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North Carolina Passes "Anti-LGBT" Bill

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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bill?

yeh
217
29%
neh
431
58%
weh?
42
6%
eh
52
7%
 
Total votes : 742

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Kannap
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Posts: 60491
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:02 am

Tufoba-Beringia wrote:
Kannap wrote:
They make it illegal for PUBLIC and government buildings to allow transgender people to use their appropriate bathrooms. The law also prohibits transgender people from using their appropriate bathrooms. The law also prohibits cities and municipalities from passing pro-LGBT ordinances. The law also prohibits, for some reason, cities from raising the minimum wage above the national minimum wage.


Yep, and I'm fine with the latter two -- cities and muncipalities should not be allowed to impose any regulations on private businesses, forget this hardly relevant stuff. And yeah, minimum wage is crap. I don't like the order on public buildings.

Discrimination hurts businesses. They have no incentive to discriminate. It's bad business practice. But it isn't the job of the government to decide what business practices are profitable.


So: Cities and municipalities have no right to create such "regulations," the state government fully has the right, and if the federal government - which certainly has the right - does it, Republicans cry foul.
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Pichtonia
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Founded: Apr 13, 2016
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Postby Pichtonia » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:06 am

I'm not sure if I would be extraordinarily comfortable with trans people in the same toilet as me either, mainly because I never experienced that, but that is my problem, not theirs. I find it depressive how some conservatives try to go back in time with discriminatory legislature.
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Soldati Senza Confini
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Posts: 86050
Founded: Mar 11, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:07 am

Kannap wrote:
Tufoba-Beringia wrote:
Yep, and I'm fine with the latter two -- cities and muncipalities should not be allowed to impose any regulations on private businesses, forget this hardly relevant stuff. And yeah, minimum wage is crap. I don't like the order on public buildings.

Discrimination hurts businesses. They have no incentive to discriminate. It's bad business practice. But it isn't the job of the government to decide what business practices are profitable.


So: Cities and municipalities have no right to create such "regulations," the state government fully has the right, and if the federal government - which certainly has the right - does it, Republicans cry foul.


By his logic -- that cities and municipalities have no right to impose regulations on private businesses, commercial sprinkler installations shouldn't have a double check valve. Hell, I'm sure most commercial clients would be happy to not spend 3,000 dollars on the installation of a double check valve and let the city take care of any backflow that goes back into the main water supply line.

I'll be sure to go and console some of those poor business owners who have to spend thousands of dollars into commercial sprinkler installations because they spent 3,000 dollars on an useless valve. /sarcasm
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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:08 am

Pichtonia wrote:I'm not sure if I would be extraordinarily comfortable with trans people in the same toilet as me either, mainly because I never experienced that, but that is my problem, not theirs. I find it depressive how some conservatives try to go back in time with discriminatory legislature.


What, ain't you ever had somebody tap your foot.

Ah, but seriously... You wouldn't know they were transgender unless you were in the same stall as them.

So... Unless you're also going into bathrooms for blowjobs, that won't be a problem.
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Threlizdun
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Founded: Jun 14, 2009
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Postby Threlizdun » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:10 am

Pichtonia wrote:I'm not sure if I would be extraordinarily comfortable with trans people in the same toilet as me either, mainly because I never experienced that, but that is my problem, not theirs. I find it depressive how some conservatives try to go back in time with discriminatory legislature.

Odds are that you have been in a restroom wth a trans person before, you just didn't know it because they were just doing the same thing you were.
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The United Colonies of Earth
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Posts: 9659
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby The United Colonies of Earth » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:10 am

Tufoba-Beringia wrote:
Kannap wrote:
They make it illegal for PUBLIC and government buildings to allow transgender people to use their appropriate bathrooms. The law also prohibits transgender people from using their appropriate bathrooms. The law also prohibits cities and municipalities from passing pro-LGBT ordinances. The law also prohibits, for some reason, cities from raising the minimum wage above the national minimum wage.


Yep, and I'm fine with the latter two -- cities and muncipalities should not be allowed to impose any regulations on private businesses, forget this hardly relevant stuff. And yeah, minimum wage is crap. I don't like the order on public buildings.

Discrimination hurts businesses. They have no incentive to discriminate. It's bad business practice. But it isn't the job of the government to decide what business practices are profitable.

Businesses are run by idiots, and there's a reason for everything. If you live in a sufficiently bigoted place and your business accepts the local law-abiding scum of society into its' doors, the mob will come and burn your livelihood to ashes at the first opportunity.
The job of the government is to exist.
The United Colonies of Earth exists:
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to ensure that human rights are respected, with force if necessary, and that all nations recognize the inevitable and unalienable rights of all human beings regardless of their individual and harmless differences, or Idiosyncrasies;
to represent the interests of all humankind to other sapient species;
to protect all humanity and its’ colonies from unneeded violence or danger;
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Soldati Senza Confini
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Posts: 86050
Founded: Mar 11, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:12 am

The United Colonies of Earth wrote:
Tufoba-Beringia wrote:
Yep, and I'm fine with the latter two -- cities and muncipalities should not be allowed to impose any regulations on private businesses, forget this hardly relevant stuff. And yeah, minimum wage is crap. I don't like the order on public buildings.

Discrimination hurts businesses. They have no incentive to discriminate. It's bad business practice. But it isn't the job of the government to decide what business practices are profitable.

Businesses are run by idiots, and there's a reason for everything. If you live in a sufficiently bigoted place and your business accepts the local law-abiding scum of society into its' doors, the mob will come and burn your livelihood to ashes at the first opportunity.
The job of the government is to exist.


Not every business owner is an idiot, just putting that out there. :p

Otherwise, I agree.
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Tekania wrote:Welcome to NSG, where informed opinions get to bump-heads with ignorant ideology under the pretense of an equal footing.

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Zeinbrad
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Founded: Jun 04, 2012
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Postby Zeinbrad » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:15 am


I...I feel someone should contact the authorities.
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The second way is to be kind.
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Pichtonia
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Posts: 17
Founded: Apr 13, 2016
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Pichtonia » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:15 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Pichtonia wrote:I'm not sure if I would be extraordinarily comfortable with trans people in the same toilet as me either, mainly because I never experienced that, but that is my problem, not theirs. I find it depressive how some conservatives try to go back in time with discriminatory legislature.


Ah, but seriously... You wouldn't know they were transgender unless you were in the same stall as them.


Threlizdun wrote:Odds are that you have been in a restroom wth a trans person before, you just didn't know it because they were just doing the same thing you were.


Could be true. But I'm from a very rural area, so I kind of doubt it. Only recently moved to a larger city.

The Rich Port wrote:So... Unless you're also going into bathrooms for blowjobs, that won't be a problem.


... No, never done that. :lol:
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Kannap
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 60491
Founded: May 07, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:16 am

Zeinbrad wrote:

I...I feel someone should contact the authorities.


Doesn't help when the authorities encourage such behavior.
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Soldati Senza Confini
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Founded: Mar 11, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:17 am

Zeinbrad wrote:

I...I feel someone should contact the authorities.


Some of the people against the bill are "the authorities".

Which should tell you more about your own local elections than anything else.
Soldati senza confini: Better than an iPod in shuffle more with 20,000 songs.
Tekania wrote:Welcome to NSG, where informed opinions get to bump-heads with ignorant ideology under the pretense of an equal footing.

"When it’s a choice of putting food on the table, or thinking about your morals, it’s easier to say you’d think about your morals, but only if you’ve never faced that decision." - Anastasia Richardson

Current Goal: Flesh out nation factbook.

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Kannap
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 60491
Founded: May 07, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:19 am

Pichtonia wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
Ah, but seriously... You wouldn't know they were transgender unless you were in the same stall as them.


Threlizdun wrote:Odds are that you have been in a restroom wth a trans person before, you just didn't know it because they were just doing the same thing you were.


Could be true. But I'm from a very rural area, so I kind of doubt it. Only recently moved to a larger city.


I've had the good fortunes of growing up in a nice sized city that is a suburb of Charlotte.
Last edited by Kannap on Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Zeinbrad
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Founded: Jun 04, 2012
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Postby Zeinbrad » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:19 am

Kannap wrote:
Zeinbrad wrote:I...I feel someone should contact the authorities.


Doesn't help when the authorities encourage such behavior.

Can't the US Marshals get involved? I'm not an expert exactly on Federal Law Enforcement.
Last edited by Zeinbrad on Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The first way is to be kind.
The second way is to be kind.
The third way is to be kind.”
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The Rich Port
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Posts: 37151
Founded: Jul 29, 2008
Left-Leaning College State

Postby The Rich Port » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:20 am

Pichtonia wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
Ah, but seriously... You wouldn't know they were transgender unless you were in the same stall as them.


Threlizdun wrote:Odds are that you have been in a restroom wth a trans person before, you just didn't know it because they were just doing the same thing you were.


Could be true. But I'm from a very rural area, so I kind of doubt it. Only recently moved to a larger city.

The Rich Port wrote:So... Unless you're also going into bathrooms for blowjobs, that won't be a problem.


... No, never done that. :lol:


Pfft, I live in rural Florida.

More closeted homosexuals and fetishists per capita than everywhere else in the U.S.A.
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Soldati Senza Confini
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Ex-Nation

Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:20 am

Zeinbrad wrote:
Kannap wrote:
Doesn't help when the authorities encourage such behavior.

Can't the US Marshals get involved? I'm not exactly on Federal Law Enforcement.


U.S. Marshals generally don't have the authority on state law.

Those would be your state troopers.
Soldati senza confini: Better than an iPod in shuffle more with 20,000 songs.
Tekania wrote:Welcome to NSG, where informed opinions get to bump-heads with ignorant ideology under the pretense of an equal footing.

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Kannap
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Founded: May 07, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:20 am

Zeinbrad wrote:
Kannap wrote:
Doesn't help when the authorities encourage such behavior.

Can't the US Marshals get involved? I'm not an expert exactly on Federal Law Enforcement.


Nor am I an expert on Federal Law Enforcement, so I am unaware of the correct answer for your question.
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Zeinbrad
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Postby Zeinbrad » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:22 am

Soldati senza confini wrote:
Zeinbrad wrote:Can't the US Marshals get involved? I'm not exactly on Federal Law Enforcement.


U.S. Marshals generally don't have the authority on state law.

Those would be your state troopers.

Okay.

I'm just pretty sure threatening to shoot people on Twitter will get you arrested. Law or not.
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The second way is to be kind.
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Kannap
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Founded: May 07, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:23 am

Soldati senza confini wrote:
Zeinbrad wrote:Can't the US Marshals get involved? I'm not exactly on Federal Law Enforcement.


U.S. Marshals generally don't have the authority on state law.

Those would be your state troopers.


Who are currently busy dealing with the recent crackdown by the North Carolina Department of Transportation: No more five MPH grace limit above the speed limit, if you are going over the posted speed limit (even 1 MPH over), you'll be pulled over. I doubt they've got time to concern themselves with guarding bathrooms from folks with guns.
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Soldati Senza Confini
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Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:24 am

Zeinbrad wrote:
Soldati senza confini wrote:
U.S. Marshals generally don't have the authority on state law.

Those would be your state troopers.

Okay.

I'm just pretty sure threatening to shoot people on Twitter will get you arrested. Law or not.


Lots of people say stupid things on twitter. Also, pretty sure they can't do anything on a threat to shoot a demographic, just against one individual.

Saying "I'm going to shoot those motherfuckers" is different from saying "I will shoot your ass next time I see you. I know where you live".
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Tekania wrote:Welcome to NSG, where informed opinions get to bump-heads with ignorant ideology under the pretense of an equal footing.

"When it’s a choice of putting food on the table, or thinking about your morals, it’s easier to say you’d think about your morals, but only if you’ve never faced that decision." - Anastasia Richardson

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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:25 am

Zeinbrad wrote:
Kannap wrote:
Doesn't help when the authorities encourage such behavior.

Can't the US Marshals get involved? I'm not an expert exactly on Federal Law Enforcement.


Hmm, maybe.

The Marshals are more about capturing fugitives, serving federal arrest warrants, and operating the WitSec.

But they're also in charge of maintaining an operating judiciary. As in, making sure that the cops aren't all dead or corrupt.
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NOW WITH SUPER SECRET VIP CONSTRUCTIVE DISCUSSION DISCORD. INQUIRE VIA TELEGRAM.

Coronavirus is real, and a real problem. Do not panic, but please educate yourself and take steps to protect yourself and your loved ones. Donald Trump lied. Pray for the sick.
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THOSE THAT SOW THORNS SHOULD NOT EXPECT FLOWERS
YOU NEVER KNOW JUST HOW YOU LOOK THROUGH OTHER PEOPLE'S EYES

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The V O I D
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Postby The V O I D » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:25 am

Oh, for crying out loud -- Fuck democracy at this point. Declare me dictator and I'll give full rights for LGBT for marriage, bathroom usage, etc. and I'll enforce laws that enforce pro-choice on abortion so no sneaky underhanded laws can be made. I'll also make it illegal for anyone but the police to use military grade weapons [because criminals will get them anyways probably], and enforce a strict "rifles and shotguns are for hunting purposes only" rule of thumb. You get a pistol for self defense, and that's that. I'll also try to fix all the shitty problems our inefficient government has gotten us into. Our debt's too deep, tempted to say I'd declare us bankrupt to save us from having to pay it. After all of this, I'd make any/all laws as dictator amendments into the Constitution, and make an amendment that all further amendments cannot remove or cancel previous amendments, even if they were made by a dictator. Then I'd resign and re-institute the proper democracy.

Any issues with this?

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The United Colonies of Earth
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Postby The United Colonies of Earth » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:27 am

The V O I D wrote:Oh, for crying out loud -- Fuck democracy at this point. Declare me dictator and I'll give full rights for LGBT for marriage, bathroom usage, etc. and I'll enforce laws that enforce pro-choice on abortion so no sneaky underhanded laws can be made. I'll also make it illegal for anyone but the police to use military grade weapons [because criminals will get them anyways probably], and enforce a strict "rifles and shotguns are for hunting purposes only" rule of thumb. You get a pistol for self defense, and that's that. I'll also try to fix all the shitty problems our inefficient government has gotten us into. Our debt's too deep, tempted to say I'd declare us bankrupt to save us from having to pay it. After all of this, I'd make any/all laws as dictator amendments into the Constitution, and make an amendment that all further amendments cannot remove or cancel previous amendments, even if they were made by a dictator. Then I'd resign and re-institute the proper democracy.

Any issues with this?

plenty from everyone. None from me...yet.
The United Colonies of Earth exists:
to encourage settlement of all habitable worlds in the Galaxy and perhaps the Universe by the human race;
to ensure that human rights are respected, with force if necessary, and that all nations recognize the inevitable and unalienable rights of all human beings regardless of their individual and harmless differences, or Idiosyncrasies;
to represent the interests of all humankind to other sapient species;
to protect all humanity and its’ colonies from unneeded violence or danger;
to promote technological advancement and scientific achievement for the happiness, knowledge and welfare of all humans;
and to facilitate cooperation in the spheres of law, transportation, communication, and measurement between nation-states.

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Threlizdun
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Threlizdun » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:28 am

Pichtonia wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
Ah, but seriously... You wouldn't know they were transgender unless you were in the same stall as them.


Threlizdun wrote:Odds are that you have been in a restroom wth a trans person before, you just didn't know it because they were just doing the same thing you were.


Could be true. But I'm from a very rural area, so I kind of doubt it. Only recently moved to a larger city.
That doesn't really mean much. Demographics for LGBTQ+ individuals tend to be relatively similar regardless of where you look, they just may be less likely to openly identify as a such. I'm a trans woman who grew up in a rural area and new other trans folks.
Last edited by Threlizdun on Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The V O I D
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Founded: Apr 13, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The V O I D » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:29 am

The United Colonies of Earth wrote:
The V O I D wrote:Oh, for crying out loud -- Fuck democracy at this point. Declare me dictator and I'll give full rights for LGBT for marriage, bathroom usage, etc. and I'll enforce laws that enforce pro-choice on abortion so no sneaky underhanded laws can be made. I'll also make it illegal for anyone but the police to use military grade weapons [because criminals will get them anyways probably], and enforce a strict "rifles and shotguns are for hunting purposes only" rule of thumb. You get a pistol for self defense, and that's that. I'll also try to fix all the shitty problems our inefficient government has gotten us into. Our debt's too deep, tempted to say I'd declare us bankrupt to save us from having to pay it. After all of this, I'd make any/all laws as dictator amendments into the Constitution, and make an amendment that all further amendments cannot remove or cancel previous amendments, even if they were made by a dictator. Then I'd resign and re-institute the proper democracy.

Any issues with this?

plenty from everyone. None from me...yet.


Some people have told me when I've said that before that I'd be the most liberal, benevolent dictator that ever existed. But on the topic of this - yes, I'd make laws enforcing that gender identity is what determines your bathroom usage, no matter what other people whine or complain about.

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The United Colonies of Earth
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Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby The United Colonies of Earth » Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:35 am

The V O I D wrote:
The United Colonies of Earth wrote:plenty from everyone. None from me...yet.


Some people have told me when I've said that before that I'd be the most liberal, benevolent dictator that ever existed. But on the topic of this - yes, I'd make laws enforcing that gender identity is what determines your bathroom usage, no matter what other people whine or complain about.

That I can definitely support.
The United Colonies of Earth exists:
to encourage settlement of all habitable worlds in the Galaxy and perhaps the Universe by the human race;
to ensure that human rights are respected, with force if necessary, and that all nations recognize the inevitable and unalienable rights of all human beings regardless of their individual and harmless differences, or Idiosyncrasies;
to represent the interests of all humankind to other sapient species;
to protect all humanity and its’ colonies from unneeded violence or danger;
to promote technological advancement and scientific achievement for the happiness, knowledge and welfare of all humans;
and to facilitate cooperation in the spheres of law, transportation, communication, and measurement between nation-states.

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