UK Referendum Thread [Moderator Sanctioned]

[Ostroeuropa]

Is the EU able to regulate the immigration of non EU peoples into EU countries? On a country by country basis or in general?
Like, can they say "EU member nation number 5 is only allowed to take in 10,000 people from any non-EU countries", or " Only 100,000 people will be allowed to emigrate to the EU in total"?

Genuine question btw, I don't know.

No.

If they could, "THE EWE IS STEALING OUT SOVEREIGNTY" types might have had a point.

That would be a preferable system. The one the EU used is absurd. The EU already stole our sovereignty by its current system by forcing us to always pander to the most open bordered nation in Europe, which when Germany shat the bed and had a panic attack about being Nazis because of hysterical progressives shouting at them about it, meant, all of Europe was forced to have no borders with the middle east or africa.

Forcing everyone to adhere to a single standard, instead of forcing everyone to accept the most liberal and progressive standard, would have been fairer.

A single standard would have meant we can vote in people to alter it. The one the EU used meant our votes didn't matter unless we were the most radically for open borders.

[The Peoples Republic of Kent]

[deleted]

[Imperializt Russia]

No.

If they could, "THE EWE IS STEALING OUT SOVEREIGNTY" types might have had a point.

That would be a preferable system. The one the EU used is absurd. The EU already stole our sovereignty by its current system by forcing us to always pander to the most open bordered nation in Europe, which when Germany shat the bed and had a panic attack about being Nazis because of hysterical progressives shouting at them about it, meant, all of Europe was forced to have no borders with the middle east or africa.

That didn't happen.

A single standard would have meant we can vote in people to alter it. The one the EU used meant our votes didn't matter unless we were the most radically for open borders.

That definitely didn't happen to the UK, because the UK wasn't in Schengen, which is the thing you seem to be strawmanning.

[Ostroeuropa]

That would be a preferable system. The one the EU used is absurd. The EU already stole our sovereignty by its current system by forcing us to always pander to the most open bordered nation in Europe, which when Germany shat the bed and had a panic attack about being Nazis because of hysterical progressives shouting at them about it, meant, all of Europe was forced to have no borders with the middle east or africa.

That didn't happen.

A single standard would have meant we can vote in people to alter it. The one the EU used meant our votes didn't matter unless we were the most radically for open borders.

That definitely didn't happen to the UK, because the UK wasn't in Schengen, which is the thing you seem to be strawmanning.

It did happen, and while we're not in Schengen, we're going to be forced to accept these immigrants when they inevitably refuse to go home and start applying for citizenship in the various continental countries they reside in. We have about 4 or 5 years to get out of the EU to prevent that.
The Schengen area though? It's fucked. You've seen how routine terrorism and rape attacks are there now. The only solution is either to change policy and pursue strict assimilation and be prepared to crack down on the inevitable protests from Islamic communities to break their will, or to deport them.

Otherwise, you're witnessing the decline of a civilization. It's rome V2.

[Alvecia]

Is the EU able to regulate the immigration of non EU peoples into EU countries? On a country by country basis or in general?
Like, can they say "EU member nation number 5 is only allowed to take in 10,000 people from any non-EU countries", or " Only 100,000 people will be allowed to emigrate to the EU in total"?

Genuine question btw, I don't know.

No.

If they could, "THE EWE IS STEALING OUT SOVEREIGNTY" types might have had a point.

I did some quick back of the envelope calculation based on the 2001 Census and EU immigrants accounted for 34.97% of foreign born citizens that year.
15.8% of total were Irish.
8.4% were German.

This is based off the top 20 countries. I like statistics.

[Imperializt Russia]

There's this thing called the Home Office, you might have heard of it.
Our PM came from it.

[Dooom35796821595]

There's this thing called the Home Office, you might have heard of it.
Our PM came from it.

I knew our new PM was government issue!

[Imperializt Russia]

The Schengen area though? It's fucked. You've seen how routine terrorism and rape attacks are there now.

Neither are "routine" by any stretch of the word, unless you're now turning into a strawman of feminism.

[Ostroeuropa]

There's this thing called the Home Office, you might have heard of it.
Our PM came from it.

I never said it had happened here yet. I still identify as a European, but sometimes you've got to abandon Anatolia and accept it's been overrun.

[Ifreann]

"""refugees"""

One set of quotes would be, in person, making the finger-quotes gesture.
Two, logically, would be making the finger-quotes gesture, but really overdoing it, big, obvious movements, like you were trying to communicate with someone far away.
Therefore three is

[Ostroeuropa]

"""refugees"""

One set of quotes would be, in person, making the finger-quotes gesture.
Two, logically, would be making the finger-quotes gesture, but really overdoing it, big, obvious movements, like you were trying to communicate with someone far away.
Therefore three is

It's one fingerquote per syllable.

[Ostroeuropa]

The Schengen area though? It's fucked. You've seen how routine terrorism and rape attacks are there now.

Neither are "routine" by any stretch of the word, unless you're now turning into a strawman of feminism.

Public attacks which terrorize the population aren't quite the same thing. You only need one every now and then to be routine, and theres no denying it dominates news coverage routinely. It is the equivalent of the Blitz in terms of morale damage for those not caught in the immediate area.

Beyond that, there is the effects on the culture and our institutions such populations have, as well as our politicians and political parties.

We should never have allowed them here. I'd say at this junction, we're at an impasse due to the ridiculous open borders shit.

Either Europe will collapse to Islamic demographic shifts, enter a series of civil wars, schism, or eventually, the muslims will be forcibly deported.
The fantasy land utopia bullshit of the radical progressives vision will never come to pass.

The UK may be able to get away with forcible assimilation policies and strict crackdowns, since they now no longer have to worry about rapidly rising Islamic population numbers due to mass migration.

By the way, you can bet progressives wont have learned shit from the holocaust and will do absolutely fucking everything they can to prevent a country deporting minorities it doesn't like as a first solution. It's called final for a reason.

The question is whether the far-right will go that far or not. I doubt it, unless there is war, which as I pointed out elsewhere, degrades human morality over time.

I'm very cynical about the future of the species at this point.

[Imperializt Russia]

One set of quotes would be, in person, making the finger-quotes gesture.
Two, logically, would be making the finger-quotes gesture, but really overdoing it, big, obvious movements, like you were trying to communicate with someone far away.
Therefore three is

It's one fingerquote per syllable.

Because that makes fucking sense.

[Alvecia]

No.

If they could, "THE EWE IS STEALING OUT SOVEREIGNTY" types might have had a point.

I did some quick back of the envelope calculation based on the 2001 Census and EU immigrants accounted for 34.97% of foreign born citizens that year.
15.8% of total were Irish.
8.4% were German.

This is based off the top 20 countries. I like statistics.

I did the whole lot cause it's the end of the day and I'm bored in work.
Source

(2001) Percentages of:
Foreign born - 8.2%
Non-Eu member - 5.6%
EU Members - 2.5%
EU/Non EU ratio - 1/2.2

(2015) Predicted precentages:
Foreign born - 13.1%
Non-Eu member - 8.6%
EU Members - 4.6%
EU/Non EU ratio - 1/1.9

When the next Census btw? Is it every 10 years?

[Vassenor]

Farage is a racist pile of human waste, and should never have been allowed near politics.

And if he hadn't then I dare say this split would be a lot more amicable.

That's not a vety constructive point. How is he a racist pile of human waste exactly.

He's kind of responsible for stirring up the recent wave of xenophobia among British voters. Did you notice how every single piece of campaign literature UKIP has put out from the last few GEs has focused on OMG MIGRANTS ARE COMING TO STEAL OUR JOBS AND WELFARE?

Or how he basically abandoned any pretence of subtlety and broke out the Nazi propaganda during the referendum?

[Ostroeuropa]

That's not a vety constructive point. How is he a racist pile of human waste exactly.

He's kind of responsible for stirring up the recent wave of xenophobia among British voters. Did you notice how every single piece of campaign literature UKIP has put out from the last few GEs has focused on OMG MIGRANTS ARE COMING TO STEAL OUR JOBS AND WELFARE?

Or how he basically abandoned any pretence of subtlety and broke out the Nazi propaganda during the referendum?

He isn't responsible for it. The people who forced these policies on the population against their will are.
The european elite didn't learn their lesson about importing massive amounts of culturally foreign people into a country and forcing them on the natives while pretending to "civilize" the country and being morally superior.

The current wave of resistance isn't racism, it's opposition to racism and hatred for the white working classes among the western elite.

The longer the situation continues, the worse it will become. We're reaching the stage where deportations of colonists and their descendants is becoming more acceptable to talk about. Eventually, there may be violent uprisings. Violent attacks against colonists is becoming more a norm, and we've already seen a few attacks on politicians.

You may as well be raging about any colonial independence movement and hating their leader as the source of it. You don't get to repeatedly abuse people and then get angry at the first one to oppose you.

The moral arrogance of the western elite caused this, nothing else. They have forgotten that democracy prevents violence.

[Vassenor]

UK service sector shrinks at fastest pace since the financial crisis after Brexit vote

[Souseiseki]

[Souseiseki]

from the above

Take for example the need for an exit agreement with the EU. In the memorable example of Gus O’Donnell, former cabinet secretary and head of the civil service: Greenland, population less than Croydon, one issue — fish, and it still took three years for it to leave what was then the EEC. There is no sensible reason to believe that the UK could extract itself from the EU (a more complex entity than the EEC) in the two years envisaged by Article 50.

This is no surprise: Article 50 was never intended to be a practical provision. It was there just for decoration. It was an ornament, not an instrument. According to Reuters, the former Italian prime minister Giuliano Amato is quoted as saying:

“I wrote Article 50, so I know it well,” Amato told a conference in Rome, saying he had inserted it specifically to prevent the British from complaining that there was no clear cut, official way for them to bail out of the Union.

“My intention was that it should be a classic safety valve that was there, but never used. It is like having a fire extinguisher that should never have to be used. Instead, the fire happened.”

Another person claiming credit for Article 50 (you would think no one would want to admit to authoring the provision) is the British diplomat Lord Kerr. He explains that it was inserted into the Lisbon treaty as a sop to the Eurosceptic media.

[Imperializt Russia]

What is PFI and why is it bad?

[Vassenor]

What is PFI and why is it bad?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_f ... initiative

[Souseiseki]

What is PFI and why is it bad?

can't read the article https://next.ft.com/content/a37459ac-39 ... 1de6a61009 hydesland pls find out what it is

i'm going to assume it's related to private franchise initiatives which were famously really really shit deals

[Vassenor]

How to lose friends and alienate China: Or how the way we've acted might have torpedoed the so-called “golden” relationship between London and Beijing.

[Olerand]

How to lose friends and alienate China: Or how the way we've acted might have torpedoed the so-called “golden” relationship between London and Beijing.

God bless May for postponing the position on Hinkley Point and hopefully she'll torpedo the whole thing. EDF is building the fucking thing (using EPR technology which has become a quasi-failure in Flamanville and Finland), as well as providing 2/3 of the funding, and the project will cost more than EDF's current total market capitalization as the nuclear industry has collapsed in the last few years. This is a project that just might sink EDF, and May is doing us a favor by postponing this thing. If China's pissed, let it take on the entirety of the funding and responsibility.

[Imperializt Russia]

How to lose friends and alienate China: Or how the way we've acted might have torpedoed the so-called “golden” relationship between London and Beijing.

God bless May for postponing the position on Hinkley Point and hopefully she'll torpedo the whole thing. EDF is building the fucking thing (using EPR technology which has become a quasi-failure in Flamanville and Finland), as well as providing 2/3 of the funding, and the project will cost more than EDF's current total market capitalization as the nuclear industry has collapsed in the last few years. This is a project that just might sink EDF, and May is doing us a favor by postponing this thing. If China's pissed, let it take on the entirety of the funding and responsibility.

If it were to go ahead, EDF wouldn't be sunk by it, unless it somehow transpired the EPR were completely impossible to work.

And the EPR passed the ONR's notoriously stringent design agreement phase, so that clearly isn't the case.