Abortion: Pro-Choice or Pro-Life?

[New Edom]

Edom, if your entire argument for removing women's rights is because you don't like women/feminists... your argument is automatically disqualified by virtue of being founded upon spite and such rather than anything that could be considered legitimate. Spite is not a legitimate reason.

That's like saying you want to say blacks can't vote because you don't like the way BLM is going.

mini-edit: Oh, and that's also flawless logic in your argument. "Women think rape culture and patriarchy are a thing, so they won't address some issues I want them to address. Let's take away their right to choose to abort pregnancy, in effect raping their bodies by making them carry pregnancy to term, and force them to listen to my issues as a man. That'll teach'em! No way in hell that proves them right!"

That's one of the stupidest things I've ever read.

Look at my original post here. What I said is that I took the position that I DO support it in linmited circumstances--where women's choice to have sex to begin with is remnoved. Ie if they are experiencing serious medical conditions, were raped or subjected to incest. Furthermore I entirely support improving sex ed, access to birth control and improved women's medical health.

However I will not be emotinoally bullied into supporting abortion rights any further than I already have, and I will nto consider supporting it while feminists continue to block support for abused men, women and boys subject to female initiated abuse. If that's too petty and egotistical a matter for you people, too bad. If they really stand for egalitarianism then it should be easy for them to at least reconsider their position.

[The V O I D]

Edom, if your entire argument for removing women's rights is because you don't like women/feminists... your argument is automatically disqualified by virtue of being founded upon spite and such rather than anything that could be considered legitimate. Spite is not a legitimate reason.

That's like saying you want to say blacks can't vote because you don't like the way BLM is going.

mini-edit: Oh, and that's also flawless logic in your argument. "Women think rape culture and patriarchy are a thing, so they won't address some issues I want them to address. Let's take away their right to choose to abort pregnancy, in effect raping their bodies by making them carry pregnancy to term, and force them to listen to my issues as a man. That'll teach'em! No way in hell that proves them right!"

That's one of the stupidest things I've ever read.

Look at my original post here. What I said is that I took the position that I DO support it in linmited circumstances--where women's choice to have sex to begin with is remnoved. Ie if they are experiencing serious medical conditions, were raped or subjected to incest. Furthermore I entirely support improving sex ed, access to birth control and improved women's medical health.

However I will not be emotinoally bullied into supporting abortion rights any further than I already have, and I will nto consider supporting it while feminists continue to block support for abused men, women and boys subject to female initiated abuse. If that's too petty and egotistical a matter for you people, too bad. If they really stand for egalitarianism then it should be easy for them to at least reconsider their position.

You realize you're just proving my point, yeah? Hope you do. Your argument makes no sense. Hell, doing it for the sake of religion makes more sense.

[New Edom]

That's one of the stupidest things I've ever read.

Look at my original post here. What I said is that I took the position that I DO support it in linmited circumstances--where women's choice to have sex to begin with is remnoved. Ie if they are experiencing serious medical conditions, were raped or subjected to incest. Furthermore I entirely support improving sex ed, access to birth control and improved women's medical health.

However I will not be emotinoally bullied into supporting abortion rights any further than I already have, and I will nto consider supporting it while feminists continue to block support for abused men, women and boys subject to female initiated abuse. If that's too petty and egotistical a matter for you people, too bad. If they really stand for egalitarianism then it should be easy for them to at least reconsider their position.

You realize you're just proving my point, yeah? Hope you do. Your argument makes no sense. Hell, doing it for the sake of religion makes more sense.

Well, I don't think I can persuade you anyway. Fortunately there are many other people who agree with me, and we will have to see whose influence is stronger in the end. At some point in the midst of that no doubt negotiation will take place, that's how this sort of thing works at the end of the day.

[Alvecia]

You realize you're just proving my point, yeah? Hope you do. Your argument makes no sense. Hell, doing it for the sake of religion makes more sense.

Well, I don't think I can persuade you anyway. Fortunately there are many other people who agree with me, and we will have to see whose influence is stronger in the end. At some point in the midst of that no doubt negotiation will take place, that's how this sort of thing works at the end of the day.

It is the best example of cutting off the nose to spite the face I've seen in some time, I'll give you that.

[The V O I D]

You realize you're just proving my point, yeah? Hope you do. Your argument makes no sense. Hell, doing it for the sake of religion makes more sense.

Well, I don't think I can persuade you anyway. Fortunately there are many other people who agree with me, and we will have to see whose influence is stronger in the end. At some point in the midst of that no doubt negotiation will take place, that's how this sort of thing works at the end of the day.

I doubt that. Planned Parenthood v. Casey upheld and enforced Roe v. Wade, and I think changed it somehow but not by much to make it more enforced. Then, just a couple months ago, the Supreme Court in a 5-3 ruling decided in another case to rule that state laws restricting access and/or making it harder to access abortions is unconstitutional because it goes against previous abortion rights cases. So, as of that other case, states in the US can't even restrict access to abortions; in all 50 US states, women need only request an abortion and get an appointment for one set up, then get it done. No restrictions or blockages.

Pro-Choice has already won, and I doubt that's going to change if the Supreme Court decided to go in favor of abortion rights despite missing a member. Oh, the best part is, since the Supreme Court decides what is or isn't constitutional, if anyone sues them for unconstitutionality for that ruling due to not having all nine members, the same five who ruled in favor of abortion rights will simply vote that yes, it is constitutional; and no one can question them as they decide what is/isn't constitutional. This gives the Supreme Court a substantial amount of power, but regardless, there is no real point in saying 'eventually we'll negotiate', as Pro-Choice has already won times a billion. Being Pro-life out of spite for feminism and such is a pointless endeavor.

[Renewed Imperial Germany]

Hey, Edom. Make an argument against abortion that ain't "FUCK FEMMIES!" and maybe we'll treat it like it holds water, k?

[New Edom]

Hey, Edom. Make an argument against abortion that ain't "FUCK FEMMIES!" and maybe we'll treat it like it holds water, k?

No, we're done here for now. However I will demolish some more feminist theory later on. You will all notice I'm sure.

[Renewed Imperial Germany]

Hey, Edom. Make an argument against abortion that ain't "FUCK FEMMIES!" and maybe we'll treat it like it holds water, k?

No, we're done here for now. However I will demolish some more feminist theory later on. You will all notice I'm sure.

Lighting straw women on fire isn't demolishing feminist theory.

[Kelinfort]

Improving women's healthcare is a feminist initiative.

And that's as far as I am prepared to go with my support. I am willing to support health benefits to fellow citizens. I won't support abortions.

That makes no sense.

[Kelinfort]

Hey, Edom. Make an argument against abortion that ain't "FUCK FEMMIES!" and maybe we'll treat it like it holds water, k?

No, we're done here for now. However I will demolish some more feminist theory later on. You will all notice I'm sure.

You'll see...YOU'LL ALL SEE!

Another one off the deep end, go get me the chalkboard

[Socialist Nordia]

Hey, Edom. Make an argument against abortion that ain't "FUCK FEMMIES!" and maybe we'll treat it like it holds water, k?

No, we're done here for now. However I will demolish some more feminist theory later on. You will all notice I'm sure.

Look, if your only argument is that abortion should be illegal to spite feminists, you're not going to win any arguments.

[The Romulan Republic]

No, we're done here for now. However I will demolish some more feminist theory later on. You will all notice I'm sure.

Look, if your only argument is that abortion should be illegal to spite feminists, you're not going to win any arguments.

I mean.. normally I would be inclined to regard "You oppose abortion because you hate and want to oppress women" to be an over-simplistic straw man. Its sad to see someone actually openly live down to that standard.

And yes, I know women and feminist aren't synonymous. But still...

This is just stupid.

[Wallenburg]

Look, if your only argument is that abortion should be illegal to spite feminists, you're not going to win any arguments.

I mean.. normally I would be inclined to regard "You oppose abortion because you hate and want to oppress women" to be an over-simplistic straw man. Its sad to see someone actually openly live down to that standard.

And yes, I know women and feminist aren't synonymous. But still...

This is just stupid.

Please, cite where Socialist Nordia said that.

[Ardavia]

I mean.. normally I would be inclined to regard "You oppose abortion because you hate and want to oppress women" to be an over-simplistic straw man. Its sad to see someone actually openly live down to that standard.

And yes, I know women and feminist aren't synonymous. But still...

This is just stupid.

Please, cite where Socialist Nordia said that.

I think Romulan was referring to New Edom.

[The Romulan Republic]

Please, cite where Socialist Nordia said that.

I think Romulan was referring to New Edom.

Yeah, no shit.

[New Edom]

I think Romulan was referring to New Edom.

Yeah, no shit.

Yeah that was MY insult.

[New Edom]

By the way all you feminist supporters had your chance to deal with my concern in this thread and failed miserably. If you examine the poll results, out of 91 people--more than are used in the average feminist study to suport rape culture btw--23% said feminists were dealing with the issue of women who abuse others and were addressing issues, though there was pretty much no proof of this whatsoever. 24% said some feminsts were trying to address it but most were not. That leaves 57% saying that they dont think feminism addresses the issue adequately.

If some of you would care to sojourn over to that thread and revive it a bit, I'm game. Demonstrate to me how feminism's mainstream is addressing the important issue of women abusing children, sexually molesting children, etc, and in other ways underminining sexual and bodily consent, and I'll take a look at your proof. But don't think you're so clever that you can pretend I'm just the bafd guy by insisting that before I support his movement further I insist on this issue being at leats talked about more openly.

Or hey, don't. The more you all say that I'm the villain here, the more I'll find ways to point out the truth. But if you have the proof, offer it. Convince me.

[Wallenburg]

I think Romulan was referring to New Edom.

Yeah, no shit.

Ah, I see. I misinterpreted your post.

[Wallenburg]

By the way all you feminist supporters had your chance to deal with my concern in this thread and failed miserably. If you examine the poll results, out of 91 people--more than are used in the average feminist study to suport rape culture btw--23% said feminists were dealing with the issue of women who abuse others and were addressing issues, though there was pretty much no proof of this whatsoever. 24% said some feminsts were trying to address it but most were not. That leaves 57% saying that they dont think feminism addresses the issue adequately.

If some of you would care to sojourn over to that thread and revive it a bit, I'm game. Demonstrate to me how feminism's mainstream is addressing the important issue of women abusing children, sexually molesting children, etc, and in other ways underminining sexual and bodily consent, and I'll take a look at your proof. But don't think you're so clever that you can pretend I'm just the bafd guy by insisting that before I support his movement further I insist on this issue being at leats talked about more openly.

Or hey, don't. The more you all say that I'm the villain here, the more I'll find ways to point out the truth. But if you have the proof, offer it. Convince me.

I recall several people demonstrating it to you, but you and your fellow MGTOWs just said "that doesn't count!"

[Kelinfort]

By the way all you feminist supporters had your chance to deal with my concern in this thread and failed miserably. If you examine the poll results, out of 91 people--more than are used in the average feminist study to suport rape culture btw--23% said feminists were dealing with the issue of women who abuse others and were addressing issues, though there was pretty much no proof of this whatsoever. 24% said some feminsts were trying to address it but most were not. That leaves 57% saying that they dont think feminism addresses the issue adequately.

If some of you would care to sojourn over to that thread and revive it a bit, I'm game. Demonstrate to me how feminism's mainstream is addressing the important issue of women abusing children, sexually molesting children, etc, and in other ways underminining sexual and bodily consent, and I'll take a look at your proof. But don't think you're so clever that you can pretend I'm just the bafd guy by insisting that before I support his movement further I insist on this issue being at leats talked about more openly.

Or hey, don't. The more you all say that I'm the villain here, the more I'll find ways to point out the truth. But if you have the proof, offer it. Convince me.

He's got a push poll! Everyone hide in fear!

Maybe I should make a thread called, "Why do feminists want men to be slaves to their hideous vaginas?"

[Risottia]

Maybe I should make a thread called, "Why do feminists want men to be slaves to their hideous vaginas?"

I for one welcome our hairy (or also shaven) overlords.

[New Edom]

By the way all you feminist supporters had your chance to deal with my concern in this thread and failed miserably. If you examine the poll results, out of 91 people--more than are used in the average feminist study to suport rape culture btw--23% said feminists were dealing with the issue of women who abuse others and were addressing issues, though there was pretty much no proof of this whatsoever. 24% said some feminsts were trying to address it but most were not. That leaves 57% saying that they dont think feminism addresses the issue adequately.

If some of you would care to sojourn over to that thread and revive it a bit, I'm game. Demonstrate to me how feminism's mainstream is addressing the important issue of women abusing children, sexually molesting children, etc, and in other ways underminining sexual and bodily consent, and I'll take a look at your proof. But don't think you're so clever that you can pretend I'm just the bafd guy by insisting that before I support his movement further I insist on this issue being at leats talked about more openly.

Or hey, don't. The more you all say that I'm the villain here, the more I'll find ways to point out the truth. But if you have the proof, offer it. Convince me.

I recall several people demonstrating it to you, but you and your fellow MGTOWs just said "that doesn't count!"

Is this actually the best you can do? You'd think if you cared so much you'd be anxious to prove your point. But you are welcome to try again. I'm out of this thread, please continue with your discussion of why abortion rights are a dogma all must follow or be labeled haters of women. This is about freedom, right? Thank you.

[Wallenburg]

I recall several people demonstrating it to you, but you and your fellow MGTOWs just said "that doesn't count!"

Is this actually the best you can do? You'd think if you cared so much you'd be anxious to prove your point.

I'm not all that anxious to debate with people who refuse to recognize reality.

But you are welcome to try again. I'm out of this thread, please continue with your discussion of why abortion rights are a dogma all must follow or be labeled haters of women. This is about freedom, right? Thank you.

Strawman. Try harder.

[Godular]

By the way all you feminist supporters had your chance to deal with my concern in this thread and failed miserably. If you examine the poll results, out of 91 people--more than are used in the average feminist study to suport rape culture btw--23% said feminists were dealing with the issue of women who abuse others and were addressing issues, though there was pretty much no proof of this whatsoever. 24% said some feminsts were trying to address it but most were not. That leaves 57% saying that they dont think feminism addresses the issue adequately.

If some of you would care to sojourn over to that thread and revive it a bit, I'm game. Demonstrate to me how feminism's mainstream is addressing the important issue of women abusing children, sexually molesting children, etc, and in other ways underminining sexual and bodily consent, and I'll take a look at your proof. But don't think you're so clever that you can pretend I'm just the bafd guy by insisting that before I support his movement further I insist on this issue being at leats talked about more openly.

Or hey, don't. The more you all say that I'm the villain here, the more I'll find ways to point out the truth. But if you have the proof, offer it. Convince me.

We don't call you a villain for what you purport to fight for. We would only be inclined to name you a villain because the reasons you have stated are a bullshit basis to deny the rights of others. Your statements are those of a petulant child angry at an entire demographic for the actions of a few.

And your idea that all women should be punished for not addressing your concerns to your satisfaction also reflects this.

And you claim that evidence is on your side, but it has been indicated in multiple ways that your position is one massive non-sequitur based on anger at some perceived slight.

It is a comforting delusion, to presume persecution in order to justify that which you inflict upon others.

[The V O I D]

Edom just totally ignored my response to him... not really surprised, though.