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Brussels Terrorist Attack: ISIS Claims Responsibility

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Vistulange
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5066
Founded: May 13, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Vistulange » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:42 am

Ganos Lao wrote:
Vistulange wrote:The Middle-East has a virulent cancer of radical Islamism and violent Jihad. Europe and the West have a just as virulent cancer of irredentism, racism and ultranationalism.


It all boils down to the institutionalized idiocracy in both cases.


Precisely. The key word there, however, is not "idiocracy" but instead "institutionalised". People willingly and knowingly engage in the nonsense, putting aside rationale and the very process of empathy and understanding aside.

"Understanding" does not mean "agreeing with". You must understand and empathise with anything you see as an enemy or a hostile as to better engage it. Unfortunately, those who engage in this nonsense also feel that the words "understanding" and "empathy" are not on their aside, as they are oft inclined to believe that nothing short of violence and cruelty will solve their problems.

Saiwania wrote:
Trada wrote:Huh... How about Europe colonizing other poorer nations and enslaving them?


Done partially in response to being invaded for centuries by north Africans through Spain and by Seljuks from the east. Europe had long come to the conclusion that if they didn't empire build, their overseas rivals would and thus would threaten Europe's security going forward. Another component was gaining economic advantages in trade.


Right, please explain this to the thousands of people who are sick and tired of Western imperialism, whose borders were drawn arbitrarily at the behest of Western powers? The French and the British carved up the Middle-East without even poking the local Arab people. Borders were drawn arbitrarily, as I have stated in the previous sentence, with no heed to local dynamics and power relations. Now, you are angry that these people despise you.

You really are not trying to even comprehend why these people are willing to die for a God some don't even believe in, are you? I am certain you have the capability to do so, but you simply choose not to. Keeping them as uneducated masses who are not civilised in your reality-distortion field probably makes the whole concept of keeping them away from your Fortress Europe much more appealing and righteous.
Last edited by Vistulange on Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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United Marxist Nations
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Founded: Dec 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby United Marxist Nations » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:43 am

Sanctissima wrote:
Saiwania wrote:
Done partially in response to being invaded for centuries by north Africans through Spain and by Seljuks from the east. Europe had long come to the conclusion that if they didn't empire build, their overseas rivals would and thus would threaten Europe's security going forward. Another component was gaining economic advantages in trade.


The economic and imperialist side of things had a lot more to do with it than the whole "gotta conquer them before they conquer us" mentality. You could potentially make an argument for that during the many wars against the Ottoman Empire, but even then, by the time European powers actually started to make significant gains against the Ottomans there were other more influential factors at play.

What do you mean by "significant gains", because the Wars against the Ottomans spanned for like 450+ years.
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United Marxist Nations
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Founded: Dec 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby United Marxist Nations » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:44 am

Vistulange wrote:
Ganos Lao wrote:
It all boils down to the institutionalized idiocracy in both cases.


Precisely. The key word there, however, is not "idiocracy" but instead "institutionalised". People willingly and knowingly engage in the nonsense, putting aside rationale and the very process of empathy and understanding aside.

"Understanding" does not mean "agreeing with". You must understand and empathise with anything you see as an enemy or a hostile as to better engage it. Unfortunately, those who engage in this nonsense also feel that the words "understanding" and "empathy" are not on their aside, as they are oft inclined to believe that nothing short of violence and cruelty will solve their problems.

Didn't you just decry using emotion in political discourse? So why are you now saying we have to show empathy?
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Kautharr
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Founded: Feb 25, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Kautharr » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:44 am

Trada wrote:
Saiwania wrote:
We effectively had that before with the Ottoman empire. They were nothing but trouble for Europe. They kept trying to invade and expand but weren't able to. Great Britain was just opportunistic in having them formally get dissolved after WWI.


Huh... How about Europe colonising other poorer nations and enslaving them? The Caliphate was one of the most developed and rich empires ever seen in history, I strongly advise you to first learn about the history of Caliphate and then say something about it. The caliphate is not what you thinnk it is (strict sharia law that kills everyone who opposes them)

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Trada
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Posts: 6
Founded: Mar 14, 2016
Ex-Nation

Radicalisation

Postby Trada » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:44 am

We must understand these extremists. Why do they do this?
Well, becuase they see videos on the internet where Syrians are being killed and where a father is crying in fornt of his dead child. Or Palestinians being killed by the Israeli occupation forces. And after watching like 20 of them (videos) they get nervous and they want to help. Here it starts, the very beginning to radicalisation. And when they hear that these bombs, killing civilians (colleteral damage), are from the West (airstrikes), they get some anti-western feelings and ideas. The next week they have watching like 100 of them. So these guys are potential terrorists and a threat, they want to kill Western people (Europeans,..), becuase they are too mad at them. And then one day these guys encounter a racist European who gives racist remarks. There it is, these guys have made their choice: terrorist attack. They think that all Europeans are the same one racist nation. And one day these guys make an end to their life by bombing something after being brainwashed by extremists...
So to stop all this we have firstly look at our own racist people and groups (Pegida, Trump,...) and stop them.
The once peaceful multicultural Belgium is now kinda in shock, and I live in Belgium, it feels bad.
We also have to stop polarising (through media, politicians,..), it just makes the IS make more recruit gains.

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
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Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:47 am

Uxupox wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
Now, now, Christian terrorists are just as evil as any other terrorists.

Also, we need evidence and everyone is innocent until proven guilty.


You don't see Christian people publicly lauding that attack do you?




"As a proud Canadian Muslim, I can only hope that this attack won't turn fellow Canadians against each other. I can only fear Islamophobia after this attack. But if we're smart about it, we won't let these terrorists change who Canadians are."-Abdala Haidar, Current top voted comment on the official facebook re post of the official statement by Justin Trudeau.

I haven't seen any Muslim people approving of that attack. There reacting to a major attack by publicly condemning the attack.
Last edited by The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp on Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:50 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Sanctissima
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8486
Founded: Jul 16, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Sanctissima » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:47 am

United Marxist Nations wrote:
Sanctissima wrote:
The economic and imperialist side of things had a lot more to do with it than the whole "gotta conquer them before they conquer us" mentality. You could potentially make an argument for that during the many wars against the Ottoman Empire, but even then, by the time European powers actually started to make significant gains against the Ottomans there were other more influential factors at play.

What do you mean by "significant gains", because the Wars against the Ottomans spanned for like 450+ years.


I mean during the 19th and 20th centuries when everything started to actually fall apart.

Prior to that, territorially speaking, the Ottomans never had many huge losses. By the time European powers started to actually carve up the Ottoman Empire and form their own colonies from its former territory, there were many other factors at play which superseded the old thoughts of mere survival.

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Tokuopolis
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Founded: Oct 04, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Tokuopolis » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:47 am

Vassenor wrote:


Is there a reason you decided to go for the version oriented towards Children when looking for an explanation post?

Well, I just wondered what people would think of it.
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Zoice
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Posts: 3041
Founded: Oct 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Zoice » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:48 am

United Marxist Nations wrote:
Vistulange wrote:
Precisely. The key word there, however, is not "idiocracy" but instead "institutionalised". People willingly and knowingly engage in the nonsense, putting aside rationale and the very process of empathy and understanding aside.

"Understanding" does not mean "agreeing with". You must understand and empathise with anything you see as an enemy or a hostile as to better engage it. Unfortunately, those who engage in this nonsense also feel that the words "understanding" and "empathy" are not on their aside, as they are oft inclined to believe that nothing short of violence and cruelty will solve their problems.

Didn't you just decry using emotion in political discourse? So why are you now saying we have to show empathy?

Empathy should motivate your policies, but not blur the lines and facts.
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Vistulange
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5066
Founded: May 13, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Vistulange » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:48 am

United Marxist Nations wrote:
Vistulange wrote:
Precisely. The key word there, however, is not "idiocracy" but instead "institutionalised". People willingly and knowingly engage in the nonsense, putting aside rationale and the very process of empathy and understanding aside.

"Understanding" does not mean "agreeing with". You must understand and empathise with anything you see as an enemy or a hostile as to better engage it. Unfortunately, those who engage in this nonsense also feel that the words "understanding" and "empathy" are not on their aside, as they are oft inclined to believe that nothing short of violence and cruelty will solve their problems.

Didn't you just decry using emotion in political discourse? So why are you now saying we have to show empathy?

Empathy has nothing to do with emotion. Empathy is understanding what the opposite thinks by way of thinking the way they think. I also make a distinction between the public politics and the institution of politics. Public politics is what we are doing - none of us are in a government post or a key decision-maker in any degree. What we are doing is mere discussion. There is room for emotion here, despite my utter disdain of it. Institutionalised politics, on the other hand, have no such luxury.
Last edited by Vistulange on Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Ganos Lao
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Founded: Feb 26, 2008
Ex-Nation

Postby Ganos Lao » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:48 am

United Marxist Nations wrote:
Ganos Lao wrote:
It all boils down to the institutionalized idiocracy in both cases.

Is your flag the silhouette of the monkey from Lion King holding up a baby (Napoleon?) in a bicorne hat?


I think it's a human woman, actually. :p

I just grabbed it off Google Images and figured it looked cool enough.



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United Marxist Nations
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Founded: Dec 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby United Marxist Nations » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:49 am

Sanctissima wrote:
United Marxist Nations wrote:What do you mean by "significant gains", because the Wars against the Ottomans spanned for like 450+ years.


I mean during the 19th and 20th centuries when everything started to actually fall apart.

Prior to that, territorially speaking, the Ottomans never had many huge losses. By the time European powers started to actually carve up the Ottoman Empire and form their own colonies from its former territory, there were many other factors at play which superseded the old thoughts of mere survival.

But during those periods, the primary losses the Ottomans experienced were from internal strife because the Ottomans had been doing those things to peoples who decided to rebel for independence (merely taking advantage of wars against the Ottomans), not because European powers were conquering the Ottomans (in fact, I can only think of a few outlying territories that were actually taken by major powers directly, aside from Egypt).
Last edited by United Marxist Nations on Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Gig em Aggies
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Founded: Aug 15, 2009
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Gig em Aggies » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:49 am

Vistulange wrote:
Atelia wrote:And the Far Right shall grow ever stronger.

But really dont vote us in and this is what you get, and with another million of the 'refugees' coming in this year dont expect it to get any better.


You are a racist bigot who has wet dreams of conquering Istanbul and driving out the barbaric ungodly Turks out of "your" land. Why in bloody hell should we, as rational and thinking people, take somebody such as you seriously? Refugees are refugees, or do you not believe that hundreds of thousands in Syria, Afghanistan or various other war-torn countries are being displaced and are fleeing their very homes, as you often complain that your ancestors have done when the Ottoman Empire conquered Istanbul?

The problem is not the refugees, it is the diseased and cancerous thoughts at both sides. The Middle-East has a virulent cancer of radical Islamism and violent Jihad. Europe and the West have a just as virulent cancer of irredentism, racism and ultranationalism. Your thoughts have no basis in rational thought, only emotion, just as the radical Islamists. Both diseases do not ever condemn their entire respective societies, but for the good of world - if you care about that and not just about your oh-so-holy white race - both cancers must be cut out and eradicated from this world. Populist, radical and irrational ideologies has and will bring only tears and destruction to the world. Nothing more, nothing less.

The many rational Western people ought to condemn you and your thoughts of seeing refugees as so inhuman and violent as to put the bloody word in between apostrophes, just as the few rational people in the Middle-East condemn ISIS and its diseased and cancerous ideology and all variants of it at the risk of their lives and freedoms.

Even though you are right in some aspects it won't happen until either extremist views are eradicated completely or humanity in general ceases to exsist. In the refugee aspect the reason becuase so many don't care for them is becuase they assault women and children thinking Europe is their playground while maintaining Europeans have to be nice to them and let them in just because they fled a civil war. I for one am saddened by the state these people had to flee from but I do not want them near me or my family for the very reasons that happened in Europe. That does not make me a bigot or racist it just means I would rather look out for my family over them plus we can't vet these refugees with any precision that's why groups like Daesh are taking advantage of people's charity and infiltrating into the refugee population that's really the main reason why no one wants refugees. Plus how come the west always has to open its arms why not get the Muslim world to take care of its fellow Muslims.
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Ganos Lao
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Founded: Feb 26, 2008
Ex-Nation

Postby Ganos Lao » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:50 am

Trada wrote:
Saiwania wrote:
We effectively had that before with the Ottoman empire. They were nothing but trouble for Europe. They kept trying to invade and expand but weren't able to. Great Britain was just opportunistic in having them formally get dissolved after WWI.


Huh... How about Europe colonising other poorer nations and enslaving them? The Caliphate was one of the most developed and rich empires ever seen in history, I strongly advise you to first learn about the history of Caliphate and then say something about it. The caliphate is not what you thinnk it is (strict sharia law that kills everyone who opposes them)


The problem there isn't Europeans, but rather human beings. If the roles were reversed, you'd still see the same results. Europe and the others were all engaging in similar practices such as slavery, colonization, etc.

Europe simply did it all better than they ever could. That's just the way it works. History is a competition between powers, after all.



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The TransPecos
Envoy
 
Posts: 295
Founded: May 14, 2006
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The TransPecos » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:52 am

Ostroeuropa wrote:
The Qeiiam Star Cluster wrote:Nazism was a political ideology, not an entire culture.


So is Islam.

When you base your entire culture around an ideology, the two become synonymous. Islam is quite a totalitarian religion in that it prescribes rules for much of day to day life and social interaction. The culture of totalitarian states is often one and the same as its governing ideology, so destruction of one is basically the same as destruction of the other.
Assisting the natives with reconnecting to their pre-islamic cultural roots would also be beneficial, as well as encouraging them to take the view of themselves as part of the international community, similar to the german scenario.

For nazi germany, the de-nazification process pretty much WAS the entire culture being destroyed and rebuilt.


Isn't it significant that 'Submission' (Islam in translation) isn't really a religion but a warlord's method of rewarding his 'warriors' (jihadists in translation) and providing a means of subjugation of conquered peoples and areas? If 'Submission' is treated as a cult and loses it's position as a 'religion' it could be dealt with under numerous existing laws and regulations. For example Sharia law can't be implemented because of unequal treatment of women, bigamy is illegal, prohibition on cruel and unusual punishment, and many, many more.

Genocide not required, cultural cleansing not required. Just enforce the existing laws.

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Kautharr
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Posts: 557
Founded: Feb 25, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Kautharr » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:52 am

Vistulange wrote:
Atelia wrote:And the Far Right shall grow ever stronger.

But really dont vote us in and this is what you get, and with another million of the 'refugees' coming in this year dont expect it to get any better.


You are a racist bigot who has wet dreams of conquering Istanbul and driving out the barbaric ungodly Turks out of "your" land. Why in bloody hell should we, as rational and thinking people, take somebody such as you seriously? Refugees are refugees, or do you not believe that hundreds of thousands in Syria, Afghanistan or various other war-torn countries are being displaced and are fleeing their very homes, as you often complain that your ancestors have done when the Ottoman Empire conquered Istanbul?

The problem is not the refugees, it is the diseased and cancerous thoughts at both sides. The Middle-East has a virulent cancer of radical Islamism and violent Jihad. Europe and the West have a just as virulent cancer of irredentism, racism and ultranationalism. Your thoughts have no basis in rational thought, only emotion, just as the radical Islamists. Both diseases do not ever condemn their entire respective societies, but for the good of world - if you care about that and not just about your oh-so-holy white race - both cancers must be cut out and eradicated from this world. Populist, radical and irrational ideologies has and will bring only tears and destruction to the world. Nothing more, nothing less.

The many rational Western people ought to condemn you and your thoughts of seeing refugees as so inhuman and violent as to put the bloody word in between apostrophes, just as the few rational people in the Middle-East condemn ISIS and its diseased and cancerous ideology and all variants of it at the risk of their lives and freedoms.

Good. Send the turks out of Constantinople* and also, I'm a proud racist and proud bigot. Refugees aren't refugees if they're terrorists, fuck them if they're terrorists. We should've went on a crusade to take back Constantinople from the turks when they conquered it.
No the problem isn't """racism""" or ultranationalism the problem is Islam (which is the real disease here). And we care about the white race because we're not self-hating pussy neo-hippie leftists, like you I suppose.
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Uxupox
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Posts: 13447
Founded: Nov 13, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Uxupox » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:53 am

Kautharr wrote:
Vistulange wrote:
You are a racist bigot who has wet dreams of conquering Istanbul and driving out the barbaric ungodly Turks out of "your" land. Why in bloody hell should we, as rational and thinking people, take somebody such as you seriously? Refugees are refugees, or do you not believe that hundreds of thousands in Syria, Afghanistan or various other war-torn countries are being displaced and are fleeing their very homes, as you often complain that your ancestors have done when the Ottoman Empire conquered Istanbul?

The problem is not the refugees, it is the diseased and cancerous thoughts at both sides. The Middle-East has a virulent cancer of radical Islamism and violent Jihad. Europe and the West have a just as virulent cancer of irredentism, racism and ultranationalism. Your thoughts have no basis in rational thought, only emotion, just as the radical Islamists. Both diseases do not ever condemn their entire respective societies, but for the good of world - if you care about that and not just about your oh-so-holy white race - both cancers must be cut out and eradicated from this world. Populist, radical and irrational ideologies has and will bring only tears and destruction to the world. Nothing more, nothing less.

The many rational Western people ought to condemn you and your thoughts of seeing refugees as so inhuman and violent as to put the bloody word in between apostrophes, just as the few rational people in the Middle-East condemn ISIS and its diseased and cancerous ideology and all variants of it at the risk of their lives and freedoms.

Good. Send the turks out of Constantinople* and also, I'm a proud racist and proud bigot. Refugees aren't refugees if they're terrorists, fuck them if they're terrorists. We should've went on a crusade to take back Constantinople from the turks when they conquered it.
No the problem isn't """racism""" or ultranationalism the problem is Islam (which is the real disease here). And we care about the white race because we're not self-hating pussy neo-hippie leftists, like you I suppose.


Oh my god.
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Ganos Lao
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Ex-Nation

Postby Ganos Lao » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:56 am

Kautharr wrote:We should've went on a crusade to take back Constantinople from the turks when they conquered it.


It's too bad, then, that the only reason the Turks even managed to conquer it was because you guys drove a dagger into the heart of the Byzantines in 1204.

Putting prostitutes on the Patriarch's throne might have been fun, but ultimately the Fourth Crusade was the key the Muslims needed to get past the door.

All the Turks did in 1453 was put Byzantium out of its misery. Blame Venice if you're so mad about it.
Last edited by Ganos Lao on Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:58 am, edited 1 time in total.



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Vistulange
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5066
Founded: May 13, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Vistulange » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:57 am

Gig em Aggies wrote:
Vistulange wrote:
You are a racist bigot who has wet dreams of conquering Istanbul and driving out the barbaric ungodly Turks out of "your" land. Why in bloody hell should we, as rational and thinking people, take somebody such as you seriously? Refugees are refugees, or do you not believe that hundreds of thousands in Syria, Afghanistan or various other war-torn countries are being displaced and are fleeing their very homes, as you often complain that your ancestors have done when the Ottoman Empire conquered Istanbul?

The problem is not the refugees, it is the diseased and cancerous thoughts at both sides. The Middle-East has a virulent cancer of radical Islamism and violent Jihad. Europe and the West have a just as virulent cancer of irredentism, racism and ultranationalism. Your thoughts have no basis in rational thought, only emotion, just as the radical Islamists. Both diseases do not ever condemn their entire respective societies, but for the good of world - if you care about that and not just about your oh-so-holy white race - both cancers must be cut out and eradicated from this world. Populist, radical and irrational ideologies has and will bring only tears and destruction to the world. Nothing more, nothing less.

The many rational Western people ought to condemn you and your thoughts of seeing refugees as so inhuman and violent as to put the bloody word in between apostrophes, just as the few rational people in the Middle-East condemn ISIS and its diseased and cancerous ideology and all variants of it at the risk of their lives and freedoms.

Even though you are right in some aspects it won't happen until either extremist views are eradicated completely or humanity in general ceases to exsist. In the refugee aspect the reason becuase so many don't care for them is becuase they assault women and children thinking Europe is their playground while maintaining Europeans have to be nice to them and let them in just because they fled a civil war. I for one am saddened by the state these people had to flee from but I do not want them near me or my family for the very reasons that happened in Europe. That does not make me a bigot or racist it just means I would rather look out for my family over them plus we can't vet these refugees with any precision that's why groups like Daesh are taking advantage of people's charity and infiltrating into the refugee population that's really the main reason why no one wants refugees. Plus how come the west always has to open its arms why not get the Muslim world to take care of its fellow Muslims.


The Muslim world cannot take care of the Muslims because majority of the countries which are predominantly Muslim have zero care about human, political or civil rights. People do not flee from one hell-hole into another. Simply because Saudi Arabia is not in a state of war does not mean Saudi Arabia is a preferable place to reside in. That's one answer.

I never called you a bigot or a racist. I called Atelia a bigot and a racist. There is a difference, as I am sure you appreciate. I also fully understand wanting to take care of your own before refugees, it is the very thing I myself advocate, and which you can see if you dig through my old posts. And yes, I know that ISIS is slipping people in with refugees. That does not condemn the entirety of the refugee population, just as people such as Atelia do not condemn his entire societal group, or just as people like Erdoğan do not condemn their entire country.

Kautharr wrote:
Vistulange wrote:
You are a racist bigot who has wet dreams of conquering Istanbul and driving out the barbaric ungodly Turks out of "your" land. Why in bloody hell should we, as rational and thinking people, take somebody such as you seriously? Refugees are refugees, or do you not believe that hundreds of thousands in Syria, Afghanistan or various other war-torn countries are being displaced and are fleeing their very homes, as you often complain that your ancestors have done when the Ottoman Empire conquered Istanbul?

The problem is not the refugees, it is the diseased and cancerous thoughts at both sides. The Middle-East has a virulent cancer of radical Islamism and violent Jihad. Europe and the West have a just as virulent cancer of irredentism, racism and ultranationalism. Your thoughts have no basis in rational thought, only emotion, just as the radical Islamists. Both diseases do not ever condemn their entire respective societies, but for the good of world - if you care about that and not just about your oh-so-holy white race - both cancers must be cut out and eradicated from this world. Populist, radical and irrational ideologies has and will bring only tears and destruction to the world. Nothing more, nothing less.

The many rational Western people ought to condemn you and your thoughts of seeing refugees as so inhuman and violent as to put the bloody word in between apostrophes, just as the few rational people in the Middle-East condemn ISIS and its diseased and cancerous ideology and all variants of it at the risk of their lives and freedoms.

Good. Send the turks out of Constantinople* and also, I'm a proud racist and proud bigot. Refugees aren't refugees if they're terrorists, fuck them if they're terrorists. We should've went on a crusade to take back Constantinople from the turks when they conquered it.
No the problem isn't """racism""" or ultranationalism the problem is Islam (which is the real disease here). And we care about the white race because we're not self-hating pussy neo-hippie leftists, like you I suppose.


My entire fucking point proven, folks.
Last edited by Vistulange on Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Zoice
Minister
 
Posts: 3041
Founded: Oct 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Zoice » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:58 am

Kautharr wrote:
Vistulange wrote:
You are a racist bigot who has wet dreams of conquering Istanbul and driving out the barbaric ungodly Turks out of "your" land. Why in bloody hell should we, as rational and thinking people, take somebody such as you seriously? Refugees are refugees, or do you not believe that hundreds of thousands in Syria, Afghanistan or various other war-torn countries are being displaced and are fleeing their very homes, as you often complain that your ancestors have done when the Ottoman Empire conquered Istanbul?

The problem is not the refugees, it is the diseased and cancerous thoughts at both sides. The Middle-East has a virulent cancer of radical Islamism and violent Jihad. Europe and the West have a just as virulent cancer of irredentism, racism and ultranationalism. Your thoughts have no basis in rational thought, only emotion, just as the radical Islamists. Both diseases do not ever condemn their entire respective societies, but for the good of world - if you care about that and not just about your oh-so-holy white race - both cancers must be cut out and eradicated from this world. Populist, radical and irrational ideologies has and will bring only tears and destruction to the world. Nothing more, nothing less.

The many rational Western people ought to condemn you and your thoughts of seeing refugees as so inhuman and violent as to put the bloody word in between apostrophes, just as the few rational people in the Middle-East condemn ISIS and its diseased and cancerous ideology and all variants of it at the risk of their lives and freedoms.

Good. Send the turks out of Constantinople* and also, I'm a proud racist and proud bigot. Refugees aren't refugees if they're terrorists, fuck them if they're terrorists. We should've went on a crusade to take back Constantinople from the turks when they conquered it.
No the problem isn't """racism""" or ultranationalism the problem is Islam (which is the real disease here). And we care about the white race because we're not self-hating pussy neo-hippie leftists, like you I suppose.

lol

What's the problem that you're compensating for by cranking up the nitro on your macho attitude? Generally, the only people that use pussy or self-hating as an insult are those that are very insecure about themselves.
♂♀Copy and Paste this in your sig if you're ignorant about human sexuality and want to let everyone know. ♂♀
Or if you're an asshole that goes out of your way to bully minorities and call them words with the strict intent of upsetting a demographic that is already at a huge risk of suicide, or being murdered for who they are. :)

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Sanctissima
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8486
Founded: Jul 16, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Sanctissima » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:58 am

United Marxist Nations wrote:
Sanctissima wrote:
I mean during the 19th and 20th centuries when everything started to actually fall apart.

Prior to that, territorially speaking, the Ottomans never had many huge losses. By the time European powers started to actually carve up the Ottoman Empire and form their own colonies from its former territory, there were many other factors at play which superseded the old thoughts of mere survival.

But during those periods, the primary losses the Ottomans experienced were from internal strife because the Ottomans had been doing those things to peoples who decided to rebel for independence (merely taking advantage of wars against the Ottomans), not because European powers were conquering the Ottomans (in fact, I can only think of a few outlying territories that were actually taken by major powers directly, aside from Egypt).


That's kind of my point though, actually. Britain and France carved up North Africa, Mesopotamia and the Levant. Russia gained territory in the North and Caucasus, and formed States out of the Ottomans' domains in the Balkans. And Greece gained independence and bit by bit forged a kingdom in the Aegean.

Despite Saiwania's claims, European survival had very little to do with the reason why the Ottomans fell and, to a broader extent, why the Age of Colonialism took place. There were economic, imperialist and nationalist ideals which took place, but very little of it had to do with "invading them before they invade us".

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Kautharr
Diplomat
 
Posts: 557
Founded: Feb 25, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Kautharr » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:58 am

Ganos Lao wrote:
Kautharr wrote:We should've went on a crusade to take back Constantinople from the turks when they conquered it.


It's too bad, then, that the only reason the Turks even managed to conquer it was because you guys drove a dagger into their heart of the Byzantines in 1204.

Putting prostitutes on the Patriarch's throne might have been fun, but ultimately the Fourth Crusade was the key the Muslims needed to get past the door.

All the Turks did in 1453 was put Byzantium out of its misery. Blame Venice if you're so mad about it.

the fourth crusade was degenerate, we should've just organized a big crusade to take out Islam at it's heart (Mecca)
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Lunalia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 621
Founded: Oct 19, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Lunalia » Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:59 am

Trada wrote:We must understand these extremists. Why do they do this?
Well, becuase they see videos on the internet where Syrians are being killed and where a father is crying in fornt of his dead child. Or Palestinians being killed by the Israeli occupation forces. And after watching like 20 of them (videos) they get nervous and they want to help. Here it starts, the very beginning to radicalisation. And when they hear that these bombs, killing civilians (colleteral damage), are from the West (airstrikes), they get some anti-western feelings and ideas. The next week they have watching like 100 of them. So these guys are potential terrorists and a threat, they want to kill Western people (Europeans,..), becuase they are too mad at them. And then one day these guys encounter a racist European who gives racist remarks. There it is, these guys have made their choice: terrorist attack. They think that all Europeans are the same one racist nation. And one day these guys make an end to their life by bombing something after being brainwashed by extremists...
So to stop all this we have firstly look at our own racist people and groups (Pegida, Trump,...) and stop them.
The once peaceful multicultural Belgium is now kinda in shock, and I live in Belgium, it feels bad.
We also have to stop polarising (through media, politicians,..), it just makes the IS make more recruit gains.

Pointing out that this is how ISIS recruits only makes people tell you that if you don't crack down harshly on all Muslims, ISIS will continue to recruit.

/sigh
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United Marxist Nations
Post Czar
 
Posts: 33804
Founded: Dec 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby United Marxist Nations » Tue Mar 22, 2016 10:07 am

Sanctissima wrote:
United Marxist Nations wrote:But during those periods, the primary losses the Ottomans experienced were from internal strife because the Ottomans had been doing those things to peoples who decided to rebel for independence (merely taking advantage of wars against the Ottomans), not because European powers were conquering the Ottomans (in fact, I can only think of a few outlying territories that were actually taken by major powers directly, aside from Egypt).


That's kind of my point though, actually. Britain and France carved up North Africa, Mesopotamia and the Levant. Russia gained territory in the North and Caucasus, and formed States out of the Ottomans' domains in the Balkans. And Greece gained independence and bit by bit forged a kingdom in the Aegean.

Despite Saiwania's claims, European survival had very little to do with the reason why the Ottomans fell and, to a broader extent, why the Age of Colonialism took place. There were economic, imperialist and nationalist ideals which took place, but very little of it had to do with "invading them before they invade us".

Wouldn't it be natural to, once there was security, to reverse the gains the Ottomans had made before they were solidified?
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CODSQUEAKS
Civilian
 
Posts: 1
Founded: Apr 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Terrorist attacks seem to be getting more frequent.

Postby CODSQUEAKS » Tue Mar 22, 2016 10:09 am

Napkiraly wrote:
The Belgian fire service told local media there were at least several dead and wounded.
The cause of the explosions is unknown. The airport is being evacuated and has been closed to flights.
The blasts come four days after the capture in Brussels of Salah Abdeslam, the main suspect in the Paris attacks in November.
Images on social media showed smoke rising from one of the buildings, amid reports of panic as people fled the airport.
Rail transport to the facility has been halted.
Other reports say at least one explosion was close to the American Airlines check-in area but this has not been confirmed.
The Belgian broadcaster RTBF quoted a witness as saying there were people injured or unconscious in the departure area, opposite the Sheraton hotel.
Niels Caignau, a Swissport employee, told Flemish broadcaster VRT: "I was on a break and heard and felt a big explosion - we have from here a view over the departure hall and saw a plume of smoke come out.
"The windows are completely shattered. People went outside in shock. It doesn't look good."
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-35869254?ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbcnews&ns_source=facebook

From the Guardian: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/mar/22/brussels-airport-explosions-heard

Passengers are being evacuated from Brussels airport, where two loud explosions have been heard.

Smoke was seen rising from a terminal building and Belgian media reported that several people were injured in a departure hall. The cause of the blasts is unclear.

Sky News television’s Alex Rossi, at the scene, said he heard two “very, very loud explosions”.

“I could feel the building move. There was also dust and smoke as well … I went towards where the explosion came from and there were people coming out looking very dazed and shocked,” he said.

The federal prosecutor confirmed to Politico that explosions took place, but could not confirm if they were terrorist attacks.


Two explosions at Zaventem airport, one in at least one terminal building. While it has yet to be determined the cause, there is of course the possibility that it could be a terrorist attack. Hopefully no one was killed or seriously wounded, but I expect that to not be the case, unfortunately. Thread will be updated continuously, though a proper fully accurate OP won't be coming until most of the facts are known.
One explosion believed to be at the American Airlines check-in.

Video of the explosion can be found here: Warning, it may be disturbing to some. https://twitter.com/OnlineMagazin/status/712188304150679552/video/1 No longer available.


Summary: What we know are that there have been at least three blasts; two at the airport at 8 am and one confirmed Metro station Maelbeek at 9ish am. 26 confirmed to have been killed, 11 at the airport and 15 at Maelbeek station. 136 have been wounded. Casualties have yet to be fully determined, however, and the number of deaths may, unfortunately, continue to rise. Officially a terrorist attack, but no claims for responsibility as of now, though Daesh remains the likely culprit. Reports of gunfire in the airport and shouting in Arabic before the explosions at the airport. PM Michel has confirmed that the bombing at the airport was carried out by a suicide bomber. Brussels is now under complete lockdown and Belgium is currently at its highest threat alert level. Hopefully, our resident NSGers that are in Brussels are safe and remain safe until this all ends.

Live updates: http://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-europe-35869266
http://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2016/mar/22/brussels-airport-explosions-live-updates
http://www.itv.com/news/story/2016-03-22/several-dead-in-two-explosions-at-brussels-airport/
http://news.sky.com/story/1664469/explosions-at-brussels-airport-live-updates

Twitter links: https://twitter.com/Conflicts
https://twitter.com/AAhronheim?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
https://twitter.com/Tabagari
Warning for the second and third for extremely graphic and disturbing content. Proceed at your own caution.

It is starting to seem like these attacks just happen more frequently than they used to and it is really scary because terrorism is like a virus, you can prevent it but you can't cure it.

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