Muslim prayer hall set on fire in Corsica

[El-Amin Caliphate]

You're honestly calling me a regressive leftist. Goodnight my sides!

There are indeed some among the shi'ites. The Twelvers are mostly hardliners anyway.

But yes. The Salafi movement is by far the biggest and practically the most relavent threat in Islam and the face of it's fundamentalism. And there are a fucking lot of them. Over a third of Muslims almost.

The Shi'a hardliners are a problem too, but pale in number compared to Salafis.
Name one movwmovent as big or as relevant as they are.that aren't even influenced by them.

And by protestant logic I mean rejecting the clear commentary by scholars of the past that throughly explain what you find issue with.

Yet, no one seems to combat the Salafi movement, or any other hardline moment.

Could it be because most Muslims are socially conservative and support the destruction of anything against their religion? Look no further than Bangladesh to know that's true.

1st off, the Holy Qur'an states that we can't destroy religious things, much less anything belonging to a religious group or anyone. So the question is incorrect.

[Kriga]

Yet, no one seems to combat the Salafi movement, or any other hardline moment.

Could it be because most Muslims are socially conservative and support the destruction of anything against their religion? Look no further than Bangladesh to know that's true.

And the Salafi Wahhabi dogma and other hardline movements are combated strongly in parts of Southeast Asia and North Africa.

Bangladesh actually has a great deal of Anti Hardliner movements. And Hardliners in general seem to be a minority in government positions and in the polls.

But most Strongly in The Balkans and Turkic World.

Yet Bangladesh still does nothing when Secular bloggers are relentlessly pursued by hardliners and killed. Nor do the Salafi movements seem to be curtailed.

Maybe because there is no real movement to reform Islam. After all, look at the pathetic state of the capital of the Muslim world. For such a bad movement, the Wahabbis sure do control Islam's holiest sites. You sure they aren't the bad one? They seem to be the legitimate face of Islam.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Also don't say Wahhabi. That's offensive to the adherents. Say Salafi instead.

[Kriga]

Yet, no one seems to combat the Salafi movement, or any other hardline moment.

Could it be because most Muslims are socially conservative and support the destruction of anything against their religion? Look no further than Bangladesh to know that's true.

1st off, the Holy Qur'an states that we can't destroy religious things, much less anything belonging to a religious group or anyone. So the question is incorrect.

That's definitely not what the conquering Arabs in the 7th century seemed to think when they burnt churches and fire temples alike during their conquests of Byzantine and Persian land...

Hypocrisy.

[Kriga]

Also don't say Wahhabi. That's offensive to the adherents. Say Salafi instead.

Don't tell me what to say. Wahabbi, Salafi. Different names, same thing.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

And the Salafi Wahhabi dogma and other hardline movements are combated strongly in parts of Southeast Asia and North Africa.

Bangladesh actually has a great deal of Anti Hardliner movements. And Hardliners in general seem to be a minority in government positions and in the polls.

But most Strongly in The Balkans and Turkic World.

Yet Bangladesh still does nothing when Secular bloggers are relentlessly pursued by hardliners and killed. Nor do the Salafi movements seem to be curtailed.

Maybe because there is no real movement to reform Islam. After all, look at the pathetic state of the capital of the Muslim world. For such a bad movement, the Wahabbis sure do control Islam's holiest sites. You sure they aren't the bad one? They seem to be the legitimate face of Islam.

The only legit Islam is Muhammad's (SAWS) interpretation of Al-Islam.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Also don't say Wahhabi. That's offensive to the adherents. Say Salafi instead.

Don't tell me what to say. Wahabbi, Salafi. Different names, same thing.

Same thing. "Adherents often object to the term Wahhabi or Wahhabism as derogatory, and prefer to be called Salafi or muwahhid" Wikipedia is the source.

[Jochistan]

And the Salafi Wahhabi dogma and other hardline movements are combated strongly in parts of Southeast Asia and North Africa.

Bangladesh actually has a great deal of Anti Hardliner movements. And Hardliners in general seem to be a minority in government positions and in the polls.

But most Strongly in The Balkans and Turkic World.

Yet Bangladesh still does nothing when Secular bloggers are relentlessly pursued by hardliners and killed. Nor do the Salafi movements seem to be curtailed.

Maybe because there is no real movement to reform Islam. After all, look at the pathetic state of the capital of the Muslim world. For such a bad movement, the Wahabbis sure do control Islam's holiest sites. You sure they aren't the bad one? They seem to be the legitimate face of Islam.

They are the bad one. They can be the bad one and the majority.

There is no saying that they are not significant or not the real enemy. Or the real bad ones.

There is no united reform Movement to Islam be ause of denominational, cultural and ideological differences. Differences in end goal has led to infighting against Anti Salafis. Fellow Traditionalists hate Modernists, Modernists and Traditionalists hate all "lol heterodox" Echstatics Schools of thought. ..everyone hates liberals.. Which makes the Hardliner Fundamentalist Salafis very happy indeed no doubt.

[Jochistan]

Also don't say Wahhabi. That's offensive to the adherents. Say Salafi instead.

Why would you defend them. You're a Liberal Muslim! I'm a damn Reactionary and they still want to kill people like me.

[Kriga]

Yet Bangladesh still does nothing when Secular bloggers are relentlessly pursued by hardliners and killed. Nor do the Salafi movements seem to be curtailed.

Maybe because there is no real movement to reform Islam. After all, look at the pathetic state of the capital of the Muslim world. For such a bad movement, the Wahabbis sure do control Islam's holiest sites. You sure they aren't the bad one? They seem to be the legitimate face of Islam.

They are the bad one. They are either the bad one or the majority by some.

There is no saying that they are not significant or not the real enemy.

There is no united reform Movement to Islam necause of denominational, cultural and ideological differences. Differences in end goal has led to infighting against Anti Salafis. Which makes the Hardliner Fundamentalist Salafis very happy indeed no doubt.

So lets do something about it then, hm? Unite the denominations and fight the hardliners.

Cultual differences? Well, you guys should have thought twice before invading the entire middle east. Differences were bound to arise.

[Jochistan]

They are the bad one. They are either the bad one or the majority by some.

There is no saying that they are not significant or not the real enemy.

There is no united reform Movement to Islam necause of denominational, cultural and ideological differences. Differences in end goal has led to infighting against Anti Salafis. Which makes the Hardliner Fundamentalist Salafis very happy indeed no doubt.

So lets do something about it then, hm? Unite the denominations and fight the hardliners.

Cultual differences? Well, you guys should have thought twice before invading the entire middle east. Differences were bound to arise.

What do you mean you guys?

[Kriga]

So lets do something about it then, hm? Unite the denominations and fight the hardliners.

Cultual differences? Well, you guys should have thought twice before invading the entire middle east. Differences were bound to arise.

What do you mean you guys?

Forgive me. Let me clarify my earlier statement.

Do the 7th century Islamic Conquests ring a bell by any chance? Did you really think every country the Muslim Arabs conquered were going to simply lie down and accept one form of Islam? Not really...

Hell, you know what made Shia Islam so strong? Iranian dynasties. And they are very, very different from Arabs. Most denominations started forming because of cultural differences.

[Crockerland]

There are indeed some among the shi'ites.

There are some terrorist groups among all of the religious sects of Islam, except for Ibadism.

The Twelvers are mostly hardliners anyway.

But yes. The Salafi movement is by far the biggest and practically the most relavent threat in Islam and the face of it's fundamentalism. And there are a fucking lot of them. Over a third of Muslims almost.

The Shi'a hardliners are a problem too, but pale in number compared to Salafis.

Shi'ites as a whole pale in number compared to sunnis as a whole, so that shouldn't come as a surprise. Almost all the Shiite countries are wrought with extremism and barbarism; Syria's occupation of Lebanon and fatal silencing of critics of the Syrian occupation, Azerbaijan's Armenian genocide denial, Iran's state-sponsorship of Shiite terror abroad, Iraq doesn't do much but it's a failed state at this point.

Name one movwmovent as big or as relevant as they are.that aren't even influenced by them.

You said yourself they make up like 1/3rd of Muslims. Obviously no other movement will be the size of the largest one, that doesn't mean the smaller ones are any less of a problem.

And by protestant logic I mean rejecting the clear commentary by scholars of the past that throughly explain what you find issue with.

They can try to explain away all they want, it won't change the fact that the Quran clearly calls it's followers to brutally slaughter various people, nor will it change the fact that thousands of people have lost their lives in recent years to people influenced by these verses.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

What do you mean you guys?

Forgive me. Let me clarify my earlier statement.

Do the 7th century Islamic Conquests ring a bell by any chance? Did you really think every country the Muslim Arabs conquered were going to simply lie down and accept one form of Islam? Not really...

Hell, you know what made Shia Islam so strong? Iranian dynasties. And they are very, very different from Arabs. Most denominations started forming because of cultural differences.

Shia' Islam began by political differences, not by conquest.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

There are indeed some among the shi'ites.

There are some terrorist groups among all of the religious sects of Islam, except for Ibadism.

The Twelvers are mostly hardliners anyway.

But yes. The Salafi movement is by far the biggest and practically the most relavent threat in Islam and the face of it's fundamentalism. And there are a fucking lot of them. Over a third of Muslims almost.

The Shi'a hardliners are a problem too, but pale in number compared to Salafis.

Shi'ites as a whole pale in number compared to sunnis as a whole, so that shouldn't come as a surprise. Almost all the Shiite countries are wrought with extremism and barbarism; Syria's occupation of Lebanon and fatal silencing of critics of the Syrian occupation, Azerbaijan's Armenian genocide denial, Iran's state-sponsorship of Shiite terror abroad, Iraq doesn't do much but it's a failed state at this point.

Name one movwmovent as big or as relevant as they are.that aren't even influenced by them.

You said yourself they make up like 1/3rd of Muslims. Obviously no other movement will be the size of the largest one, that doesn't mean the smaller ones are any less of a problem.

And by protestant logic I mean rejecting the clear commentary by scholars of the past that throughly explain what you find issue with.

They can try to explain away all they want, it won't change the fact that the Quran clearly calls it's followers to brutally slaughter various people, nor will it change the fact that thousands of people have lost their lives in recent years to people influenced by these verses.

The Holy Qur'an tells us Muslims to fight in war not just because.

[Crockerland]

There are some terrorist groups among all of the religious sects of Islam, except for Ibadism.

Shi'ites as a whole pale in number compared to sunnis as a whole, so that shouldn't come as a surprise. Almost all the Shiite countries are wrought with extremism and barbarism; Syria's occupation of Lebanon and fatal silencing of critics of the Syrian occupation, Azerbaijan's Armenian genocide denial, Iran's state-sponsorship of Shiite terror abroad, Iraq doesn't do much but it's a failed state at this point.

You said yourself they make up like 1/3rd of Muslims. Obviously no other movement will be the size of the largest one, that doesn't mean the smaller ones are any less of a problem.

They can try to explain away all they want, it won't change the fact that the Quran clearly calls it's followers to brutally slaughter various people, nor will it change the fact that thousands of people have lost their lives in recent years to people influenced by these verses.

The Holy Qur'an tells us Muslims to fight in war not just because.

Quran (9:123)
"O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Yes, the Quran tells muslims to fight in wars of aggression which they have instigated against the infidels.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

The Holy Qur'an tells us Muslims to fight in war not just because.

Quran (9:123)
"O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Yes, the Quran tells muslims to fight in wars of aggression which they have instigated against the infidels.

Surat Al-Baqarah, ayahs 190-193: Waqatiloo fee sabeeli Allahiallatheena yuqatiloonakum wala taAAtadooinna Allaha la yuhibbu almuAAtadeen. Waqtuloohum haythuthaqiftumoohum waakhrijoohum min haythu akhrajookum walfitnatuashaddu mina alqatli wala tuqatiloohum AAindaalmasjidi alharami hatta yuqatilookumfeehi fa-in qatalookum faqtuloohum kathalikajazao alkafireen. Fa-ini intahaw fa-inna Allahaghafoorun raheem. Waqatiloohum hatta latakoona fitnatun wayakoona addeenu lillahi fa-iniintahaw fala AAudwana illa AAala aththalimeen.

Translation: Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors. And kill them wherever you overtake them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah is worse than killing. And do not fight them at al-Masjid al- Haram until they fight you there. But if they fight you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers. And if they cease, then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. Fight them until there is no [more] fitnah and [until] worship is [acknowledged to be] for Allah . But if they cease, then there is to be no aggression except against the oppressors. Translation by Sahih International. When quoting a religious book, don't go at 1 verse. Search the topic to get the big picture. Also, the Holy Qur'an isn't meant to be picked at ayah by ayah.

[Arkadacia]

But no matter what you think the text of a religion actually means. You don't go around burning random Mosques and Muslims.

>You don't go around burning random Mosques and Muslims.

Well, why not? They don't belong in Europe or the West

Great plan. Let's start setting white people who live in Asia on fire because they don't belong in Asia, or set a gyro on fire because it doesn't belong in New York, or set pasta on fire because it doesn't belong anywhere outside of Italy, set a dachshund on fire because it doesn't belong outside of Germany, etc.

Really, you're making this too easy.

[Jochistan]

There are indeed some among the shi'ites.

There are some terrorist groups among all of the religious sects of Islam, except for Ibadism.

The Twelvers are mostly hardliners anyway.

But yes. The Salafi movement is by far the biggest and practically the most relavent threat in Islam and the face of it's fundamentalism. And there are a fucking lot of them. Over a third of Muslims almost.

The Shi'a hardliners are a problem too, but pale in number compared to Salafis.

Shi'ites as a whole pale in number compared to sunnis as a whole, so that shouldn't come as a surprise. Almost all the Shiite countries are wrought with extremism and barbarism; Syria's occupation of Lebanon and fatal silencing of critics of the Syrian occupation, Azerbaijan's Armenian genocide denial, Iran's state-sponsorship of Shiite terror abroad, Iraq doesn't do much but it's a failed state at this point.

Name one movwmovent as big or as relevant as they are.that aren't even influenced by them.

You said yourself they make up like 1/3rd of Muslims. Obviously no other movement will be the size of the largest one, that doesn't mean the smaller ones are any less of a problem.

And by protestant logic I mean rejecting the clear commentary by scholars of the past that throughly explain what you find issue with.

They can try to explain away all they want, it won't change the fact that the Quran clearly calls it's followers to brutally slaughter various people, nor will it change the fact that thousands of people have lost their lives in recent years to people influenced by these verses.

Okay. I'm sure you know much more than these Islamic Scholars that understood the Qur'an better than you ever could.

And although Salafis are a 3rd. The other movements added to them wouldn't make it to be over the range of majority.

If you added all Shi'a period it wouldn't make it to that point. And the Muslim Brotherhood is about 100 million people. Still only about 5%.

Theres definately a fucking problem. And populists and ultranationalists are just as detrimental to combating it as Liberal apologists and Islamic Hardliners.

[Kriga]

There are some terrorist groups among all of the religious sects of Islam, except for Ibadism.

Shi'ites as a whole pale in number compared to sunnis as a whole, so that shouldn't come as a surprise. Almost all the Shiite countries are wrought with extremism and barbarism; Syria's occupation of Lebanon and fatal silencing of critics of the Syrian occupation, Azerbaijan's Armenian genocide denial, Iran's state-sponsorship of Shiite terror abroad, Iraq doesn't do much but it's a failed state at this point.

You said yourself they make up like 1/3rd of Muslims. Obviously no other movement will be the size of the largest one, that doesn't mean the smaller ones are any less of a problem.

They can try to explain away all they want, it won't change the fact that the Quran clearly calls it's followers to brutally slaughter various people, nor will it change the fact that thousands of people have lost their lives in recent years to people influenced by these verses.

Okay. I'm sure you know much more than these Islamic Scholars that understood the Qur'an better than you ever could.

And although Salafis are a 3rd. The other movements added to them wouldn't make it to be over the range of majority.

If you added all Shi'a period it wouldn't make it to that point. And the Muslim Brotherhood is about 100 million people. Still only about 5%.

Theres definately a fucking problem. And populists and ultranationalists are just as detrimental to combating it as Liberal apologists and Islamic Hardliners.

Well...sorry to say, it doesn't seem that way.

[Jochistan]

Okay. I'm sure you know much more than these Islamic Scholars that understood the Qur'an better than you ever could.

And although Salafis are a 3rd. The other movements added to them wouldn't make it to be over the range of majority.

If you added all Shi'a period it wouldn't make it to that point. And the Muslim Brotherhood is about 100 million people. Still only about 5%.

Theres definately a fucking problem. And populists and ultranationalists are just as detrimental to combating it as Liberal apologists and Islamic Hardliners.

Well...sorry to say, it doesn't seem that way.

Make no fucking mistake. They are a massive amount of Muslims. 40% of 1.6 Billion is almost twice the population of the United States.

They are a huge chunk. They're growing and they need to be taken down.

[Crockerland]

Quran (9:123)
"O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Yes, the Quran tells muslims to fight in wars of aggression which they have instigated against the infidels.

Surat Al-Baqarah, ayahs 190-193: Waqatiloo fee sabeeli Allahiallatheena yuqatiloonakum wala taAAtadooinna Allaha la yuhibbu almuAAtadeen. Waqtuloohum haythuthaqiftumoohum waakhrijoohum min haythu akhrajookum walfitnatuashaddu mina alqatli wala tuqatiloohum AAindaalmasjidi alharami hatta yuqatilookumfeehi fa-in qatalookum faqtuloohum kathalikajazao alkafireen. Fa-ini intahaw fa-inna Allahaghafoorun raheem. Waqatiloohum hatta latakoona fitnatun wayakoona addeenu lillahi fa-iniintahaw fala AAudwana illa AAala aththalimeen.

Translation: Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors. And kill them wherever you overtake them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah is worse than killing. And do not fight them at al-Masjid al- Haram until they fight you there. But if they fight you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers. And if they cease, then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. Fight them until there is no [more] fitnah and [until] worship is [acknowledged to be] for Allah . But if they cease, then there is to be no aggression except against the oppressors. Translation by Sahih International. When quoting a religious book, don't go at 1 verse. Search the topic to get the big picture. Also, the Holy Qur'an isn't meant to be picked at ayah by ayah.

Quran 9:29
"Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled."

A consistent theme of murdering anyone who does not worship Allah or submit to paying the jizya. Your own verse says "Fight them until there is no [more] fitnah and [until] worship is [acknowledged to be] for Allah"

[Kriga]

Well...sorry to say, it doesn't seem that way.

Make no fucking mistake. They are a massive amount of Muslims. 40% of 1.6 Billion is almost twice the population of the United States.

They are a huge chunk. They're growing and they need to be taken down.

I'm glad you think that. But, to do that, we must stop this discord and division between the West and East. Whatever alignment you are, tackling radical extremities should be a top priority in today's world.

[Kubumba Tribe]

Surat Al-Baqarah, ayahs 190-193: Waqatiloo fee sabeeli Allahiallatheena yuqatiloonakum wala taAAtadooinna Allaha la yuhibbu almuAAtadeen. Waqtuloohum haythuthaqiftumoohum waakhrijoohum min haythu akhrajookum walfitnatuashaddu mina alqatli wala tuqatiloohum AAindaalmasjidi alharami hatta yuqatilookumfeehi fa-in qatalookum faqtuloohum kathalikajazao alkafireen. Fa-ini intahaw fa-inna Allahaghafoorun raheem. Waqatiloohum hatta latakoona fitnatun wayakoona addeenu lillahi fa-iniintahaw fala AAudwana illa AAala aththalimeen.

Translation: Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors. And kill them wherever you overtake them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah is worse than killing. And do not fight them at al-Masjid al- Haram until they fight you there. But if they fight you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers. And if they cease, then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. Fight them until there is no [more] fitnah and [until] worship is [acknowledged to be] for Allah . But if they cease, then there is to be no aggression except against the oppressors. Translation by Sahih International. When quoting a religious book, don't go at 1 verse. Search the topic to get the big picture. Also, the Holy Qur'an isn't meant to be picked at ayah by ayah.

Quran 9:29
"Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled."

A consistent theme of murdering anyone who does not worship Allah or submit to paying the jizya. Your own verse says "Fight them until there is no [more] fitnah and [until] worship is [acknowledged to be] for Allah"

When they fight you

[Kubumba Tribe]

Quran 9:29
"Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled."

A consistent theme of murdering anyone who does not worship Allah or submit to paying the jizya. Your own verse says "Fight them until there is no [more] fitnah and [until] worship is [acknowledged to be] for Allah"

When they fight you

And in the verse after you said ""Fight them until there is no [more] fitnah [u]and [until] worship is [acknowledged to be] for Allah" says "But if they cease, then there is to be no aggression except against the oppressors".