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Make America Great Britain Again

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Should the United States bring back the monarchy?

YES
228
52%
No
214
48%
 
Total votes : 442

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Agrellus
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Posts: 19
Founded: May 15, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Agrellus » Tue May 17, 2016 7:34 pm

I want a "meh" option.

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Novus America
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Posts: 36800
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Novus America » Tue May 17, 2016 7:42 pm

Agrellus wrote:I want a "meh" option.


We need a Lady Liberty Mecha option.
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Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. I support what is good for the country, which means I cannot support either party.

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Dooom35796821595
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9309
Founded: Sep 11, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dooom35796821595 » Tue May 17, 2016 7:44 pm

Novus America wrote:
Agrellus wrote:I want a "meh" option.


We need a Lady Liberty Mecha option.


You should try a petition, like the Death Star one only cooler. :)
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SD_Film Artists
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Posts: 12540
Founded: Jun 10, 2009
Father Knows Best State

Postby SD_Film Artists » Wed May 18, 2016 4:38 am

Europe and Oceania wrote:I wouldn't mind the U.S. being Great Britain's colonies again, I don't like monarchies though so that has got to go.

Other than that I'm an anglophile.


Yes, it's good that America is leading the world against hereditry rule- with the wife of a former president contesting against someone who won against a president's brother who's dad was also president. :p
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The Archregimancy
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 26672
Founded: Aug 01, 2005
Democratic Socialists

Postby The Archregimancy » Wed May 18, 2016 5:11 am

SD_Film Artists wrote:
Europe and Oceania wrote:I wouldn't mind the U.S. being Great Britain's colonies again, I don't like monarchies though so that has got to go.

Other than that I'm an anglophile.


Yes, it's good that America is leading the world against hereditry rule- with the wife of a former president contesting against someone who won against a president's brother who's dad was also president. :p


Ah, to be Canadian - where you can have both a hereditary head of state and a hereditary head of government....

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Roma Byzantina
Minister
 
Posts: 2651
Founded: Mar 18, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Roma Byzantina » Wed May 18, 2016 6:54 am

The Archregimancy wrote:
SD_Film Artists wrote:
Yes, it's good that America is leading the world against hereditry rule- with the wife of a former president contesting against someone who won against a president's brother who's dad was also president. :p


Ah, to be Canadian - where you can have both a hereditary head of state and a hereditary head of government....

If it makes us have such a connection with Canada then I'd say do it!
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Greater Tezdrian
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7249
Founded: Feb 27, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Greater Tezdrian » Wed May 18, 2016 6:58 am

Yes.
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Old Tyrannia
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 15908
Founded: Aug 11, 2009
Father Knows Best State

Postby Old Tyrannia » Wed May 18, 2016 7:31 am

The Archregimancy wrote:
SD_Film Artists wrote:
Yes, it's good that America is leading the world against hereditry rule- with the wife of a former president contesting against someone who won against a president's brother who's dad was also president. :p


Ah, to be Canadian - where you can have both a hereditary head of state and a hereditary head of government....

So what you're effectively saying is, Canada is Japan under the shogunate/bakufu? I look forward to the Charlesian Restoration and consequent imperialist antics.

Honour the king, expel the barbarians, eh.
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The Empire of Pretantia
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Posts: 39273
Founded: Oct 18, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby The Empire of Pretantia » Wed May 18, 2016 7:35 am

Old Tyrannia wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:
Ah, to be Canadian - where you can have both a hereditary head of state and a hereditary head of government....

So what you're effectively saying is, Canada is Japan under the shogunate/bakufu?

Hail to our supreme excellence, Tokugawa I-ay-yasu!

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Hakons
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Posts: 5619
Founded: Jul 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Hakons » Wed May 18, 2016 1:28 pm

Dooom35796821595 wrote:
Hakons wrote:
So if a monarch is a "symbol," they have no practical purpose. A nation should unify on their basic principals like liberty and democracy, and not on one person that will die eventually. It is much easier to place loyalty in time honored principals than in a different person every generation or two.
Because freedom.... freedom never dies


A monarchy is the Head of State, negating the need for one to be elected. And they can also be important symbols of a nations culture and history.

War...War never changes.
until they started using immortals


So the Head of State doesn't need to be elected? Why should the Head of State be selected by whoever popped out the womb first?
The Nihilistic view wrote:
Hakons wrote:
So if a monarch is a "symbol," they have no practical purpose. A nation should unify on their basic principals like liberty and democracy, and not on one person that will die eventually. It is much easier to place loyalty in time honored principals than in a different person every generation or two.
Because freedom.... freedom never dies


So handing out the complete works of John Locke would have created a stronger unity and national strength in 1940-41 than the King and Churchill among others bringing the nation together with the resolve to carry on?
?

John Locke was a colonist, so his words wouldn't do much for England. FDR, a democratically elected President, brought our nation into a fighting stance and was a major contributor to Allied victory.
Dooom35796821595 wrote:
Novus America wrote:
So we can just make the Statue of Liberty our queen. She does as much as yours. Who is also nothing more than a symbol and tourist attraction.


Our Queen does more work then your presidents. :p

I'd really like to see that. Of course, it would require turning the Statue of Liberty into a 50' mecha and have it walk around as the American head of state.


"Our Queen does more work then your presidents"

I just have to laugh at that and chalk it up to excessive nationalism. The United States is the most influential nation in the world, and thus its leader is the most influential person. President Barrack Obama has helped pull America out of the Recession, captured the orchestrator of the 9-11 attacks, opened relations with Cuba and Iran, passed near universal Healthcare, and urged sweeping reforms for LGBT rights. What has the Queen done since 2008? :P

To everyone now:

I have yet to see someone explain to me why a hereditary ruler is preferable to a democratic ruler. Why does a monarch deserve their position? How on Earth are you going to get good leaders based on rigid hereditary rules that pay no attention to ability?
“All elements of the national life must be made to drink in the Life which proceedeth from Him: legislation, political institutions, education, marriage and family life, capital and labour.” —Pope Leo XIII

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Europe and Oceania
Diplomat
 
Posts: 886
Founded: Mar 07, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Europe and Oceania » Wed May 18, 2016 1:33 pm

SD_Film Artists wrote:
Europe and Oceania wrote:I wouldn't mind the U.S. being Great Britain's colonies again, I don't like monarchies though so that has got to go.

Other than that I'm an anglophile.


Yes, it's good that America is leading the world against hereditry rule- with the wife of a former president contesting against someone who won against a president's brother who's dad was also president. :p


Not sure if I'm supposed to take this seriously or if this is a joke lol.
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Roma Byzantina
Minister
 
Posts: 2651
Founded: Mar 18, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Roma Byzantina » Wed May 18, 2016 1:39 pm

Hakons wrote:To everyone now:

I have yet to see someone explain to me why a hereditary ruler is preferable to a democratic ruler. Why does a monarch deserve their position? How on Earth are you going to get good leaders based on rigid hereditary rules that pay no attention to ability?

The Monarch would be a symbol, while Congress (from my understanding) would choose a Prime Minister. Combine that with the right voting system (not FPTP) and it might be possible to drag the US out of the "Possibly a flawed Democracy" zone.
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Make America Great Britain Again Wanna know how to get this siggy?
"We are the Blorg. Lower your shields, power down your point defenses, and prepare your airlocks. We will hug you. We will love you. We will call you friend. We will add your biological and sociological traits to our friendgroup. Your culture will adapt to befriend us. Resistance is impolite." - As written by Arroz, Illustrious Chronicler of the Great Blorg Friendquest
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Hakons
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5619
Founded: Jul 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Hakons » Wed May 18, 2016 4:36 pm

Roma Byzantina wrote:
Hakons wrote:To everyone now:

I have yet to see someone explain to me why a hereditary ruler is preferable to a democratic ruler. Why does a monarch deserve their position? How on Earth are you going to get good leaders based on rigid hereditary rules that pay no attention to ability?

The Monarch would be a symbol, while Congress (from my understanding) would choose a Prime Minister. Combine that with the right voting system (not FPTP) and it might be possible to drag the US out of the "Possibly a flawed Democracy" zone.


Why does the monarch deserve to be a symbol? Why not get the most likeable or charismatic person to be that symbol? This new "symbol" will be another tax liability. Their plush lifestyle would be paid by the hardworking taxpayer.

Rule by inheritance simply doesn't stack up to democracy. Making the Head of State a monarch is a BIG step away from Democracy. Yes, the current system has its flaws, but the WORST thing to do would be to eliminate elections for the Head of State altogether.
“All elements of the national life must be made to drink in the Life which proceedeth from Him: legislation, political institutions, education, marriage and family life, capital and labour.” —Pope Leo XIII

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Neolvex
Diplomat
 
Posts: 994
Founded: Oct 20, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Neolvex » Wed May 18, 2016 4:37 pm

The Archregimancy wrote:
SD_Film Artists wrote:
Yes, it's good that America is leading the world against hereditry rule- with the wife of a former president contesting against someone who won against a president's brother who's dad was also president. :p


Ah, to be Canadian - where you can have both a hereditary head of state and a hereditary head of government....

Welp, time to move to canada.
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Albertae
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Founded: Oct 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Albertae » Wed May 18, 2016 4:39 pm

This is the dumbest topic ever. There was never a republic. There was never a republic of the United States. The Republican Party was not founded because of that fact.
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Hakons
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Posts: 5619
Founded: Jul 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Hakons » Wed May 18, 2016 5:00 pm

Albertae wrote:This is the dumbest topic ever. There was never a republic. There was never a republic of the United States. The Republican Party was not founded because of that fact.


I just realized another flaw. The OP claimed this would end the Republican Party. However, if the Presidency was abolished, the Republican Party would gain enormous power. They have a strong hold in the House and a majority in the Senate. They could choose the PM, which would likely be Paul Ryan. GOP would have the House, Senate, and the equivalent of the White House, and could choose which judge to replace Scalia.

Quite a different result than what the OP said. :p
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Arachaea
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 459
Founded: May 16, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Arachaea » Sun Jun 05, 2016 2:59 am

We need to combine Canada, Australia, New Zealand, the USA and the UK into one United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland, North America, Australia and New Zealand! One massive constitutional monarchy / parliamentary democracy to rival the world!

But in all seriousness, if the USA wants to join the Commonwealth, I wouldn't mind.
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Novus America
Post Czar
 
Posts: 36800
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Novus America » Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:47 am

Arachaea wrote:We need to combine Canada, Australia, New Zealand, the USA and the UK into one United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland, North America, Australia and New Zealand! One massive constitutional monarchy / parliamentary democracy to rival the world!

But in all seriousness, if the USA wants to join the Commonwealth, I wouldn't mind.


If you combined all those countries the US would have a large majority of the population. And would vote to remove the monarchy... You would be basically having the US annex the UK. It is hard to arrange an equitable merger when one of the 4 has far more population, money and military than the other 3 combined. And again the monarchy would be unlikely to survive.

What does the US gain from joining the commonwealth of nations?

The US should focus on strengthening NAFTA, the Caribbean Commonwealth and OAS instead.

Despite speaking the same language, the US is very different than just a British colony now, we are a combination of former French and Spanish colonies as well, and have migration from a lot of places other than Britain. The US has not been predominantly British for nearly 200 years now.
Last edited by Novus America on Sun Jun 05, 2016 7:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. I support what is good for the country, which means I cannot support either party.

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Albertae
Senator
 
Posts: 4680
Founded: Oct 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Albertae » Sun Jun 05, 2016 11:37 am

Arachaea wrote:We need to combine Canada, Australia, New Zealand, the USA and the UK into one United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland, North America, Australia and New Zealand! One massive constitutional monarchy / parliamentary democracy to rival the world!

But in all seriousness, if the USA wants to join the Commonwealth, I wouldn't mind.


The Commonwealth would join the USA. 8)
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The Christonian Imperium
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Posts: 888
Founded: Jan 29, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby The Christonian Imperium » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:27 pm

and texas, the Appalachian mountains, the ozarks, the rockies, the planes, and montanna would secede
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Neolvex
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Posts: 994
Founded: Oct 20, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Neolvex » Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:28 pm

The Christonian Imperium wrote:and texas, the Appalachian mountains, the ozarks, the rockies, the planes, and montanna would secede

Basically there would be no "United States" to rule. Just smaller countries.
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The Christonian Imperium
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Founded: Jan 29, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby The Christonian Imperium » Sat Jul 02, 2016 6:45 pm

Screw nafta and globalization
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Dar es Saalam
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Posts: 5
Founded: Aug 18, 2004
Capitalist Paradise

Risking hijacking the thread....

Postby Dar es Saalam » Sat Jul 02, 2016 7:34 pm

I would prefer a fascism form in order to bring things to rights in the US, if we are talking about changing the country's politics so radically. A little anarchy blended in, some fractionalization of the Union and boom, stabilization.

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The Christonian Imperium
Diplomat
 
Posts: 888
Founded: Jan 29, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby The Christonian Imperium » Sat Jul 02, 2016 7:35 pm

Dar es Saalam wrote:I would prefer a fascism form in order to bring things to rights in the US, if we are talking about changing the country's politics so radically. A little anarchy blended in, some fractionalization of the Union and boom, stabilization.

WHAT DID YOU SAY. IF YOU WANT TO MAKE THE UNITED STATES INTO A DICTATORSHIP YOU CAN GO TO THE CORNER AND CRY
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Socialist Nordia
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Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Socialist Nordia » Sat Jul 02, 2016 8:01 pm

Dar es Saalam wrote:I would prefer a fascism form in order to bring things to rights in the US, if we are talking about changing the country's politics so radically. A little anarchy blended in, some fractionalization of the Union and boom, stabilization.

Ok, that made no sense. "Fascism with some anarchy blended in" is an oxymoron. This isn't even coherent. Oh wait, this is sarcasm.
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