Occult/Paranormal Discussion Thread

[New confederate ramenia]

I made this thread because there's an ongoing occultism discussion in the CTD which isn't specifically Christian.

Are occult and paranormal phenomena real? Do some occult or magical practices work? Should you educate your children about the occult?

I would say that some paranormal phenomena probably exist, but that's just because metaphysical naturalism seems so unlikely to me. Some forms of occultism or magic work, but I think it's mostly because of the placebo effect. It works because you think it works.

I'm not a parent, but I don't think educating your kids about occultism is necessary. Most people won't even be interested in that.

[The Wolven League]

Magic is not real and never will be.

/thread

[Barboneia]

Well, I'm friends with a pink ghost who haunts the forums, so I think that's clear proof of the paranormal existing.

[Nationes Pii Redivivi]

My original point in responding to Dispolis (forgive me if it is spelt incorrectly) is that, lacking knowledge of 'the occult', it is quite wrong for ignorant (in this respect) Christian parents to denounce it as 'evil' and needing to be warned of.

[New confederate ramenia]

Why would you believe in tarot divination? They're literally just playing cards.
And talking boards like Hasbro's Oiuja are just a parlour game.

I've heard way too many stories about people messing with Ouija boards and accidentally summoning something. And Tarot cards...well, the Church says divination isn't good, anyway, because we can't tell the future, soooo...*Shrugs.*

Probably just people spooking themselves.

My original point in responding to Dispolis (forgive me if it is spelt incorrectly) is that, lacking knowledge of 'the occult', it is quite wrong for ignorant (in this respect) Christian parents to denounce it as 'evil' and needing to be warned of.

I agree somewhat. You shouldn't usually hold strong opinions on things you don't know about.

[Jessrond]

I believe in telepathy to be honest. At least the ability to read people.

[Pasovo-nacoBo]

I made this thread because there's an ongoing occultism discussion in the CTD which isn't specifically Christian.

Are occult and paranormal phenomena real? Do some occult or magical practices work? Should you educate your children about the occult?

I would say that some paranormal phenomena probably exist, but that's just because metaphysical naturalism seems so unlikely to me. Some forms of occultism or magic work, but I think it's mostly because of the placebo effect. It works because you think it works.

I'm not a parent, but I don't think educating your kids about occultism is necessary. Most people won't even be interested in that.

Huh, I thought this was like a forum for people like us. Is this a forum for Occultists or a debate about the belief system?

[New confederate ramenia]

I made this thread because there's an ongoing occultism discussion in the CTD which isn't specifically Christian.

Are occult and paranormal phenomena real? Do some occult or magical practices work? Should you educate your children about the occult?

I would say that some paranormal phenomena probably exist, but that's just because metaphysical naturalism seems so unlikely to me. Some forms of occultism or magic work, but I think it's mostly because of the placebo effect. It works because you think it works.

I'm not a parent, but I don't think educating your kids about occultism is necessary. Most people won't even be interested in that.

Huh, I thought this was like a forum for people like us. Is this a forum for Occultists or a debate about the belief system?

It can be both tbh.

[Jessrond]

Go around a time or two, just to waste my time with you.

[Ostroeuropa]

Which Types of Magic Work?

None (tips fedora)

I guess we're just trying our damndest to make a fedora compulsory for anyone to signal they take facts seriously.

[Valystria]

None? If you say otherwise, provide the evidence for it or stop saying it exists.

At least human sacrifices, ouija boards and tarot cards exist. Can't say the same for demons.

It saddens me that these superstitions continue to be taken seriously.

Actively engaging in superstitions such as divination, faith healing and demon summoning ought to be banned.

[Stoic Melancholics]

Magic is not real and never will be.

/thread

Fucking muggles.

[Ava Ire]

Well, I'm friends with a pink ghost who haunts the forums, so I think that's clear proof of the paranormal existing.

At least someone around here believes in me.

But no, I don't believe in the powers of magic and whatnot. And in my opinion, I don't think it's really anything worthwhile to teach to young children. It makes for really interesting and entertaining stories to read about, but I can clearly distinguish the line separating reality from fiction.

[New confederate ramenia]

Which Types of Magic Work?

None (tips fedora)

I guess we're just trying our damndest to make a fedora compulsory for anyone to signal they take facts seriously.

It's just a prank bro.

Actively engaging in superstitions such as divination, faith healing and demon summoning ought to be banned.

Why should they be banned?

[Cetacea]

1 why is Animal or Human sacrifice on the list?
they're not inherently occult and yes they do work - assuming the intention is to have a dead sacrifice.

2 both prayer and faith healing work because of the persons faith - its psychosomatic, possibly even self hypnosis.

3. I accept that human beings generate an EM field and that there have been studies that have shown that neural activity can be influenced by external intense electromagnetic stimulation, EM feilds are also being used to treat cancer tumours. I also accept that such fields can carry information and that some people might even call them an aura.
I also know that some animals including pigeons and sharks have well developed electromagnetic senses and that plants can exchange information using similar stimula.

I don't know if two such human aura's when interacting with each other can affect each other to the extent of affecting moods

[Valystria]

Actively engaging in superstitions such as divination, faith healing and demon summoning ought to be banned.

Why should they be banned?

Explain why a fundamentally detrimental, harmful and regressive behaviour that belongs in the dark ages should be permitted.

There is no benefit to engaging in superstitions. There is only harm from it.

[Cetacea]

Why should they be banned?

Explain why a fundamentally detrimental, harmful and regressive behaviour that belongs in the dark ages should be permitted.

There is no benefit to engaging in superstitions. There is only harm from it.

why? if divination and demon summoning doesn't exist then they can't cause harm and thus there is nothing to ban

[Ostroeuropa]

Explain why a fundamentally detrimental, harmful and regressive behaviour that belongs in the dark ages should be permitted.

There is no benefit to engaging in superstitions. There is only harm from it.

why? if divination and demon summoning doesn't exist then they can't cause harm and thus there is nothing to ban

Waste of material resources and intellectual manhours.

[The Foxes Swamp]

Why should they be banned?

Explain why a fundamentally detrimental, harmful and regressive behaviour that belongs in the dark ages should be permitted.

There is no benefit to engaging in superstitions. There is only harm from it.

so your fine with me killing me if i so choose but the harm superstition may or may not cause is a bridge to far?

[New confederate ramenia]

why? if divination and demon summoning doesn't exist then they can't cause harm and thus there is nothing to ban

Waste of material resources and intellectual manhours.

The waste is really negligible.

[Renewed Dissonance]

Are occult and paranormal phenomena real?

No one took JREF's money. The number of mystics, mediums, and other con-artists expressly refusing the opportunity to walk away with a million dollars says the most.

So: no.

[Valystria]

Explain why a fundamentally detrimental, harmful and regressive behaviour that belongs in the dark ages should be permitted.

There is no benefit to engaging in superstitions. There is only harm from it.

so your fine with me killing me if i so choose but the harm superstition may or may not cause is a bridge to far?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"), short for argumentum ad hominem, is an attack on an argument made by attacking the character, motive, or other attribute of the person making the argument, rather than attacking the argument directly. When used inappropriately, it is a logical fallacy in which a claim or argument is dismissed on the basis of some irrelevant fact or supposition about the author or the person being criticized.

Your question is an ad hominem, an attack on the opponent rather than being against the opponent's position. That is not an acceptable or productive means of debate or discussion.

You are free to oppose a ban on superstitious practices, provided you present reasoning or evidence against that position rather than merely attacking the presenter of that position.

---

Explain why a fundamentally detrimental, harmful and regressive behaviour that belongs in the dark ages should be permitted.

There is no benefit to engaging in superstitions. There is only harm from it.

why? if divination and demon summoning doesn't exist then they can't cause harm and thus there is nothing to ban

Demonstrably untrue.

There is a large and profitable scam industry around swindlers and charlatans peddling fraudulent superstitions such as divination and summoning spirits. Such brazen scamming is immensely harmful.

[The Foxes Swamp]

so your fine with me killing me if i so choose but the harm superstition may or may not cause is a bridge to far?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"), short for argumentum ad hominem, is an attack on an argument made by attacking the character, motive, or other attribute of the person making the argument, rather than attacking the argument directly. When used inappropriately, it is a logical fallacy in which a claim or argument is dismissed on the basis of some irrelevant fact or supposition about the author or the person being criticized.

Your question is an ad hominem, an attack on the opponent rather than being against the opponent's position. That is not an acceptable or productive means of debate or discussion.

You are free to oppose a ban on superstitious practices, provided you present reasoning or evidence against that position rather than merely attacking the presenter of that position.

---

why? if divination and demon summoning doesn't exist then they can't cause harm and thus there is nothing to ban

Demonstrably untrue.

There is a large and profitable scam industry around swindlers and charlatans peddling fraudulent superstitions such as divination and summoning spirits. Such brazen scamming is immensely harmful.

assume whatever you like that wasnt my intention

[Prussia-Steinbach]

Is not believing in magic all it takes to be a fedora-tipper nowadays? Damn. Oh well.

[Renewed Dissonance]

Actively engaging in superstitions such as divination, faith healing and demon summoning ought to be banned.

At least in the United States (my own political context), such a ban would be easily (and correctly) challenged and overturned on First Amendment (speech and religion) grounds. I would anticipate some similar outcome in most first world democracies.

Even so, the only thing such a ban would accomplish would be the strengthening of paranoid and paranormal beliefs. "Why would the government ban something if it was just silly nonsense?" "What are they covering up?" So on and so forth.

Educate those you can reach, ignore the rest. Anything else is playing directly into their hands.