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The UK Referendum on Membership of the European Union

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Should the UK remain a member of the EU or leave the EU

Remain a member of the EU (UK citizen)
279
18%
Leave the EU (UK citizen)
207
13%
Remain a member of the EU (citizen of other EU member)
146
9%
Leave the EU (citizen of other EU member)
99
6%
Remain a member of the EU (non-EU citizen)
432
27%
Leave the EU (non-EU citizen)
414
26%
 
Total votes : 1577

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Frank Zipper
Senator
 
Posts: 4207
Founded: Nov 16, 2015
Ex-Nation

The UK Referendum on Membership of the European Union

Postby Frank Zipper » Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:30 am

On the 23rd of June this year a referendum will be held in the UK and Gibraltar on whether the UK should remain a member of the European Union. The proposed referendum question is:

Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?

and for the Welsh:

A ddylai’r Deyrnas Unedig aros yn aelod o’r Undeb Ewropeaidd neu adael yr Undeb Ewropeaidd?

The choices of answer being

Remain a member of the European Union
Leave the European Union

and for the Welsh:

Aros yn aelod o’r Undeb Ewropeaidd
Gadael yr Undeb Ewropeaidd

The BBC's potted guide to Brexit is here

If, as a result of the referendum, the UK leaves the European Union, it would be the first sovereign member state to do so. The decision has implications for both the UK and for the European Union. Though there is much dispute about what the results of withdrawal would be.

Opinion polls suggest that the UK public is fairly evenly split on the issue at the moment. The Prime Minister David Cameron and some other leading Conservatives, the Labour Party, the Liberal Democrats, the SNP, and Plaid Cymru favour remaining in the EU. UKIP and the DUP, several Conservative cabinet members and about half of the Tory MPs, and several Labour MPs support leaving.

The arguments for and against largely centre around issues of sovereignty and economics. The sovereignty questions include arguments on controlling UK borders and immigration, and the principle of free movement ; whether there are too many rules imposed on the UK by the EU; and the idea of closer union if we remain a member. The economic arguments include whether the UK gets value for money for its membership; whether it is good or bad for businesses, and the general economic prosperity in the UK.

What I think would be interesting, is to know more than just whether people here are in favour of leaving or not, but whether they are a UK citizen or from another EU member state or the wider world, and what is the most persuasive issue for them.

Time for my opinion... I am a UK Liberal Democrat voter, I don't have strong nationalist feelings, so for me the economic aspects are the most important. I am definitely in favour of the UK remaining a member of the European Union.
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Irona
Minister
 
Posts: 2399
Founded: Dec 27, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Irona » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:28 am

Honestly I'm torn. The EU isn't nearly as democratic as it should be, various EU states are attempting to use the EU to weaken the city of London as the worlds financial center and the enforced austerity the EU is forcing on country's that want to pull themselves out of economic devistation is appalling. Yet the principles of the EU and the financial advantage make me want to stay.

Any chance of archiving significant reform of the EU seems to have been crushed. If real reform was on the table I wouldn't be thinking about leaving. But it isn't.
Last edited by Irona on Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Vassenor
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Founded: Nov 11, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vassenor » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:32 am

This is already being discussed over in the main UK politics thread.
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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
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Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:33 am

Vassenor wrote:This is already being discussed over in the main UK politics thread.


Arch cleared a standalone thread as it's impacting more than just the UK.

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Mefpan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5872
Founded: Oct 23, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Mefpan » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:48 am

As I've said before in previous threads, I'd much rather see the UK stay, but its government ought to just fucking stop treating the European Union as a buffet and asking for opt-outs on things it doesn't particularly care for.
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Ifreann
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 163860
Founded: Aug 07, 2005
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Ifreann » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:48 am

Fartsniffage wrote:
Vassenor wrote:This is already being discussed over in the main UK politics thread.


Arch cleared a standalone thread as it's impacting more than just the UK.

Maybe we should have a referendum on whether the topic of the referendum should leave the megathread or remain in it.
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Vorond
Minister
 
Posts: 2449
Founded: Feb 15, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Vorond » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:49 am

The perfidious albion, hereditary enemy of both France and Germany... no, seriously, have the referendum and then stop the fence-sitting. And remember: the european free market zone is members only.
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The Great European Commonwealth
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 3
Founded: Aug 04, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby The Great European Commonwealth » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:52 am

UK is better without the EU

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Khadgar
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11006
Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Postby Khadgar » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:52 am

Didn't the UK have a referendum on leaving the EU a couple years back? Instead of threatening to bail out perhaps someone ought propose reforms that would make being a member more attractive.

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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42050
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:53 am

Khadgar wrote:Didn't the UK have a referendum on leaving the EU a couple years back? Instead of threatening to bail out perhaps someone ought propose reforms that would make being a member more attractive.


Nope. There was one on joining in the 70's.

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Vorond
Minister
 
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Founded: Feb 15, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Vorond » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:54 am

The Great European Commonwealth wrote:UK is better without the EU


You have a mixup there.
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Densaner
Minister
 
Posts: 2760
Founded: Jul 19, 2005
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Densaner » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:57 am

I'm voting leave. The end destination for the EU is a United States of Europe, no thanks.

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Alyakia
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18422
Founded: Jul 12, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Alyakia » Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:59 am

Densaner wrote:I'm voting leave. The end destination for the EU is a United States of Europe, no thanks.


yeah, would be pretty horrible to be in a union of countries, especially ones where you feel a far away city does not adequately represent you *gonk*
Last edited by Alyakia on Thu Feb 25, 2016 10:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Khadgar
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Ex-Nation

Postby Khadgar » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:00 am

Densaner wrote:I'm voting leave. The end destination for the EU is a United States of Europe, no thanks.


I want the EU to become the US of Europe, that way we can take the back seat and passive aggressively bitch every time you do or don't do anything. It'll be fun!

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Densaner
Minister
 
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Founded: Jul 19, 2005
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Densaner » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:01 am

Alyakia wrote:
Densaner wrote:I'm voting leave. The end destination for the EU is a United States of Europe, no thanks.


yeah, would be pretty horrible to be in a union of countries, especially ones where you feel a far away city does not adequately represent you *gonk*


Agreed. But that was settled already. This is about Britain in Europe. The EU is remote and undemocratic. However it will become a full federation in due course. People in the UK don't want that.

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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42050
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:03 am

Densaner wrote:
Alyakia wrote:
yeah, would be pretty horrible to be in a union of countries, especially ones where you feel a far away city does not adequately represent you *gonk*


Agreed. But that was settled already. This is about Britain in Europe. The EU is remote and undemocratic. However it will become a full federation in due course. People in the UK don't want that.


And people in the UK do want that.

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Densaner
Minister
 
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Founded: Jul 19, 2005
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Densaner » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:03 am

Khadgar wrote:
Densaner wrote:I'm voting leave. The end destination for the EU is a United States of Europe, no thanks.


I want the EU to become the US of Europe, that way we can take the back seat and passive aggressively bitch every time you do or don't do anything. It'll be fun!


Have fun then. If we don't leave this year we will eventually. We don't want a United States of Europe.

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Densaner
Minister
 
Posts: 2760
Founded: Jul 19, 2005
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Densaner » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:05 am

Fartsniffage wrote:
Densaner wrote:
Agreed. But that was settled already. This is about Britain in Europe. The EU is remote and undemocratic. However it will become a full federation in due course. People in the UK don't want that.


And people in the UK do want that.


Nope they really don't.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... rope#Polls

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Bojikami
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11276
Founded: Jul 24, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Bojikami » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:05 am

Leave the EU! C'mon Britain, join us in the non-EU club.
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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42050
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:06 am

Densaner wrote:
Fartsniffage wrote:
And people in the UK do want that.


Nope they really don't.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... rope#Polls


Am I not a person? Am I not from the UK?

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Densaner
Minister
 
Posts: 2760
Founded: Jul 19, 2005
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Densaner » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:07 am

Fartsniffage wrote:


Am I not a person? Am I not from the UK?


You might be. I don't know you. Are you the whole electorate?

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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42050
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:10 am

Densaner wrote:
Fartsniffage wrote:
Am I not a person? Am I not from the UK?


You might be. I don't know you. Are you the whole electorate?


Who's mentioned the whole electorate? You said "People in the UK don't want that." I'm a person from the UK and I do want that.

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Great Britain Out
Attaché
 
Posts: 89
Founded: Jan 23, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Great Britain Out » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:10 am

There are hardly any benefits of staying in the EU. The result will be very close, but it is the right thing to do to get the UK out of the EU on the 23rd June. We have to vote to leave.
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Densaner
Minister
 
Posts: 2760
Founded: Jul 19, 2005
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Densaner » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:13 am

Fartsniffage wrote:
Densaner wrote:
You might be. I don't know you. Are you the whole electorate?


Who's mentioned the whole electorate? You said "People in the UK don't want that." I'm a person from the UK and I do want that.


People in the UK don't want a federal Europe. You're one person. A majority of voters disagree. Satisfied? :p

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Densaner
Minister
 
Posts: 2760
Founded: Jul 19, 2005
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Densaner » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:14 am

Great Britain Out wrote:There are hardly any benefits of staying in the EU. The result will be very close, but it is the right thing to do to get the UK out of the EU on the 23rd June. We have to vote to leave.


Well said. :clap:

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