accounts. But, whatever.
http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/ ... ot-choice/
https://www.theguardian.com/science/blo ... al-with-it

And, it often causes mental damage and is very harmful.
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Postby Oil exporting People » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:13 pm

Socialist Nordia wrote:I mean, you could just trust the LGB community and their personal accounts. But, whatever.


That's basically the "Because I say so!" argument, and it isn't convincing.

http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/31/modern-science-says-homosexuality-not-choice/
https://www.theguardian.com/science/blo ... al-with-it

And, it often causes mental damage and is very harmful.


You need to read your sources. The Guardian article specifically stated only one of four studies even found any markers at all, and still no "gay gene".
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Postby Godular » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:19 pm

Oil exporting People wrote:
Socialist Nordia wrote:I mean, you could just trust the LGB community and their personal accounts. But, whatever.


That's basically the "Because I say so!" argument, and it isn't convincing.


The same could be said of testimonials... like that one you linked.

http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/31/modern-science-says-homosexuality-not-choice/
https://www.theguardian.com/science/blo ... al-with-it

And, it often causes mental damage and is very harmful.


You need to read your sources. The Guardian article specifically stated only one of four studies even found any markers at all, and still no "gay gene".


I like how you look at genes as if they're some kind of on/off switch. Very... quaint? Hmm that doesn't seem like the right word. I'll have to think on this conundrum.
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Postby Socialist Nordia » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:22 pm

Oil exporting People wrote:
Socialist Nordia wrote:I mean, you could just trust the LGB community and their personal accounts. But, whatever.


That's basically the "Because I say so!" argument, and it isn't convincing.

http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/31/modern-science-says-homosexuality-not-choice/
https://www.theguardian.com/science/blo ... al-with-it

And, it often causes mental damage and is very harmful.


You need to read your sources. The Guardian article specifically stated only one of four studies even found any markers at all, and still no "gay gene".

http://www.livescience.com/50058-being- ... hoice.html
Of course they haven't found the specific gene yet, if it is a gene. Do you have any idea how many genes there are? They're still looking. Homosexuality isn't a choice. And if it was, I still wouldn't support gay conversion therapy because it is your right to make that choice.
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Postby Orberstine » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:24 pm

Nariterrr wrote:If you want to convert to heterosexuality as an adult, that's your free will and I can't stop you.

You want your children to do that, HELL NO.

Convert? When did this become a religion?
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Postby Gauthier » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:25 pm

Orberstine wrote:
Nariterrr wrote:If you want to convert to heterosexuality as an adult, that's your free will and I can't stop you.

You want your children to do that, HELL NO.

Convert? When did this become a religion?


It's a religion to believe that people can choose their sexual orientation exactly like what clothes they want to wear.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be a pan-Islamic plot and proof of Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of loners who do not represent their belief system at all.
The probability of one's participation in homosexual acts is directly proportional to one's public disdain and disgust for homosexuals.
If a political figure makes an accusation of wrongdoing without evidence, odds are probable that the accuser or an associate thereof has in fact committed the very same act, possibly to a worse degree.
Where is your God-Emperor now?

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Postby Yodle » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:26 pm

Oil exporting People wrote:
Socialist Nordia wrote:I mean, you could just trust the LGB community and their personal accounts. But, whatever.


That's basically the "Because I say so!" argument, and it isn't convincing.

http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/31/modern-science-says-homosexuality-not-choice/
https://www.theguardian.com/science/blo ... al-with-it

And, it often causes mental damage and is very harmful.


You need to read your sources. The Guardian article specifically stated only one of four studies even found any markers at all, and still no "gay gene".

Here's a thought exercise that may help you understand this, imagine conversion therapy to make you gay. If it's "a choice," then you can choose to be gay right? Imagine being forced to watch gay porn until you're sexually attracted by it, and then being forced to undergo disturbing aversion therapy in which they show you sexually explicit photos of women, then shock you or do some sort of negative stimulus to make you feel aversion toward women. Do you honestly think that would work in making you sexually attracted to men and unattracted to women? Because that's what conversion therapy is.

Also.. Is there a depression gene? Anyone can get depression, even if they're not genetically exposed to it. There's no such thing as a gay gene, essentially because if there was such thing as a gay gene then by definition all humans would have it and by simply turning it on with certain biochemical interactions you'd turn gay. All humans have the same genes, just different expressions of those genes, and with different expressions come infinite possibilities of outcomes.. Including different sexual orientation. If you believe it's a choice then you have to admit that you personally can choose to be attracted to the same gender if you wanted to..
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Postby Xadufell » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:28 pm

Gauthier wrote:
Orberstine wrote:Convert? When did this become a religion?


It's a religion to believe that people can choose their sexual orientation exactly like what clothes they want to wear.


Well that's how modern feminists are.

You dare insult me? Well I'm a genderqueer nonbinary transabled transsexual genderfluid otherkin, check your privilege.
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Postby Socialist Nordia » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:30 pm

Xadufell wrote:
Gauthier wrote:
It's a religion to believe that people can choose their sexual orientation exactly like what clothes they want to wear.


Well that's how modern feminists are.

You dare insult me? Well I'm a genderqueer nonbinary transabled transsexual genderfluid otherkin, check your privilege.


What do you have against genderqueer non binary transabled transsexual gender fluid otherkin? And how is this relevant? Why are we talking about feminism?
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Postby Gauthier » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:31 pm

Socialist Nordia wrote:
Xadufell wrote:
Well that's how modern feminists are.

You dare insult me? Well I'm a genderqueer nonbinary transabled transsexual genderfluid otherkin, check your privilege.


What do you have against genderqueer non binary transabled transsexual gender fluid otherkin? And how is this relevant? Why are we talking about feminism?


Any chance to remind people that feminists are oppressive testicle-chopping monsters no doubt.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be a pan-Islamic plot and proof of Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of loners who do not represent their belief system at all.
The probability of one's participation in homosexual acts is directly proportional to one's public disdain and disgust for homosexuals.
If a political figure makes an accusation of wrongdoing without evidence, odds are probable that the accuser or an associate thereof has in fact committed the very same act, possibly to a worse degree.
Where is your God-Emperor now?

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