Truck Drives Through Crowd in Nice, France

[Dragonia Re Xzua]

My condolences to the people of Nice. I wish I could say something lighthearted in this instance, but I've given up a long time ago. Terror attacks will continue and will only get worse.

80 people died and your first worry is "islamophobia"

Well we wouldn't want dead innocent people to overshadow Gauthier's motherly virtue signalling concern for muslims now would we?

At this point I wonder if Gauthier merely comments on threads like these just so that he can increase his post count via "hurr durr, dez durty islamophobz" comments or just to make an ass out of himself and everyone else in the thread.

[Olerand]

French media reports that the terrorist is Tunisian and living in France, and not Franco-Tunisian.

Edit: He was also known by the police for multiple crimes, but no connections to Islamist rings.

[Implacable Death]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_terrorism

The Nationalist Socialist Council of Nagaland (NSCN) is also a Christian[55] Naga nationalist Militant group operating in North India.[56][57] The main aim of the organization is to establish a sovereign Christian state, "Nagalim"[58] unifying all the areas inhabited by the Naga people in Northeast India and Burma.[59] The organization's slogan is "Nagaland for Christ".[60][61][62][63][64][65] Its manifesto is based on the principle of Socialism for economic development and a Baptist Christian religious outlook ‘Nagaland for Christ’.[66] In some of their documents the NSCN has called for recognizing only Christianity in Nagalim.[67] They believe in Christian theocracy.[68] The NSCN has been declared a terrorist organisation in India under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) Act, 1967.[69] It is believed that the organisation primarily raises funds through trafficking drugs from Burma and selling smuggled weapons to other insurgent groups in the region.[70] The group reportedly indulges in kidnapping, extortion and other terrorist activities.[71][72][73][74][75][76][77][78][79] NSCN is accused of carrying out the 1992–1993 ethnic cleansing of Kuki tribes in Manipur, said to have leave over 900 people dead. During that NSCN-IM operation, 350 Kuki villages were driven out and about 100,000 Kukis were turned into refugees[80]

On 3 August 2015 NSCN leader T. Muivah signed a peace accord with the Government of India in the presence of Prime Minister Narendra Modi, Home Minister Rajnath Singh, and NSA Ajit Doval.[81]

I'm not sayin I'm just sayin'

You can't compare the two.

[Aurea]

My thoughts to France.

Another attack? The country cannot catch its breath before someone tries to attack it again? Why France so much? It seems more targeted than any other country in Europe.

I hope they catch and bring to justice all those involved in this terrible act of terror and I hope the injured recovered. Yet again, France will have to mourn the dead from terror attacks.

And on Bastille day...

[Dameth]

You can't compare the two.

Did I ? I just pasted a link in response to someone who asked where the christian barbarians were. It's an element of response.

I can't recall Jesus saying stuff like "if someone hits you on the cheeks, cut his lips off, rape his wife and make his kid a child soldier", yet this things happen.
Maybe the specifics of the religion of this or that barbarian is not the point we should focus on. Maybe applying theology and text studies to a modern territorial conflict is using the wrong key to understand the situation.

I don't know. I'm just some dude over the internet.

[Mefpan]

French media reports that the terrorist is Tunisian and living in France, and not Franco-Tunisian.

Edit: He was also known by the police for multiple crimes, but no connections to Islamist rings.

So there we have it. He was doing for other motives than religious one.

Technically, it says nothing of the sort. Since I'm struggling to imagine a motive that a regular crime without political goals could have that would necessitate killing over 70 people, I'll remain skeptical.

[Napkiraly]

French media reports that the terrorist is Tunisian and living in France, and not Franco-Tunisian.

Edit: He was also known by the police for multiple crimes, but no connections to Islamist rings.

So there we have it. He was doing for other motives than religious one.

Or that he was a lone wolf.

[The Black Forrest]

French media reports that the terrorist is Tunisian and living in France, and not Franco-Tunisian.

Edit: He was also known by the police for multiple crimes, but no connections to Islamist rings.

So there we have it. He was doing for other motives than religious one.

A sick bastard who wanted glory/infamy to make up for their pathetic existence.

He will achieve it as the media will dig and report every conceivable piece of information.

[Roskian Federation]

It is clear that France itself is under seige by radicals who wish to threaten peace and liberty.

We must do more than denounce faiths and kill terrorists, we must act against the root causes of terrorism.

[Atomic Utopia]

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/06/19/gaffe-century-nyt-says-st-paul-ordered-christians-execute-homosexuals/
Some more

Yes while this will forever taint my view of him, doesn't change the fact that Christians aren't the ones throwing gay people of roofs.

The denial of radical Christian anti-gay sentiment is rather impressive.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/201 ... law-uganda
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la ... story.html

So no, the slaughter of homosexuals is not only an Islamic problem.

[Felrik]

Yes while this will forever taint my view of him, doesn't change the fact that Christians aren't the ones throwing gay people of roofs.

The denial of radical Christian anti-gay sentiment is rather impressive.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/201 ... law-uganda
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la ... story.html

So no, the slaughter of homosexuals is not only an Islamic problem.

I guess I was wrong.

[The Black Forrest]

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/06/19/gaffe-century-nyt-says-st-paul-ordered-christians-execute-homosexuals/
Some more

Yes while this will forever taint my view of him, doesn't change the fact that Christians aren't the ones throwing gay people of roofs.

Well not really. They tend to like "fag bashing" and dragging them behind trucks. You have to go to the lessor developed Christian countries were they do worse things(Uganda comes to mind. Much of their laws were guided by American Christians).

[Liriena]

And what exactly do you want the rest of Muslims to do? Do you want hundreds of millions of them to grab a rifle and march into Mosul?

Well, now that you mention it, that would definitely be nice, yes.

Do you believe that the lack of such an event means the Islamic faith as a whole is violent and hateful, or enabling of violence and hate? Do you believe that, if a significant percentage of over a billion people is not actively fighting a war against one specific terrorist organization, that means that all Muslims are somehow morally culprit for the actions of said organization?

Do you hold any other vast and diverse community to that same standard?

A bit more apt... but still very much debatable. For one, the largest Christian denomination continues to treat homosexuality as a sin (when not as a disease of sorts)

You're a little behind the times.

You mean, as opposed to the church of "no condoms for Africa" and "women should die rather than terminate a dangerous pregnancy"?

The Catholic Church respects and loves the homosexual person the same as it does the heterosexual. Catholicism teaches that homosexual people must be treated with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every act or thought of hatred, violence, or persecution toward the homosexual is condemned.

The Church opposes same-sex unions based on Genesis 1:25–28: "God created man in his own image….male and female he created them… and God said, 'Be fruitful and multiply' " and Genesis 2:24, " a man shall be joined to his wife, and they shall become one flesh." Jesus himself uses these same quotation in Mark 10:6–9 when asked about marriage.

Directly from the Catechism:

Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that 'homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered'. They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God's will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord's Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection

Notice how homosexuality is repeatedly referred to as "disordered".

and continues to encourage anti-scientific practices that only serve to worsen the HIV/AIDS pandemic in several regions of the world. And Orthodox Judaism remains orthodox and numerous.

Gonna need some facts and specifics for that one, because Catholicism is certainly not anti-science as a whole

Historically, Catholics are numbered among the most important scientists of all time, including Rene Descartes, who discovered analytic geometry and the laws of refraction; Blaise Pascal, inventor of the adding machine, hydraulic press, and the mathematical theory of probabilities; Augustinian priest Gregor Mendel, who founded modern genetics; Louis Pasteur, founder of microbiology and creator of the first vaccine for rabies and anthrax; and cleric Nicolaus Copernicus, who first developed scientifically the view that the earth rotated around the sun.

One might try to explain such distinguished Catholic scientists as rare individuals who dared to rebel against the institutional Church, which opposes science. However, the Catholic Church as an institution funds, sponsors, and supports scientific research in the Pontifical Academy of Science and in the departments of science found in every Catholic university across the world, including those governed by Roman Catholic bishops, such as The Catholic University of America. This financial and institutional support of science by the Church began at the very birth of science in seventeenth-century Europe and continues today. Even Church buildings themselves were not only used for religious purposes but designed in part to foster scientific knowledge. As Thomas Woods notes:

I was referring, in particular, to the Church's teachings on matters of sexuality.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/sep/11/bad-science-pope-anti-condom

[Felrik]

The news channel here in Australia is saying that Islamic state is claiming responsibility for the attack, Pretty sure they didn't organised it.

[Liriena]

Many Jihadists are actually from wealthy or elite families, so I don't think Islamic fundamentalism is tied to poverty at all. I think the madrassahs are to blame and the proliferation of Wahhabism needs to be rolled back or seriously challenged for it to wane in support.

It's encouraged by the Saudi's, in a play to grow influence. They control the charity, and this, control the message to the poor.

I said it once and I say it again: #dropSaudiArabia

If you sincerely want to put an end to Islamic fundamentalism, and not just use it as a cudgel against all Muslims, Saudi Arabia is at the root of the problem.

[Liriena]

The insinuation that Islam is culturally backward is ignorant and bigoted. I will not debate it.

Sorry it's also true.

No. Referring to a culture as "backward" is decisively inaccurate, anthropologically speaking, on top of an anachronism with a most unfortunate history of serving the modern European ethnocentrism.

[Liriena]

The news channel here in Australia is saying that Islamic state is claiming responsibility for the attack, Pretty sure they didn't organised it.

ISIS claimed responsibility for Orlando as well. At this point, I'm sure they'd retroactively claim responsibility for 9/11 if they could get away with it. It's their thing: They don't seem to actually have the capabilities to regularly organize attacks in all of Europe or the United States, so they use the actions of lone wolves to push the narrative that they are, in fact, everywhere, and pose a serious threat to the West's very existence. In that regard, they are amazing propagandists.

[Napkiraly]

Sorry it's also true.

No. Referring to a culture as "backward" is decisively inaccurate, anthropologically speaking, on top of an anachronism with a most unfortunate history of serving the modern European ethnocentrism.

So the kind of culture Trump wants to create isn't backwards to you? How about people wishing to strip away women's, LGBTQ, and minority rights aren't backwards?

[Blakullar]

At this stage I'm just beyond being outraged by this sort of thing.

It'll be the usual outpouring of grief, plus dickwaving by Western leaders promising to crack down on terrorists, yet LITERALLY NOTHING will be done about it because the elites that control the leaders make a profit from it. They see to the conquest of the Middle East in order to benefit from its oil and weapon sales, and the common folk end up dying for their profits. It's the same vicious cycle.

[MERIZoC]

No. Referring to a culture as "backward" is decisively inaccurate, anthropologically speaking, on top of an anachronism with a most unfortunate history of serving the modern European ethnocentrism.

So the kind of culture Trump wants to create isn't backwards to you? How about people wishing to strip away women's, LGBTQ, and minority rights aren't backwards?

I mean you can't really make any legitimate objective claim on the matter.....

Anthropology doesn't give a rats ass about "backwardness" because it's so subjective. Why bother discussing it?

[Liriena]

No. Referring to a culture as "backward" is decisively inaccurate, anthropologically speaking, on top of an anachronism with a most unfortunate history of serving the modern European ethnocentrism.

So the kind of culture Trump wants to create isn't backwards to you? How about people wishing to strip away women's, LGBTQ, and minority rights aren't backwards?

An ideology can be "backwards", insofar as it can be reactionary. Referring to a culture as "backwards", however, is simply bad anthropology.

The kind of culture Trump wants to create isn't "backwards" to me. It's many things, including hateful and stupid, but not "backwards".

[New Chalcedon]

The news channel here in Australia is saying that Islamic state is claiming responsibility for the attack, Pretty sure they didn't organised it.

ISIS claimed responsibility for Orlando as well. At this point, I'm sure they'd retroactively claim responsibility for 9/11 if they could get away with it. It's their thing: They don't seem to actually have the capabilities to regularly organize attacks in all of Europe or the United States, so they use the actions of lone wolves to push the narrative that they are, in fact, everywhere, and pose a serious threat to the West's very existence. In that regard, they are amazing propagandists.

And they're helped by our sensationalistic mass-media companies, who all gleefully peddle the "FEAR! FEAR! TERROR!" angle to sell more papers/TV adspace/etc. - if the media stopped feeding the FEAR!TERROR! narrative, those terrorist groups would lose. But then, so would the right-wing, xenophobic politicians who depend on FEAR!TERROR! to suppress a rational cost/benefit assessment of their policies. And since those right-wing politicians are the ones who wish to continue favourable treatment (in taxation, among other areas) of the media corp. owners, it's more reason to run with FEAR!TERROR!FEAR! narratives.

[Liriena]

ISIS claimed responsibility for Orlando as well. At this point, I'm sure they'd retroactively claim responsibility for 9/11 if they could get away with it. It's their thing: They don't seem to actually have the capabilities to regularly organize attacks in all of Europe or the United States, so they use the actions of lone wolves to push the narrative that they are, in fact, everywhere, and pose a serious threat to the West's very existence. In that regard, they are amazing propagandists.

And they're helped by our sensationalistic mass-media companies, who all gleefully peddle the "FEAR! FEAR! TERROR!" angle to sell more papers/TV adspace/etc. - if the media stopped feeding the FEAR!TERROR! narrative, those terrorist groups would lose. But then, so would the right-wing, xenophobic politicians who depend on FEAR!TERROR! to suppress a rational cost/benefit assessment of their policies. And since those right-wing politicians are the ones who wish to continue favourable treatment (in taxation, among other areas) of the media corp. owners, it's more reason to run with FEAR!TERROR!FEAR! narratives.

Agreed. Wholeheartedly.

[Napkiraly]

So the kind of culture Trump wants to create isn't backwards to you? How about people wishing to strip away women's, LGBTQ, and minority rights aren't backwards?

I mean you can't really make any legitimate objective claim on the matter.....

Anthropology doesn't give a rats ass about "backwardness" because it's so subjective. Why bother discussing it?

Of course you can't. However any progressive with a backbone will view such things as both immoral and harkening back to darker and more ignorant times - hence backwards. As it stands, Islam promotes a lot of that stuff and thus it promotes and establishes backwardness when its influence is rather significant in Muslim communities be it in the ME or here in the West. Being a minority community doesn't give them a free pass from criticism and derision on such matters if such views are widespread in their community. It's not different than when people do the same to the South, Midwest, Little England, etc.

[Napkiraly]

So the kind of culture Trump wants to create isn't backwards to you? How about people wishing to strip away women's, LGBTQ, and minority rights aren't backwards?

An ideology can be "backwards", insofar as it can be reactionary. Referring to a culture as "backwards", however, is simply bad anthropology.

The kind of culture Trump wants to create isn't "backwards" to me. It's many things, including hateful and stupid, but not "backwards".

Only true if the discussion is held within an anthropological context. From an ideological and personal cultural context it's rather different.