Gay Nightclub Attacked in Orlando, FL

[Gauthier]

Muhammad Ali is already turbining right now I bet, and I would not be surprised if we have edgelords and right wingers heading to Louisville with full bladders.

[Thermodolia]

Thankfully FBI says there is no connection to Orlando.

How can they link that up so quickly? I think they deserve a pay raise if this info is correct.

According to the FBI the guy in LA was arrested before the shooting in Orlando.

[Imperializt Russia]

The only thing CNN confirmed was that he had gun licenses and purchased at least one firearm legally. I'm betting it was the handgun. They aren't outright banned like assault rifles are, but AR-15's are still pretty tough to get.

I'm quite certain that the AR-15 itself, not counting derivatives and clones, is the most popular single semi-automatic rifle in the US. The US market for AK and derived rifles is enough to keep Izhmash afloat.

[Unified Governments]

Muhammad Ali is already turbining right now I bet, and I would not be surprised if we have edgelords and right wingers heading to Louisville with full bladders.

I'm going to start taking a shot every time you mention right-wingers in this thread. It's like you have a sexual fetish for us or something.

[Church of the Earth Mother]

Thankfully FBI says there is no connection to Orlando.

How can they link that up so quickly? I think they deserve a pay raise if this info is correct.

Fuck no.

Do what the Finns have been doing.

Fucking educate new immigrants and accept them as part of society rather than isolating them into self-contained enclaves which encourage an echo chamber of thought from The Old Country.

The problem is how do you let them integrate when many of them have no desire to do so?

Kidnap the kids from their families and send them to live with the ruling classes.

[Conserative Morality]

I'm in favor, sure. But that doesn't deal with the enclaves, does it. They need to be broken up, forcibly.

Goddamn those Muslims for embracing violence, amirite?

They won't dissolve on their own.

No. They won't. In order to break up ethnic enclaves, you have to engage the ethnic minority economically, civically, and culturally. America learned that long ago.

And i'm not in favor of any new muslim arrivals until the current ones are dealt with and integrated so we at least have a proof of concept.

... or you could examine places in which Muslim arrivals have integrated so you proof of concept.

The problem is that any action taken to assimilate the current Islamic community will inevitably be perceived as hostile to them.
Because it is. It would be us rocking up and saying "You are no longer allowed to do things your way, and we're here to force you to stop."

I'm going to take that as seriously as your ranting on how liberals hate the West.

[The Serbian Empire]

How can they link that up so quickly? I think they deserve a pay raise if this info is correct.


The problem is how do you let them integrate when many of them have no desire to do so?

Break up the enclaves with a few laws. If necessary, by force. Move muslims around the country and regulate where they can stay.
Try and isolate them so there's no Islamic community and deal with them as atomized individuals.

They can either be a basement dweller, or join the majority culture. Don't leave them the option of forming their own groups.

It's authoritarian, but its the only way I can see it working.

And then they get violent. We've seen this with Native Americans and reservations such as The Great Sioux War of 1876.

[Galiantus VII]

Fuck no.

Do what the Finns have been doing.

Fucking educate new immigrants and accept them as part of society rather than isolating them into self-contained enclaves which encourage an echo chamber of thought from The Old Country.

I'm in favor, sure. But that doesn't deal with the enclaves, does it. They need to be broken up, forcibly. They won't dissolve on their own.
And i'm not in favor of any new muslim arrivals until the current ones are dealt with and integrated so we at least have a proof of concept.

The problem is that any action taken to assimilate the current Islamic community will inevitably be perceived as hostile to them.
Because it is. It would be us rocking up and saying "You are no longer allowed to do things your way, and we're here to force you to stop."

I agree entirely with this. The thing is, Western culture is different than Islamic culture. If we want to preserve both cultures, then Western culture needs to be maintained in Western countries and Muslim culture needs to be maintained in Muslim countries. Muslims will be happier in countries with their same culture anyways, so it will be better to set that expectation.

[Jumalariik]

Maybe, just maybe, not everybody only thinks of people as objects like you do....

I mean I think most Christians are sad that this happened, or at least not happy. I think you have a deep seated problem with Christians, and for that reason, you have a secret love for Islam, or just shitposting. Take your pick.

It was Muslims who pushed for the passing of Amendment 8 in California, I forgot.

Yeah. Killing 50 people = supporting a law.

Why do you hate Christians and love Islam? I'm serious. You seem to think that Islam is great and that Christians are awful. I think you wish a Christian had done this so you could blame it on Christianity, so instead you need to say how bad Christianity is for whatever other reason you can think of.

Gauth logic:
50 people killed for being gay by a Muslim
Christianity is evil too because
Because
Because
Some Christians supported a bill to ban gay marriage
Banning gay marriage=killing gays

[Imperializt Russia]

So because a Muslim did it, it therefore has no points of commonality to any mass shooting committed by a non-Muslim, ever.

Uh-huh.

Oh right, I'm sorry. It was the righteous fervor of the fact that he had a weapon that made him go out and shoot 50 homosexuals

err... yes.
He shot a hundred, by the way.

[Armed Citizens]

http://m.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/lo ... es-/nrfFf/

Beginning to look as if just before walking into the night club this guy would have been just as likely as me and you to pass a background check.

[Thermodolia]

BBC

ABC

CBS

NBC

PBS

Are we just going to keep going down the list of news stations or are we going to start linking to sources?

This thread really is shit.

Here's the link you missed:

Source

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-us-canada-36510172

[Valaran]

Was all of this just crap, or is it more fun to insult one another and wildly point fingers?

Just curious if it was something I said, or didn't say.Hard to tell sometimes, especially when it appears points get ignored.

Nuance and effort don't normally lead to replies. If I'm being honest, my urge is often to critique a point I heavily or partially disagree with, instead of making my reply agreeing with someone else. Its partly because I (and I imagine others) have less to say with the latter - posting 'yeah' isn't really much of an answer and it seems awkward if you reiterate the same point from the post you're just replying to. I'd normally only reply to something of that ilk if it says what I'd say in a more articulate/concise manner, or if I wanted to offer constructive debate/qualifiers.

Though, those were just general reasons. I hadn't actually seen your post until now.

[Ostroeuropa]

Break up the enclaves with a few laws. If necessary, by force. Move muslims around the country and regulate where they can stay.
Try and isolate them so there's no Islamic community and deal with them as atomized individuals.

They can either be a basement dweller, or join the majority culture. Don't leave them the option of forming their own groups.

It's authoritarian, but its the only way I can see it working.

And then they get violent. We've seen this with Native Americans and reservations such as the incident at Wounded Knee.

I don't see another way.

I'm in favor, sure. But that doesn't deal with the enclaves, does it. They need to be broken up, forcibly.

Goddamn those Muslims for embracing violence, amirite?

They won't dissolve on their own.

No. They won't. In order to break up ethnic enclaves, you have to engage the ethnic minority economically, civically, and culturally. America learned that long ago.

And i'm not in favor of any new muslim arrivals until the current ones are dealt with and integrated so we at least have a proof of concept.

... or you could examine places in which Muslim arrivals have integrated so you proof of concept.

The problem is that any action taken to assimilate the current Islamic community will inevitably be perceived as hostile to them.
Because it is. It would be us rocking up and saying "You are no longer allowed to do things your way, and we're here to force you to stop."

I'm going to take that as seriously as your ranting on how liberals hate the West.

We've tried that for decades. It hasn't worked.

[The Serbian Empire]

How can they link that up so quickly? I think they deserve a pay raise if this info is correct.

According to the FBI the guy in LA was arrested before the shooting in Orlando.

Wooo... sigh of relief.

[Unified Governments]

I'm in favor, sure. But that doesn't deal with the enclaves, does it. They need to be broken up, forcibly.

Goddamn those Muslims for embracing violence, amirite?

They won't dissolve on their own.

No. They won't. In order to break up ethnic enclaves, you have to engage the ethnic minority economically, civically, and culturally. America learned that long ago.

And i'm not in favor of any new muslim arrivals until the current ones are dealt with and integrated so we at least have a proof of concept.

... or you could examine places in which Muslim arrivals have integrated so you proof of concept.

The problem is that any action taken to assimilate the current Islamic community will inevitably be perceived as hostile to them.
Because it is. It would be us rocking up and saying "You are no longer allowed to do things your way, and we're here to force you to stop."

I'm going to take that as seriously as your ranting on how liberals hate the West.

The problem is they don't want to merge culturally. That's the issue. They reject Western culture and embrace their own. They come directly from the most culturally ass-backwards place in the world and then bring those ass-backwards cultural and religious beliefs with them.

[Patridam]

The only thing CNN confirmed was that he had gun licenses and purchased at least one firearm legally. I'm betting it was the handgun. They aren't outright banned like assault rifles are, but AR-15's are still pretty tough to get.

You'd be surprised. If it's not full automatic, it's easy to get one of that model. The thing is they won't be cheap.

If it's fully automatic, its IMPOSSIBLE to get (legally).

But in this context - indoors - the "assault weapon" AR-15 isn't any more effective than a handgun. So it shouldn't matter that the damn things looks scary.

The only thing CNN confirmed was that he had gun licenses and purchased at least one firearm legally. I'm betting it was the handgun. They aren't outright banned like assault rifles are, but AR-15's are still pretty tough to get.

I'm quite certain that the AR-15 itself, not counting derivatives and clones, is the most popular single semi-automatic rifle in the US. The US market for AK and derived rifles is enough to keep Izhmash afloat.

Okay? The semiautomatic rifle market still isn't the hugest market out there....

[Imperializt Russia]

You're damn right it's not, because until the moment he rocked up with his guns, he wasn't a terrorist. There were no grounds of political extremism to discount him from owning guns until then.

The Boston Bombers didn't have guns. Guns aren't the only way to commit terrorist acts, and if this fellow couldn't get his hands on guns then he would have likely resorted to other means.

"I'm angry, I have a gun, let's put 2 and 2 together" is, while despicable and horrific, much more plausible than "I'm angry, let's assemble a bomb".

Your statement that he was predisposed to terrorism rather than simply angered to the point of using weapons he already owned to kill in a fit of rage is somewhat bizarre.

[IsraelHoldsTheDoor]

usa getting fed up of the left's senseless defence of radical islamic terrorism- don't be surprised come November to see:

President Trump.

[Thermodolia]

It was Muslims who pushed for the passing of Amendment 8 in California, I forgot.

Yeah. Killing 50 people = supporting a law.

Why do you hate Christians and love Islam? I'm serious. You seem to think that Islam is great and that Christians are awful. I think you wish a Christian had done this so you could blame it on Christianity, so instead you need to say how bad Christianity is for whatever other reason you can think of.

Gauth logic:
50 people killed for being gay by a Muslim
Christianity is evil too because
Because
Because
Some Christians supported a bill to ban gay marriage
Banning gay marriage=killing gays

No beating up and calling for the death of gays makes Christians evil.

[Mega City 5]

I wish to note the following:

The killer was a brown person.
The killer was a Muslim.

Liberals will continually complain about guns, but the problem's not guns. A gun didn't murder people at a night club. A brown muslim did.

The solution to me seems obvious. I'm with Trump:

1. Build the wall.
2. End birthright citizenship.
3. Put a stop to Muslim immigration.
4. Deport the illegals.

If we were to have made America white again already, this would not have happened.

Just remember:

"We ought to send 'em all back to Africa. We ought to send 'em all back to Africa. We ought to send 'em all back to Africa where they belong."

[Gauthier]

It was Muslims who pushed for the passing of Amendment 8 in California, I forgot.

Yeah. Killing 50 people = supporting a law.

Why do you hate Christians and love Islam? I'm serious. You seem to think that Islam is great and that Christians are awful. I think you wish a Christian had done this so you could blame it on Christianity, so instead you need to say how bad Christianity is for whatever other reason you can think of.

Gauth logic:
50 people killed for being gay by a Muslim
Christianity is evil too because
Because
Because
Some Christians supported a bill to ban gay marriage
Banning gay marriage=killing gays

Or pointing out it's disingenuous and hypocritical to express pity and defend a group you think of as shit just because someone from another group you think of as shit brutalized them.

[The Black Forrest]

It's been repeatedly stated that at least one of his firearms were legally acquired. He had a securities firearms licence.

Do you disagree that if it were harder to acquire a rifle and a handgun, it would be less likely he would have shot one hundred people in a nightclub because he thought gays were icky?

I'm going to bet the handgun was the one purchased legally.

This all wouldn't have been a damn problem if at least one of the club patrons had a carry firearm though.

Speculation at best.

If a guy with training failed to stop him why would some yahoo in a mass panic situation be able to do better?

[Thermodolia]

I wish to note the following:

The killer was a brown person.
The killer was a Muslim.

Liberals will continually complain about guns, but the problem's not guns. A gun didn't murder people at a night club. A brown muslim did.

The solution to me seems obvious. I'm with Trump:

1. Build the wall.
2. End birthright citizenship.
3. Put a stop to Muslim immigration.
4. Deport the illegals.

If we were to made America white again already, this would not have happened.

Just remember:

"We ought to send 'em all back to Africa. We ought to send 'em all back to Africa."

That won't work as the shooter was born in New York City. He was not an illegal immigrant!

[Jumalariik]

Muhammad Ali is already turbining right now I bet, and I would not be surprised if we have edgelords and right wingers heading to Louisville with full bladders.

I'm going to start taking a shot every time you mention right-wingers in this thread. It's like you have a sexual fetish for us or something.

You will get alcohol poisoning. He might stop though. Drinking is against Islam. If you drink it offends his "ebil muslims" or whatever, so he will not make you drink. Maybe if we all threaten to eat a pack of bacon everytime he makes a ridiculous "whatabout" or "all religions are the same" post he will stop that.