UK Politics Thread III: Thready McThreadface (+ Jo Cox)

[Wolfmanne2]

I'm not South Asian, I'm half Maltese and half Nicaraguan.

oh right, sorry. i was just going off the slur in your last post.

Or, along side addressing economic issues, couldn't we also address racial issues, gender issues, LGBT issues at the same time as addressing them?

YES.

but not at the expense of the former.

(i'm not necessarily addressing your position btw)

Well, than I would not like to have a part in such thing. The issues of women and racial minorities are constantly pushed to the side in favour of 'real issues' already. I don't want any part in an ideology that does the same.

Additionally, I do not believe in the viability of hard left socialism and I also find the Marxist analysis to be inherently flawed, so no thanks.

[Imperializt Russia]

Pretty sure neither me nor Questers promote "hard left socialism", we both call for a return to the socialist-derived models of the postwar era. Which worked pretty well, and were not "hard left socialism".

I would argue that a more just social model is an inherently more receptive environment for gender, race and other progression. The current system is quite clearly opposed.
Demanding that all be pursued at the same time, or that gender and racial etc need more focus than the overall social model is somewhat bizarre, though I understand the sentiment. It's a clear diversion of focus and resources, and will surely lead to a fatigue of progressive issues.

[CoraSpia]

My only solace to take is that I don't quite win privilege bingo in this thread's membership.

Privelege bingo?

[Questers]

my political views aren't difficult to understand.

i believe in an egalitarian, internationalist, environmentalist & rationalist country, with an economy centred around social ownership and equality of outcome.

[Wolfmanne2]

my political views aren't difficult to understand.

i believe in an egalitarian, internationalist, environmentalist & rationalist country, with an economy centred around social ownership and equality of outcome.

I don't disagree with any of that.

[Imperializt Russia]

My only solace to take is that I don't quite win privilege bingo in this thread's membership.

Privelege bingo?

Privilege bingo is a derogatory term for the implicit "ranking" of how severe people's problems and their validity are.
Since I'm an (ostensibly) straight, white, cis male in a middle class family who went to university and studied two STEM degrees, I'm supposed to be highly privileged.

Some less-rational people would then say that my opinion on many social topics is inherently less valid than someone from a less privileged background from mine. Such mindsets inherently entrench the difficulties and differences that people face, which is clearly not the point.

[Vassenor]

Maybe we need to stop with the oppression olympics and start figuring out what we need to do to fix things.

[Wolfmanne2]

Maybe we need to stop with the oppression olympics and start figuring out what we need to do to fix things.

Kill all non-white, non-cisgendered, LGBT and poor people.

No moar people with problems.

[Questers]

my political views aren't difficult to understand.

i believe in an egalitarian, internationalist, environmentalist & rationalist country, with an economy centred around social ownership and equality of outcome.

I don't disagree with any of that.

i'm not convinced, but if it is true, it's funny that we fight so much.

the left was always more divided than the right

[Vassenor]

Maybe we need to stop with the oppression olympics and start figuring out what we need to do to fix things.

Kill all non-white, non-cisgendered, LGBT and poor people.

No moar people with problems.

=/

[Wolfmanne2]

I don't disagree with any of that.

i'm not convinced, but if it is true, it's funny that we fight so much.

the left was always more divided than the right

Differences between us can be summarised here. Fun game: guess whether I'm revisionist or third way.

Kill all non-white, non-cisgendered, LGBT and poor people.

No moar people with problems.

=/

I have a very dark sense of humour.

[Vassenor]

i'm not convinced, but if it is true, it's funny that we fight so much.

the left was always more divided than the right

Differences between us can be summarised here. Fun game: guess whether I'm revisionist or third way.

=/

I have a very dark sense of humour.

That and I react badly to jokes involving me getting lynched.

[Imperializt Russia]

i'm not convinced, but if it is true, it's funny that we fight so much.

the left was always more divided than the right

Differences between us can be summarised here. Fun game: guess whether I'm revisionist or third way.

You claim to have no real interest in socialism at all, so my gut assumption is third way.

[The Huskar Social Union]

David Cameron lifted the ban on women in combat roles in the Military: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36746917?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

[Divitaen]

David Cameron lifted the ban on women in combat roles in the Military: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36746917?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Colonel Richard Kemp said that "this foolish move will reduce the capability of the infantry, undermine our national defences and put lives in danger"....

Wow honestly where do these misogynistic pigs all come from...

[Imperializt Russia]

David Cameron lifted the ban on women in combat roles in the Military: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36746917?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Interesting.

A female friend of mine, who began, then abandoned army officership and now works with Army Headquarters on that study, disagreed with me some time ago that combat roles should be opened, beyond officer/command/staff roles.

[Divitaen]

David Cameron lifted the ban on women in combat roles in the Military: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36746917?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Interesting.

A female friend of mine, who began, then abandoned army officership and now works with Army Headquarters on that study, disagreed with me some time ago that combat roles should be opened, beyond officer/command/staff roles.

Uh oh. And what was her reasoning for that?

[The Huskar Social Union]

I personally have no problems with it, i think that if a woman can pass the tests and training required they should be allowed to join the Infantry and other combat roles, if not dont let them in then simple as that. The British Army also according to the article said they dont feel it will adversely affect the capability and cohesions of units in the field so.

Seen some people act like its the end of the world though and that the UK will now get overrun by its enemies.

[Minzerland]

David Cameron lifted the ban on women in combat roles in the Military: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36746917?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

Colonel Richard Kemp said that "this foolish move will reduce the capability of the infantry, undermine our national defences and put lives in danger"....

Wow honestly where do these misogynistic pigs all come from...

Facts are misogynistic?

[Souseiseki]

i believe the dominant argument is that we are barely evolved/over evolved apes with a stupid culture which means we can't have men and women in the same unit without the men treating the women as special snowflakes/trying to fuck them

[Divitaen]

Colonel Richard Kemp said that "this foolish move will reduce the capability of the infantry, undermine our national defences and put lives in danger"....

Wow honestly where do these misogynistic pigs all come from...

Facts are misogynistic?

And how is it factual that women in combat roles will put "lives in danger"?

[Imperializt Russia]

Interesting.

A female friend of mine, who began, then abandoned army officership and now works with Army Headquarters on that study, disagreed with me some time ago that combat roles should be opened, beyond officer/command/staff roles.

Uh oh. And what was her reasoning for that?

Physical fitness, basically. On average, women are not as physically capable as men, which isn't an untrue statement.

I remember when she was training for the officer programme, she worked herself nearly to death to get there.
She quit the training at a very early phase because she despised the "break you down to build you up" style of psychological conditioning.

[Imperializt Russia]

Colonel Richard Kemp said that "this foolish move will reduce the capability of the infantry, undermine our national defences and put lives in danger"....

Wow honestly where do these misogynistic pigs all come from...

Facts are misogynistic?

Those statements aren't factual.

If the standards were significantly lowered (and I mean enormously, and solely for the point of getting all 7,000 female army members into combat units for whatever reason or something), then he would have a point.
But that's what precisely no-one is proposing or has proposed.

Even if the standards were slightly lowered, that is not an inherent loss of capability, so it's still not a factual statement.

[CoraSpia]

Uh oh. And what was her reasoning for that?

Physical fitness, basically. On average, women are not as physically capable as men, which isn't an untrue statement.

I remember when she was training for the officer programme, she worked herself nearly to death to get there.
She quit the training at a very early phase because she despised the "break you down to build you up" style of psychological conditioning.

It's not true, but the solution to that is to get rid of 'average,' and to make it completely genderless. As in, men and women held to the same standards: it wil result in very few women making the grade, but it's the most fair way of doing it while not compromising affectiveness.

[Souseiseki]

angela eagle continues her brutal "please stand down or i might stand against you eventually maybe how about next week maybe if you feel like it o-oh actually i don't feel like it maybe the week after then" onslaught against corbyn