Turkey thread: now stuffed with more authoritarianism!

[Llamalandia]

Then why launch a coup at all? A coup will provoke a reaction by default.

The purpose of a coup is to eliminate the government. Had they shot down his plane it certainly would have gone better. (Friday evening was as stupid time to launch it too, that is when people are out at the Mosques.

That's the point.

Erdogan staged the coup to provoke a reaction among his people in his support so he now has the political capital he needs to purge his enemies.

This false flag narrative seems a bit complicated and unnecessary. Erdogan already has enough support plus us and eu as allies. Staging a coup against himself to boost his poll numbers is not entirely out of the realm of possibility but seems rather unlikely.

[Llamalandia]

Feel like erdogan was quick to try to minimize the coup. Sure, not the best coup attempt, but this went far enough to disrupt anti isis operations run at encerlic (spelling) airbase. Not sure Turkish military leadership would be any better than erdogan unfortunately.
Curious about the international legality of the coup as well. They killed police which seem like they would be civilian targets, on the other hand they are also armed and support the regime so maybe they were fair game. Not sure.
Clearly though turkey has issues it needs to work on.

Erdogan has so far proven to be the biggest disruption for operations against Daesh.

Well he's not the best partner (and he has that whole antikurdish thing goin on). Apparently the turkish commander at encerlic was a part of the coup though. That probably doesn't make the usa look very good right now. It will be interesting to see how relations unfold especially woth the US holding a cleric who erdogan claims was behind the coup.

[Corrian]

So what is the most sane country in the middle east at this point? Seems like everywhere is going to hell there, except like Jordan which I don't ever hear anything going bad at. Though I think they have their own problems with the refugee crisis...

[Geilinor]

So what is the most sane country in the middle east at this point? Seems like everywhere is going to hell there, except like Jordan which I don't ever hear anything going bad at. Though I think they have their own problems with the refugee crisis...

Israel, even though Netanyahu is annoying and not helping peace.

[The Two Jerseys]

So what is the most sane country in the middle east at this point? Seems like everywhere is going to hell there, except like Jordan which I don't ever hear anything going bad at. Though I think they have their own problems with the refugee crisis...

Probably Israel. Yeah, they may have problems with the Palestinians, but it's not like they have to worry about some internal faction overthrowing the government.

[Corrian]

I'm not sure if it is a good thing when Israel is considered the sane one.

[Geilinor]

But why did they not shoot his jet down? Were they just stupid?

So much about this coup makes no sense.

Maybe they didn't want to provoke too much of a reaction?

Erodgan is the AKP's purpose for existing. If they wanted a coup, that was their best chance.

[G-Tech Corporation]

I'm not sure if it is a good thing when Israel is considered the sane one.

Yeah. They aren't the most compassionate or kindhearted of nations, but the best thing we can say is that they're consistently pro-democracy, and radicalized Israelis aren't likely to detonate a bomb in Times Square.

[Tule]

They weren't playing BF4. You don't think "fuck it, I'll just shoot the wing a bit", especially since that could have brought the aircraft down anyway.

Probably would have, considering the rate of fire of the M61 Vulcan carried by the F-16.

"I'll just lightly tap the trigg... BRRAAAAAP! o shit."

[San Marlindo]

Very interesting that people on this thread seem to be saying Jordan and Israel are the two most stable countries in the Middle East right now, despite also being two of the most heavily militarized. Coincidence?

[Esperantujo 2]

The fact that Obama came out against the coup does not prove that NATO or the US military-industrial complex were not involved in some way. Since Turkey joined NATO there have been 4 successful coups in that country. Although the government has redesignated its ideology from Islamism to Conservatism, and joined the Anglo-Polish ACR right-wing political alliance, this not mean it is trusted by the western political establishment. Turkey was involved in arming Syrian opposition groups, and it appears that many of these arms landed in the hands of the Daesh. NATO governments openly supported the coup against the democratically elected Morsi government in Egypt.
The western strategy is to destabilise the Middle East, to prevent the liberation of Israeli occupied territories, but not too much, because that leaves the door open to extreme movements like Daesh. This strategy is hard to implement.
It seems that Erdogan is using the coup attempt to crack down on all opposition, including judges, not just the coup plotters.
In my mind, this resembles the attempted coup against Gorbachev. Whether the neo-Stalinists or the Yeltsinites won, the Russian people lost out, and it's the same with the Turkish people today.
Obama and Kerry would have come out in support of whichever side won, IMHO.

[The Two Jerseys]

Very interesting that people on this thread seem to be saying Jordan and Israel are the two most stable countries in the Middle East right now, despite also being two of the most heavily militarized. Coincidence?

Having pretty sane leaders also seems to help.

[Geilinor]

The fact that Obama came out against the coup does not prove that NATO or the US military-industrial complex were not involved in some way. Since Turkey joined NATO there have been 4 successful coups in that country. Although the government has redesignated its ideology from Islamism to Conservatism, and joined the Anglo-Polish ACR right-wing political alliance, this not mean it is trusted by the western political establishment. Turkey was involved in arming Syrian opposition groups, and it appears that many of these arms landed in the hands of the Daesh. NATO governments openly supported the coup against the democratically elected Morsi government in Egypt.
The western strategy is to destabilise the Middle East, to prevent the liberation of Israeli occupied territories, but not too much, because that leaves the door open to extreme movements like Daesh. This strategy is hard to implement.
It seems that Erdogan is using the coup attempt to crack down on all opposition, including judges, not just the coup plotters.
In my mind, this resembles the attempted coup against Gorbachev. Whether the neo-Stalinists or the Yeltsinites won, the Russian people lost out, and it's the same with the Turkish people today.
Obama and Kerry would have come out in support of whichever side won, IMHO.

The AKP has not really changed their ideology from Islamism to conservatism. They're moving more towards Islamism in recent years despite their protests otherwise.

[Calimera II]

Maybe they didn't want to provoke too much of a reaction?

Erodgan is the AKP's purpose for existing. If they wanted a coup, that was their best chance.

In Turkey stories are quite credible stories are circulating that the coup intentions were leaked, and that the army, not totally prepared, was forced to kick Erdogan out of office directly.

Erdogan got his Reichtstag Fire.

[Unified Governments]

You can find such furniture in Erdogan's hideous illegal palace.

Gah. Look at them. Two horrible leaders sitting right next to each other. Disgusting.

[Calimera II]

Gah. Look at them. Two horrible leaders sitting right next to each other. Disgusting.

Merkel a horrible leader? Whut.

[Republic of the Cristo]

I think I saw somewhere a conspiracy theory stating that the Coup was an attempt to destabilize Turkey to the point were they could no longer continue in bombing ISIS targets. This was done by the CIA of course, who created ISIS in order to Balkanize the middle east to the point of never being able to pose a threat to American interests.

[The Two Jerseys]

I think I saw somewhere a conspiracy theory stating that the Coup was an attempt to destabilize Turkey to the point were they could no longer continue in bombing ISIS targets. This was done by the CIA of course, who created ISIS in order to Balkanize the middle east to the point of never being able to pose a threat to American interests.

Don't know who came up with that one, but their game is weak even for a conspiracy theorist.

[Guyanes]

Exactly. Erdogan is doing all of the things Hitler has done before WWII. Now he just needs to invade another country (Syria) and pretend they are attacking Turkey.... He already has controlled the media, the legal and political structures.

Maybe if Erdogan starts making Kurds wear badges in public it'll be more plausible.

No I think he will go straight to the genocide. They are already endlessly persecuted by Turkish authorities. Some might say the genocide of Kurds in Turkey is already happening. It will get worse now after this coup attempt. He will find a way to blame them and link them and persecute them further.

[Republic of the Cristo]

I think I saw somewhere a conspiracy theory stating that the Coup was an attempt to destabilize Turkey to the point were they could no longer continue in bombing ISIS targets. This was done by the CIA of course, who created ISIS in order to Balkanize the middle east to the point of never being able to pose a threat to American interests.

Don't know who came up with that one, but their game is weak even for a conspiracy theorist.

I think it's one of the more realistic conspiracy theories. But realistic has never exactly been fun now has it? Throw in something about dragons and Bungee actually being controlled by the Covenant and then we have got a conspiracy theory!

[The Two Jerseys]

Don't know who came up with that one, but their game is weak even for a conspiracy theorist.

I think it's one of the more realistic conspiracy theories. But realistic has never exactly been fun now has it? Throw in something about dragons and Bungee actually being controlled by the Covenant and then we have got a conspiracy theory!

Realistic, yes, but I was actually implying that the whole "US is Balkanizing the Mid East to stop ISIS" thing would be pretty counterproductive in reality.

[Republic of the Cristo]

I think it's one of the more realistic conspiracy theories. But realistic has never exactly been fun now has it? Throw in something about dragons and Bungee actually being controlled by the Covenant and then we have got a conspiracy theory!

Realistic, yes, but I was actually implying that the whole "US is Balkanizing the Mid East to stop ISIS" thing would be pretty counterproductive in reality.

No no, the US is using ISIS to Balkanize the middle east. That is the conspiracy theory.

[The Two Jerseys]

Realistic, yes, but I was actually implying that the whole "US is Balkanizing the Mid East to stop ISIS" thing would be pretty counterproductive in reality.

No no, the US is using ISIS to Balkanize the middle east. That is the conspiracy theory.

That's...also pretty counterproductive in reality...

[Souseiseki]

Very interesting that people on this thread seem to be saying Jordan and Israel are the two most stable countries in the Middle East right now, despite also being two of the most heavily militarized. Coincidence?

yes, actually.

[Baltenstein]

I think I saw somewhere a conspiracy theory stating that the Coup was an attempt to destabilize Turkey to the point were they could no longer continue in bombing ISIS targets. This was done by the CIA of course, who created ISIS in order to Balkanize the middle east to the point of never being able to pose a threat to American interests.

Don't know who came up with that one, but their game is weak even for a conspiracy theorist.

Probably the same people who came up with the "Greater Israel" conspiracy theory which has been stating - for decades now - that Israel is fracturing the Middle East on purpose in order to expand its territory from the Nile to the Euphrat and that those two rivers are in fact represented by the two blue lines in Israel's flag.